Other than or windshield randomly being busted 3 times (we're getting the 3rd replacement tomorrow - a giant chunk of ice fell off our roof and destroyed it on Friday), we've had a totally maintenance-free experience with our '17 jetta. 6.5yrs and 72k miles and nothing but general maintenance, it's even still on the first set of brake pads. We bought it knowing it could be a maintenance nightmare, but the deal was so good (<$14k OTD brand new, thanks to Dieselgate) that we figured it would hardly be a loss if we just got rid of it when the warranty was up. Not sure we'd buy another VW unless we got a screaming deal again, but it's been great.Outer Marker wrote: ↑Sun Feb 26, 2023 8:07 amI owned a VW Jetta, and failed to learn my lesson when our first kid arrived and bought a Passat wagon. Both were maintenance hogs. Fun to drive, though. The Mazdas are both fun to drive and very reliable.welloiledinvestor wrote: ↑Sat Feb 25, 2023 7:44 pm I wasn't going to but I test drove VW Atlas. There was lot of things I liked about the car but since I want to own the car for long term, I am not too sure how reliable and expensive VW parts will be down the line. I mean, compared to American or Japanese brands, I am pretty sure it will be more expensive.
Have until Dec. to decide on a new 3-row car
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Re: Have until Dec. to decide on a new 3-row car
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Re: Have until Dec. to decide on a new 3-row car
Just a few months before that, Toyota recalled 460,000 vehicles because of a failure that would disable stability control.
And in 2020, Toyota recalled six million vehicles for a fuel pump problem that caused running vehicles to stall.
Every automaker has recalls on a regular basis.
- welloiledinvestor
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Re: Have until Dec. to decide on a new 3-row car
You are right about that. The reliability reports from Consumer Reports and other sources go so far. It all comes to little luck and how you take care of your car as well, not just being diligent with maintenance stuff but how you use the car etc.Scorpion Stare wrote: ↑Sun Feb 26, 2023 12:38 pmJust a few months before that, Toyota recalled 460,000 vehicles because of a failure that would disable stability control.
And in 2020, Toyota recalled six million vehicles for a fuel pump problem that caused running vehicles to stall.
Every automaker has recalls on a regular basis.
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Re: Have until Dec. to decide on a new 3-row car
I owned a Miata for ten years - only maintenance it required was changing the oil and wiper blades. Equally reliable as Toyotas and much more “drivers” cars.welloiledinvestor wrote: ↑Sun Feb 26, 2023 12:27 pmSeveral users have mentioned Mazda, especially the CX-90. I have got nothing to lose, maybe I test drive it and check out the cabin. Do you think Mazda would be as reliable as (or close to) Toyota and worth owning?Outer Marker wrote: ↑Sun Feb 26, 2023 8:07 amI owned a VW Jetta, and failed to learn my lesson when our first kid arrived and bought a Passat wagon. Both were maintenance hogs. Fun to drive, though. The Mazdas are both fun to drive and very reliable.welloiledinvestor wrote: ↑Sat Feb 25, 2023 7:44 pm I wasn't going to but I test drove VW Atlas. There was lot of things I liked about the car but since I want to own the car for long term, I am not too sure how reliable and expensive VW parts will be down the line. I mean, compared to American or Japanese brands, I am pretty sure it will be more expensive.
Re: Have until Dec. to decide on a new 3-row car
My history with cars since 1960. )
3 Oldsmobiles drove and beat the heck out of them, little to no problems
2 Pontiacs, 1 is a 1965 and still have it today. Rebuilt the engine 2x
2 Mazda's 1st made in Japan, beat the heck out of, long lasting, #2 not made in Japan, after 20k miles get rid of it, just a piece of junk.
2 Chevy trucks, 1st no problems, 2nd shook, rattled, wore out tires < 10K miles.
1 GMC truck 07, still have it today. No problems.
1 Toyota Highlander, ok, v6 gutless motor, no abnormal problems
1 2013 Kia Sorento, ordered with no 3rd row seat, no problems, still have it today
Undecided what my next vehicle will be if any. Waiting until prices become realistic. [One reason I am following this thread].
