What (if anything) are you reducing in your monthly spending?

Questions on how we spend our money and our time - consumer goods and services, home and vehicle, leisure and recreational activities
madbrain
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Re: What (if anything) are you reducing in your monthly spending?

Post by madbrain »

Bama12 wrote: Tue May 17, 2022 12:10 pm Eating out more, it's cheaper.
Cheaper than what ?
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Re: What (if anything) are you reducing in your monthly spending?

Post by madbrain »

Not many Bogleheads seem to be struggling with their cash flow. I guess that's expected in this forum. Unfortunately, not the case for us.
I have been unemployed for 13 of the last 17 months. It seems my 25 year career as a software engineer has sadly come to a close.

Things we have cut :
1) satellite TV bill . About $800/year
2) dining out. Not 100% of it, but most. About $5000/year. The inflation has really been insane on these. Same meal that cost about $50 pre-pandemic now ends up costing about $75.
3) annual fee credit cards. About $1000/year . Reduced travel means we can't use the benefits.
4) life insurance. Our ported premiums double every 5 years and just became too high. $4500/year. No other coverage we can qualify for.
5) long term care insurance. About $1000/year
6) switched auto/car insurer . Increased auto policy deductibles to $1500 from $1000. Home deductible to $10k. This was merely to keep the premiums the same. They couldn't be reduced.
7) movies. About $1000/year. We haven't gone back to a theater since pandemic started.
8) pest control service. About $500/year
9), travel, for obvious reasons. About $8k/year

There are more to come that I haven't implemented yet.

All these cuts still don't offset the very rapidly escalating costs in maintaining our home. Parts have become very expensive or unavailable altogether. Contractor labor costs are through the roof. We spent $20k on maintenance last year, and it will likely be that much this year too. There is only so much maintenance we can defer. Our utilities are way up also - electricity and water in particular, even though usage is not.
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Re: What (if anything) are you reducing in your monthly spending?

Post by Bama12 »

madbrain wrote: Fri May 20, 2022 4:30 pm
Bama12 wrote: Tue May 17, 2022 12:10 pm Eating out more, it's cheaper.
Cheaper than what ?
Buying food and cooking. I know it depends on what you like but for me it's cheaper eating out.
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Re: What (if anything) are you reducing in your monthly spending?

Post by madbrain »

Bama12 wrote: Fri May 20, 2022 6:08 pm Buying food and cooking. I know it depends on what you like but for me it's cheaper eating out.
I would love to see your detailed math on that. My Quicken data shows we spent $809/month for 2 adults on groceries in the last 12 months, mostly from Costco. I try to break down groceries from other items each time I enter the transaction in Quicken, since we buy many non-grocery items at Costco, also, but that category technically still includes some paper products and house cleaning products. Even if one assumes it's all food, that's $13.50/person per day of groceries. We generally each have 2 meals a day, and some snacks. A single meal for one person at in-n-out burger costs $9.57 including the 9.375% CA sales tax, which doesn't apply to most groceries. There aren't many dining options that cost less than that around here. The ones that are will all be fast foods. Even if there is a $6/meal dining option to be found, with the tax, for two meals a day, it will come close to $13.50/day per person, and that wouldn't cover the snacks.

Also, the $809/month grocery budget has a fair amount of slack in it, as it covers fancy things like Haagen Dasz ice cream, French wine, USDA Prime beef, none of which one will ever get in a $6/meal. It's likely possible to cut about $100-200/month off our grocery bill by eating less fancy items, and/or fewer of them. Probably possible to cut a lot more if trying for the bare minimum amount of food to survive with the cheapest possible staple foods like grains and canned foods, but who wants that ?
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Re: What (if anything) are you reducing in your monthly spending?

Post by delamer »

madbrain wrote: Fri May 20, 2022 7:26 pm
Bama12 wrote: Fri May 20, 2022 6:08 pm Buying food and cooking. I know it depends on what you like but for me it's cheaper eating out.
I would love to see your detailed math on that. My Quicken data shows we spent $809/month for 2 adults on groceries in the last 12 months, mostly from Costco. I try to break down groceries from other items each time I enter the transaction in Quicken, since we buy many non-grocery items at Costco, also, but that category technically still includes some paper products and house cleaning products. Even if one assumes it's all food, that's $13.50/person per day of groceries. We generally each have 2 meals a day, and some snacks. A single meal for one person at in-n-out burger costs $9.57 including the 9.375% CA sales tax, which doesn't apply to most groceries. There aren't many dining options that cost less than that around here. The ones that are will all be fast foods. Even if there is a $6/meal dining option to be found, with the tax, for two meals a day, it will come close to $13.50/day per person, and that wouldn't cover the snacks.

Also, the $809/month grocery budget has a fair amount of slack in it, as it covers fancy things like Haagen Dasz ice cream, French wine, USDA Prime beef, none of which one will ever get in a $6/meal. It's likely possible to cut about $100-200/month off our grocery bill by eating less fancy items, and/or fewer of them. Probably possible to cut a lot more if trying for the bare minimum amount of food to survive with the cheapest possible staple foods like grains and canned foods, but who wants that ?
There are very few “dining out” meals that don’t provide at least two meals for me. We got Chipotle carryout yesterday, and a burrito bowl is three meals.

But, generally, dining out is more expensive for equivalent quality.
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Re: What (if anything) are you reducing in your monthly spending?

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Re: What (if anything) are you reducing in your monthly spending?

Post by smectym »

madbrain wrote: Fri May 20, 2022 5:23 pm Not many Bogleheads seem to be struggling with their cash flow. I guess that's expected in this forum. Unfortunately, not the case for us.
I have been unemployed for 13 of the last 17 months. It seems my 25 year career as a software engineer has sadly come to a close.

