Lenovo Thinkpad X1 Extreme refurbished vs new

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leeks
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Lenovo Thinkpad X1 Extreme refurbished vs new

Post by leeks »

I've been needing a new laptop for a while, my current one is 9 years old. I use it for personal use and part-time freelance work (including GIS and data analysis software), no gaming. Among other issues, it crashes if you use the touchpad so it is only usable with an external mouse. Also I have gone through 3-4 batteries but currently can't hold a charge for more than 20 minutes. I've been shopping on and off for 8 months but have felt like the prices were unreasonable.

My minimum requirements:
~ 1TB SSD
~ 32 GB RAM
~ i7 processor
~ NVIDIA graphics card
~ >14" screen

I prefer Lenovo but want to switch back to a Thinkpad. My current one has not been as good as prior Thinkpads. I really miss the mouse button in the middle of the keyboard and mouse click buttons. Those just work much better for me than touchpads. I want a larger screen than the 14" that comes on the regular X1 Thinkpads. My husband has the 14" one and it is just a bit too small for me. I often move my laptop around the house and won't always be using it with an external monitor. However, looking at the Thinkpad offerings, the larger models outside the "X" line (the ones that have a numeric keypad) are just a bit too wide and heavy for me.

So I have settled on the Thinkpad X1 Extreme as meeting my preferred balance of size and portability.

I just ordered a refurbished 2021 one for $1K on Ebay (reputable dealer) to see if it seems good enough. I will have 30 days free return so I'm not committed. It is a Thinkpad X1 Extreme Gen 3:
~ 1TB SSD
~ 32 GB RAM
~ 10th generation i7 processor 2.70 GHz
~ NVIDIA GeForce GTX 1650 Ti Max-Q
~ 15.6" display at 3840 x 2160 resolution (I won't know more about the screen until it arrives, I hope it is not a touch screen)

I'm unimpressed with any of the Memorial Day deals on the Lenovo site. It looks like ballpark $2500 to get a new Gen 5 X1 Extreme with my minimum specs (it would have a 12th generation i7 processor).

Am I cheaping out by trying the used one? Would the gen 5 model really be $1500 better? Or does anyone know of third-party vendors that would have a better deal on a new one? Costco only has the 14" size.
Last edited by leeks on Sun May 28, 2023 12:11 pm, edited 2 times in total.
MH2
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Re: Lenovo Thinkpad X1 Extreme refurbished vs new

Post by MH2 »

I've bought several news, used, and refurbished Lenovos. I haven't had an issue with any of them. My rule has always been to go for whatever T, W, or X series is being CERP'ed or coming off of a corporate lease and fits my needs.

I will say this, though. Unless if you have a use case for Windows, consider making the jump to one of the MacBooks with an M1/M2 processor.
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Re: Lenovo Thinkpad X1 Extreme refurbished vs new

Post by leeks »

MH2 wrote: Sun May 28, 2023 11:57 am I've bought several news, used, and refurbished Lenovos. I haven't had an issue with any of them. My rule has always been to go for whatever T, W, or X series is being CERP'ed or coming off of a corporate lease and fits my needs.

I will say this, though. Unless if you have a use case for Windows, consider making the jump to one of the MacBooks with an M1/M2 processor.
I have never liked Macs or anything made by Apple. My intuition must be unusual as it somehow doesn't match any of their "intuitive" designs.

I know Windows is crappy. My computer scientist husband uses Linux and I have tried to switch to it before. However, it wasn't good for our marriage for me to rely on his help to figure out anything about my computer. It's better if I have Windows so he can claim not to be able to help me with anything.

Also I work in ArcGIS and most of my clients rely on Windows based software so Windows is what I am stuck with.