YMMV.
3 Oldsmobiles drove and beat the heck out of them, little to no problems
2 Pontiacs, 1 is a 1965 and still have it today. Rebuilt the engine 2x
2 Mazda's 1st made in Japan, beat the heck out of, long lasting, #2 not made in Japan, after 20k miles get rid of it, just a piece of junk.
2 Chevy trucks, 1st no problems, 2nd shook, rattled, wore out tires < 10K miles.
1 GMC truck 07, still have it today. No problems.
1 Toyota Highlander, ok, v6 gutless motor, no abnormal problems
1 2013 Kia Sorento, ordered with no 3rd row seat, no problems, still have it today
Undecided what my next vehicle will be if any. Waiting until prices become realistic. [One reason I am following this thread].
YMMV.
Re: Have until Dec. to decide on a new 3-row car
This. OP mentioned off roading. Most of OP's list will get torn up if that off roading is much more than a gravel or dirt road. Check out the 4 Runner, the Lexus GX, or a Jeep product. The 4 Runner and the GX will last forever.
- welloiledinvestor
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Re: Have until Dec. to decide on a new 3-row car
Just want to clarify about the "offroading." It was my mistake to include that requirement. Going to state parks is the only off-roading that I can think of.
Thanks @meebers for sharing your experiences.meebers wrote: ↑Sun Feb 26, 2023 8:46 pm My history with cars since 1960. )
3 Oldsmobiles drove and beat the heck out of them, little to no problems
2 Pontiacs, 1 is a 1965 and still have it today. Rebuilt the engine 2x
2 Mazda's 1st made in Japan, beat the heck out of, long lasting, #2 not made in Japan, after 20k miles get rid of it, just a piece of junk.
2 Chevy trucks, 1st no problems, 2nd shook, rattled, wore out tires < 10K miles.
1 GMC truck 07, still have it today. No problems.
1 Toyota Highlander, ok, v6 gutless motor, no abnormal problems
1 2013 Kia Sorento, ordered with no 3rd row seat, no problems, still have it today
Undecided what my next vehicle will be if any. Waiting until prices become realistic. [One reason I am following this thread].
YMMV.
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Re: Have until Dec. to decide on a new 3-row car
We were looking at all the 3-row vehicles you referenced, but happened to end up at an Acura dealership and test drove the 2023 MDX. We took it home the same day and have been extremely happy with it.
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Re: Have until Dec. to decide on a new 3-row car
Mazda fan here, so definitely would recommend the brand. Plus the CX-90 looks great inside and out. It can't hurt to let either dealership know you are cross shopping with the other. Yes, I realize there may not be any discounts, but you don't get for what you don't ask.
Re: Have until Dec. to decide on a new 3-row car
There are two brands that I have an unfounded, stupid reasoned negative feeling about and I can't shake it...
Mazda because of the "zoom zoom" marketing from years ago.
Kia because of the "buy one get one free" marketing from years ago
Mazda because of the "zoom zoom" marketing from years ago.
Kia because of the "buy one get one free" marketing from years ago
Vanguard/Fidelity | 76% US Stock | 16% Int'l Stock | 8% Cash
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Re: Have until Dec. to decide on a new 3-row car
Toyota has a lot of the Costco and Apple mystique going on...Toyota probably manufacturers the most reliable vehicles (overall) of any manufacturer (anecdotally, my corolla was by a HUGE margin the most unreliable car I've ever owned), but they still can have their issues. Toyota has had some pretty scary recalls in the last decade, including on the corolla and tacoma which have this reputation for being bulletproof.Scorpion Stare wrote: ↑Sun Feb 26, 2023 12:38 pmJust a few months before that, Toyota recalled 460,000 vehicles because of a failure that would disable stability control.