Things we have cut :
1) satellite TV bill . About $800/year
2) dining out. Not 100% of it, but most. About $5000/year. The inflation has really been insane on these. Same meal that cost about $50 pre-pandemic now ends up costing about $75.
3) annual fee credit cards. About $1000/year . Reduced travel means we can't use the benefits.
4) life insurance. Our ported premiums double every 5 years and just became too high. $4500/year. No other coverage we can qualify for.
5) long term care insurance. About $1000/year
6) switched auto/car insurer . Increased auto policy deductibles to $1500 from $1000. Home deductible to $10k. This was merely to keep the premiums the same. They couldn't be reduced.
7) movies. About $1000/year. We haven't gone back to a theater since pandemic started.
8) pest control service. About $500/year
9), travel, for obvious reasons. About $8k/year

There are more to come that I haven't implemented yet.

All these cuts still don't offset the very rapidly escalating costs in maintaining our home. Parts have become very expensive or unavailable altogether. Contractor labor costs are through the roof. We spent $20k on maintenance last year, and it will likely be that much this year too. There is only so much maintenance we can defer. Our utilities are way up also - electricity and water in particular, even though usage is not.
Madbrain, thanks for a very useful list. Some of the cuts you detail are indeed painful. Others perhaps are good highlighters of non-essential spending that we too will look at axing. We’re retired, so don’t face job angst, but we have budget issues as well.

Congratulations on a great career, and if you’re still looking, hope an opportunity comes your way soon.
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Re: What (if anything) are you reducing in your monthly spending?

Post by mw1739 »

No major changes so far as we have plenty of room in the budget. Starting to notice increases in groceries and gas prices. May try to reduce driving if prices increase further. Went ahead and pre bought enough meat for the summer grilling season as I foresee further price increases in that area. Expensive vacation in June still unchanged and thinking about another in August. Overall minimal impact but the higher prices are definitely noticeable. We’re fortunate to easily absorb it.
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Re: What (if anything) are you reducing in your monthly spending?

Post by sschoe2 »

My spending is already bare bones so not much room to reasonably cut. I live off about $35k per year.
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Re: What (if anything) are you reducing in your monthly spending?

Post by 22twain »

We're retired, ages 68/73, in a LCOL area. Our lifestyle is pretty low-key by the standards of this forum. Even with the recent drop in the markets, our annual total spending rate is less than 2% of our assets. This is before accounting for my wife's Social Security, which covers about half of our spending. I'm still waiting to claim SS at 70.

Groceries have definitely gone up, but we can still afford them easily. Last weekend I did a day-trip to a hobby show which cost me about $40 in gas instead of $30 a couple of years ago. On the way home I spent about $30 on dinner, including a generous tip, instead of about $20 a couple of years ago.

We haven't felt the need to cut anything out yet.
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Re: What (if anything) are you reducing in your monthly spending?

Post by mrspock »

I’m not cutting anything. I’m just putting in bonus years into my retirement fund, and enjoying the excess funds (finally). Just bought a car for the first time in forever. I’ll probably buy another later this year.

Data point #1: I bought a nearly new car (<5k mikes) for thousands under MSRP, and grinded the sales guy lower than asking price. Pretty sure a few months back that wouldn’t have been possible.

Data point #2: Seeing houses cut prices too on my saved searches. Higher mortgage rates are working their magic. Personally… I hope they hit 7 or 8% in a 30yr.

I think this is good news, the sooner things cool off — with a recession if necessary — the better off we will all be (i.e. inflation should come down). This time, I don’t think JPOW will have our backs…. we will be on our own.
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Re: What (if anything) are you reducing in your monthly spending?

Post by Wanderingwheelz »

mrspock wrote: Sat May 21, 2022 1:45 am I’m not cutting anything. I’m just putting in bonus years into my retirement fund, and enjoying the excess funds (finally). Just bought a car for the first time in forever. I’ll probably buy another later this year.

Data point #1: I bought a nearly new car (<5k mikes) for thousands under MSRP, and grinded the sales guy lower than asking price. Pretty sure a few months back that wouldn’t have been possible.

Data point #2: Seeing houses cut prices too on my saved searches. Higher mortgage rates are working their magic. Personally… I hope they hit 7 or 8% in a 30yr.

I think this is good news, the sooner things cool off — with a recession if necessary — the better off we will all be (i.e. inflation should come down). This time, I don’t think JPOW will have our backs…. we will be on our own.
“We will be on our own“ isn’t all that problematic for most of us here on the forum (The land of the 2% SWR), but I cringe at the thought of most of the rest of America having to adjust to a stark “new normal”.

As for us, we haven’t cut back on anything, explicitly. I suppose I’m cutting back subconsciously- which I think most of the people who say they’re not cutting back are doing. Some of this is human nature. For things that are done consciously and for reasons we think are good ones, we’ve actually been spending more. Cars alone over the last month have been about $45,000, net of trade-in/sale of old ones. That wasn’t difficult to do, since even if we are entering a dark time, I’ve got three new cars that will last 10+ years If need be.

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Re: What (if anything) are you reducing in your monthly spending?

Post by chipperd »

Bama12 wrote: Fri May 20, 2022 6:08 pm
madbrain wrote: Fri May 20, 2022 4:30 pm
Bama12 wrote: Tue May 17, 2022 12:10 pm Eating out more, it's cheaper.
Cheaper than what ?
Buying food and cooking. I know it depends on what you like but for me it's cheaper eating out.
Could you kindly provide a short list of what you cook and eat at home vs what you order and eat out?
Thanks
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Re: What (if anything) are you reducing in your monthly spending?

Post by Pacific »

Phoenix Suns tickets.
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Re: What (if anything) are you reducing in your monthly spending?

