Career advice

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newparentNYC
Posts: 32
Joined: Sun Apr 04, 2021 1:52 pm

Career advice

Post by newparentNYC »

Hello Bogleheads -

Looking for a bit of career advice as I consider whether to pursue a change. I am early 40s, single earner household, with a young child. Currently work for a large financial firm, income past 3 years has averaged around 500k / yr consisting roughly 60/40 salary vs bonus. Annual savings of a 125-150k / yr (inclusive of maxing my 401k) and current net worth in the low $2m range, approx 1/3 retirement and the remainder after tax accounts.

This year is shaping up to be .. not so great, so I'm likely looking at flat comp as a best case and maybe down 10% total comp as the likely scenario putting me back a bit under $500 for the year. Overall it's been a slog for me the last year+ and I'm struggling to see the path upwards from here and with motivation in general, which seems pretty common at the large firms. I could continue to cruise along and do "well" by any normal measure but I'm not sure that would be so satisfying to me as I've been fairly unhappy at work for the past while.

About a year and a half ago I was pursued aggressively by a small firm (similar but smaller to the firm I was at prior to joining my current firm) which eventually made me an offer, which I declined at the time for a few reasons. First, I had a younger child and was not feeling personally ready to jump to a new position that would be much more demanding of me. Second, I was gunning for a promotion at work (which I got) and which I wanted as a main accomplishment of my time at my current firm; in short, I didn't feel like I had spent enough time in my current position yet to suddenly make another move.

Financially, the offer from the new firm was pretty good - roughly equivalent salary, sign on bonus to make me whole on my missed bonus for the year I resign (non-compete will keep me out of the market for 6 months), and then a very high profit split for the first full year with a minimum guarantee of $700k total comp to a max of $2m.

I ended up not negotiating with them since I already knew at the time that I didn't' want to move but if I had I would have pushed for the extra profit split to be during year 2 rather than year 1 since the first year would likely be spent just getting new strategies up and running. Additionally we never discussed the deferred comp I'd be leaving on the table so I would expect them to match that as well.

Overall the upside at this firm is likely much higher compared to where I am now but the downside is also greater and there's a non-zero chance I flamed out after a few years as well. I'm just having a hard time reconciling these conflicting feelings.

So .. did I make a mistake? I left things on a good note with them and if I wanted to try to pursue this opportunity again (assuming they haven't yet filled the role), any advice on how to reestablish contact and interest? Or should I be looking around more aggressively at other firms?

I do feel like I do not earn quite enough money at the moment (sounds strange to say) just given the cost of everything has gone up so much, especially housing, so the idea of salvaging this year by making a move and thereby guaranteeing next year as well (and nearly doubling my savings rate due to the higher earnings) feels a bit hard to pass up if it is still there, considering it would probably take me at least 3+ years to reach a similar income level on my current trajectory in my current position.
Last edited by newparentNYC on Sat Oct 07, 2023 3:17 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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FiveK
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Re: Career advice

Post by FiveK »

newparentNYC wrote: Tue Jun 06, 2023 6:50 pm ...income past 3 years has averaged 500k / yr... Annual savings of a 125-150k / yr (inclusive of maxing my 401k)....

I do feel like I do not earn quite enough money at the moment....
Even assuming high state taxes (e.g., CA), the numbers above imply ~$200K/yr after-tax spending. Up to you if the spending and/or savings seem insufficient and thus worth rolling the dice to allow more.
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Watty
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Re: Career advice

Post by Watty »

One thing that might help would be to redo your calculations in after tax dollars. In one job you might make more but a $100K before tax difference sounds a lot larger than a $50K(ish) after tax difference.

That said which job would you take if money was not a factor? You might last longer in that job without getting burned out.

There was a lot in your post about the dollar values but it more sounded mainly like numbers for score keeping and there was very little in your post about what the non-monetary factors of the different jobs are.

One job or the other could also be more secure.

That could be very important in a recession when layoffs can happen at any level.

In some fields jobs tend to be "up or out" and if you get off the promotion track and are forced out when you are 45 or 50 you may never get another job that pays at that level again.
tashnewbie
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Joined: Thu Apr 23, 2020 12:44 pm

Re: Career advice

Post by tashnewbie »

I think you first need to decide whether you want a new job. It wasn't quite clear to me from your post what exactly your dissatisfaction is with the current job. I think you just mentioned vaguely that you're "unhappy."

If you decide you want to change jobs, then I think it makes sense to cast your net wide, including reconnecting with the smaller firm that offered you a position last year. Would you be able to determine if they have any promising open positions by checking their website?
newparentNYC wrote: Tue Jun 06, 2023 6:50 pm Currently work for a large financial firm for 4 years, income past 3 years has averaged 500k / yr consisting roughly 60/40 salary vs bonus. Annual savings of a 125-150k / yr (inclusive of maxing my 401k)
I expected higher annual savings with this salary. But you're probably paying combined ~42% marginal taxes so maybe that explains it. You should keep in mind your target portfolio value for FI so that you have a clearer sense of what your savings rate should be in the near term.
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TomatoTomahto
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Re: Career advice

Post by TomatoTomahto »

Maybe some more detail about why you’re unhappy at work and why you expect flat to 10% down total comp would be helpful to those wishing to provide advice. Also, some information about your employer, potential employers, position would help; not so much detail as to be anonymity shattering but it can give a sense of why you might be stalled.