And in 2020, Toyota recalled six million vehicles for a fuel pump problem that caused running vehicles to stall.
Every automaker has recalls on a regular basis.
Re: Have until Dec. to decide on a new 3-row car
I just got back from renting a 2022 Toyota Highlander and I currently own a 2021 Kia Telluride. I have the highest end Telluride and the Highlander was more of a middle of the road model so I won't factor in things like HUD that the Highlander didn't have. The Highlander had the V6, which was smooth and powerful. I see now that they are moving towards a 4 cyl Turbo, which I generally hate, even if they are faster/more fuel efficient.
Powertrain-Seem similar with both having a V6. I think the Highlander seemed more peppy to me. The ride, noise and comfort are better in the Kia. I got about 22 MPG with a mix of city and 80mph highway driving. I get similar MPG with the Telluride but usually run E10 Ethanol (live in Midwest). The Highlander was a little sportier. Just thought of something.....the Highlander was FWD not AWD like my Kia. Probably a lot lighter.
Fit/Finish-This one surprised me. The Highlander with 7k miles had plastics that were creaking. I got into my Kia after driving the Toyota for a week and the Kia seemed a lot better put together. The door closing sound, the up/down on windows, the steering feel.
Safety-I'm not going to penalize the Highlander for not having a front camera, I'm sure the upper models do have one. Both units have adaptive cruise and I instantly chose the most aggressive setting. The highlander is more aggressive and I like it. With the Kia, I feel like even on the most aggressive setting I have to move over in the passing lane way too early. I don't like that the Toyota makes me choose that aggressive setting each time I start the car. Also, making me turn on my cruise is annoying. I've owned a lot of Toyotas and they have a tendency to never change, even when it's dumb. The rear window in the Toyota, because of design, is a little small for my liking.
Infotainment-Both have Android Auto/Apple Carplay, which is great. The design of the Highlander infotainment system looks dumb and has for awhile. Looks like it's an after thought that they just plopped on the dash. My 2021 Kia is better but the 2023 is a ton better with the with in all in one design, which the Hyundai Palisade has had since the start.
In the end, I really cant imagine how someone would pick the Highlander over the Telluride if they drove each one back to back.
Powertrain-Seem similar with both having a V6. I think the Highlander seemed more peppy to me. The ride, noise and comfort are better in the Kia. I got about 22 MPG with a mix of city and 80mph highway driving. I get similar MPG with the Telluride but usually run E10 Ethanol (live in Midwest). The Highlander was a little sportier. Just thought of something.....the Highlander was FWD not AWD like my Kia. Probably a lot lighter.
Fit/Finish-This one surprised me. The Highlander with 7k miles had plastics that were creaking. I got into my Kia after driving the Toyota for a week and the Kia seemed a lot better put together. The door closing sound, the up/down on windows, the steering feel.
Safety-I'm not going to penalize the Highlander for not having a front camera, I'm sure the upper models do have one. Both units have adaptive cruise and I instantly chose the most aggressive setting. The highlander is more aggressive and I like it. With the Kia, I feel like even on the most aggressive setting I have to move over in the passing lane way too early. I don't like that the Toyota makes me choose that aggressive setting each time I start the car. Also, making me turn on my cruise is annoying. I've owned a lot of Toyotas and they have a tendency to never change, even when it's dumb. The rear window in the Toyota, because of design, is a little small for my liking.
Infotainment-Both have Android Auto/Apple Carplay, which is great. The design of the Highlander infotainment system looks dumb and has for awhile. Looks like it's an after thought that they just plopped on the dash. My 2021 Kia is better but the 2023 is a ton better with the with in all in one design, which the Hyundai Palisade has had since the start.
In the end, I really cant imagine how someone would pick the Highlander over the Telluride if they drove each one back to back.
