Auto withdrawal from a checking account

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regfman
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Auto withdrawal from a checking account

Post by regfman »

Here's something I've always wondered:

I grew up with writing paper checks but have been a tech guy for many years and started using online banking to pay monthly bills when it was first generally offered to customers in the 90s. I would log in and pay each bill with a specific fund transfer to the utility companies, my health insurance bill, the credit card bills, etc.

Now I am using more autopay where appropriate. In situations like the utility bills and insurance I use autopay. That requires that I have given the payee my bank routing number and my checking account number to withdraw funds from. When I set those up I did not have to inform my bank that I was setting up an autopayment to a particular party. The bank just gets the request from a utility company to transfer funds out of my checking account and the bank makes the transfer.

What protections keep anyone that knows my bank routing number and my checking account number from initiating a request to transfer funds out of my account? I've always wondered this. This morning I started a chat session with my bank and asked if there is a way to restrict which entities can withdraw funds from my account and they said No. They just said that if there is a charge I don't recognize I can go open a claim. That seems insecure, but somehow I guess it works. Seems it would be better to have some list of approved transfer entiites. I would be fine entering the dozen entities that are authorized to withdraw fund or deposit funds to my checking account. Citi bank does not appear to have this feature.
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8foot7
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Re: Auto withdrawal from a checking account

Post by 8foot7 »

On a consumer account there are no protections in advance. This is partially why ACH is slow — it is operated in anticipation of transactions being reversed.

Businesses can typically subscribe to a positive pay service where transactions are white listed and any transaction that attempts to post not on that white list can be decisions before a certain cut off time or rejected automatically.
student
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Re: Auto withdrawal from a checking account

Post by student »

Why would you setup auto pay with your utility companies and insurance companies using checking account rather than credit card? Do they not accept credit cards? If you must use checking account, limit the amount of money you have in the checking account and disable overdraft protection from your savings account.
Big Dog
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Re: Auto withdrawal from a checking account

Post by Big Dog »

This is an example on why one should always balance their checking account. (Yeah, I get that most probably do not.)
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whodidntante
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Re: Auto withdrawal from a checking account

Post by whodidntante »

student wrote: Sun May 15, 2022 7:53 am If you must use checking account, limit the amount of money you have in the checking account and disable overdraft protection from your savings account.
Meh. YMMV. I always decline overdraft protection when opening a checking account.

I had a $2000 direct debit hit a Wells Fargo checking account* with $1500 in it once. Overdraft was disabled. The transaction went through regardless, and then I just had a -$500 balance. I think banks love this kind of stuff as a fee generator.
* one that I actually opened :twisted:

I did a wire transfer to bring the account positive. The only fee I ended up with was $15 to receive a wire transfer.
student
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Re: Auto withdrawal from a checking account

Post by student »

whodidntante wrote: Sun May 15, 2022 8:05 am
student wrote: Sun May 15, 2022 7:53 am If you must use checking account, limit the amount of money you have in the checking account and disable overdraft protection from your savings account.
Meh. YMMV. I always decline overdraft protection when opening a checking account.

I had a $2000 direct debit hit a Wells Fargo checking account* with $1500 in it once. Overdraft was disabled. The transaction went through regardless, and then I just had a -$500 balance. I think banks love this kind of stuff as a fee generator.
* one that I actually opened :twisted:

I did a wire transfer to bring the account positive. The only fee I ended up with was $15 to receive a wire transfer.
Well. Wells Fargo. That's the problem. Joking aside, did you ask them why they do that? Even if they reject it, they will probably charge you for insufficient fund. I assume that if the direct debit was $2,000,000, they would not cover it. There is a local bank here that advertises they will let you overdraw your account with no fee as long as you cover it within 24 hours. I assume that there is a dollar amount limit.
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whodidntante
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Re: Auto withdrawal from a checking account

Post by whodidntante »

student wrote: Sun May 15, 2022 8:11 am
whodidntante wrote: Sun May 15, 2022 8:05 am
student wrote: Sun May 15, 2022 7:53 am If you must use checking account, limit the amount of money you have in the checking account and disable overdraft protection from your savings account.
Meh. YMMV. I always decline overdraft protection when opening a checking account.

I had a $2000 direct debit hit a Wells Fargo checking account* with $1500 in it once. Overdraft was disabled. The transaction went through regardless, and then I just had a -$500 balance. I think banks love this kind of stuff as a fee generator.
* one that I actually opened :twisted:

I did a wire transfer to bring the account positive. The only fee I ended up with was $15 to receive a wire transfer.
Well. Wells Fargo. That's the problem. Joking aside, did you ask them why they do that? Even if they reject it, they will probably charge you for insufficient fund. I assume that if the direct debit was $2,000,000, they would not cover it. There is a local bank here that advertises they will let you overdraw your account with no fee as long as you cover it within 24 hours. I assume that there is a dollar amount limit.
No. I prefer my only interaction with customer service to occur at account closing. And that's only because the banks prefer to not provide a "close account" button. :twisted:

They can still charge you a fee even if the transaction is declined.
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Re: Auto withdrawal from a checking account

Post by jebmke »

In the days of writing checks, you gave the routing number and account number out every time you wrote a check. My USAA bill pay issues many checks to payees (it isn't an ACH transfer for most). I see no issue here.

I do use a credit card for much of our spend; more for convenience as well as consolidating cash management each month. A few, like utilities are direct debit on the checking account; I always get an email notification of the invoice being issued (elecronically) so I always know what the debit will be. My bank system is set to alert me to any payment over a "small" amount (can't recall the amount).
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Re: Auto withdrawal from a checking account

Post by LadyGeek »

This thread is now in the Personal Finance (Not Investing) forum (checking account).
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PaunchyPirate
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Re: Auto withdrawal from a checking account

Post by PaunchyPirate »

student wrote: Sun May 15, 2022 7:53 am Why would you setup auto pay with your utility companies and insurance companies using checking account rather than credit card? Do they not accept credit cards? If you must use checking account, limit the amount of money you have in the checking account and disable overdraft protection from your savings account.
It's not uncommon for utility companies to not accept credit card payments for auto payments. In my town, the local gas company and the city's sewer/water/trash authority do not accept credit cards. You must link to a bank account if you want auto payment. Annoying, but a fact of life in my location. I assume the same is true for some insurance companies.
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goingup
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Re: Auto withdrawal from a checking account

Post by goingup »

I get a notification from my bank when a new payee is set up. Also get a notification when a bill payment has been set up. Check your bank to see what notifications can be set up. Other than that I don't see a reason to worry about things that will likely never happen. If they do happen, even though you have been proactive, just deal with it then. :beer
KlangFool
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Re: Auto withdrawal from a checking account

Post by KlangFool »

regfman wrote: Sun May 15, 2022 7:28 am
Now I am using more autopay where appropriate. In situations like the utility bills and insurance I use autopay. That requires that I have given the payee my bank routing number and my checking account number to withdraw funds from. When I set those up I did not have to inform my bank that I was setting up an autopayment to a particular party. The bank just gets the request from a utility company to transfer funds out of my checking account and the bank makes the transfer.
regfman,

Why? This is not safe. The payment is pulled from utility and insurance. And, you need to key in the information to many places. More places for folks to break in and steal your A/C information.