Post by darkhorse346 »

Cut Hulu to the lowest cost option. Eh, so we lost live TV and some of the channels we just thought we HAD to have...

Watch local news livestream on internet.
I can READ the national/world/business news on apps for free without a lot of the annoying TV personalities and the fear-mongering.

Been doing this for a little over a month. Only regret I have is we didn't do this sooner. :beer
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Re: What (if anything) are you reducing in your monthly spending?

Post by MH2 »

Internet service. Going down from 40 to 10 a month.
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Re: What (if anything) are you reducing in your monthly spending?

Post by wander »

Not much to change, I have to drive to work like many people. Folks on TV recommend to drive less sounds ridiculous to me.
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Re: What (if anything) are you reducing in your monthly spending?

Post by A440 »

Reducing or pausing Roth IRA contributions in our case seems to be the best solution. We have been contributing the maximum permitted since 1998 and years of compounding has worked its magic. So hitting the pause button would free up to ~$1,000/month if needed for other needs. However, the Boglehead saver in me has to fight with the knowledge that stocks are on "sale" right now and I would be missing on a good opportunity to add to my 3-fund portfolio at a discount. :happy
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Re: What (if anything) are you reducing in your monthly spending?

Post by Jack FFR1846 »

To reduce family spending, our son who still lives with us commutes 50 miles one way to work. He's using my Crosstrek that gets 30 mpg on regular gas to save money instead of driving his STi that gets 20 mpg on premium.

I've also been cleaning stuff out and using Craigslist to help with the cleaning. An old college refrigerator that's been in my shed for 4 years, gone for $20. A ladder gone for $80. A broken chainsaw (advertised with what's wrong) sold for $75. This has also opened up room in both the garage and shed. I'm in the process of building rails on my snowmobile trailer to sell extra firewood as fall approaches. The wood I'm using is from a pile saved behind the garage, so the cost is going to be zero. I'll advertise on Craigslist and avoid disclosing where my wood is stored by only selling by delivery so I don't get startled with a strange pickup and guys stealing the wood.
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Re: What (if anything) are you reducing in your monthly spending?

Post by livesoft »

smectym wrote: Fri May 20, 2022 9:00 pm [...] Others perhaps are good highlighters of non-essential spending that we too will look at axing. We’re retired, so don’t face job angst, but we have budget issues as well.
It was rather interesting to read that list. Two-thirds of those expenses we never had in the first place. Other typical expenses in our neighborhood not on our list are pool service and lawn service neither of which we have.
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Re: What (if anything) are you reducing in your monthly spending?

Post by madbrain »

smectym wrote: Fri May 20, 2022 9:00 pm Madbrain, thanks for a very useful list. Some of the cuts you detail are indeed painful. Others perhaps are good highlighters of non-essential spending that we too will look at axing.
Thanks. Some of the above cuts were hard, others easy.
We’re retired, so don’t face job angst, but we have budget issues as well.

Congratulations on a great career, and if you’re still looking, hope an opportunity comes your way soon.
Unfortunately, job angst is very much still a thing for me. I'm still looking for job opportunities, but I don't know how much longer I'll keep my search going. It seems futile to keep trying, after the number of lengthy (5 hour+) interviews I have done that not only didn't result in offers, but even in the decency of any response at all. I might need a career change, but I have literally never done any job in my life that didn't relate to software, so I have no idea what that could be.

I'm 45, and was planning on retiring at 50. My husband still works, but doesn't earn much above the CA $15/hr minimum wage. Even though we are completely debt free, we live in a mansion built with a lot of custom things that have become expensive to fix since the pandemic started. The combination of high inflation and loss of income is not a good one. And this year, the portfolio is also down to 15x last year's annual spending, which already included a couple of those spending cuts. 6.6% is a long way from an SWR. With one of us working low-wage, and taxes being close to zero, the portfolio only needs to cover 70% of the spending. By that metric, that makes it 21.6x last of year's spending. Still 4.62%, not what I would consider safe. Hence the need to watch the cash flow carefully.
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Re: What (if anything) are you reducing in your monthly spending?

Post by madbrain »

livesoft wrote: Sat May 21, 2022 6:46 am It was rather interesting to read that list. Two-thirds of those expenses we never had in the first place. Other typical expenses in our neighborhood not on our list are pool service and lawn service neither of which we have.
We don't have a pool. I don't do the repairs on the hot tub myself, but I do take care of all the chemicals myself. That needs to be done pretty much every time it's used. Tested before getting in, at minimum.

I do have a gardener, who mostly takes cares of the lawn, but also trees. That's $1620/year. And that's one of the cuts I'm still looking to make.
I also estimate the cost of watering the lawn to be about $100/month, half our very expensive water bill due to the very punitive rates with the California drought. I have been thinking about eliminating the lawn altogether, actually.

Our electric bill has gone from $0 to $3000/year in the last decade due to changes in PG&E TOU hours, which became more expensive when the sun doesn't shine, when it used to be the opposite; as well as adding a second EV 5 years ago. I have been wanting to install more solar panels to get the electric bill back to $0. I was just researching ground mounted solar to go where the front lawn is. It would be unsightly, though. It seems it's more expensive than rooftop, unfortunately. Perhaps filling the north west facing side of the roof makes more sense. I'm not sure how much less they would produce vs the south east facing side. It's a bit hard for me to pull the trigger on an expensive project of that sort with current limited cash flow.
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Re: What (if anything) are you reducing in your monthly spending?

Post by Mr. Rumples »

I go to the grocery store every - and I mean every - day. (The only exception was during the worst of Covid.) I do this since I have a terrible sweet tooth. If I buy three pounds of peaches, all of it will be gone by the end of the day. Thus, I go and and a least get some fruit. There is a Kroger near me which I avoid, its as if the cashiers took lessons in rudeness. I therefore go to a Kroger which is about five miles away. Now, with gas prices, I go to the one near me as aggravating as it is.
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Re: What (if anything) are you reducing in your monthly spending?