- welloiledinvestor
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Re: Have until Dec. to decide on a new 3-row car
Quick update:
I decided to test drive some models again:
I decided to test drive some models again:
- Highlander (Bronze trim)
- Honda Pilot (Trailsport trim)
- Chrysler Pacifica (gas version)
- Kia Carnival
- Honda Odyssey
- Toyota Sienna
- welloiledinvestor
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Re: Have until Dec. to decide on a new 3-row car
Quick update:
I decided to test drive some models again:
I decided to test drive some models again:
- Highlander (Bronze trim)
- Honda Pilot (Trailsport trim)
- Chrysler Pacifica (gas version)
- Kia Carnival
- Honda Odyssey
- Toyota Sienna
Re: Have until Dec. to decide on a new 3-row car
Keep in mind that most smaller SUVs don't have a big enough second row to accommodate a rear-facing car seat without having to move the corresponding front seat forward.
When our kids were young we had a 1st generation (2004) Highlander and I couldn't comfortably sit in the passenger seat with the rear-facing seat behind me and I'm not a tall person. The rear-facing seat behind the driver would have been impossible.
When our kids were young we had a 1st generation (2004) Highlander and I couldn't comfortably sit in the passenger seat with the rear-facing seat behind me and I'm not a tall person. The rear-facing seat behind the driver would have been impossible.
- welloiledinvestor
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Re: Have until Dec. to decide on a new 3-row car
Yes, that's a great point. I am not going to get an SUV anymore but a minivan instead.Luke Duke wrote: ↑Fri Mar 17, 2023 11:02 am Keep in mind that most smaller SUVs don't have a big enough second row to accommodate a rear-facing car seat without having to move the corresponding front seat forward.
When our kids were young we had a 1st generation (2004) Highlander and I couldn't comfortably sit in the passenger seat with the rear-facing seat behind me and I'm not a tall person. The rear-facing seat behind the driver would have been impossible.
Re: Have until Dec. to decide on a new 3-row car
We have a 2015 Acura MDX and front seat leg room is fine with rear facing car seats in second row
Third row seats are ok for short trips but if you need for a road trip you need a pilot, minivan or a Tahoe type sized vehicle
It’s a great vehicle - would recommend the AWD version. Probably going to get a fully loaded new-er one in a few years
Third row seats are ok for short trips but if you need for a road trip you need a pilot, minivan or a Tahoe type sized vehicle
It’s a great vehicle - would recommend the AWD version. Probably going to get a fully loaded new-er one in a few years
Re: Have until Dec. to decide on a new 3-row car
hudson wrote: ↑Fri Feb 17, 2023 7:35 amI'm on my 6th Toyota since 2000. I doubt that I'll ever own any other brand. Very few issues.welloiledinvestor wrote: ↑Thu Feb 16, 2023 8:20 pm
I have until December to decide on which 3-row car to get come December of 2023.
My question is, should I go with Toyota Highlander instead? Gas or Hybrid? I plan on driving this car until the tires fall off.
I'd get a 4Runner but the 3d row is tight. I think they have one? Gas mileage is nothing to brag about.
Of the vehicles that you listed, I'd go with the Highlander with 4WD. I know nothing about hybrids, so I'd get the gas model. Can you really drive a Toyota until the wheels fall off? I drove a 2000 Tacoma 18 years and it was still running and looking fine when I sold it.
Same here..awesome vehicles.
Re: Have until Dec. to decide on a new 3-row car
I would second the Mazda CX-9 or the newer model CX-90.
It is smaller than the Subarban or Buick enclave. But for my family where we are all below 5'9", it has worked out fine.
Buick enclaves are also a possibility. One of my neighbors has enclave and really likes it. It is a gas guzzler though.
It is smaller than the Subarban or Buick enclave. But for my family where we are all below 5'9", it has worked out fine.
Buick enclaves are also a possibility. One of my neighbors has enclave and really likes it. It is a gas guzzler though.
Re: Have until Dec. to decide on a new 3-row car
Get the Toyota. It will still be running long after sales of gasoline engines are banned.