I use my bank's payment system to push payment to utility and insurance. Or, I use credit card to pay.

With the bank's payment system, everything is centralized.

What if one of them made a mistake and pull 10K from you? And, then, every other payment bounces and you ended up bounce check fee. This is the same problem with debit card.

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Re: Auto withdrawal from a checking account

Post by KlangFool »

goingup wrote: Sun May 15, 2022 9:22 am
I get a notification from my bank when a new payee is set up. Also get a notification when a bill payment has been set up.
goingup,

Only if the payment is setup on the bank side. Aka, the payment is pushed from the bank. In OP's case, the payment is pulled from the utility. There will be no notification since the bank know nothing about this.

KlangFool
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goingup
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Re: Auto withdrawal from a checking account

Post by goingup »

KlangFool wrote: Sun May 15, 2022 9:26 am
goingup wrote: Sun May 15, 2022 9:22 am
I get a notification from my bank when a new payee is set up. Also get a notification when a bill payment has been set up.
goingup,

Only if the payment is setup on the bank side. Aka, the payment is pushed from the bank. In OP's case, the payment is pulled from the utility. There will be no notification since the bank know nothing about this.

KlangFool
I agree with you.
I think the OP is worried about fraud. That is, some unknown fraudster getting his banking info and tapping into (and drawing from) his checking account.
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CRC_Volunteer
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Re: Auto withdrawal from a checking account

Post by CRC_Volunteer »

I have been using auto drafts for 30+ years. I setup my account to generate an email on any withdrawal activity that exceeds $.01. As for routing/transit information being out in the wild, depending on which state you live in, it already is. That is why I have the email notification activated. Also, the bank will make good any unauthorized activity.

For all the years DW and I worked overseas, we still needed bills to be paid when we were not stateside. I am/have been completely comfortable with this process.

BTW, most banks ask for the last 004 digits of your SSN for verification. Change that to a password. Your last 004 digits of you SSN are definitely out in the wild.
Last edited by CRC_Volunteer on Sun May 15, 2022 9:42 am, edited 1 time in total.
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JoMoney
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Re: Auto withdrawal from a checking account

Post by JoMoney »

If you have the money in the account, unfortunately there's no whitelisting of only the select few that can draw on it.
Financial institutions that have access to the ACH system though are required to know their clients and vet them, so for someone to tell their bank to transfer money from your account, presumably their bank knows them and has the capability of taking recourse against them if they're requesting fraudulent transactions.
Further, "The Electronic Funds Transfer Act" or "Reg E" provides consumer protections if a fraudulent transaction occurs against your account. You are required to report it immediately, but your bank is required to take action to make you whole. It is possible your account could become over-drawn and that might create additional problems with other third-parties, bounced checks... etc... and there's not a whole of recourse from those impacts, you just have to get the matter reported and fixed with your bank, then resubmit payment to the legitimate payee. I avoid writing physical checks, in part to avoid any possibility of a "bounced check" which can have more severe consequences than a payment failed through ACH request.
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KlangFool
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Re: Auto withdrawal from a checking account

Post by KlangFool »

CRC_Volunteer wrote: Sun May 15, 2022 9:34 am I have been using auto drafts for 30+ years. I setup my account to generate an email on any withdrawal activity that exceeds $.01. As for routing/transit information being out in the wild, depending on which state you live in, it already is. That is why I have the email notification activated. Also, the bank will make good any unauthorized activity.

For all the years DW and I worked overseas, we still needed bills to be paid when we were not stateside. I am/have been completely comfortable with this process.

BTW, most banks ask for the last 004 digits of your SSN for verification. Change that to a password. Your last 004 digits of you SSN are definitely out in the wild.
CRC_Volunteer,

I worked in the IT/Telecom/Data Comm world for 30+ years. I have no faith that things cannot go wrong. In fact, it is normal for things to go wrong.

" I setup my account to generate an email on any withdrawal activity that exceeds $.01. As for routing/transit information being out in the wild, depending on which state you live in, it already is. That is why I have the email notification activated. Also, the bank will make good any unauthorized activity."

It is up to you to inform the bank within X number of days. And, email notification is not reliable. I had setup email notification for my credit card bill. And, when the bank transition/upgrade their software, the system forgot to send out the email notification.

"I have been using auto drafts for 30+ years. "

You have been lucky so far. I prefer to setup my system to work even if the system stop working.

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Re: Auto withdrawal from a checking account

Post by KlangFool »

JoMoney wrote: Sun May 15, 2022 9:35 am If you have the money in the account, unfortunately there's no whitelisting of only the select few that can draw on it.
Financial institutions that have access to the ACH system though are required to know their clients and vet them, so for someone to tell their bank to transfer money from your account, presumably their bank knows them and has the capability of taking recourse against them if they're requesting fraudulent transactions.
Further, "The Electronic Funds Transfer Act" or "Reg E" provides consumer protections if a fraudulent transaction occurs against your account. You are required to report it immediately, but your bank is required to take action to make you whole. It is possible your account could become over-drawn and that might create additional problems with other third-parties, bounced checks... etc... and there's not a whole of recourse from those impacts, you just have to get the matter reported and fixed with your bank, then resubmit payment to the legitimate payee. I avoid writing physical checks, in part to avoid any possibility of a "bounced check" which can have more severe consequences than a payment failed through ACH request.
JoMoney,

I think the bank A/C holder has to report withing a certain number of days. I do not remember the exact number.

KlangFool
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CRC_Volunteer
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Re: Auto withdrawal from a checking account

Post by CRC_Volunteer »

KlangFool wrote: Sun May 15, 2022 9:50 am
CRC_Volunteer wrote: Sun May 15, 2022 9:34 am I have been using auto drafts for 30+ years. I setup my account to generate an email on any withdrawal activity that exceeds $.01. As for routing/transit information being out in the wild, depending on which state you live in, it already is. That is why I have the email notification activated. Also, the bank will make good any unauthorized activity.