Post by chazas »

I haven’t, really. I rejiggered my life after divorce a few years ago when I realized I couldn’t sustain the same lifestyle indefinitely and in a fairly close retirement on half the savings. Very nice house, but in a much less expensive exurb. I don’t do takeout, I cook. I go to a nice restaurant when there is a reason to, but not all the time. I do my own yard work and pool maintenance. When I want to buy something pricey, like home furnishings, I first check used prices from FB marketplace, eBay, etc. I notice inflation primarily in gas prices (I don’t drive to commute, but drive downtown to see my BF routinely). parking, restaurants and travel. Food prices are higher but I save a lot by shopping at less expensive stores and buying what’s on sale. Anyway, my work income was really high for me last year, so I’ve more than kept up to date with inflation.

While I’ve been pondering retirement in about 18 months, or at least seriously downshifting, some of what’s going on feels a lot like 2008 to me, and I was very lucky to keep my job (and had my compensation cut in half). So I’m diverting all extra savings to cash holdings, even though they’re never going to keep up with inflation, and mentally preparing myself for the possibility of a shock.

I have a lot of slack if that comes to pass. I’ve actually been taking care of some larger semi discretionary items while I have the cash flow to pay for them - for example I just finished a somewhat expensive landscaping project, but if we go into recession and it affects my job status anything else like that that comes up can just be ignored. I had three nice vacations in the past 18 months, I will not be planning more of those until things settle. Bar and restaurant tabs would be next to go - my BF and I did just fine during COVID when it was all cooking and eating at home, barbecuing by the pool, etc. I’ve looked at cutting cable/streaming costs, and will probably take a hard look at that about the time I retire, but even though recurring those don’t move the needle that much.
Last edited by chazas on Sat May 21, 2022 8:04 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: What (if anything) are you reducing in your monthly spending?

Post by whodidntante »

delamer wrote: Fri May 20, 2022 8:25 pm There are very few “dining out” meals that don’t provide at least two meals for me. We got Chipotle carryout yesterday, and a burrito bowl is three meals.

But, generally, dining out is more expensive for equivalent quality.
I eat most meals out. The meals range from buy one get one free chicken wings, a $10 meal, to $125 steaks. Just for the steak.

It's kind of the reason that people hire somebody to cut their grass, but dining out requires me to pay a lower cost of labor on average. It's a bad idea for those who don't want to pay for that much labor.
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Re: What (if anything) are you reducing in your monthly spending?

Post by JackoC »

delamer wrote: Fri May 20, 2022 8:25 pm
madbrain wrote: Fri May 20, 2022 7:26 pm
Bama12 wrote: Fri May 20, 2022 6:08 pm Buying food and cooking. I know it depends on what you like but for me it's cheaper eating out.
I would love to see your detailed math on that. My Quicken data shows ...
1. There are very few “dining out” meals that don’t provide at least two meals for me. We got Chipotle carryout yesterday, and a burrito bowl is three meals.

2. But, generally, dining out is more expensive for equivalent quality.
1. True for us too and increasingly as appetite decreases with age. Although that should in theory reflect in supermarket bills also.

2. If a person has a goal of adequately nourishing themselves for the absolute fewest $'s, eating out more is almost never the answer I agree. But just looking at my pretty complete record for 'supermarket category' spending (including non-food) and the eat out/takeout category it's hard to say just how much cheaper eating home is, because all else is not typically equal. There are a few clear inversions of the normal relationship. For example, Burger King is still $10.66 including tax for a more than filling meal for each of us, whereas when we get sushi at the Japanese supermarket it's around $40 for two, if we invite grown kids they eat much more so it's >>$20/person. But even excluding outliers like that, I don't have a clear quantitative idea how marginally more meals out/take out vs. supermarket>home would affect our spending in $'s, the stuff we'd actually choose. Fortunately it doesn't matter a lot for us what we spend on food, (I track not 'budget' it) and changes in response to recent inflation are ad hoc mainly based on some things increasing faster than others, rather than the overall inflation rate ('that particular thing no longer seems as good a relative value compared to this other particular thing').
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Re: What (if anything) are you reducing in your monthly spending?

Post by howard71 »

Beer. Been averaging probably a six pack a day for a long time. At the current price that amounts to > $300/month. So that all by itself is offsetting the current effect of inflation on the monthly budget (not to mention the health benefits, of course).

Also cutting way down on eating out as others have suggested. This is not only for the money savings but since retiring 6 years ago I've learned to cook well enough that I can make a far better tasting and more nutritious meal than any fast-food place as well as most low-end restaurants. So, eating out has simply been losing its appeal even before inflation.
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Re: What (if anything) are you reducing in your monthly spending?

Post by jebmke »

Mr. Rumples wrote: Sat May 21, 2022 7:17 am I go to the grocery store every - and I mean every - day. (The only exception was during the worst of Covid.) I do this since I have a terrible sweet tooth. If I buy three pounds of peaches, all of it will be gone by the end of the day. Thus, I go and and a least get some fruit. There is a Kroger near me which I avoid, its as if the cashiers took lessons in rudeness. I therefore go to a Kroger which is about five miles away. Now, with gas prices, I go to the one near me as aggravating as it is.
Cashiers? Doesn't Kroger have self-checkout? Every grocery store here -- and even most mini-marts in this area - have self-checkout; and we are a rural area; most progress comes here last.
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Re: What (if anything) are you reducing in your monthly spending?

