Possible gas leaks? (Update and new questions)

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student
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Possible gas leaks? (Update and new questions)

Post by student »

There is a bad smell (every now and then) for the past few days from the utility/laundry room where the water heater and the furnace are in, which is also the place I keep my garbage. So I assume that it is from the garbage. Today is garbage day and I took out the garbage last night. This morning the bad smell was coming from the kitchen area (next to the utility/laundry room). I checked the closet in the utility room, no bad smell. So I concluded that it was from the pipe via the kitchen sink. So I used garbage disposal/sink freshener. About an hour ago, the utility room smelled from the closet where the water heater and the furnace are in. So I went to Home Depot and got https://www.homedepot.com/p/HOME-FLEX-E ... /301876827 Came back and the smell is gone. Used the detector and it did not find anything. I understand that sometimes it may be caused by a backdraft. Any idea?

Update: See below.
Last edited by student on Sun Jun 04, 2023 7:02 am, edited 2 times in total.
livesoft
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Re: Possible gas leaks?

Post by livesoft »

When we have had a mercaptan odor we call the gas company. They come out at any time. The person who comes out is on call to do exactly that. They WANT to come out because otherwise their job is BORING. One time the smell led to our gas meter being replaced within 1 hour.

Of course, maybe you have a dead rat, mouse, or roommate that is causing the smell. That will be a different bad smell than a gas leak, but you did not state it was a gas (i.e. mercaptan) smell.
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hicabob
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Re: Possible gas leaks?

Post by hicabob »

Complimentary mercaptan scratch n sniff's are available if OP is not familiar with the odor.

https://www.dominionenergy.com/safety/n ... -and-sniff
Luke Duke
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Re: Possible gas leaks?

Post by Luke Duke »

If the gas company detects gas, they will shut off your service until the leak is repaired. If the leak is downstream of the meter, it is probably your responsibility to fix the problem. I'd have a plumber on speed dial that you can call or be prepared to be without gas for several days.
homebuyer6426
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Re: Possible gas leaks?

Post by homebuyer6426 »

My wife when she was living in Greece used to get bad smells coming from the shower drain in her bathroom. I believe it was because the pipes there weren't vented, but I don't know for sure.

It was not a smell you would mistake for the rotten-egg smell of natural gas, though.
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makeitcount
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Re: Possible gas leaks?

Post by makeitcount »

I would call the gas company especially if is this is a new thing you are noticing.
I too have a detector able to alert when natural gas is detected. I have called the gas company twice when I smelled natural gas in the same room as the non-alerting detector and both times minor leaks were detected and corrected for. Often the human nose is more sensitive to the smell additive than the commercially available detectors are to the natural gas itself.
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Hockey10
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Re: Possible gas leaks?

Post by Hockey10 »

During an energy audit, the auditor detected a tiny leak in the gas pipe going into our heater. (I could not smell any sign of natural gas). He asked that I call the local gas utility immediately. The utility guy showed up within 10 minutes and fixed the leak. No charge. I was impressed with the service from both the energy auditor and the gas company employee.
TLC1957
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Re: Possible gas leaks?

Post by TLC1957 »

Call the fire department! I am a volunteer firefighter we have gas meters and will respond significantly faster than the utility company. You never want to wait to call if you smell natural gas. The gas explosions are significant events and result in deaths and destruction.
adamthesmythe
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Re: Possible gas leaks?

Post by adamthesmythe »

The smell of leaking natural gas is quite distinctive and most people can probably tell the difference between that and something else.

Good suggestions above to call fire department or the gas company. (Better than a cheap gas detector with unknown capability). I have experience with calling the gas company (called on the neighbor, and on a leak big enough to HEAR). They responded quickly and (as it turned out) the location actually belonged to a different gas company.
bbqguru
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Re: Possible gas leaks?

Post by bbqguru »

If you have a drain in the mechanical room (floor, sink, condensate, etc...) pour a pitcher or so of water down the drain. Many times the smell is from a drain where the p-trap has dried out and is letting sewer gas back into the room. However, if in doubt or any hesitation, call your gas supplier. It's their job to check, and trust me when I say this, they'd rather come out and find nothing versus not being called and hearing about it on the news. (Speaking from a guy who owns a gas company).
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Re: Possible gas leaks?