For all the years DW and I worked overseas, we still needed bills to be paid when we were not stateside. I am/have been completely comfortable with this process.

BTW, most banks ask for the last 004 digits of your SSN for verification. Change that to a password. Your last 004 digits of you SSN are definitely out in the wild.
CRC_Volunteer,

I worked in the IT/Telecom/Data Comm world for 30+ years. I have no faith that things cannot go wrong. In fact, it is normal for things to go wrong.

" I setup my account to generate an email on any withdrawal activity that exceeds $.01. As for routing/transit information being out in the wild, depending on which state you live in, it already is. That is why I have the email notification activated. Also, the bank will make good any unauthorized activity."

It is up to you to inform the bank within X number of days. And, email notification is not reliable. I had setup email notification for my credit card bill. And, when the bank transition/upgrade their software, the system forgot to send out the email notification.

"I have been using auto drafts for 30+ years. "

You have been lucky so far. I prefer to setup my system to work even if the system stop working.

KlangFool
Retired after 41+ years in IT. My approach and setup has worked flawlessly for that duration. Of all concerns that I may have financially, auto draft ranks at the bottom. Unless you have a credit freeze in place, you will have more issues than you can count. This is where I concentrated my efforts.
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RetiredAL
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Re: Auto withdrawal from a checking account

Post by RetiredAL »

student wrote: Sun May 15, 2022 7:53 am Why would you setup auto pay with your utility companies and insurance companies using checking account rather than credit card? Do they not accept credit cards? If you must use checking account, limit the amount of money you have in the checking account and disable overdraft protection from your savings account.
I am currently setting up a lot of our bills to a charge a credit card using a new second higher % cash-back card issued by our bank. I want our spending card separate from our bill-paying card for security reasons, thus the second card.

A major wrinkle I've run into head-on after I started this, is that many (most?) banks will no longer issue a joint owned card. So this new card is in my name only, and when I die it dies, stranding the auto-pays my DW would be expecting. Yes, she can be an authorized user, but that does not solve the die issue and an authorized cannot online view the transactions.

I enjoy having a one logon view of most of our banking stuff, but using a card with another bank that does allow joint ownership may be the final way I go. Of note, our long standing card from our bank is joint, but does not pay the higher cash-back.
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Re: Auto withdrawal from a checking account

Post by jebmke »

RetiredAL wrote: Sun May 15, 2022 10:02 am A major wrinkle I've run into head-on after I started this, is that many (most?) banks will no longer issue a joint owned card. So this new card is in my name only, and when I die it dies, stranding the auto-pays my DW would be expecting. Yes, she can be an authorized user, but that does not solve the die issue and an authorized cannot online view the transactions.
This may vary according to the issuer. At one point, I realized that I was the only one with full access and "management" rights with our green AMEX card. We were able to designate my wife as a manager so she now has the same rights that I do. It was a while ago but I think we did this over the phone with American Express.
Don't trust me, look it up. https://www.irs.gov/forms-instructions-and-publications
furwut
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Re: Auto withdrawal from a checking account

Post by furwut »

I don’t know what mechanism banks have in place to stop unauthorized charges but, as stated up top, I suspect they do have a whitelist of sorts.

My utility and condo fee auto debits my checking. I have auto pay setup for all my other regular billers to use one of my three credit cards. Each credit card auto pays from my checking so I do not have to “write” any payments at all.

If I had to push every payment out each month that would be something like 10 or 15 payments. I would surely miss one or more very quickly. I do have all the bank and credit alerts set so I get a notification of all activity as it occurs.
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JoMoney
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Re: Auto withdrawal from a checking account

Post by JoMoney »

KlangFool wrote: Sun May 15, 2022 9:52 am
JoMoney wrote: Sun May 15, 2022 9:35 am If you have the money in the account, unfortunately there's no whitelisting of only the select few that can draw on it.
Financial institutions that have access to the ACH system though are required to know their clients and vet them, so for someone to tell their bank to transfer money from your account, presumably their bank knows them and has the capability of taking recourse against them if they're requesting fraudulent transactions.
Further, "The Electronic Funds Transfer Act" or "Reg E" provides consumer protections if a fraudulent transaction occurs against your account. You are required to report it immediately, but your bank is required to take action to make you whole. It is possible your account could become over-drawn and that might create additional problems with other third-parties, bounced checks... etc... and there's not a whole of recourse from those impacts, you just have to get the matter reported and fixed with your bank, then resubmit payment to the legitimate payee. I avoid writing physical checks, in part to avoid any possibility of a "bounced check" which can have more severe consequences than a payment failed through ACH request.
JoMoney,

I think the bank A/C holder has to report withing a certain number of days. I do not remember the exact number.

KlangFool
Yes, basically it needs to be reported within 60 days of getting your statement to avoid being liable for any of it. After that, a consumer may be liable for some or potentially all of it. There are exceptions for consumer negligence that can put the burden on the consumer as well. Also, a "business" (non consumer account) would have different potential liability.

See below, note an "access device" would be something like a debit card, an ACH transfer would fall under "not involving access device"
https://www.consumerfinance.gov/rules-p ... 2-Interp-1
6(b)(3) Periodic Statement; Timely Notice Not Given
...
2. Transfers not involving access device. The first two tiers of liability do not apply to unauthorized transfers from a consumer's account made without an access device. If, however, the consumer fails to report such unauthorized transfers within 60 calendar days of the financial institution's transmittal of the periodic statement, the consumer may be liable for any transfers occurring after the close of the 60 days and before notice is given to the institution. For example, a consumer's account is electronically debited for $200 without the consumer's authorization and by means other than the consumer's access device. If the consumer notifies the institution within 60 days of the transmittal of the periodic statement that shows the unauthorized transfer, the consumer has no liability. However, if in addition to the $200, the consumer's account is debited for a $400 unauthorized transfer on the 61st day and the consumer fails to notify the institution of the first unauthorized transfer until the 62nd day, the consumer may be liable for the full $400.
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RetiredAL
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Re: Auto withdrawal from a checking account

Post by RetiredAL »

JoMoney wrote: Sun May 15, 2022 10:16 am
KlangFool wrote: Sun May 15, 2022 9:52 am
JoMoney wrote: Sun May 15, 2022 9:35 am If you have the money in the account, unfortunately there's no whitelisting of only the select few that can draw on it.
Financial institutions that have access to the ACH system though are required to know their clients and vet them, so for someone to tell their bank to transfer money from your account, presumably their bank knows them and has the capability of taking recourse against them if they're requesting fraudulent transactions.
Further, "The Electronic Funds Transfer Act" or "Reg E" provides consumer protections if a fraudulent transaction occurs against your account. You are required to report it immediately, but your bank is required to take action to make you whole. It is possible your account could become over-drawn and that might create additional problems with other third-parties, bounced checks... etc... and there's not a whole of recourse from those impacts, you just have to get the matter reported and fixed with your bank, then resubmit payment to the legitimate payee. I avoid writing physical checks, in part to avoid any possibility of a "bounced check" which can have more severe consequences than a payment failed through ACH request.
JoMoney,

I think the bank A/C holder has to report withing a certain number of days. I do not remember the exact number.