What is CERP?
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Re: Lenovo Thinkpad X1 Extreme refurbished vs new

Post by cacophony »

leeks wrote: Sun May 28, 2023 11:47 am ...
Am I cheaping out by trying the used one? Would the gen 5 model really be $1500 better? Or does anyone know of third-party vendors that would have a better deal on a new one? Costco only has the 14" size.[/b]
I think you're making a reasonable choice as the gen 5 is most definitely not worth an extra $1500. Thinkpads last a long time and are easy to repair if needed. Offhand I don't know of any better deals, but note that the P1 Gen 1/2/3/4/5 more or less identical to the X1 Extreme Gen 1/2/3/4/5, so that might give you some more options to look for.
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Re: Lenovo Thinkpad X1 Extreme refurbished vs new

Post by MH2 »

leeks wrote: Sun May 28, 2023 12:06 pm Also I work in ArcGIS...
Ick :mrgreen:
leeks wrote: Sun May 28, 2023 12:06 pm What is CERP?
Capital equipment replacement.
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Re: Lenovo Thinkpad X1 Extreme refurbished vs new

Post by leeks »

MH2 wrote: Sun May 28, 2023 12:21 pm
leeks wrote: Sun May 28, 2023 12:06 pm Also I work in ArcGIS...
Ick :mrgreen:
I know how to do things in QGIS or python or other tools. But my clients often use ArcGIS (shrug). I am an analyst not a developer.
Last edited by leeks on Sun May 28, 2023 12:34 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Lenovo Thinkpad X1 Extreme refurbished vs new

Post by MH2 »

leeks wrote: Sun May 28, 2023 12:27 pm
MH2 wrote: Sun May 28, 2023 12:21 pm
leeks wrote: Sun May 28, 2023 12:06 pm Also I work in ArcGIS...
Ick :mrgreen:
I know how to do things in QGIS or python or other tools. But my clients often use ArcGIS (shrug). I am an analyst not a developer.
I completely understand. One of the reasons I'm trying to ride out academia as long as possible... :beer
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Re: Lenovo Thinkpad X1 Extreme refurbished vs new

Post by Yarlonkol12 »

Why not buy a Mac M1/M2 in the same price range instead? My $800 base M1 Macbook air is perfect for all of my general purpose computing. I use it a few hours a day usually and plug it in every few days or so, no fans/heat, great form factor, love it

If your a PC gamer, I can see the case for building a Desktop Windows PC, but I'm at a loss as to why anyone would buy an x86 based laptop these days for the same (or more???) money :confused
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Re: Lenovo Thinkpad X1 Extreme refurbished vs new

Post by alexbogle »

I agree that the m1/m2 laptops are the best in value and performance right now for laptops.

But if you need arcgis then you may be stuck with Intel or amd for now.

My understanding is that Lenovo pricing has moved to a coupon model. Without using coupons, the prices are unreasonable.

Check if you can get access to perksatwork.com or a similar coupon-through-employment site that will give you a reasonable deal.
"Learn every day, but especially from the experiences of others. It’s cheaper!” -- Jack Bogle
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Re: Lenovo Thinkpad X1 Extreme refurbished vs new

Post by 8301 »

Yarlonkol12 wrote: Sun May 28, 2023 12:42 pm Why not buy a Mac M1/M2 in the same price range instead? My $800 base M1 Macbook air is perfect for all of my general purpose computing. I use it a few hours a day usually and plug it in every few days or so, no fans/heat, great form factor, love it

If your a PC gamer, I can see the case for building a Desktop Windows PC, but I'm at a loss as to why anyone would buy an x86 based laptop these days for the same (or more???) money :confused
Why do any grownups devote of so much of their time and energy to a little thing called computers? If one has spent enough time to become familiar with one type, why should he repeat again?
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Re: Lenovo Thinkpad X1 Extreme refurbished vs new

Post by NYCaviator »

leeks wrote: Sun May 28, 2023 11:47 am Am I cheaping out by trying the used one? Would the gen 5 model really be $1500 better? Or does anyone know of third-party vendors that would have a better deal on a new one? Costco only has the 14" size.[/b]
Back in the day - before I switched to Mac - I bought a refurbished Thinkpad directly from Lenovo (they have their own website) Came with a warranty and everything, and was a much better deal than buying new. I probably wouldn't buy a computer from an eBay seller, no matter how reputable. Who knows what their "refurbishment" process actually entails... Check out the Lenovo outlet online.

These days, computers should last a LONG TIME. We've basically reached peak performance. People keep saying that you need to buy as much RAM as possible, etc. but in reality, 8GB or RAM has been the standard for a number of years and unless you are a serious power user using serious apps, you'd be hard pressed to need more than that. Software has become extremely efficient and cloud storage has basically replaced the need to have a big, physical hard drive.