Post by mrc »

If you are not familiar with the difference between the smell of garbage, an open drain (sewer gas), and mercaptan (the scent agent added to odorless natural gas, this can be tough to diagnose. A garbage smell can linger a little while as can sewer gas even if you fill all the drain traps. Perhaps a friend or neighbor can stop by and help you ID what you are smelling. If it is a gas leak, you don't want to delay. Once you know the source, the remedy will be clear.
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livesoft
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Re: Possible gas leaks?

Post by livesoft »

It has been 2 hours, so we should have a report about what the gas company technician found out about this smell.
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student
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Re: Possible gas leaks?

Post by student »

Thank you so much for the replies. The smell is no longer there. So that's a good sign. I haven't called the gas company. (I don't want to the boy who cries wolf. I am afraid I would be tagged in the system for false report.)
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Cheez-It Guy
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Re: Possible gas leaks?

Post by Cheez-It Guy »

Check for dry trap in rarely-used plumbing drains. Residual water in the p-trap creates a liquid seal against sewer or septic gases. The water evaporates over time and eventually breaks the seal. Then there is nothing to stop gases coming back up. Specific atmospheric conditions can also pull a vacuum and siphon a trap dry.

I have an unused guest bathroom, and I have to remember to run or pour water in the fixture drains every few weeks to avoid this.
MadDwag
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Re: Possible gas leaks?

Post by MadDwag »

student wrote: Fri Jun 02, 2023 4:24 pm Thank you so much for the replies. The smell is no longer there. So that's a good sign. I haven't called the gas company. (I don't want to the boy who cries wolf. I am afraid I would be tagged in the system for false report.)
Better to be the boy crying wolf one time than having an issue on your hands. Especially one that you're aware of and have documented on an online forum that your insurance company can point so saying you were aware and didn't do anything about...
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Re: Possible gas leaks?

Post by student »

MadDwag wrote: Fri Jun 02, 2023 4:33 pm
student wrote: Fri Jun 02, 2023 4:24 pm Thank you so much for the replies. The smell is no longer there. So that's a good sign. I haven't called the gas company. (I don't want to the boy who cries wolf. I am afraid I would be tagged in the system for false report.)
Better to be the boy crying wolf one time than having an issue on your hands. Especially one that you're aware of and have documented on an online forum that your insurance company can point so saying you were aware and didn't do anything about...
Good point. If I smell something that I think is gas again, I will call someone.
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Re: Possible gas leaks?

Post by HomeStretch »

student wrote: Fri Jun 02, 2023 4:24 pm …If I smell something that I think is gas again, I will call someone.
First, exit your house and don’t operate any light switches, your phone, etc. while exiting.
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student
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Re: Possible gas leaks?

Post by student »

hicabob wrote: Fri Jun 02, 2023 2:16 pm Complimentary mercaptan scratch n sniff's are available if OP is not familiar with the odor.

https://www.dominionenergy.com/safety/n ... -and-sniff
Thanks. I ordered.
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student
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Re: Possible gas leaks?

Post by student »

Cheez-It Guy wrote: Fri Jun 02, 2023 4:32 pm Check for dry trap in rarely-used plumbing drains. Residual water in the p-trap creates a liquid seal against sewer or septic gases. The water evaporates over time and eventually breaks the seal. Then there is nothing to stop gases coming back up. Specific atmospheric conditions can also pull a vacuum and siphon a trap dry.

I have an unused guest bathroom, and I have to remember to run or pour water in the fixture drains every few weeks to avoid this.
Thanks. The shower that I don't use have this problem and I have to pour water a few times in the past decade.
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Re: Possible gas leaks?

Post by zie »

If you get the gas smell, definitely call your gas company. They will wander out with their special sniffing equipment, they can almost always tell you exactly where the leak is. Sometimes fixing the leak is child's play, just tightening a connector. That's not something they can technically do if it's in your house, but if you have a wrench, they are almost always willing to let you tighten it, and then test again, right there on the spot. If it's more involved, unless you happen to be smart about iron pipe and gas, it's better to have a gas specialist come out.

Better safe than sorry. They don't charge you extra, even if they don't find a leak. It's already all baked into the bills you pay to have people on stand-by ready to check your system for leaks, so don't be afraid to use it.