KlangFool
Yes, basically it needs to be reported within 60 days of getting your statement to avoid being liable for any of it. After that, a consumer may be liable for some or potentially all of it. There are exceptions for consumer negligence that can put the burden on the consumer as well. Also, a "business" (non consumer account) would have different potential liability.

See below, note an "access device" would be something like a debit card, an ACH transfer would fall under "not involving access device"
https://www.consumerfinance.gov/rules-p ... 2-Interp-1
6(b)(3) Periodic Statement; Timely Notice Not Given
...
2. Transfers not involving access device. The first two tiers of liability do not apply to unauthorized transfers from a consumer's account made without an access device. If, however, the consumer fails to report such unauthorized transfers within 60 calendar days of the financial institution's transmittal of the periodic statement, the consumer may be liable for any transfers occurring after the close of the 60 days and before notice is given to the institution. For example, a consumer's account is electronically debited for $200 without the consumer's authorization and by means other than the consumer's access device. If the consumer notifies the institution within 60 days of the transmittal of the periodic statement that shows the unauthorized transfer, the consumer has no liability. However, if in addition to the $200, the consumer's account is debited for a $400 unauthorized transfer on the 61st day and the consumer fails to notify the institution of the first unauthorized transfer until the 62nd day, the consumer may be liable for the full $400.
Do note that consumer accounts have these protections, business accounts do not. This applies to both checking and card accounts.

In my dialog with my bank about joint ownership of that card, I was told they could issue a business card which would continue after I die, but I declined that, as I would loose all the consumer protections.
student
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Re: Auto withdrawal from a checking account

Post by student »

RetiredAL wrote: Sun May 15, 2022 10:02 am
student wrote: Sun May 15, 2022 7:53 am Why would you setup auto pay with your utility companies and insurance companies using checking account rather than credit card? Do they not accept credit cards? If you must use checking account, limit the amount of money you have in the checking account and disable overdraft protection from your savings account.
I am currently setting up a lot of our bills to a charge a credit card using a new second higher % cash-back card issued by our bank. I want our spending card separate from our bill-paying card for security reasons, thus the second card.

A major wrinkle I've run into head-on after I started this, is that many (most?) banks will no longer issue a joint owned card. So this new card is in my name only, and when I die it dies, stranding the auto-pays my DW would be expecting. Yes, she can be an authorized user, but that does not solve the die issue and an authorized cannot online view the transactions.

I enjoy having a one logon view of most of our banking stuff, but using a card with another bank that does allow joint ownership may be the final way I go. Of note, our long standing card from our bank is joint, but does not pay the higher cash-back.
After you die, the card will be cancelled so the autopay will stop, right? Are you concerned about your spouse won't set up autopay in time? If so, perhaps enter a backup card with the companies, if possible, that you have bills with.
Mr. Rumples
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Re: Auto withdrawal from a checking account

Post by Mr. Rumples »

My credit union permits multiple checking accounts at no extra cost - except for the check order. I use one now for this purpose and to write checks to companies on the rare occasion that this happens. They also have a form which they sent me for information purposes to dispute an ACH transaction.
(My utility company charges extra for credit card payments.)

Over $70 Trillion is moved via ACH. I remember years ago, when we moved to ACH at work. https://www.nacha.org

Under the rules, a customer has 60 days to dispute a charge and thus it pays to look at the monthly statements:

https://www.nacha.org/news/which-60-day ... acha-rules

The rules are a bit confusing, thus my reaching out to the credit union for how to handle this if something happened.
"History is the memory of time, the life of the dead and the happiness of the living." Captain John Smith 1580-1631
RetiredAL
Posts: 3537
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Location: SF Bay Area

Re: Auto withdrawal from a checking account

Post by RetiredAL »

student wrote: Sun May 15, 2022 10:30 am
RetiredAL wrote: Sun May 15, 2022 10:02 am
student wrote: Sun May 15, 2022 7:53 am Why would you setup auto pay with your utility companies and insurance companies using checking account rather than credit card? Do they not accept credit cards? If you must use checking account, limit the amount of money you have in the checking account and disable overdraft protection from your savings account.
I am currently setting up a lot of our bills to a charge a credit card using a new second higher % cash-back card issued by our bank. I want our spending card separate from our bill-paying card for security reasons, thus the second card.

A major wrinkle I've run into head-on after I started this, is that many (most?) banks will no longer issue a joint owned card. So this new card is in my name only, and when I die it dies, stranding the auto-pays my DW would be expecting. Yes, she can be an authorized user, but that does not solve the die issue and an authorized cannot online view the transactions.

I enjoy having a one logon view of most of our banking stuff, but using a card with another bank that does allow joint ownership may be the final way I go. Of note, our long standing card from our bank is joint, but does not pay the higher cash-back.
After you die, the card will be cancelled so the autopay will stop, right? Are you concerned about your spouse won't set up autopay in time? If so, perhaps enter a backup card with the companies, if possible, that you have bills with.
Yes, and made worse by her fighting most technology because it does not work the way she thinks it should. She is very set in her ways! She does none of our finances and has no interest to learn it. So when I die, she will have a cliff to climb. Thus any continuing paying system will ease her into it. She is likely to revert to paying bills by check.

I am not hard against ACH auto-pays to checking, other than the loss of the cash-back. I don't believe ACH auto-pays are more risky than an actual check.
student
Posts: 10764
Joined: Fri Apr 03, 2015 6:58 am

Re: Auto withdrawal from a checking account

Post by student »

RetiredAL wrote: Sun May 15, 2022 11:00 am
student wrote: Sun May 15, 2022 10:30 am
RetiredAL wrote: Sun May 15, 2022 10:02 am
student wrote: Sun May 15, 2022 7:53 am Why would you setup auto pay with your utility companies and insurance companies using checking account rather than credit card? Do they not accept credit cards? If you must use checking account, limit the amount of money you have in the checking account and disable overdraft protection from your savings account.
I am currently setting up a lot of our bills to a charge a credit card using a new second higher % cash-back card issued by our bank. I want our spending card separate from our bill-paying card for security reasons, thus the second card.