I know you are not too keen on Macs, but I will say that they are definitely the better value proposition. Traditionally they cost more up front (but not the case with the new Airs), but they last a lot longer than any windows machine I've used. I have colleagues still using Macs from 2016 and they are going strong. As long as you still get security updates, there's no need to upgrade.
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Re: Lenovo Thinkpad X1 Extreme refurbished vs new

Post by leeks »

NYCaviator wrote: Sun May 28, 2023 2:09 pm I probably wouldn't buy a computer from an eBay seller, no matter how reputable. Who knows what their "refurbishment" process actually entails... Check out the Lenovo outlet online.

These days, computers should last a LONG TIME. We've basically reached peak performance. People keep saying that you need to buy as much RAM as possible...
I have 16 GB RAM now and there are times when I want more so if I am buying a new laptop, I want it to have something better than what I have now. My old Lenovo laptop was only $700 new and I was still having the apparently outdated expectation that the same price point will buy a much better more-of-everything laptop a few years later.

I have been looking at the Lenovo outlet for many months and I feel like the pickings have been very slim. They have not offered any refurbished ones meeting my specs.

I think "refurbished" in this case just means a 2 year old used laptop on which they have cleared the hard drive and installed Windows 11. And they have allegedly tested that everything else works. It is still under manufacturer warranty for 2 more years and I did confirm that a Lenovo warranty transfers with a used purchase.

I will have 30 days to test it out so hopefully that will be enough to uncover any major issues. But I am feeling a bit nervous that I will regret a used purchase if I keep it. I don't mind replacing the battery as I assume it may wear out soon. But maybe I am missing out on some latest and greatest features?

I have only owned 3 laptops, each bought new and used for about 9 (Thinkpad), 7 (Thinkpad), and 9 (Z40) years. My concern is that buying used might mean I will need to replace again in 2-3 years because something becomes outdated. But if it is good enough for 5-7 years, that will be okay.

I am glad others are happy with their Macs but a Mac is not right for me at any price.
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Re: Lenovo Thinkpad X1 Extreme refurbished vs new

Post by bendix »

I am not sure why anyone would want an X1 Extreme, but I´d much rather go with a new Thinkpad with warranty than used kit. If anything breaks on a laptop it gets really expensive really fast. Also, from my point of view, buying top of the line products like X1 Extreme or Intel i7 or mobile GFX cards is money not well spent. Usually somewhere in the midrange you´ll find the price value optimas.
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Re: Lenovo Thinkpad X1 Extreme refurbished vs new

Post by leeks »

bendix wrote: Sun May 28, 2023 3:46 pm I am not sure why anyone would want an X1 Extreme, but I´d much rather go with a new Thinkpad with warranty than used kit. If anything breaks on a laptop it gets really expensive really fast. Also, from my point of view, buying top of the line products like X1 Extreme or Intel i7 or mobile GFX cards is money not well spent. Usually somewhere in the midrange you´ll find the price value optimas.
I'm stubborn about wanting the mouse button in the keyboard. It's an old person thing but limits me to Thinkpads. I regret not going with a Thinkpad for my last purchase. The X1 extreme is the smallest and lightest of the Thinkpads that has a screen larger than 14" and I know the sizes I prefer. I think the name "extreme" is silly though. The P1 16" might be okay too sizewise, but still $2300+ in current sale prices.

The used one I found has two years remaining of manufacturer warranty. I'm less worried about it breaking and more worried the feautures will become outdated quickly.
Last edited by leeks on Sun May 28, 2023 4:10 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Lenovo Thinkpad X1 Extreme refurbished vs new

Post by bendix »

leeks wrote: Sun May 28, 2023 3:56 pm
bendix wrote: Sun May 28, 2023 3:46 pm I am not sure why anyone would want an X1 Extreme, but I´d much rather go with a new Thinkpad with warranty than used kit. If anything breaks on a laptop it gets really expensive really fast. Also, from my point of view, buying top of the line products like X1 Extreme or Intel i7 or mobile GFX cards is money not well spent. Usually somewhere in the midrange you´ll find the price value optimas.
I'm stubborn about wanting the mouse button in the keyboard. It's an old person thing but limits me to Thinkpads. I regret not going with a Thinkpad for my last purchase. The X1 extreme is the smallest and lightest of the Thinkpads that has a screen larger than 14" and I know the sizes I prefer. I think the name "extreme" is silly though.