The only time they will get mad over it(as far as I know) is if they find a leak, close your gas down and then you go turn it on again without them verifying the leak is fixed. Don't do that. Have them come verify the leak is fixed and let them turn it on, it's quick and simple. It's very common to get same day service for leak checks. They don't want leaks any more than you do. They get all the bad PR when your house blows up from a gas leak, so they are even incentivized.

And you should be incentivized to call because you don't want the headache of having your house blow up, though I guess if you are inside of it at the time, you won't have a headache, you will be dead.
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Re: Possible gas leaks?

Post by nordsteve »

If you've got a drain that dries, after you fill it with water pour a bit of baby or cooking oil in. It floats, and keeps the water from evaporating. A quarter cup is plenty.
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Re: Possible gas leaks?

Post by bikesandbeers »

I recently saw a news item that my local gas company bought new/more advanced sniffers for the local fire departments. I think you can call either with a suspected leak.
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Re: Possible gas leaks?

Post by tunafish »

bbqguru wrote: Fri Jun 02, 2023 4:02 pm If you have a drain in the mechanical room (floor, sink, condensate, etc...) pour a pitcher or so of water down the drain. Many times the smell is from a drain where the p-trap has dried out and is letting sewer gas back into the room. However, if in doubt or any hesitation, call your gas supplier. It's their job to check, and trust me when I say this, they'd rather come out and find nothing versus not being called and hearing about it on the news. (Speaking from a guy who owns a gas company).
Yes. the gas issue is much much more important than a drain issue, but this reminded me that a plumber once told me to run water in the upstairs bathroom, which I basically never use, at least once a month otherwise the water that normally blocks sewer gas will have evaporated. so now it's on my calendar.
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Re: Possible gas leaks?

Post by student »

Thanks again for all the help. Everything seems normal at this time. Since all my Kidde monitors only do CO, I went to Home Depot again to get one that does both CO and explosive gas. So far, it has not detected anything. I will also ask the HVAC guy to check for leaks when he comes for the annual maintenance.
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Re: Possible gas leaks?

Post by Sandtrap »

student wrote: Fri Jun 02, 2023 1:54 pm There is a bad smell (every now and then) for the past few days from the utility/laundry room where the water heater and the furnace are in, which is also the place I keep my garbage. So I assume that it is from the garbage. Today is garbage day and I took out the garbage last night. This morning the bad smell was coming from the kitchen area (next to the utility/laundry room). I checked the closet in the utility room, no bad smell. So I concluded that it was from the pipe via the kitchen sink. So I used garbage disposal/sink freshener. About an hour ago, the utility room smelled from the closet where the water heater and the furnace are in. So I went to Home Depot and got https://www.homedepot.com/p/HOME-FLEX-E ... /301876827 Came back and the smell is gone. Used the detector and it did not find anything. I understand that sometimes it may be caused by a backdraft. Any idea?
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TLC1957
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Re: Possible gas leaks?

Post by TLC1957 »

My experience as a firefighter regarding a gas leak…

You call the utility company …..they come when they can send someone….

You call the Fire Department they are at your door in 5 minutes…they locate the gas leak and secure the building….If we ie the fire department calls the utility company they respond immediately.

Your choice….

So what do you do when you smell smoke in your home???
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leeks
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Re: Possible gas leaks?

Post by leeks »

student wrote: Fri Jun 02, 2023 4:24 pm Thank you so much for the replies. The smell is no longer there. So that's a good sign. I haven't called the gas company. (I don't want to the boy who cries wolf. I am afraid I would be tagged in the system for false report.)
There is nothing false about reporting that you are unsure about a smell and want to confim it is not gas. Just be honest and don't hesitate to report immediately. No one will tag you as troublesome. Gas companies and fire departments want you to report any possible leak.

Sometimes when I am on a walk I get a whiff of natural gas smell. I always call and report the general location just in case even if I can't tell where it might have been coming from. Then I continue on my way and don't think about it again. But I know that immediate reporting is the right thing to do.
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Re: Possible gas leaks?

Post by samsoes »

student wrote: Fri Jun 02, 2023 4:24 pm Thank you so much for the replies. The smell is no longer there. So that's a good sign. I haven't called the gas company. (I don't want to the boy who cries wolf. I am afraid I would be tagged in the system for false report.)
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student
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Re: Possible gas leaks?