Re: Have until Dec. to decide on a new 3-row car
We highly recommend the GMC Acadia.
We have had 2 in the household for 7 years with three rows, with no problems!
They are very economical and highly reliable.
We have had 2 in the household for 7 years with three rows, with no problems!
They are very economical and highly reliable.
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Re: Have until Dec. to decide on a new 3-row car
Sorry if I missed it but how many kids, middle row captains chairs or bench?
I know you said you didn't want the traverse, but that is about the closest thing to a minivan you will find in an SUV. The cx9 is great, but probably won't be enough room
I know you said you didn't want the traverse, but that is about the closest thing to a minivan you will find in an SUV. The cx9 is great, but probably won't be enough room
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Re: Have until Dec. to decide on a new 3-row car
2 Mazda's 1st made in Japan, beat the heck out of, long lasting, #2 not made in Japan, after 20k miles get rid of it, just a piece of junk.
This was my experience with Mazda. Had a leak in the cowling every time it rained. Dealer tried 3 times to fix it. Corporate Mazda wouldn't even talk to me. Traded for a Toyota and have never bought anything else (I include Lexus here).
2 Toyota Camrys each traded at 100K miles
1 LS400 250k miles 20 years traded it to get a highlander to pull a boat
RX330 160k still driving it
Highlander 130K still driving it
All these and had a water power steering pump replaced (because it was noisy) in the LS400 at 220k
TOYOTA!
Oh but really sad they have gone turbo on all new Highlanders. May need to stick with used....
Good Luck
Wally
This was my experience with Mazda. Had a leak in the cowling every time it rained. Dealer tried 3 times to fix it. Corporate Mazda wouldn't even talk to me. Traded for a Toyota and have never bought anything else (I include Lexus here).
2 Toyota Camrys each traded at 100K miles
1 LS400 250k miles 20 years traded it to get a highlander to pull a boat
RX330 160k still driving it
Highlander 130K still driving it
All these and had a water power steering pump replaced (because it was noisy) in the LS400 at 220k
TOYOTA!
Oh but really sad they have gone turbo on all new Highlanders. May need to stick with used....
Good Luck
Wally
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Re: Have until Dec. to decide on a new 3-row car
Telluride is your best option. I also went through this exercise in the last few months.
- welloiledinvestor
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Re: Have until Dec. to decide on a new 3-row car
2 child car seats, and occasional 2 additional adults in 3rd rowBikes4life wrote: ↑Sun Mar 26, 2023 4:05 am Sorry if I missed it but how many kids, middle row captains chairs or bench?
I know you said you didn't want the traverse, but that is about the closest thing to a minivan you will find in an SUV. The cx9 is great, but probably won't be enough room
Captain chairs
I started off looking for 3rd row but will very likely get a minivan.
- welloiledinvestor
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Re: Have until Dec. to decide on a new 3-row car
Thanks, Wally. I will probably still test drive CX-90 but not likely to get it due to size and pricing. My wife and I test drove Highlander twice. It might be obvious, but that 3rd row is not made for adults. I also test drove Sienna. I am leaning toward Honda's Odyssey though.wallygator wrote: ↑Sun Mar 26, 2023 6:24 am 2 Mazda's 1st made in Japan, beat the heck out of, long lasting, #2 not made in Japan, after 20k miles get rid of it, just a piece of junk.
This was my experience with Mazda. Had a leak in the cowling every time it rained. Dealer tried 3 times to fix it. Corporate Mazda wouldn't even talk to me. Traded for a Toyota and have never bought anything else (I include Lexus here).
2 Toyota Camrys each traded at 100K miles
1 LS400 250k miles 20 years traded it to get a highlander to pull a boat
RX330 160k still driving it
Highlander 130K still driving it
All these and had a water power steering pump replaced (because it was noisy) in the LS400 at 220k
TOYOTA!