The used one I found has two years remaining of manufacturer warranty. I'm less worried about it breaking and more worried the feautures will become outdated quickly.
I can understand that. Then again the beauty and character of the Thinkpad range has never been about them being the thinnest and lightest on the market, but other aspects, such as durability, keyboard, the trackpoint which I wouldnt want to miss etc. and basically a reputation for being the best overall engineered product, maybe carrying over from the old IBM days.

I own a T14 which cost A LOT less than the X1 Extreme and I wouldnt even want it any thinner or lighter as this all goes along with compromises somewhere else. Then again the X1 in general is not a bad product if you want to some kind of ultra flat device this is a good choice. Tech of this sort will become outdated before you know it anyways, so enjoy the device and dont worry about it :beer
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Re: Lenovo Thinkpad X1 Extreme refurbished vs new

Post by rooms222 »

If you are purchasing from Lenovo yourself, I found it worthwhile to use the triple dip strategy to purchase mine. I watched the price for what I wanted or a pre-built configuration I could live with, and then waited for a good deal, as the coupon is a necessity for personal purchases. I also made sure to sign in and get certified ahead of time for the senior discount(55+) as Lenovo uses ID.me for all of its various discounts such as students or first responders. Then, I also signed up for Rakuten which offers cash back on the purchase, and waited until they offered 8 or 10 percent cash back. I also found a $100 off $500 offer from American Express for using the American Express card after loading the offer at American Express.

This resulted in my $2200 list price computer costing $440. The Rakuten bonus I learned about from a website that reviews Chromebooks, and they pointed out the utility in using the Rakuten offer, especially when it is high. You get the money 2-4 months after purchase, and can arrange for it to be directly deposited to Paypal, or I think a bank account.
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Re: Lenovo Thinkpad X1 Extreme refurbished vs new

Post by leeks »

rooms222 wrote: Sun May 28, 2023 10:45 pm If you are purchasing from Lenovo yourself, I found it worthwhile to use the triple dip strategy to purchase mine. I watched the price for what I wanted or a pre-built configuration I could live with, and then waited for a good deal, as the coupon is a necessity for personal purchases. I also made sure to sign in and get certified ahead of time for the senior discount(55+) as Lenovo uses ID.me for all of its various discounts such as students or first responders. Then, I also signed up for Rakuten which offers cash back on the purchase, and waited until they offered 8 or 10 percent cash back. I also found a $100 off $500 offer from American Express for using the American Express card after loading the offer at American Express.

This resulted in my $2200 list price computer costing $440. The Rakuten bonus I learned about from a website that reviews Chromebooks, and they pointed out the utility in using the Rakuten offer, especially when it is high. You get the money 2-4 months after purchase, and can arrange for it to be directly deposited to Paypal, or I think a bank account.
Interesting. I have never bothered to learn what the annoyance factor is with Rakuten but may look into it in the future.

The new laptop I priced on the Lenovo site (using THINKMAY eCoupon) was $2521, their made-up pre-coupon list price is $3879 which just seems crazy. And there are plenty of configuration options I could have picked to add even much more cost than that, that is nowhere near the max build! I've been going back to that site regularly for about 8 months and haven't seen any better sales. I had high hopes for Memorial Day weekend, but was disappointed which is why I gave up and decided to order the used one to try out before making a final decision on what to keep/get.
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Re: Lenovo Thinkpad X1 Extreme refurbished vs new

Post by EddyB »

Just check that it’s not one of the models with the widespread charging port problem.
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Re: Lenovo Thinkpad X1 Extreme refurbished vs new

Post by rooms222 »

Rakuten is doing 12% cash back for the next day or so.... https://www.rakuten.com/lenovo.com
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Re: Lenovo Thinkpad X1 Extreme refurbished vs new

Post by hunoraut »

Bought a refurb X1 Carbon and while physically it was in flawless condition the battery capacity was only something like 80% of original.

Overall it was a disappointing in many ways (not related to battery) but you already decided on it so itll be unpolite to say more
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Re: Lenovo Thinkpad X1 Extreme refurbished vs new

Post by HanSolo »

hunoraut wrote: Mon May 29, 2023 2:23 am Bought a refurb X1 Carbon and while physically it was in flawless condition the battery capacity was only something like 80% of original.