Don’t feel bad about not being ebullient about $500k; you appear to be based in NYC and with taxes and COL, “half a buck” doesn’t go as far as it once did. That’s difficult for many in lower COL locations to comprehend.
I get the FI part but not the RE part of FIRE.
muffins14
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Location: New York

Re: Career advice

Post by muffins14 »

They gave you an offer, so you met some people on the team, right?

Just reach out to one again over email or LinkedIn and ask to have a coffee and catch up.

Now you’ve gotten in touch, established contact and interest.

Not that hard, just do it. If you don’t want to do it, that must be a sign you don’t really want to work with them.

As you’re aware, reward usually has risk, so if you want to get that 40%-500% raise, you know you might have to work harder, and yea, it might not work out. No risk no reward. You’re not going to get 700k-2M comp in a job that has no risk. Since you know the tradeoff, perhaps you should try it out for a year.

It might be easier to get an extra 200k in your pocket if your partner would work, too. Would they be willing and able to work rather than be home with the child full-time?
Crom laughs at your Four Winds
Minderbinder
Posts: 168
Joined: Wed Feb 14, 2018 2:41 pm

Re: Career advice

Post by Minderbinder »

newparentNYC wrote: Tue Jun 06, 2023 6:50 pm
I do feel like I do not earn quite enough money at the moment (sounds strange to say) just given the cost of everything has gone up so much, especially housing
I think from your numbers you have a spending problem more than an income problem.

In this environment tough to say whether old comp terms are relevant at all, they are not for certain industries (tech) but never hurts to ask.

I'd start more with figuring out what is particularly grinding you. Is it not having enough saved, being absolutely miserable in a job, or purely regret that you can't get over from making a bad decision. Root cause then determines your correct path as there are different ways to address different issues.
srt7
Posts: 1357
Joined: Mon Sep 29, 2014 12:19 pm

Re: Career advice

Post by srt7 »

Others have given solid advice so I won't repeat them.

All I will say is ... stop living in the past and work towards a job you feel is a good fit (rather than trying to get away from one). Good luck!
Taking care of tomorrow while enjoying today.
YeWill
Posts: 83
Joined: Sat May 20, 2023 1:21 am

Re: Career advice

Post by YeWill »

srt7 wrote: Wed Jun 07, 2023 9:51 am Others have given solid advice so I won't repeat them.

All I will say is ... stop living in the past and work towards a job you feel is a good fit (rather than trying to get away from one). Good luck!
Not trying to trivialize the situation but OPs post reads like .... I was offered a choice of a bottle of red and white wine with dinner. I accepted a bottle of white wine. I liked the first glass but not so on the second. Did I make the right choice?


OP ...
A/ write short posts.
B/ if you had to ask if you made the right choice AFTER THE FACT, you probably did make the right choice BEFOREHAND but knowing this doesn't help you anything about your current situation. Move on.
crisp3er
Posts: 29
Joined: Sun Dec 27, 2020 11:08 am

Re: Career advice

Post by crisp3er »

Man, I totally get where you're coming from. A few years ago, I was in a similar boat, working in a steady job but feeling pretty stuck. The daily grind just wasn't doing it for me anymore. I had this offer from a smaller company that was super tempting, but like you, I had my reasons to stay.

But then, I thought, "What if?" What if this was my chance to shake things up? So, I took the plunge. So, if you're thinking of reaching out to that small firm again, I say go for it.

And about the income thing, I totally get it. Life's expensive, and sometimes you've got to make moves to keep up. While I was in the midst of all this, I took some time to upgrade my skills. Did a few human resources certifications online. It gave me a fresh perspective and even helped me negotiate better in my new role.
Last edited by crisp3er on Thu Dec 21, 2023 10:55 am, edited 1 time in total.
er999
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Joined: Wed Nov 05, 2008 10:00 am

Re: Career advice

Post by er999 »

Do you own a house or rent? Perhaps if rent harder to get a stable expenses. If your current job would be limited to $500k, and you have the potential of 4x in your new job, that means 6 years at the new job could potentially be work 24 years work at the old job (not exactly as discounting higher taxes). That could mitigate the higher risk of switching positions, assuming you can last at least a few years.

Personally I would consider non compensation factors before switching since $500k is still a lot of money. Do I like my current coworkers and would I be working more hours? Would the new job be more fun or interesting? Like the other poster said could be more a spending issue and could work on economizing first unless than are other positive things about the new job besides pay.
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