Oh but really sad they have gone turbo on all new Highlanders. May need to stick with used....
Good Luck
Wally
- welloiledinvestor
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Re: Have until Dec. to decide on a new 3-row car
While I had read good reviews about Telluride, in my book, they have not been making them for many years for me to feel they are reliable. Maybe they are, who knows. Anyway I don't think 3rd row SUVs will serve us. We are looking into minivans.Fpdesignco wrote: ↑Sun Mar 26, 2023 6:46 am Telluride is your best option. I also went through this exercise in the last few months.
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Re: Have until Dec. to decide on a new 3-row car
In that case, it’s a odyssey. I have a 3 row and a minivan spent a lot of time before both purchases looking at the field. On the minivan front it’s between the odyssey and Pacifica. If you consider the Sienna, my recommendation is test drive it against the odyssey the same day.welloiledinvestor wrote: ↑Sat Apr 01, 2023 6:33 pmWhile I had read good reviews about Telluride, in my book, they have not been making them for many years for me to feel they are reliable. Maybe they are, who knows. Anyway I don't think 3rd row SUVs will serve us. We are looking into minivans.Fpdesignco wrote: ↑Sun Mar 26, 2023 6:46 am Telluride is your best option. I also went through this exercise in the last few months.
- welloiledinvestor
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Re: Have until Dec. to decide on a new 3-row car
Thanks. Yeah, I am very likely leaning toward Odyssey. I test drove Sienna (2022) few days apart from the test drive for Odyssey. I have to say I found the cabin to be more practical and the fact that you can slide the chairs side ways in Odyssey also impressed me.Fpdesignco wrote: ↑Sat Apr 01, 2023 6:42 pmIn that case, it’s a odyssey. I have a 3 row and a minivan spent a lot of time before both purchases looking at the field. On the minivan front it’s between the odyssey and Pacifica. If you consider the Sienna, my recommendation is test drive it against the odyssey the same day.welloiledinvestor wrote: ↑Sat Apr 01, 2023 6:33 pmWhile I had read good reviews about Telluride, in my book, they have not been making them for many years for me to feel they are reliable. Maybe they are, who knows. Anyway I don't think 3rd row SUVs will serve us. We are looking into minivans.Fpdesignco wrote: ↑Sun Mar 26, 2023 6:46 am Telluride is your best option. I also went through this exercise in the last few months.
Re: Have until Dec. to decide on a new 3-row car
We chose the Honda Odyssey Elite. I love the performance of the lane keeping assist on highway. The mocha interior, abundance of charge ports, magic seats, rear entertainment, Honda refinement & reliability, and low maintenance costs make it hard to beat.
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Re: Have until Dec. to decide on a new 3-row car
Great! I test drove Elite trim and dealership let me take it home (20 mins drive). It was snowing lightly but I really liked driving it. I am leaning toward getting EX-L trim. We'll see.
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Re: Have until Dec. to decide on a new 3-row car
I also need a three-row vehicle because my three kids are too big to sit three across in the back seat of our Volvo station wagon, a 2015 xc70.
I am leaning toward to buying a used XC90 later this year when used prices will hopefully be lower. It has the same chassis as the xc70 but some of that model's capacious cargo hold has been used for the third row.
Anyone got a case for not going with the XC90?
In about seven years of ownership, my xc70 maintenance has included a brake pad change, replacement of turbocharger lines, and replacement of three flat or bulging tires, caused by running over nails and hitting the curb twice. It's fun to drive and handles snow and ice beautifully.
I am leaning toward to buying a used XC90 later this year when used prices will hopefully be lower. It has the same chassis as the xc70 but some of that model's capacious cargo hold has been used for the third row.
Anyone got a case for not going with the XC90?
In about seven years of ownership, my xc70 maintenance has included a brake pad change, replacement of turbocharger lines, and replacement of three flat or bulging tires, caused by running over nails and hitting the curb twice. It's fun to drive and handles snow and ice beautifully.