Overall it was a disappointing in many ways (not related to battery) but you already decided on it so itll be unpolite to say more
Interesting. Do you have any suggestions for those who are ThinkPad fans (preferring the TrackPoint) and especially the smaller models (X-series)?

I'm typing on an X220/i7/SSD (which I bought used/refurbished from a local computer repair shop in 2018). It still works fine, but might consider buying something new within a few years.
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Re: Lenovo Thinkpad X1 Extreme refurbished vs new

Post by eric321 »

How much work do you do at a client site or on the road vs how much do you do at home?

I love think pads as well.

My 2.5 year old ThinkPad broke while thankfully under warranty. I needed a new computer ASAP and didn't want to spend too much money.

I ended up getting a Lenovo desktop. I could get all the performance specs I wanted without the need for space saving or power saving components.

With one drive, it worked seamlessly with my older and less powerful laptop. I have a great desktop for my home office most of the time. And all my files are synced on my laptop when I need a laptop.
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Re: Lenovo Thinkpad X1 Extreme refurbished vs new

Post by hunoraut »

HanSolo wrote: Mon May 29, 2023 4:45 am Interesting. Do you have any suggestions for those who are ThinkPad fans (preferring the TrackPoint) and especially the smaller models (X-series)?

I'm typing on an X220/i7/SSD (which I bought used/refurbished from a local computer repair shop in 2018). It still works fine, but might consider buying something new within a few years.
I think the no nonsense business-centric T-series is the lineup that embodies what ThinkPad fans love all the way from the pre-Lenovo days.

My favorite Windows laptop ever remain Dell's Latitude 7xxx series. Solid chassis, great battery performance, terrific keyboard, no skimping on componentry. It's an ultrabook class and sized like the X220.
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Re: Lenovo Thinkpad X1 Extreme refurbished vs new

Post by exodusing »

HanSolo wrote: Mon May 29, 2023 4:45 am
hunoraut wrote: Mon May 29, 2023 2:23 am Bought a refurb X1 Carbon and while physically it was in flawless condition the battery capacity was only something like 80% of original.

Overall it was a disappointing in many ways (not related to battery) but you already decided on it so itll be unpolite to say more
Interesting. Do you have any suggestions for those who are ThinkPad fans (preferring the TrackPoint) and especially the smaller models (X-series)?

I'm typing on an X220/i7/SSD (which I bought used/refurbished from a local computer repair shop in 2018). It still works fine, but might consider buying something new within a few years.
I use an X1 carbon 7th gen, which is great. It's much better than my old X200. I sometimes think of getting a newer X1, but am hard pressed to see what this model is lacking. It's fast, great screen, Thinkpad keyboard. My only issue is that I sometimes rest my hand on the trackpad and it interprets that as a mouse button press, but I'm not sure I can blame the x1 for that.
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Re: Lenovo Thinkpad X1 Extreme refurbished vs new

Post by HanSolo »

exodusing wrote: Mon May 29, 2023 5:39 am My only issue is that I sometimes rest my hand on the trackpad and it interprets that as a mouse button press, but I'm not sure I can blame the x1 for that.
I disabled the trackpad on my X220/Win7. I don't remember how I did it. I hope it's still possible on later models.
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Re: Lenovo Thinkpad X1 Extreme refurbished vs new

Post by exodusing »

HanSolo wrote: Mon May 29, 2023 6:33 am
exodusing wrote: Mon May 29, 2023 5:39 am My only issue is that I sometimes rest my hand on the trackpad and it interprets that as a mouse button press, but I'm not sure I can blame the x1 for that.
I disabled the trackpad on my X220/Win7. I don't remember how I did it. I hope it's still possible on later models.
It is possible, but I've come to prefer the trackpad over the nub for general use.

FWIW, my X220 is dual booting Win10 and Linux. I usually run it in Linux, mainly as a file server. I don't use the trackpad on it. The X1 trackpad is much better than the X220's
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Re: Lenovo Thinkpad X1 Extreme refurbished vs new

Post by leeks »

eric321 wrote: Mon May 29, 2023 5:17 am How much work do you do at a client site or on the road vs how much do you do at home?

I love think pads as well.