Post by student »

Thanks for the comments. I did call the gas company and they came within 30 minutes. There is a leak.
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Sandtrap
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Re: Possible gas leaks?

Post by Sandtrap »

TLC1957 wrote: Fri Jun 02, 2023 7:34 pm My experience as a firefighter regarding a gas leak…

You call the utility company …..they come when they can send someone….

You call the Fire Department they are at your door in 5 minutes…they locate the gas leak and secure the building….If we ie the fire department calls the utility company they respond immediately.

Your choice….

So what do you do when you smell smoke in your home???
outstanding

j
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student
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Re: Possible gas leaks?

Post by student »

Sandtrap wrote: Fri Jun 02, 2023 8:30 pm
TLC1957 wrote: Fri Jun 02, 2023 7:34 pm My experience as a firefighter regarding a gas leak…

You call the utility company …..they come when they can send someone….

You call the Fire Department they are at your door in 5 minutes…they locate the gas leak and secure the building….If we ie the fire department calls the utility company they respond immediately.

Your choice….

So what do you do when you smell smoke in your home???
outstanding

j
Thanks again for your suggestion. Now I have to find a plumber that I can trust.
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student
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Re: Possible gas leaks?

Post by student »

TLC1957 wrote: Fri Jun 02, 2023 7:34 pm My experience as a firefighter regarding a gas leak…

You call the utility company …..they come when they can send someone….

You call the Fire Department they are at your door in 5 minutes…they locate the gas leak and secure the building….If we ie the fire department calls the utility company they respond immediately.

Your choice….

So what do you do when you smell smoke in your home???
Very good point. Thanks so much. Now that I know there is a leak, I have to find a plumber. I probably won't be able to get anyone until Monday. Of course, my fault by not acting sooner.
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Re: Possible gas leaks?

Post by zie »

student wrote: Fri Jun 02, 2023 8:19 pm Thanks for the comments. I did call the gas company and they came within 30 minutes. There is a leak.
Glad you called! Now the chances of you being dead this weekend go down much closer to zero! Hopefully the fix is inexpensive.

Also great that the gas company was so quick to respond!
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Re: Possible gas leaks? (Update and new questions)

Post by student »

Update: Thank you for all the help. I was able to get a plumber to come in yesterday and a joint needed to be replaced. I called the plumber that I did business before. He said he does not do this type of repair but he recommended another company. I also asked him to check all linings and fittings in the utility closet and the gas fireplace in the living room. Interesting that he used the same cheap detector that I was using but it did beep for him in the same area that beeped for the gas company person. When he was done, I was asking him to let me try with my own detector to see whether I am doing it correctly. He said it would beep if I tried because he just put the kind of paste that he was using. He even showed me that it beeped when he put it against the jar of paste.

New questions.

1) Image is the picture of the work. I see that the tag for the valve of the new joint is there. Is it suppose to be there or it is immaterial. I did not notice it when he was done so I did not ask him.

2) I am going to replace all my carbon monoxide detectors with https://www.amazon.com/Nighthawk-Monoxi ... 0225&psc=1 Are there better kind out there?

3) Now that I have experienced a gas leak, my paranoid half is in high alert. I asked the plumber how often do I need to have a professional come in to check. (I read on a plumber's website that one should check once a year.) He said just once every 10-20 years and these things don't usually leak. Do you guys check on a regular basis?

4) I wish the gas company offers inspection service (and I am willing to pay extra) other than coming out for emergency. I trust their expensive detector more than the cheap ones. What other places provide such services?
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Re: Possible gas leaks? (Update and new questions)

Post by zie »

1) the label is immaterial, feel free to remove it if you wish.

2) Shrugs, no idea. You could call your Gas company and see if they have thoughts.

3) They put that noxious smell in the gas on purpose. That is your leak detector at work. Maybe sniff around once a year if you are so inclined. I'm with your plumber, don't worry about it much. See below for another way to test besides your nose.

4) Your gas company :) They are pretty much the only ones willing to pay the $$$$'s for the fancy detectors. Some plumbing companies that specialize in gas might buy some.