A major wrinkle I've run into head-on after I started this, is that many (most?) banks will no longer issue a joint owned card. So this new card is in my name only, and when I die it dies, stranding the auto-pays my DW would be expecting. Yes, she can be an authorized user, but that does not solve the die issue and an authorized cannot online view the transactions.

I enjoy having a one logon view of most of our banking stuff, but using a card with another bank that does allow joint ownership may be the final way I go. Of note, our long standing card from our bank is joint, but does not pay the higher cash-back.
After you die, the card will be cancelled so the autopay will stop, right? Are you concerned about your spouse won't set up autopay in time? If so, perhaps enter a backup card with the companies, if possible, that you have bills with.
Yes, and made worse by her fighting most technology because it does not work the way she thinks it should. She is very set in her ways! She does none of our finances and has no interest to learn it. So when I die, she will have a cliff to climb. Thus any continuing paying system will ease her into it. She is likely to revert to paying bills by check.

I am not hard against ACH auto-pays to checking, other than the loss of the cash-back. I don't believe ACH auto-pays are more risky than an actual check.
I don't think ACH auto-pays is risky than an actual check. My concern is the utility company makes a mistake and charges $10k instead of $100. https://www.cbsnews.com/chicago/news/ge ... -accounts/
rgs92
Posts: 3436
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Re: Auto withdrawal from a checking account

Post by rgs92 »

I always avoid auto payments (or any payments) from a checking account to pay for things whenever possible. A credit card is better because you have much better protection.
The credit cards get paid from the checking account which has always been totally safe for me. I rarely give out bank account info unless necessary.

tl;dr: use credit cards for bills unless there is a compelling reason, like, say, for the IRS. But not for some merchant unless really needed.

And of course I get credit card reward as a bonus.
Eno Deb
Posts: 757
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Re: Auto withdrawal from a checking account

Post by Eno Deb »

regfman wrote: Sun May 15, 2022 7:28 amNow I am using more autopay where appropriate. In situations like the utility bills and insurance I use autopay. That requires that I have given the payee my bank routing number and my checking account number to withdraw funds from.
If it concerns you, check if they also have an option to pay by credit card. Some companies "hide" the option because it's more expensive for them, others (e.g. my local gas/electric utility) take a small "convenience fee" if you want to pay by card instead of automatic debit. Personally I only use automatic debit for credit card bills, the gas/electric bill, and tax payments following my tax returns, everything else is paid by credit card. I'm not concerned about these companies or the IRS trying to scam me, and never had a problem in many years.

At the end of the day, your account details are out there anyway unless you never write checks, so if it was easily possible for crooks to debit bank accounts, it wouldn't necessarily depend on whether you authorize some utilities or not.
When I set those up I did not have to inform my bank that I was setting up an autopayment to a particular party. The bank just gets the request from a utility company to transfer funds out of my checking account and the bank makes the transfer.
The banks presumably only allow vetted companies to directly debit accounts.
DetroitRick
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Location: SE Michigan

Re: Auto withdrawal from a checking account

Post by DetroitRick »

For now, I'm comfortable with the consumer-level protections, which essentially involve my monitoring/reporting. Especially given that reimbursement is relatively quick if the worst happens. At least where I bank.

I've had one instance of a related type of fraud, a few years ago. Caught it immediately on a Saturday morning, had my money back on Tuesday.

I use credit cards for payments when possible (for the sake of points, convenience and risk management), but of course there are situations whether I don't have that choice. Then I do use auto withdrawals if the discount is enticing enough AND if I trust the company to handle problems fast. Example - I allow my health insurer to take my premiums via automatic withdrawal from checking (for a premium discount), while my wife's insurer gets paid by a push payment via credit card (because my experience there proves they could and would muck up the auto withdrawal at some point).

Just a few things that I do to control what I can - for my protection:
1)Mainly use credit cards
2)Set up monitoring on all accounts - via text or email, app, and Quicken. Any unauthorized ACH's would be spotted immediately.
3)I have no paper checks for my primary checking account (to minimize circulation of my account & routing numbers)
4)I have a small checking account at a separate bank for when I must write checks (again to limit circulation of my acct/routing numbers). No overdraft protection there. No, this isn't complicated and doesn't create any additional work.
5)For a checking account I that maintain at Schwab, I disabled overdraft protection (due to the margin availability on the linked brokerage acct)
6)My primary savings is held at a bank where I have no checking account. It's connected for ACH transfers to only one other bank and one brokerage account.
7)Use Zelle on occasion to avoid writing checks where credit cards aren't accepted.

That's it. I really only consider #2 to be critical. The rest just are bit of extra precaution. At the moment, I have two monthly automatic withdrawals from bank accounts set up, in total. Plus I probably average about three-four monthly non-auto ACH payments beyond that. Plus the ACH's to credit card companies. The later on non-auto right now, but I'm thinking of changing that to auto pay.

I do like your idea of a user-controlled list of authorized entities. If somebody is actually offering that, I'm not aware. It's something I would like, now that you mention it.
RetiredAL
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Re: Auto withdrawal from a checking account

Post by RetiredAL »

student wrote: Sun May 15, 2022 11:07 am
RetiredAL wrote: Sun May 15, 2022 11:00 am
student wrote: Sun May 15, 2022 10:30 am
RetiredAL wrote: Sun May 15, 2022 10:02 am
student wrote: Sun May 15, 2022 7:53 am Why would you setup auto pay with your utility companies and insurance companies using checking account rather than credit card? Do they not accept credit cards? If you must use checking account, limit the amount of money you have in the checking account and disable overdraft protection from your savings account.
I am currently setting up a lot of our bills to a charge a credit card using a new second higher % cash-back card issued by our bank. I want our spending card separate from our bill-paying card for security reasons, thus the second card.

A major wrinkle I've run into head-on after I started this, is that many (most?) banks will no longer issue a joint owned card. So this new card is in my name only, and when I die it dies, stranding the auto-pays my DW would be expecting. Yes, she can be an authorized user, but that does not solve the die issue and an authorized cannot online view the transactions.

I enjoy having a one logon view of most of our banking stuff, but using a card with another bank that does allow joint ownership may be the final way I go. Of note, our long standing card from our bank is joint, but does not pay the higher cash-back.
After you die, the card will be cancelled so the autopay will stop, right? Are you concerned about your spouse won't set up autopay in time? If so, perhaps enter a backup card with the companies, if possible, that you have bills with.
Yes, and made worse by her fighting most technology because it does not work the way she thinks it should. She is very set in her ways! She does none of our finances and has no interest to learn it. So when I die, she will have a cliff to climb. Thus any continuing paying system will ease her into it. She is likely to revert to paying bills by check.