My 2.5 year old ThinkPad broke while thankfully under warranty. I needed a new computer ASAP and didn't want to spend too much money.

I ended up getting a Lenovo desktop. I could get all the performance specs I wanted without the need for space saving or power saving components.

With one drive, it worked seamlessly with my older and less powerful laptop. I have a great desktop for my home office most of the time. And all my files are synced on my laptop when I need a laptop.
I considered this but also had sticker shock at current desktop prices. It seemed that getting a new (less powerful) laptop and a powerful desktop would be more expensive than getting a poweful laptop that could do everything. My current laptop is nearly unusable so I would have to get both at once.
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Re: Lenovo Thinkpad X1 Extreme refurbished vs new

Post by leeks »

hunoraut wrote: Mon May 29, 2023 2:23 am Bought a refurb X1 Carbon and while physically it was in flawless condition the battery capacity was only something like 80% of original.

Overall it was a disappointing in many ways (not related to battery) but you already decided on it so itll be unpolite to say more
I can return the used one within 30 days and will do so if it does't seem good enough. I didn't feel like I could really evaluate it as an option until I can interact with it in person but I'm not feeling sure about it. Also it happened to be one with 2 years of warranty left and I wasn't sure I would see another like that if I waited.

Do you think yours was disappointing because it was refurbished or because of the model design/specs?

My husband's work gave him a 14" X1 Carbon this year so I am somewhat familiar with that smaller version.
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Re: Lenovo Thinkpad X1 Extreme refurbished vs new

Post by protagonist »

I think the deepest Lenovo discounts on the Outlet page come out around Black Friday/Cyber Monday with cheap offerings of new versions of the prior years' models. I could be wrong about that....I have not been compulsive about checking....but that is my experience. I bought a new X1 Yoga about 4 (???) years ago in a cybermonday sale for under $1000 (I forget the actual price). I like it but but if I was in the market I think I would prefer an X1 Carbon ...thinner and lighter and I never wind up using the Yoga in Tablet mode....it's a good computer but a lousy tablet. I mostly use it at home with a 32" monitor but when traveling, overall size and weight are more important to me than screen size. I ruled out the Nano because I like all the extra ports including the legacy ones....maybe that is an age thing.
Mine has an i5 processor. My understanding (from Google research, not from expertise) is that if you don't need an i7 processor (most standard users don't), you won't notice the performance difference with an i5 and you will get better battery life with an i5.

I also read many user complaints online about the battery life of Gen 10 X1 Carbons compared with Gen 9, so many users were recommending buying the older Gen 9.. I don't know how that translates with Extreme versions, but it might be something to look into.

I agree with those above that projecting a lifespan of 5 years plus is fine, but in reality we have no idea what the technology will look like in 5-10 years. It may not have changed much (like in the recent past), but it could also be radically different, so for a $1000 investment you may want a new one in 5 years even if your computer still works flawlessly.
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Re: Lenovo Thinkpad X1 Extreme refurbished vs new

Post by cacophony »

hunoraut wrote: Mon May 29, 2023 2:23 am Bought a refurb X1 Carbon and while physically it was in flawless condition the battery capacity was only something like 80% of original.

Overall it was a disappointing in many ways (not related to battery) but you already decided on it so itll be unpolite to say more
The X1 Carbon has 11 generations over the past 11 years, and each generation has different specs and configuration options. So reporting a poor "X1 Carbon" experience is not much more specific than a poor "laptop" experience at this point. Also, the X1 Carbon is a completely different line from the X1 Extreme.
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Re: Lenovo Thinkpad X1 Extreme refurbished vs new

Post by hunoraut »

leeks wrote: Mon May 29, 2023 8:51 am I can return the used one within 30 days and will do so if it does't seem good enough. I didn't feel like I could really evaluate it as an option until I can interact with it in person but I'm not feeling sure about it. Also it happened to be one with 2 years of warranty left and I wasn't sure I would see another like that if I waited.

Do you think yours was disappointing because it was refurbished or because of the model design/specs?

My husband's work gave him a 14" X1 Carbon this year so I am somewhat familiar with that smaller version.
I had the 14” 6th gen.

Most of the issues relate to inherent design, and component options that should not exist on a Lenovo.

