Social Security & divorced spouse question

Non-investing personal finance issues including insurance, credit, real estate, taxes, employment and legal issues such as trusts and wills.
Locked
Topic Author
tph090
Posts: 39
Joined: Fri Dec 20, 2019 9:42 am

Social Security & divorced spouse question

Post by tph090 »

[deleted]
Last edited by tph090 on Sun Mar 26, 2023 1:12 pm, edited 1 time in total.
niagara_guy
Posts: 1168
Joined: Tue Feb 11, 2020 7:32 am

Re: Social Security & divorced spouse question

Post by niagara_guy »

I am going to recommend this book:

Get What's Yours: The Secrets to Maxing Out Your Social Security 

You can probably get it from a library.

There's enough money at stake that I would consider talking to a lawyer who specializes in SS.
Navillus1968
Posts: 977
Joined: Mon Feb 22, 2021 5:00 pm
Location: FL Tampa Bay

Re: Social Security & divorced spouse question

Post by Navillus1968 »

Your relative should definitely try to stay married through 10 years, since both her spousal and survivor benefits are predicated on a minimum 10 year marriage.

With a 20 year age gap, the planning is more complicated, but if she stays married for 10 years (I would plan for a cushion of X number of days beyond 10 years), she is eligible for a spousal benefit. Once her ex passes, she is also eligible for a survivor benefit.

The earliest claiming ages for the 2 benefits are 62 for spousal & 60 for survivor. With a 20 year split, she can claim spousal (at a reduced amount) at 62. [Edited to remove incorrect info]. If she waits until she is 67, she will earn the maximum 50% of his benefit at his FRA.

If he passes before she is 60, she can claim survivor benefits as early as 60 (at a reduced amount). If she waits until 67, she will be eligible for 100% of his benefit at his death. "If you are the divorced spouse of a worker who dies, you could get benefits the same as a surviving spouse, provided that your marriage lasted 10 years or more."

Like all things SSA, it's complex. She can claim each benefit separately- many people claim their spousal benefit early (62) and wait until FRA of 67 to claim the larger survivor benefit. Edited to add- at that point, the spousal benefit would stop & her survivor benefit would start, potentially more than doubling her benefit if her ex claimed later than his FRA.

Your relative needs to stay married for 10 years & 1 month or so & then start researching her options. I assume she's relatively young, 40s, since her husband hasn't claimed SS yet?

Divorced Survivor benefits link [CTRL-F 'Surviving Divorced Spouse']- https://www.ssa.gov/benefits/survivors/ifyou.html#h3
Divorced Spousal benefits link- https://www.investopedia.com/ask/answer ... usband.asp
Last edited by Navillus1968 on Sat Mar 25, 2023 5:28 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Topic Author
tph090
Posts: 39
Joined: Fri Dec 20, 2019 9:42 am

Re: Social Security & divorced spouse question

Post by tph090 »

Navillus1968 wrote: Sat Mar 25, 2023 4:29 pm Your relative should definitely try to stay married through 10 years, since both her spousal and survivor benefits are predicated on a minimum 10 year marriage.

With a 20 year age gap, the planning is more complicated, but if she stays married for 10 years (I would plan for a cushion of X number of days beyond 10 years), she is eligible for a spousal benefit. Once her ex passes, she is also eligible for a survivor benefit.

The earliest claiming ages for the 2 benefits are 62 for spousal & 60 for survivor. With a 20 year split, she can claim spousal (at a reduced amount) at 62. Since her ex will be 82, he is guaranteed to have claimed SS for himself, making her eligible. If she waits until she is 67, she will earn the maximum 50% of his benefit at his FRA.

If he passes before she is 60, she can claim survivor benefits as early as 60 (at a reduced amount). If she waits until 67, she will be eligible for 100% of his benefit at his death. "If you are the divorced spouse of a worker who dies, you could get benefits the same as a surviving spouse, provided that your marriage lasted 10 years or more."

Like all things SSA, it's complex. She can claim each benefit separately- many people claim their spousal benefit early (62) and wait until FRA of 67 to claim the larger survivor benefit. Edited to add- at that point, the spousal benefit would stop & her survivor benefit would start, potentially more than doubling her benefit if her ex claimed later than his FRA.

Your relative needs to stay married for 10 years & 1 month or so & then start researching her options. I assume she's relatively young, 40s, since her husband hasn't claimed SS yet?