I am not hard against ACH auto-pays to checking, other than the loss of the cash-back. I don't believe ACH auto-pays are more risky than an actual check.
I don't think ACH auto-pays is risky than an actual check. My concern is the utility company makes a mistake and charges $10k instead of $100. https://www.cbsnews.com/chicago/news/ge ... -accounts/
Several years back while using Bill-pay, I inadvertently selected the water company, one space below American Express, and sent the water company a $3000+ payment instead of A/E, so that's a two-way street. At first, the water company did not want to refund the excess, which was more than 30 month's of usage.

Your cited example is one reason why I prefer using a credit card for auto-pays -- I have two opportunities to see the amount. I would an anticipated $100 bill that got posted as $100,000 would not be accepted by the card issuer.

Life is not perfect, nor is billing.
Topic Author
regfman
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Re: Auto withdrawal from a checking account

Post by regfman »

thanks for the responses. I've learned a lot. I still don't know what the banks have in place to reject random ACH requests but someone suggested that they have their own sort of white list and I guess that makes a lot of sense.

Every few years we have to cancel credit cards. Sometimes it's because we think we've lost a wallet and sometimes it's a case of unauthorized use - fraud. When that happens we have to get new ones. It's a minor pain but I've made it a lot easier these days because I now keep a list of every account that is billing to a credit card so that they don't get shut off when a CC gets changed. So when I get a new card i have to log in to each account and make the changes manually. Currently my list is about ten accounts. I guess I could add the five or six utilities (assuming they don't have an extra charge to bill a credit card) where I am currently using ACH tranfers to my list.

Also, I think I will disable the autodraft protection that I have on the linked savings account. I contacted a citi chat and they said to call to talk to someone about that - will do tomorrow.
Last edited by regfman on Sun May 15, 2022 4:14 pm, edited 1 time in total.
KlangFool
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Re: Auto withdrawal from a checking account

Post by KlangFool »

regfman wrote: Sun May 15, 2022 4:07 pm thanks for the responses. I've learned a lot. I still don't know what the banks have in place to reject random ACH requests but someone suggested that they have their own sort of white list and I guess that makes a lot of sense.

Every few years we have to cancel credit cards. Sometimes it's because we think we've lost a wallet and sometimes it's a case of unauthorized use - fraud. When that happens we have to get new ones. It's a minor pain but I've made it a lot easier these days because I now keep a list of every account that is billing to a credit card so that they don't get shut off when a CC gets changed. So when I get a new card i have to log in to each account and make the changes manually. Currently my list is about ten accounts. I guess I could add the five or six utilities (assuming they don't have an extra charge to bill a credit card) where I am currently using ACH tranfers to my list.
regfman,

I solved this problem by keeping 2 separate credit cards.

A) Credit Card #1 only for bill payment and nothing else.

B) Credit card #2 for everything else.

Credit Card #2 is exposed and needs to be cancelled regularly. Credit Card #1 does not face this problem.

KlangFool
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Doctor Rhythm
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Re: Auto withdrawal from a checking account

Post by Doctor Rhythm »

I use auto-pay from my checking account for recurring bills that can’t be put on a credit card. And I use auto-pay to pay my credit cards, so ultimately almost all our expenses are paid through auto-pay. AFAIK, it’s alway a pull, never a push. I feel it is “safe enough” for my situation that I don’t worry about it.
KlangFool
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Joined: Sat Oct 11, 2008 12:35 pm

Re: Auto withdrawal from a checking account

Post by KlangFool »

Doctor Rhythm wrote: Sun May 15, 2022 4:31 pm I use auto-pay from my checking account for recurring bills that can’t be put on a credit card. And I use auto-pay to pay my credit cards, so ultimately almost all our expenses are paid through auto-pay. AFAIK, it’s alway a pull, never a push. I feel it is “safe enough” for my situation that I don’t worry about it.
So, one wrong pull of 10K from one of your bills would break the whole system.

KlangFool
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jebmke
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Re: Auto withdrawal from a checking account

Post by jebmke »

regfman wrote: Sun May 15, 2022 4:07 pm thanks for the responses. I've learned a lot. I still don't know what the banks have in place to reject random ACH requests but someone suggested that they have their own sort of white list and I guess that makes a lot of sense.

Some banks may require pre-noting. I haven't set up a direct debit in a long time but I can recall pre-noting used to be pretty common; it may even be required by ACH. You'd only see small dollar pre-notes. If they did zero dollar ones you might not even know they occurred.
Don't trust me, look it up. https://www.irs.gov/forms-instructions-and-publications
Doctor Rhythm
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Re: Auto withdrawal from a checking account

Post by Doctor Rhythm »

KlangFool wrote: Sun May 15, 2022 4:38 pm
Doctor Rhythm wrote: Sun May 15, 2022 4:31 pm I use auto-pay from my checking account for recurring bills that can’t be put on a credit card. And I use auto-pay to pay my credit cards, so ultimately almost all our expenses are paid through auto-pay. AFAIK, it’s alway a pull, never a push. I feel it is “safe enough” for my situation that I don’t worry about it.
So, one wrong pull of 10K from one of your bills would break the whole system.

KlangFool
Like I said, it’s “safe enough” for me. Your situation and risk tolerance may warrant a different approach. If I had data showing that the fraud or error rate was extremely high, I might change my mind — but I haven’t seen anything beyond anecdote.
Eno Deb
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Re: Auto withdrawal from a checking account

Post by Eno Deb »

regfman wrote: Sun May 15, 2022 4:07 pmEvery few years we have to cancel credit cards. Sometimes it's because we think we've lost a wallet and sometimes it's a case of unauthorized use - fraud. When that happens we have to get new ones. It's a minor pain but I've made it a lot easier these days because I now keep a list of every account that is billing to a credit card so that they don't get shut off when a CC gets changed. So when I get a new card i have to log in to each account and make the changes manually.
Visa and Mastercard have both have "account updater" services, through which certain qualified companies can automatically receive the updated card information if the card is replaced. So even if you forget to update an account, it will not necessarily result in a rejected charge.
I guess I could add the five or six utilities (assuming they don't have an extra charge to bill a credit card)
Inspired by this thread I just looked up what "convenience fee" my gas/electric utility currently charges for credit card billing. Turns out it's $1-$1.35 (apparently dependent on the card type). I have a credit card that gives 2.62% cashback on all payments, so as long as the bill is above ~$50 (which it usually is) I'd actually pay a little less when using the card, even taking the $1.35 fee into account. I think I'll switch to card billing. :D
bradinsky
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Location: Ohio

Re: Auto withdrawal from a checking account

Post by bradinsky »

RetiredAL wrote: Sun May 15, 2022 11:00 am
student wrote: Sun May 15, 2022 10:30 am
RetiredAL wrote: Sun May 15, 2022 10:02 am
student wrote: Sun May 15, 2022 7:53 am Why would you setup auto pay with your utility companies and insurance companies using checking account rather than credit card? Do they not accept credit cards? If you must use checking account, limit the amount of money you have in the checking account and disable overdraft protection from your savings account.
I am currently setting up a lot of our bills to a charge a credit card using a new second higher % cash-back card issued by our bank. I want our spending card separate from our bill-paying card for security reasons, thus the second card.