Post by Wanderingwheelz »

jebmke wrote: Sat May 21, 2022 10:35 am
Mr. Rumples wrote: Sat May 21, 2022 7:17 am I go to the grocery store every - and I mean every - day. (The only exception was during the worst of Covid.) I do this since I have a terrible sweet tooth. If I buy three pounds of peaches, all of it will be gone by the end of the day. Thus, I go and and a least get some fruit. There is a Kroger near me which I avoid, its as if the cashiers took lessons in rudeness. I therefore go to a Kroger which is about five miles away. Now, with gas prices, I go to the one near me as aggravating as it is.
Cashiers? Doesn't Kroger have self-checkout? Every grocery store here -- and even most mini-marts in this area - have self-checkout; and we are a rural area; most progress comes here last.
And where are stores consistently stocking peaches that are ripe enough to eat that same day that you buy them? When I am it’ll take at least two days from purchase before they ripe.
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Re: What (if anything) are you reducing in your monthly spending?

Post by TomatoTomahto »

madbrain wrote: Sat May 21, 2022 7:11 am
livesoft wrote: Sat May 21, 2022 6:46 am It was rather interesting to read that list. Two-thirds of those expenses we never had in the first place. Other typical expenses in our neighborhood not on our list are pool service and lawn service neither of which we have.
We don't have a pool. I don't do the repairs on the hot tub myself, but I do take care of all the chemicals myself. That needs to be done pretty much every time it's used. Tested before getting in, at minimum.

I do have a gardener, who mostly takes cares of the lawn, but also trees. That's $1620/year. And that's one of the cuts I'm still looking to make.
I also estimate the cost of watering the lawn to be about $100/month, half our very expensive water bill due to the very punitive rates with the California drought. I have been thinking about eliminating the lawn altogether, actually.

Our electric bill has gone from $0 to $3000/year in the last decade due to changes in PG&E TOU hours, which became more expensive when the sun doesn't shine, when it used to be the opposite; as well as adding a second EV 5 years ago. I have been wanting to install more solar panels to get the electric bill back to $0. I was just researching ground mounted solar to go where the front lawn is. It would be unsightly, though. It seems it's more expensive than rooftop, unfortunately. Perhaps filling the north west facing side of the roof makes more sense. I'm not sure how much less they would produce vs the south east facing side. It's a bit hard for me to pull the trigger on an expensive project of that sort with current limited cash flow.
Unless you’re subject to HOA rules, ditch the lawn entirely and plant a drought resistant meadow. Pollinators will love you for it.

I’m surprised that ground installed solar is “more expensive than rooftop.” The previous owner of our house installed the mountings, so I can’t comment other than that it surprises me that it’s a surprise to be expensive. There are some obvious advantages over roof mount:
You get to pick the orientation(s).
You don’t have to have lawn underneath.
You can use commercial (72 cell) panels rather than residential (60 cell) panels.
If you want to live large, you can have the panels automatically face the sun with a servo.
I get the FI part but not the RE part of FIRE.
S4C5
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Re: What (if anything) are you reducing in your monthly spending?

Post by S4C5 »

I live significantly below my means (750k income but live in a 1600/month apartment, cars all paid for, etc). The only thing I’m not doing now is travel, not so much that I can’t afford it but because I can’t mentally get around paying $1300 for a round trip domestic ticket in economy on a crammed seat on American and $300/night in a Hampton Inn. I feel like I am get swindled.

But Americans are still doing it. How? Credit.buy now pay later, etc…

Welcome to the new subprime crisis. When the bill comes due and they can’t pay they will have to sell out their 401ks for a loss, sell their homes, and everything will tank further.

Here we go again…

https://www.wsj.com/articles/more-subpr ... 1652952602
Gleops2
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Re: What (if anything) are you reducing in your monthly spending?

Post by Gleops2 »

I used to buy on impulse, various things, but I've stopped that completely...

I find that this downturn is coinciding with this period in my life where I am getting RID of unwanted "stuff" from a lifetime of impulsive buying.

It just makes it that much easier...more is going out than coming in ( if it's not completely necessary, like a recent water heater replacement...)

I still buy the foods I want, and thankfully, I was never a "steak person". I like it occasionally, in the summer, on the charcoal grill. I can still do that, but have not yet this summer. I can't pay 30.00 for two small ribeyes...not that I can't afford it, I just "can't".

I find now that I reuse and repurpose more, and I like it!!! If something can get more than one use, it does. Most things today we are trained to beleive have one use then throw away...nope. I save and wash Ziploc bags, pieces of plastic wrap or foil that I wash and reuse ( if it hasn't touched the food and gotten too glopped up). I use store plastic bags for single day's worth of garbage...been doing that a long time and it's SO much more sanitary to take that little bag out each day instead of a big bag in the kitchen for days.

I feed stray feral cats here ( I live in a rural area and there are always some around....).I won't skimp on thier food because I enjoy seeing them each day.

What else. I replaced a washer this year...bought one that has a HUGE capacity because I like to wash large quilts at home. I have found this new one is SO large I can do a lot less loads of laundry at a time. Less water and detergent.Since I'm retired, I don't get dirty per se and I don't wear heavy denim pants any longer..just tee shirts and shorts mostly...

I dry laundry on the line. there is always a breeze here. I live on a ridge, and most days, the stuff I hang up first is almost dry by the time I'm done hanging the load up.

I love the way wash smells from the line!!

I'm retired, and live alone. I don't eat that much, hence I really don't "care" what I spend on most foods. I do work outside on my property a lot, which I enjoy, and it seems to be SO much quieter now....I also have NO debt, which makes a HUGE difference. The pension is nice too!!!!

One unintended luxury for me, is the traffic in front of my home, a two lane state road with a posted 30MPH but mostly travelled at 60MPH, is silent and unused but for morning and evening ( Live outside of a small town. It is completely silent at night. And most of the day. I like it....but I realize for people who must drive to work etc, it's got to be brutal today. There is no "mass transit" here in ruralia.