Another way to test for leaks is to go around to all of your gas using appliances and shut them off, so they won't use any gas. Then go to your main meter and close the valve(on the upstream side of the usage meter) and then check your usage meter and record what it's at. Come back a while later and verify the usage meter hasn't moved. If it's moved, then you know you either forgot to shut off a device somewhere or you have a leak. A while later could be 10m or an hour, up to you. Anything more than an hour is overkill in my opinion.
Whether rich or poor, a young woman should know how a bank account works, understand the composition of mortgages and bonds, and know the value of interest and how it accumulates. -Hetty Green
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Re: Possible gas leaks? (Update and new questions)

Post by student »

zie wrote: Sun Jun 04, 2023 10:30 am 1) the label is immaterial, feel free to remove it if you wish.

2) Shrugs, no idea. You could call your Gas company and see if they have thoughts.

3) They put that noxious smell in the gas on purpose. That is your leak detector at work. Maybe sniff around once a year if you are so inclined. I'm with your plumber, don't worry about it much. See below for another way to test besides your nose.

4) Your gas company :) They are pretty much the only ones willing to pay the $$$$'s for the fancy detectors. Some plumbing companies that specialize in gas might buy some.


Another way to test for leaks is to go around to all of your gas using appliances and shut them off, so they won't use any gas. Then go to your main meter and close the valve(on the upstream side of the usage meter) and then check your usage meter and record what it's at. Come back a while later and verify the usage meter hasn't moved. If it's moved, then you know you either forgot to shut off a device somewhere or you have a leak. A while later could be 10m or an hour, up to you. Anything more than an hour is overkill in my opinion.
I appreciate your detailed response. Thank you very much!!!
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Re: Possible gas leaks? (Update and new questions)

Post by Cheez-It Guy »

Please remove the nasty valve label. It bothers me and at best could interfere with correct valve function.
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Re: Possible gas leaks? (Update and new questions)

Post by adamthesmythe »

I would have used teflon tape not a paste. Not because I am a plumber but because I have used toxic gases in the lab.
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Re: Possible gas leaks? (Update and new questions)

Post by neilpilot »

adamthesmythe wrote: Sun Jun 04, 2023 1:36 pm I would have used teflon tape not a paste. Not because I am a plumber but because I have used toxic gases in the lab.
CAREFUL - typical Teflon tape (white) should NOT be used in natural gas service. Only the yellow thread seal tape is correct for this service, and pipe dopw is actually a better choice. I'm also not a plumber, but a ChemE with much industrial gas experience.
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Re: Possible gas leaks? (Update and new questions)

Post by zie »

student wrote: Sun Jun 04, 2023 12:35 pm
zie wrote: Sun Jun 04, 2023 10:30 am 1) the label is immaterial, feel free to remove it if you wish.

2) Shrugs, no idea. You could call your Gas company and see if they have thoughts.

3) They put that noxious smell in the gas on purpose. That is your leak detector at work. Maybe sniff around once a year if you are so inclined. I'm with your plumber, don't worry about it much. See below for another way to test besides your nose.

4) Your gas company :) They are pretty much the only ones willing to pay the $$$$'s for the fancy detectors. Some plumbing companies that specialize in gas might buy some.


Another way to test for leaks is to go around to all of your gas using appliances and shut them off, so they won't use any gas. Then go to your main meter and close the valve(on the upstream side of the usage meter) and then check your usage meter and record what it's at. Come back a while later and verify the usage meter hasn't moved. If it's moved, then you know you either forgot to shut off a device somewhere or you have a leak. A while later could be 10m or an hour, up to you. Anything more than an hour is overkill in my opinion.
I appreciate your detailed response. Thank you very much!!!
My local gas company, when they do this turn everything off, check the usage test, they do it for at least 10m. Any leak that didn't show up in 10m they don't think is a concern at all. They try to be pretty strict about setting a timer and ensuring at least 10m happened though. The lazy way to ensure movement on the usage meter is with a marker/sharpie and just mark the arrows on the case. This way it's pretty obvious if the arrows moved.

Also, I'm totally with neilpilot, don't use teflon tape for natural gas. Pipe Dope or the special yellow tape, though everyone I've ever come across always uses the pipe dope for gas.
Whether rich or poor, a young woman should know how a bank account works, understand the composition of mortgages and bonds, and know the value of interest and how it accumulates. -Hetty Green
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Re: Possible gas leaks? (Update and new questions)

Post by Kagord »

If not repaired, I'm hoping your gas main is off. I'd be very surprised if a licensed plumber was not able to fix an identified gas leak did not do this.
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Re: Possible gas leaks? (Update and new questions)

Post by dagsboro »

Please don't delay in calling your natural gas provider so it can identify or rule out natural gas which contains the safety odorant called mercaptan. If it is a natural gas leak, the leak could come from something as small as a "pin hole" in a connector and the high tech sniffer used by the gas company will find it immediately.
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Re: Possible gas leaks? (Update and new questions)

Post by niagara_guy »

I have a natural gas detector that plugs in in the room where my furnace and hot water heater live. Just a few bucks.