A major wrinkle I've run into head-on after I started this, is that many (most?) banks will no longer issue a joint owned card. So this new card is in my name only, and when I die it dies, stranding the auto-pays my DW would be expecting. Yes, she can be an authorized user, but that does not solve the die issue and an authorized cannot online view the transactions.

I enjoy having a one logon view of most of our banking stuff, but using a card with another bank that does allow joint ownership may be the final way I go. Of note, our long standing card from our bank is joint, but does not pay the higher cash-back.
After you die, the card will be cancelled so the autopay will stop, right? Are you concerned about your spouse won't set up autopay in time? If so, perhaps enter a backup card with the companies, if possible, that you have bills with.
Yes, and made worse by her fighting most technology because it does not work the way she thinks it should. She is very set in her ways! She does none of our finances and has no interest to learn it. So when I die, she will have a cliff to climb. Thus any continuing paying system will ease her into it. She is likely to revert to paying bills by check.

I am not hard against ACH auto-pays to checking, other than the loss of the cash-back. I don't believe ACH auto-pays are more risky than an actual check.
+1 :sharebeer I can totally relate to the DW fighting technology. I’ve tried to explain it & if I die first, I’m dead & she can’t b*t*h at me. Key is, I tried hard!
Parkinglotracer
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Re: Auto withdrawal from a checking account

Post by Parkinglotracer »

student wrote: Sun May 15, 2022 7:53 am Why would you setup auto pay with your utility companies and insurance companies using checking account rather than credit card? Do they not accept credit cards? If you must use checking account, limit the amount of money you have in the checking account and disable overdraft protection from your savings account.
Some of my utilities - say pinellas county Florida water do not auto charge to credit cards - I assume because of the fee credit card charge.
RetiredAL
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Re: Auto withdrawal from a checking account

Post by RetiredAL »

bradinsky wrote: Sun May 15, 2022 5:55 pm
RetiredAL wrote: Sun May 15, 2022 11:00 am
student wrote: Sun May 15, 2022 10:30 am
RetiredAL wrote: Sun May 15, 2022 10:02 am
student wrote: Sun May 15, 2022 7:53 am Why would you setup auto pay with your utility companies and insurance companies using checking account rather than credit card? Do they not accept credit cards? If you must use checking account, limit the amount of money you have in the checking account and disable overdraft protection from your savings account.
I am currently setting up a lot of our bills to a charge a credit card using a new second higher % cash-back card issued by our bank. I want our spending card separate from our bill-paying card for security reasons, thus the second card.

A major wrinkle I've run into head-on after I started this, is that many (most?) banks will no longer issue a joint owned card. So this new card is in my name only, and when I die it dies, stranding the auto-pays my DW would be expecting. Yes, she can be an authorized user, but that does not solve the die issue and an authorized cannot online view the transactions.

I enjoy having a one logon view of most of our banking stuff, but using a card with another bank that does allow joint ownership may be the final way I go. Of note, our long standing card from our bank is joint, but does not pay the higher cash-back.
After you die, the card will be cancelled so the autopay will stop, right? Are you concerned about your spouse won't set up autopay in time? If so, perhaps enter a backup card with the companies, if possible, that you have bills with.
Yes, and made worse by her fighting most technology because it does not work the way she thinks it should. She is very set in her ways! She does none of our finances and has no interest to learn it. So when I die, she will have a cliff to climb. Thus any continuing paying system will ease her into it. She is likely to revert to paying bills by check.

I am not hard against ACH auto-pays to checking, other than the loss of the cash-back. I don't believe ACH auto-pays are more risky than an actual check.
+1 :sharebeer I can totally relate to the DW fighting technology. I’ve tried to explain it & if I die first, I’m dead & she can’t b*t*h at me. Key is, I tried hard!
I have forewarned my local son that he may have quite a task. He understands!
sport
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Re: Auto withdrawal from a checking account

Post by sport »

Eno Deb wrote: Sun May 15, 2022 5:26 pmVisa and Mastercard have both have "account updater" services, through which certain qualified companies can automatically receive the updated card information if the card is replaced. So even if you forget to update an account, it will not necessarily result in a rejected charge.
When my Visa card had to be replaced due to fraudulent charges, the bank told me they would notify all the regular debits to change to the new card. It never happened. I had several bills that I thought were paid that actually were not. I had to make the notifications myself. So, these "updater services" are not always reliable.
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Kenkat
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Re: Auto withdrawal from a checking account

Post by Kenkat »

Many financial institutions also using fraud checking services prior to initiating a new ACH connection. For example:

https://giact.com/

The ACH pull is blocked if the account is new, not in good standing or identity cannot be clearly established.
Broken Man 1999
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Re: Auto withdrawal from a checking account

Post by Broken Man 1999 »

Doctor Rhythm wrote: Sun May 15, 2022 4:45 pm
KlangFool wrote: Sun May 15, 2022 4:38 pm
Doctor Rhythm wrote: Sun May 15, 2022 4:31 pm I use auto-pay from my checking account for recurring bills that can’t be put on a credit card. And I use auto-pay to pay my credit cards, so ultimately almost all our expenses are paid through auto-pay. AFAIK, it’s alway a pull, never a push. I feel it is “safe enough” for my situation that I don’t worry about it.
So, one wrong pull of 10K from one of your bills would break the whole system.

KlangFool
Like I said, it’s “safe enough” for me. Your situation and risk tolerance may warrant a different approach. If I had data showing that the fraud or error rate was extremely high, I might change my mind — but I haven’t seen anything beyond anecdote.
I do pretty much the same, allowing pulls from certain vendors, and pulls from all my credit cards for payment.

All my pulls generate an advance notice prior to the actual pull from my account. Even before I get the notice of an upcoming pull, I have received an email that my statement/bill had been generated and I could examine it for accuracy.