And most of the vehicles that pass my home are 4WD pickup trucks...bought when gas was 2.00 a gallon....

This too shall pass. And maybe the habits we pick up now will last afterwards, I hope. Waste not, want not. Who knew it'd be a thing in 2022?
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LilyFleur
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Re: What (if anything) are you reducing in your monthly spending?

Post by LilyFleur »

Gleops2 wrote: Sat May 21, 2022 12:38 pm I used to buy on impulse, various things, but I've stopped that completely...

I find that this downturn is coinciding with this period in my life where I am getting RID of unwanted "stuff" from a lifetime of impulsive buying.

It just makes it that much easier...more is going out than coming in ( if it's not completely necessary, like a recent water heater replacement...)

I still buy the foods I want, and thankfully, I was never a "steak person". I like it occasionally, in the summer, on the charcoal grill. I can still do that, but have not yet this summer. I can't pay 30.00 for two small ribeyes...not that I can't afford it, I just "can't".

I find now that I reuse and repurpose more, and I like it!!! If something can get more than one use, it does. Most things today we are trained to beleive have one use then throw away...nope. I save and wash Ziploc bags, pieces of plastic wrap or foil that I wash and reuse ( if it hasn't touched the food and gotten too glopped up). I use store plastic bags for single day's worth of garbage...been doing that a long time and it's SO much more sanitary to take that little bag out each day instead of a big bag in the kitchen for days.

I feed stray feral cats here ( I live in a rural area and there are always some around....).I won't skimp on thier food because I enjoy seeing them each day.

What else. I replaced a washer this year...bought one that has a HUGE capacity because I like to wash large quilts at home. I have found this new one is SO large I can do a lot less loads of laundry at a time. Less water and detergent.Since I'm retired, I don't get dirty per se and I don't wear heavy denim pants any longer..just tee shirts and shorts mostly...

I dry laundry on the line. there is always a breeze here. I live on a ridge, and most days, the stuff I hang up first is almost dry by the time I'm done hanging the load up.

I love the way wash smells from the line!!

I'm retired, and live alone. I don't eat that much, hence I really don't "care" what I spend on most foods. I do work outside on my property a lot, which I enjoy, and it seems to be SO much quieter now....I also have NO debt, which makes a HUGE difference. The pension is nice too!!!!

One unintended luxury for me, is the traffic in front of my home, a two lane state road with a posted 30MPH but mostly travelled at 60MPH, is silent and unused but for morning and evening ( Live outside of a small town. It is completely silent at night. And most of the day. I like it....but I realize for people who must drive to work etc, it's got to be brutal today. There is no "mass transit" here in ruralia.

And most of the vehicles that pass my home are 4WD pickup trucks...bought when gas was 2.00 a gallon....

This too shall pass. And maybe the habits we pick up now will last afterwards, I hope. Waste not, want not. Who knew it'd be a thing in 2022?
I love an outdoor clothesline. As a child, I would hand the clothespins to my mother as she hung up the wash, and then I would hold the basket as she removed the dry linens and clothing. She would take a deep breath of it and say, "It smells like sunshine." Thank you for bringing this sweet memory back to me.

I live in a condo so I hang the clothing to dry on a rod in my laundry closet. I view the lint filter in the dryer as throwing pieces of clothing out in the trash. I even like the crunchy feel of towels hung to dry; they seem to absorb more.

Some parts of a frugal life can feel peaceful and meditative.
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Random Musings
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Re: What (if anything) are you reducing in your monthly spending?

Post by Random Musings »

Restaurants. The money saved covers our higher costs in groceries, electricity, natural gas and water/ sewage.

Eliminated going to cultural events, symphonies, plays and movies.

I work from home now twice a week, but sadly, my monthly gasoline costs for commuting 3 days a week is more than it was commuting five days a week a little over two years ago.

No home projects as costs have shot up. Will wait until the next recession when demand goes down, as will prices.

RM
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HanSolo
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Re: What (if anything) are you reducing in your monthly spending?

Post by HanSolo »

rich126 wrote: Fri May 20, 2022 1:48 pm It is painful although I'm not sure how much I'm cutting back. The biggest pain is the stock market. A 10, 20%, etc. loss is more money than I can make up in earning more money or saving more (it would take years to recover). And the stock loss is greater than 10% inflation.
Perhaps there's an issue with looking at short-term returns rather than long-term. Stocks are a long-term investment. What are your 5-year, 10-year, or 20-year returns? Downward blips of 10% or 20% (or even 30% or 40%) are expected, because that's what the market does. How is this not business-as-usual?
JediMisty wrote: Fri May 20, 2022 3:38 pm I haven't look for a new BF. They're expensive, so I'm saving a lot there.
Huh? I never knew that the above issue existed. I must be somehow different.
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22twain
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Re: What (if anything) are you reducing in your monthly spending?

Post by 22twain »

JediMisty wrote: Fri May 20, 2022 3:38 pm I haven't look for a new BF. They're expensive, so I'm saving a lot there.
Isn't it more often the other way around, guys complaining about how expensive their GFs are? :wink:
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AerialWombat
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Re: What (if anything) are you reducing in your monthly spending?

Post by AerialWombat »

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Last edited by AerialWombat on Mon May 23, 2022 2:41 am, edited 1 time in total.
This post is a work of fiction. Any similarity to real financial advice is purely coincidental.
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AerialWombat
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Re: What (if anything) are you reducing in your monthly spending?

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This post is a work of fiction. Any similarity to real financial advice is purely coincidental.
59Gibson
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Re: What (if anything) are you reducing in your monthly spending?