It had poor thermals and always ran extra hot. Sought specifically the matte FHD screen for better battery life and better against glare in daytime - the screen was too dim for that to matter anyway, and battery wasnt good because of the thermals. Fingerprint reader was slow and useless. Lenovos driver management not good. It was picky and finnicky on the USBC charger used (common to some but not all windows machines). And finally it had some battery drain issue on Suspend which ive also experienced on other but not all windows machines (basically some hw components refused to enter sleep).

Between work and personal use ive had maybe 15 Windows laptops over the last 20 years and this one disappointed me the most
exodusing
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Re: Lenovo Thinkpad X1 Extreme refurbished vs new

Post by exodusing »

hunoraut wrote: Mon May 29, 2023 1:38 pmI had the 14” 6th gen.

Most of the issues relate to inherent design, and component options that should not exist on a Lenovo.

It had poor thermals and always ran extra hot. Sought specifically the matte FHD screen for better battery life and better against glare in daytime - the screen was too dim for that to matter anyway, and battery wasnt good because of the thermals. Fingerprint reader was slow and useless. Lenovos driver management not good. It was picky and finnicky on the USBC charger used (common to some but not all windows machines). And finally it had some battery drain issue on Suspend which ive also experienced on other but not all windows machines (basically some hw components refused to enter sleep).

Between work and personal use ive had maybe 15 Windows laptops over the last 20 years and this one disappointed me the most
Not to be the advocate for X1 carbons, but I don't have any of those issues. Mine does not run hot. At the moment it's not even warm. The touchscreen I have is great, although it can be hard to read in direct sunlight. Fingerprint reader is fine. I can't recall any issues with driver management. Every USBC charger I've tried has worked, although one or two give warnings about slow charging, which I can easily ignore. I haven't noticed any battery issues with suspend.

I have the 7th gen.
hunoraut
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Re: Lenovo Thinkpad X1 Extreme refurbished vs new

Post by hunoraut »

exodusing wrote: Mon May 29, 2023 3:10 pm
Not to be the advocate for X1 carbons, but I don't have any of those issues. Mine does not run hot. At the moment it's not even warm. The touchscreen I have is great, although it can be hard to read in direct sunlight. Fingerprint reader is fine. I can't recall any issues with driver management. Every USBC charger I've tried has worked, although one or two give warnings about slow charging, which I can easily ignore. I haven't noticed any battery issues with suspend.

I have the 7th gen.
those issues are common at least to the 6th gen, and can be observed with a google search. ill give credit that the chassis is easily removable, which allowed me to replace the factory thermal paste, but it still didn't help much.

the ultrabook i swapped afterwards was huawei matebook x pro. besides being finnicky on the charge, that was quite a good machine.
protagonist
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Re: Lenovo Thinkpad X1 Extreme refurbished vs new

Post by protagonist »

protagonist wrote: Mon May 29, 2023 11:21 am I think the deepest Lenovo discounts on the Outlet page come out around Black Friday/Cyber Monday with cheap offerings of new versions of the prior years' models. I could be wrong about that....I have not been compulsive about checking....but that is my experience. I bought a new X1 Yoga about 4 (???) years ago in a cybermonday sale for under $1000 (I forget the actual price). I like it but but if I was in the market I think I would prefer an X1 Carbon ...thinner and lighter and I never wind up using the Yoga in Tablet mode....it's a good computer but a lousy tablet. So much for thinking one device can do everything well....I subsequently bought an iPad. I mostly use it at home with a 32" monitor but when traveling, overall size and weight are more important to me than screen size. I ruled out the Nano because I like all the extra ports including the legacy ones....maybe that is an age thing.
Mine has an i5 processor. My understanding (from Google research, not from expertise) is that if you don't need an i7 processor (most standard users don't), you won't notice the performance difference with an i5 and you will get better battery life with an i5.

I also read many user complaints online about the battery life of Gen 10 X1 Carbons compared with Gen 9, so many users were recommending buying the older Gen 9.. I don't know how that translates with Extreme versions, but it might be something to look into.