So, for someone who monitors their accounts, there shouldn't be any surprises, especially given the very ample time to react.
Save for fraudulent charges on a credit card (possible no matter HOW one pays the bill), my trusted vendors and credit card companies have never made a mistake. And I have shifted the responsibility for paying my bills to the people I owe the payments. All I have to do is keep my credit card info updated and money in my credit union to pull.

Broken Man 1999
“If I cannot drink Bourbon and smoke cigars in Heaven then I shall not go." - Mark Twain
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CRC_Volunteer
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Re: Auto withdrawal from a checking account

Post by CRC_Volunteer »

KlangFool wrote: Sun May 15, 2022 4:38 pm
Doctor Rhythm wrote: Sun May 15, 2022 4:31 pm I use auto-pay from my checking account for recurring bills that can’t be put on a credit card. And I use auto-pay to pay my credit cards, so ultimately almost all our expenses are paid through auto-pay. AFAIK, it’s alway a pull, never a push. I feel it is “safe enough” for my situation that I don’t worry about it.
So, one wrong pull of 10K from one of your bills would break the whole system.

KlangFool
We had a situation where the banks were marking checks as NSF. in one case, the county prosecutor filed charges against one of my co-workers when he had more than enough funds in his account.

Any system can break - even yours when you get older and CRS (Can't Remember S**t) takes hold. The sky isn't falling...
"Let me explain. No, there is too much. Let me sum up." (Inigo Montoya) | | 65/30/05 | 53% VTSAX | 12% VTIAX | 30% VAIPX | 5% CASH
KlangFool
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Re: Auto withdrawal from a checking account

Post by KlangFool »

CRC_Volunteer wrote: Sun May 15, 2022 6:59 pm
KlangFool wrote: Sun May 15, 2022 4:38 pm
Doctor Rhythm wrote: Sun May 15, 2022 4:31 pm I use auto-pay from my checking account for recurring bills that can’t be put on a credit card. And I use auto-pay to pay my credit cards, so ultimately almost all our expenses are paid through auto-pay. AFAIK, it’s alway a pull, never a push. I feel it is “safe enough” for my situation that I don’t worry about it.
So, one wrong pull of 10K from one of your bills would break the whole system.

KlangFool
We had a situation where the banks were marking checks as NSF. in one case, the county prosecutor filed charges against one of my co-workers when he had more than enough funds in his account.

Any system can break - even yours when you get older and CRS (Can't Remember S**t) takes hold. The sky isn't falling...
CRC_Volunteer,

My system works even if I "do nothing" for a few months. And, with only push payment from the bank, no one can pull any amount from my checking account. I do not have debit card either.

I only push payment from bank. There is no pull.

KlangFool
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Doctor Rhythm
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Re: Auto withdrawal from a checking account

Post by Doctor Rhythm »

Eno Deb wrote: Sun May 15, 2022 5:26 pm Inspired by this thread I just looked up what "convenience fee" my gas/electric utility currently charges for credit card billing. Turns out it's $1-$1.35 (apparently dependent on the card type). I have a credit card that gives 2.62% cashback on all payments, so as long as the bill is above ~$50 (which it usually is) I'd actually pay a little less when using the card, even taking the $1.35 fee into account. I think I'll switch to card billing. :D
Thanks for the heads up! I just did the same after reading your post. We are subject to the same convenience fees, which will always be less than the cash back rebate. Had been doing auto-pay for decades, as credit card payment wasn’t allowed back when we first established service.
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CRC_Volunteer
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Re: Auto withdrawal from a checking account

Post by CRC_Volunteer »

KlangFool wrote: Sun May 15, 2022 7:03 pm
CRC_Volunteer wrote: Sun May 15, 2022 6:59 pm
KlangFool wrote: Sun May 15, 2022 4:38 pm
Doctor Rhythm wrote: Sun May 15, 2022 4:31 pm I use auto-pay from my checking account for recurring bills that can’t be put on a credit card. And I use auto-pay to pay my credit cards, so ultimately almost all our expenses are paid through auto-pay. AFAIK, it’s alway a pull, never a push. I feel it is “safe enough” for my situation that I don’t worry about it.
So, one wrong pull of 10K from one of your bills would break the whole system.

KlangFool
We had a situation where the banks were marking checks as NSF. in one case, the county prosecutor filed charges against one of my co-workers when he had more than enough funds in his account.

Any system can break - even yours when you get older and CRS (Can't Remember S**t) takes hold. The sky isn't falling...
CRC_Volunteer,

My system works even if I "do nothing" for a few months. And, with only push payment from the bank, no one can pull any amount from my checking account. I do not have debit card either.

I only push payment from bank. There is no pull.

KlangFool
Water, Electricity, Insurance are not going to wait a "few months" before they are paid.

My Flex Spending check from my company (6000+ employees) "bounced" when I deposited it. Finance had a time explaining that one.

Auto draft works seamlessly and is quite reliable. And this is in a state where a major data breach in 2012 got everyone's electronically submitted tax returns going back over a 14 year timeframe. And the data was not encrypted...
"Let me explain. No, there is too much. Let me sum up." (Inigo Montoya) | | 65/30/05 | 53% VTSAX | 12% VTIAX | 30% VAIPX | 5% CASH
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celia
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Re: Auto withdrawal from a checking account

Post by celia »

We set up autopay from checking about 30 or 40 years ago. (Who has time to log in every week and authorize bills to be paid?). When setting it up, I think we had to sign a form authoring the pull. I assume the bank will let anything be paid if the “puller” has our name or SSN to go along with the checking account number. This would prevent typos from pulling from the wrong account.

OP, don’t you also authorize auto-payments TO your checking account? Think pay check, tax refund, or SS. You also authorized these when you signed some form (or tax return). Do you worry that an unknown entity may accidentally add to your checking account without your permission?

regfman wrote: Sun May 15, 2022 4:07 pm Every few years we have to cancel credit cards. Sometimes it's because we think we've lost a wallet and sometimes it's a case of unauthorized use - fraud. When that happens we have to get new ones. It's a minor pain but I've made it a lot easier these days because I now keep a list of every account that is billing to a credit card so that they don't get shut off when a CC gets changed….
I agree that this is a hassle every time an unknown charge ends up on your credit card, which happened to me recently. That’s why most bills are paid from our checking accounts. I’m looking for ways to simplify things as we are in retirement. Sometimes we want to travel for over a month or could be sick or lose cognitive skills and our utilities and insurances(s) will continue to be paid without having to think of them.

I’ve been thinking of making a list of the credit cards and the few bills each pays, but haven’t done it yet. But most of those bills are for purchases from a merchant. We also use PayPal as an intermediary between small merchants and our checking accounts.
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