Post by 59Gibson »

S4C5 wrote: Sat May 21, 2022 12:04 pm I live significantly below my means (750k income but live in a 1600/month apartment, cars all paid for, etc). The only thing I’m not doing now is travel, not so much that I can’t afford it but because I can’t mentally get around paying $1300 for a round trip domestic ticket in economy on a crammed seat on American and $300/night in a Hampton Inn. I feel like I am get swindled.

But Americans are still doing it. How? Credit.buy now pay later, etc…

Welcome to the new subprime crisis. When the bill comes due and they can’t pay they will have to sell out their 401ks for a loss, sell their homes, and everything will tank further.

Here we go again…

https://www.wsj.com/articles/more-subpr ... 1652952602
We're passing on a 5 day beach getaway in June. Accomodations are up about 35% from last yr. The decision is not based on stock market performance or affordability, It's principles. Total trip would prob be nearly double from 2018-2020( I realize 2020 there were extenuating circumstances). I simply cannot do it, I'll wait and/or give myself time to get adjusted to these prices. :)
stoptothink
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Re: What (if anything) are you reducing in your monthly spending?

Post by stoptothink »

AerialWombat wrote: Sun May 22, 2022 12:20 am
LilyFleur wrote: Sat May 21, 2022 2:01 pm I even like the crunchy feel of towels hung to dry; they seem to absorb more.
I love the feeling of crunchy, air dried towels.

I’ve lived for a few years now without a clothes dryer. Use drying racks instead.

But I recently sold a rental property, and kept the washer and dryer from that house. It’s nice having a full-size washing machine, but the dryer doesn’t get used. It’s a waste of space. Keeping my drying racks.
I too have a preference for the crunchiness of air dried towels. We air dry ~90% of our laundry, but my wife demands that I dry her BJJ gis and any towels that others will use.
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Beensabu
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Re: What (if anything) are you reducing in your monthly spending?

Post by Beensabu »

S4C5 wrote: Sat May 21, 2022 12:04 pm Welcome to the new subprime crisis. When the bill comes due and they can’t pay they will have to sell out their 401ks for a loss, sell their homes, and everything will tank further.
401ks are protected. They don't have to sell squat. If they can make their mortgage, property tax, and home insurance payments, they don't have to sell their homes either. If they can't, they walk away in non-recourse states. Credit score in tatters, but retirement accounts intact.

Secured credit means the thing that was used to secure the credit gets repossessed. Sure, take away the vehicles people need to get to work... That'll go great... And that is what will take us down, if anything does. We're too spread out - it's a completely unique US issue. It's a mobility and public transit issue. People need a car, but they can't afford one, not really.

Unsecured credit means a lender got greedy and failed to do appropriate risk management, and now there's a bag holder somewhere.

Let's not get confused. This isn't a consumer credit crisis yet. That's when more people than not can't get access to the credit they need to keep the system going. Right now, it's a game of hot potato. What kinds of debt have you been investing in?
"The only thing that makes life possible is permanent, intolerable uncertainty; not knowing what comes next." ~Ursula LeGuin
Jerry476
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Re: What (if anything) are you reducing in your monthly spending?

Post by Jerry476 »

Cancelled the Wall St. Journal. Kept it too long mainly for the mutual fund returns. It was mostly blather that had little to do with me. Got Barron’s for six months for $26. Paid with a check so they couldn’t nail me with an auto credit card re-up.
madbrain
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Re: What (if anything) are you reducing in your monthly spending?

Post by madbrain »

TomatoTomahto wrote: Sat May 21, 2022 11:38 am Unless you’re subject to HOA rules, ditch the lawn entirely and plant a drought resistant meadow. Pollinators will love you for it.
No HOA, thankfully. I have to look into this.
I’m surprised that ground installed solar is “more expensive than rooftop.” The previous owner of our house installed the mountings, so I can’t comment other than that it surprises me that it’s a surprise to be expensive.
I haven't gotten actual quotes, but all the research I have done online says the same things. Both the ground mounts and pole mounts are more expensive than roof mounts.
There are some obvious advantages over roof mount:
You get to pick the orientation(s).
In theory, you can use tilt mounts on your roof too, but those can also be expensive, and ugly.
You can use commercial (72 cell) panels rather than residential (60 cell) panels.
I wasn't aware this was a problem. What's the advantage in using 72 cell panels ?
If you want to live large, you can have the panels automatically face the sun with a servo.
I have read that the tracking mounts are prone to failures over time, which would increase costs. This is something I would want to avoid.
And I don't really want to "live large" - this a thread about cutting spending, after all :)

If I expand my PV, I would want it to provide a reasonable payback, 7 years or less ideally. I may have to change my main panel to add any PV capacity, regardless of location, so I don't know if this is achievable or not. It's also hard to predict paytback when PG&E changes its rates 4 times a year, and the CPUC just rubberstamps them. SJCE has also increased its generation rates quite a bit. The rate structure changes are also problematic, with my E-6 rate now having 8 months of "winter" rates and 4 months of "summer" rates. And it will be the same when I'm transitioned to ETOU-C or ETOU-D next year.
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AnnetteLouisan
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Re: What (if anything) are you reducing in your monthly spending?

Post by AnnetteLouisan »

Godot wrote: Tue May 17, 2022 12:08 pm
stoptothink wrote: Tue May 17, 2022 12:06 pm
runner3081 wrote: Tue May 17, 2022 12:02 pm Nope, not cutting back. We are frugal and also minimalists. We have seen the cost increases hit us (mostly in food and household items), but there isn't really anything to cut back.
In the same boat. Our budget is bare bones, almost unbelievable to most here. I guess we could cut out our gym memberships, but otherwise our discretionary spending is almost non-existent.
Dito (also cutting back on my use of t's).
Same here. Cut back so long ago there’s very little left to cut back on - maybe $200/mo or so of fat is left (unused landline). But I also don’t need to cut back because my saving rate is so high and my annual raise exceeded my increased costs. I already have most of everything I need. But I am planning to spend more.