I agree with those above that projecting a lifespan of 5 years plus is fine, but in reality we have no idea what the technology will look like in 5-10 years. It may not have changed much (like in the recent past), but it could also be radically different, so for a $1000 investment you may want a new one in 5 years even if your computer still works flawlessly.
Just checked . Mine is X1 Yoga 3rd Gen....2018 release date. No major issues but I had to replace the motherboard when it was on warranty. Lenovo came to my home within a day and did it at no charge. I doubt if I would notice a big improvement if I bought a 2023 with a faster processor and more memory, but who knows?
gtf8
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Re: Lenovo Thinkpad X1 Extreme refurbished vs new

Post by gtf8 »

I recently purchased a thinkpad. I kept an eye on the website for my exact model, for approximately 8 months as well. The price on these computers pretty much changes like the wind. On one day my computer was $3500, and on the next day was $1800. And in on the 3rd day it was $2500. So if your heart is set on a particular model, you should watch the price for approximately 2 or 3 weeks and just go with whatever's lowest.
leland
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Re: Lenovo Thinkpad X1 Extreme refurbished vs new

Post by leland »

leeks wrote: Sun May 28, 2023 11:47 am Am I cheaping out by trying the used one? Would the gen 5 model really be $1500 better? Or does anyone know of third-party vendors that would have a better deal on a new one? Costco only has the 14" size.[/b]
Used/refurb is fine, esp. w/ a 12th gen proc. Newer is not $1500 better unless you are made of money to not care about it.

Do NOT get a 14" model of the extreme - you'll be unhappy.

If you wait a year then yes the Gen 5 will have a better deal :D

And please folks, don't suggest a mac when someone is clear on a Thinkpad. They're not the same. I'm not anti Mac or something rabid, but I am very much for a trackpoint :D I usually have 2 or 3 Thinkpads at home at all times :beer
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rob
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Re: Lenovo Thinkpad X1 Extreme refurbished vs new

Post by rob »

exodusing wrote: Mon May 29, 2023 3:10 pm
hunoraut wrote: Mon May 29, 2023 1:38 pmI had the 14” 6th gen.

Most of the issues relate to inherent design, and component options that should not exist on a Lenovo.

It had poor thermals and always ran extra hot. Sought specifically the matte FHD screen for better battery life and better against glare in daytime - the screen was too dim for that to matter anyway, and battery wasnt good because of the thermals. Fingerprint reader was slow and useless. Lenovos driver management not good. It was picky and finnicky on the USBC charger used (common to some but not all windows machines). And finally it had some battery drain issue on Suspend which ive also experienced on other but not all windows machines (basically some hw components refused to enter sleep).

Between work and personal use ive had maybe 15 Windows laptops over the last 20 years and this one disappointed me the most
Not to be the advocate for X1 carbons, but I don't have any of those issues. Mine does not run hot. At the moment it's not even warm. The touchscreen I have is great, although it can be hard to read in direct sunlight. Fingerprint reader is fine. I can't recall any issues with driver management. Every USBC charger I've tried has worked, although one or two give warnings about slow charging, which I can easily ignore. I haven't noticed any battery issues with suspend.

I have the 7th gen.
Just another data point... I have the 6th also...
- The screen is not an issue BUT I went with the brighter (non-touch) matt option, so can see in daylight no issues. Your prob talking about the standard screen, so not sure.
- The left top USB port is solid but I agree the second one can be a bit twitchy on power and ethernet if your moving around.
- I don't have a battery issue in the years I've had it.
- Heat depends what & how your running.... I have the i7 version and if your pushing it (I run databases under docker and lots of apps and browser windows) in summer and it's running at performance first it's gets hot. If your just browsing it's not an issue for me.
- It has the usual windows bug where if your on power then suspect AND thre is an update pending the damn thing will turn on and be hot and running when you open next. This is a straight up windows defect... if you unplug from power before suspect, it does not seem to occur even if there is an update.
- Yeah the lenovo drive update stuff is not great,
- The finger print reader is ok but certainly not a mac. I'd call it better ok as is better than some cheap laptops but not as good as te better ones.
- One you didn't mention is that wifi is something a bit meh... it will loose connectivity when you swap a few times from ethernet and back and forth to wifi. Not sure how much of this is lenovo vs windows but seems to happen more than some other windows machines Ive had over the years.
- Keyboard is GREAT... amazing and I hate my mac keyboard when I use it in comparison.
- I might be one of three people left on the planet that prefers the mouse pointer in the middle of the keyboard :D
| Rob | Its a dangerous business going out your front door. - J.R.R.Tolkien
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