+1 that a drain without water in it can let foul smells into a room. Put water down the drain, some will stay in the trap.
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Re: Possible gas leaks? (Update and new questions)

Post by Big Dog »

neilpilot wrote: Sun Jun 04, 2023 1:50 pm
adamthesmythe wrote: Sun Jun 04, 2023 1:36 pm I would have used teflon tape not a paste. Not because I am a plumber but because I have used toxic gases in the lab.
CAREFUL - typical Teflon tape (white) should NOT be used in natural gas service. Only the yellow thread seal tape is correct for this service, and pipe dopw is actually a better choice. I'm also not a plumber, but a ChemE with much industrial gas experience.
Concur.
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Re: Possible gas leaks? (Update and new questions)

Post by student »

niagara_guy wrote: Tue Jun 06, 2023 8:55 am I have a natural gas detector that plugs in in the room where my furnace and hot water heater live. Just a few bucks.

+1 that a drain without water in it can let foul smells into a room. Put water down the drain, some will stay in the trap.
What brand do you recommend? I am swapping out my carbon monoxide detectors with the combo (carbon monoxide and explosive gas) from Kidde. That's the brand that I know and have used for a long time.
wilked
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Re: Possible gas leaks? (Update and new questions)

Post by wilked »

neilpilot wrote: Sun Jun 04, 2023 1:50 pm
adamthesmythe wrote: Sun Jun 04, 2023 1:36 pm I would have used teflon tape not a paste. Not because I am a plumber but because I have used toxic gases in the lab.
CAREFUL - typical Teflon tape (white) should NOT be used in natural gas service. Only the yellow thread seal tape is correct for this service, and pipe dopw is actually a better choice. I'm also not a plumber, but a ChemE with much industrial gas experience.
yep - don't be a dope; always use pipe dope :-)
tonyclifton
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Re: Possible gas leaks? (Update and new questions)

Post by tonyclifton »

This thread made me want to deal with a faint whiff of natural gas my spouse and I would smell from time to time in our basement. I called yesterday and made the appointment with a plumber. Plumber just left. Less than $150 to locate and fix the leak. I thought it was dry drain line in a shower but is was a leaking coupling where two pipes joined together. Fortunately the pipes were exposed.
niagara_guy
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Re: Possible gas leaks? (Update and new questions)

Post by niagara_guy »

I just looked at my gas detector and didn't see any markings on it, I believe I bought it on Amazon. I believe for natural gas the detector should be mounted up high since natural gas rises (I believe down low for LPG detector since LPG is heavier than air).

I want a CO detector near sleeping area, so I have separate detectors for CO and natural gas.
Topic Author
student
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Re: Possible gas leaks? (Update and new questions)

Post by student »

niagara_guy wrote: Wed Jun 07, 2023 6:30 am I just looked at my gas detector and didn't see any markings on it, I believe I bought it on Amazon. I believe for natural gas the detector should be mounted up high since natural gas rises (I believe down low for LPG detector since LPG is heavier than air).

I want a CO detector near sleeping area, so I have separate detectors for CO and natural gas.
Thanks. I have the CO detectors mounted high.
neilpilot
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Re: Possible gas leaks? (Update and new questions)

Post by neilpilot »

student wrote: Wed Jun 07, 2023 6:41 am
niagara_guy wrote: Wed Jun 07, 2023 6:30 am I just looked at my gas detector and didn't see any markings on it, I believe I bought it on Amazon. I believe for natural gas the detector should be mounted up high since natural gas rises (I believe down low for LPG detector since LPG is heavier than air).

I want a CO detector near sleeping area, so I have separate detectors for CO and natural gas.
Thanks. I have the CO detectors mounted high.
While CO detectors will function when mounted high, that's certainly not optimal. Since CO essentially mixes with air, the best position is 3-6' off the floor.
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