Sorry to hear some BHlers are unemployed and some even cutting back on proteins due to inflation (I won’t identify the individual but they posted about it).
Last edited by AnnetteLouisan on Fri May 27, 2022 8:07 am, edited 2 times in total.
Exterous
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Re: What (if anything) are you reducing in your monthly spending?

Post by Exterous »

TomatoTomahto wrote: Sat May 21, 2022 11:38 am
madbrain wrote: Sat May 21, 2022 7:11 am
livesoft wrote: Sat May 21, 2022 6:46 am It was rather interesting to read that list. Two-thirds of those expenses we never had in the first place. Other typical expenses in our neighborhood not on our list are pool service and lawn service neither of which we have.
We don't have a pool. I don't do the repairs on the hot tub myself, but I do take care of all the chemicals myself. That needs to be done pretty much every time it's used. Tested before getting in, at minimum.

I do have a gardener, who mostly takes cares of the lawn, but also trees. That's $1620/year. And that's one of the cuts I'm still looking to make.
I also estimate the cost of watering the lawn to be about $100/month, half our very expensive water bill due to the very punitive rates with the California drought. I have been thinking about eliminating the lawn altogether, actually.

Our electric bill has gone from $0 to $3000/year in the last decade due to changes in PG&E TOU hours, which became more expensive when the sun doesn't shine, when it used to be the opposite; as well as adding a second EV 5 years ago. I have been wanting to install more solar panels to get the electric bill back to $0. I was just researching ground mounted solar to go where the front lawn is. It would be unsightly, though. It seems it's more expensive than rooftop, unfortunately. Perhaps filling the north west facing side of the roof makes more sense. I'm not sure how much less they would produce vs the south east facing side. It's a bit hard for me to pull the trigger on an expensive project of that sort with current limited cash flow.
Unless you’re subject to HOA rules, ditch the lawn entirely and plant a drought resistant meadow. Pollinators will love you for it.

I’m surprised that ground installed solar is “more expensive than rooftop.” The previous owner of our house installed the mountings, so I can’t comment other than that it surprises me that it’s a surprise to be expensive. There are some obvious advantages over roof mount:
You get to pick the orientation(s).
You don’t have to have lawn underneath.
You can use commercial (72 cell) panels rather than residential (60 cell) panels.
If you want to live large, you can have the panels automatically face the sun with a servo.
I got a quote for both and ground mount was more expensive. When I asked why it basically came down to economies of scale for them. They do mostly residential roof top solar so they get bigger volume discounts on roof mounting hardware. Their crews are also more proficient at roof top mounts which I took to mean labor time and, therefore, costs would be a little higher for ground mount. They'd be perfectly happy to do a ground mount but it was ~15% more expensive. That said I have no way to verify that so just passing it along
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AnnetteLouisan
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Re: What (if anything) are you reducing in your monthly spending?

Post by AnnetteLouisan »

This may seem counterintuitive, but I spend more in bad times because everyone needs it more. I buy better gifts, give bigger tips, buy myself treats and health stuff, patronize businesses I like and generally upgrade. In harsh times we need extra TLC as a salve. It goes over better than in spendy times when some take it for granted, and everyone appreciates it more it seems. In good times I store up for the bad times.
Exterous
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Re: What (if anything) are you reducing in your monthly spending?

Post by Exterous »

Slightly counter intuitive but we're traveling farther away to save some money. Like many we like to head to warmer places in the winter and the costs for this coming Dec\Jan were significantly more expensive than we've paid in the past. So instead of more traditional stomping grounds of Mexico, Caribbean islands or Central America countries we're headed to the Canary islands. While we used points for the flights tickets would have been a couple hundred more than Cancun or San Jose CR and nearly the same cost as flights to Aruba, Cayman Islands, Jamaica etc. AirBnB and car rental prices were significantly cheaper though making it the cheaper choice for us. That said it won't be quite as warm - with highs in the low 70s but that is still much better than highs in the upper 20s we'll likely get at home
hmw
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Re: What (if anything) are you reducing in your monthly spending?

Post by hmw »

I have not made any effort to cut spending. We don't live extravagantly. I have noticed that my gas bill has gone up. I drive about 15k miles a year. Summer vacation budget has gone up as well. Just spent 6k on airfare last night. But compare the cost of living increase to the drop to my investment account this year, it's nothing. :)
cs412a
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Re: What (if anything) are you reducing in your monthly spending?

Post by cs412a »

AnnetteLouisan wrote: Mon May 23, 2022 8:32 pm This may seem counterintuitive, but I spend more in bad times because everyone needs it more. I buy better gifts, give bigger tips, buy myself treats and health stuff, patronize businesses I like and generally upgrade. In harsh times we need extra TLC as a salve. It goes over better than in spendy times when some take it for granted, and everyone appreciates it more it seems. In good times I store up for the bad times.
I love this perspective :beer
stoaX
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Re: What (if anything) are you reducing in your monthly spending?

Post by stoaX »

howard71 wrote: Sat May 21, 2022 10:15 am Beer. Been averaging probably a six pack a day for a long time. At the current price that amounts to > $300/month. So that all by itself is offsetting the current effect of inflation on the monthly budget (not to mention the health benefits, of course).

Also cutting way down on eating out as others have suggested. This is not only for the money savings but since retiring 6 years ago I've learned to cook well enough that I can make a far better tasting and more nutritious meal than any fast-food place as well as most low-end restaurants. So, eating out has simply been losing its appeal even before inflation.
I've cut back on the alcohol as well, for both the health and financial benefits. My wife is doing a better job than me at it.
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