Divorced Survivor benefits link [CTRL-F 'Surviving Divorced Spouse']- https://www.ssa.gov/benefits/survivors/ifyou.html#h3
Divorced Spousal benefits link- https://www.investopedia.com/ask/answer ... usband.asp
Thank you for explaining this! Yes she's relatively young, 41, and spouse is 61. He wants to continue working so I don't believe he will file until FRA if that has any impact. I think this would provide a lot of extra peace of mind and he seems fine with it as it's something he can do that provides a huge benefit to her for added peace of mind without costing him anything. Even if the gov ends up cutting back on this benefit at some point in the future with SS shortfalls, it definitely seems worthwhile for her to wait until the 10 year mark.
Topic Author
tph090
Posts: 39
Joined: Fri Dec 20, 2019 9:42 am

Re: Social Security & divorced spouse question

Post by tph090 »

niagara_guy wrote: Sat Mar 25, 2023 11:46 am I am going to recommend this book:

Get What's Yours: The Secrets to Maxing Out Your Social Security 

You can probably get it from a library.

There's enough money at stake that I would consider talking to a lawyer who specializes in SS.
Thank you, yes I will definitely recommend a chat with a lawyer who deals with SS and this book.
Navillus1968
Posts: 977
Joined: Mon Feb 22, 2021 5:00 pm
Location: FL Tampa Bay

Re: Social Security & divorced spouse question

Post by Navillus1968 »

tph090 wrote: Sat Mar 25, 2023 4:59 pm
Navillus1968 wrote: Sat Mar 25, 2023 4:29 pm <snip>
Divorced Survivor benefits link [CTRL-F 'Surviving Divorced Spouse']- https://www.ssa.gov/benefits/survivors/ifyou.html#h3
Divorced Spousal benefits link- https://www.investopedia.com/ask/answer ... usband.asp
Thank you for explaining this! Yes she's relatively young, 41, and spouse is 61. He wants to continue working so I don't believe he will file until FRA if that has any impact. I think this would provide a lot of extra peace of mind and he seems fine with it as it's something he can do that provides a huge benefit to her for added peace of mind without costing him anything. Even if the gov ends up cutting back on this benefit at some point in the future with SS shortfalls, it definitely seems worthwhile for her to wait until the 10 year mark.
Correction to my last post- It's moot in your relative's case, but I misspoke about the need for the ex to file & receive SS benefits for your relative to be eligible for spousal benefits. If you're still married, the worker needs to claim his worker's benefit for the spouse to claim her spousal benefit. Divorced spouses can claim independently. Because of the age difference, it's impossible that her ex won't have claimed by the time she turns 62, so it won't matter even if if were true (which it isn't!). Sorry for the bad info.

Note that re-marriage before age 60 will jeopardize both her spousal & survivor benefits. Weird but true. https://www.thrivent.com/insights/socia ... spouse-get
Ependytis
Posts: 617
Joined: Mon Oct 17, 2016 11:10 am

Re: Social Security & divorced spouse question

Post by Ependytis »

If her spouse waits till they are married 10 years before divorcing, is it considered a long-term marriage? If it's considered a long-term marriage, does he owe her alimony for life? If so, he could be shooting himself in the foot by trying to do her a favor.
tibbitts
Posts: 23726
Joined: Tue Feb 27, 2007 5:50 pm

Re: Social Security & divorced spouse question

Post by tibbitts »

Ependytis wrote: Sat Mar 25, 2023 10:28 pm If her spouse waits till they are married 10 years before divorcing, is it considered a long-term marriage? If it's considered a long-term marriage, does he owe her alimony for life? If so, he could be shooting himself in the foot by trying to do her a favor.
I would guess that the answer is state-specific, but I'm not an expert. I do know that at least in some states the parties can agree to any division of assets they feel is appropriate regardless of the length of the marriage, so possibly that aspect has already been agreed to. Of course in theory until the actual divorce either party could have second thoughts.
mhalley
Posts: 10432
Joined: Tue Nov 20, 2007 5:02 am

Re: Social Security & divorced spouse question

Post by mhalley »

Divorce is def state specific, but I would imagine it’s not difficult to delay a divorce for a few months. Some states require a separation first.
https://www.divorcesource.com/ds/divorc ... -621.shtml
Pops1860
Moderator
Posts: 1831
Joined: Thu Mar 14, 2013 4:05 pm

Re: Social Security & divorced spouse question

Post by Pops1860 »

This thread has run its course and is now locked.

OP has deleted his original post. Moderator Pops1860
The power of accurate observation is often called cynicism by those who do not have it. ~George Bernard Shaw
Locked