Dan Wiener's newsletter shutting down after October 2022 issue

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lomarica01
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Dan Wiener's newsletter shutting down after October 2022 issue

Post by lomarica01 »

[Title was "Dan Wiener's newsletter, The Independent Adviser for Vanguard Investors," see updates below --admin LadyGeek]

Just wondering if anyone recommends using Dan Wiener's newsletter, The Independent Adviser for Vanguard Investors, as a tool in improve your investing experience
Looks like it is $99 per year for a monthly newsletter
thanks for any comments
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CABob
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Re: Dan Wiener's newsletter, The Independent Adviser for Vanguard Investors,

Post by CABob »

It seems as if there use to be a number of Wiener inquiries on the forum but not so much recently. Doing a search for Dan Wiener produces a number of past posts. link
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Re: Dan Wiener's newsletter, The Independent Adviser for Vanguard Investors,

Post by willthrill81 »

There's so much great information out there for free that I don't know you would feel the need to pay for information unless perhaps you want it curated and really trust the curator.
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Re: Dan Wiener's newsletter, The Independent Adviser for Vanguard Investors,

Post by arcticpineapplecorp. »

he had good ratings in the past by Kiplingers and Mark Hulbert (though that was through 2015 or 2016):
https://www.kiplinger.com/article/inves ... funds.html
https://www.nasdaq.com/articles/investm ... 2016-03-01

but please note that past returns are not indicative of future results.

I think George Sistri's newsletter is best. It's short, chock full of data and helps you to stay "on course." Best of all, it's free:
https://oncoursefp.com/
(click link at upper right listing "newsletter").
It's hard to accept the truth when the lies were exactly what you wanted to hear. Investing is simple, but not easy. Buy, hold & rebalance low cost index funds & manage taxable events. Asking Portfolio Questions | Wiki
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Re: Dan Wiener's newsletter, The Independent Adviser for Vanguard Investors,

Post by GaryA505 »

Well, here's the Dan Weiner Growth portfolio compared to plain old boring Vanguard Total Stock Market. I'm not impressed.

https://www.portfoliovisualizer.com/bac ... ion8_1=100

Looks like it's a waste of time, even if it wasn't $99.
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Re: Dan Wiener's newsletter, The Independent Adviser for Vanguard Investors,

Post by Mel Lindauer »

GaryA505 wrote: Wed Jan 19, 2022 12:55 pm Well, here's the Dan Weiner Growth portfolio compared to plain old boring Vanguard Total Stock Market. I'm not impressed.

https://www.portfoliovisualizer.com/bac ... ion8_1=100

Looks like it's a waste of time, even if it wasn't $99.
Agree. And this forum, with its wealth of information from lots of knowledgeable contributors, is free.
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Taylor Larimore
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Re: Dan Wiener's newsletter, The Independent Adviser for Vanguard Investors,

Post by Taylor Larimore »

lomarica01 wrote: Wed Jan 19, 2022 12:25 pm Just wondering if anyone recommends using Dan Wiener's newsletter, The Independent Adviser for Vanguard Investors, as a tool in improve your investing experience
Looks like it is $99 per year for a monthly newsletter
thanks for any comments
lomarica01:

I like Dan Wiener and know him well. For many years I subscribed to his newsletter. I once wrote a "blind" article for Dan's newletter and was paid by him. I feel a sense of loyalty and as a result I avoid making negative comments. Here's two non-negative comments:

1. Many years ago, while attending a short Money Show seminar by Dan Wiener, a man in the front row suddenly fell to the floor unconscious. Medics took him away. I never learned what happened. Years later I met Dan and tried to make a joke by saying: "The man in your seminar died of boredom." Dan did not think my joke was funny.

2. Every few years I buy Dan's "Independent Guide to the Vanguard Funds (its expensive)." The "Guide" contains a wealth of information about Vanguard and each Vanguard Fund. My last "Guide" contains 320 pages. It helps me provide accurate information about Vanguard and Vanguard Funds in my forum posts.

Best wishes.
Taylor
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Re: Dan Wiener's newsletter, The Independent Adviser for Vanguard Investors,

Post by sperry8 »

How can we join his service? I don't see any way to subscribe. (I used to be a subscriber years ago and find value in it every 3 years or so). Seems like he's severed his relationship with InvestorPlace and now I can't figure out how to join. Anyone know?
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Re: Dan Wiener's newsletter, The Independent Adviser for Vanguard Investors,

Post by HomerJ »

All newsletters are a waste of money. If he's really that smart, he wouldn't have to sell newsletters.

But lots of people can afford to waste money.

I certainly won't judge you if you decide to waste money. Heck, I waste money (but not on newsletters)
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Re: Dan Wiener's newsletter, The Independent Adviser for Vanguard Investors,

Post by Lawrence of Suburbia »

I used to read his newsletter at the library for free. This would've been late 1990s, before there was much on the Internet not related to educational content (those were the days!).

I think I ignored his suggestions, mostly, and traded in and out of managed Vanguard balanced funds. Can't recall what he said about the index funds, but still kick myself for not going that way and sticking to it. I'd be quite secure financially.
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Re: Dan Wiener's newsletter, The Independent Adviser for Vanguard Investors,

Post by celia »

Mel Lindauer wrote: Wed Jan 19, 2022 1:49 pm Agree. And this forum, with its wealth of information from lots of knowledgeable contributors, is free.
And where do you think we learned this knowledge? As a former subscriber, that was one source I used.
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Re: Dan Wiener's newsletter, The Independent Adviser for Vanguard Investors,

Post by Mel Lindauer »

celia wrote: Fri Aug 19, 2022 11:17 pm
Mel Lindauer wrote: Wed Jan 19, 2022 1:49 pm Agree. And this forum, with its wealth of information from lots of knowledgeable contributors, is free.
And where do you think we learned this knowledge? As a former subscriber, that was one source I used.
Whatever works for you.

My point is that with any newsletter, you only get one point of view or recommendation that you have to pay for, while here on the forum, you get access to thousands of views or recommendations, free of charge. I'll take the latter.
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Dan Wiener's newsletter, The Independent Adviser for Vanguard Investors is shutting down

Post by CosmoK »

I've subscribed to Wiener's newsletter for about a year. I just got an email this morning that it's shutting down.
Over time, subscriber interest in this style of product has waned, to the point where it’s no longer viable for us to continue publishing The Independent Adviser. The October 2022 issue coming later today will be the last one we publish. Access to the online service will expire on Nov. 30, 2022.
According to this article from September 6, the decision was made by Investor Place Media and/or its parent company, and he had nothing to do with it.

https://www.financialadvisoriq.com/c/37 ... lling_plug

The quotes Weiner:
Despite the setback, Wiener has something new in the works — a project that is “95% of the way there,” he wrote in the September issue draft.

“With a little bit of luck, there’ll be no break in our reporting...
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Re: Dan Wiener's newsletter, The Independent Adviser for Vanguard Investors,

Post by arcticpineapplecorp. »

Investment newsletters: come for the high fees and stay for the underperformance!
It's hard to accept the truth when the lies were exactly what you wanted to hear. Investing is simple, but not easy. Buy, hold & rebalance low cost index funds & manage taxable events. Asking Portfolio Questions | Wiki
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Re: Dan Wiener's newsletter, The Independent Adviser for Vanguard Investors,

Post by liverpooloratorio »

from an email I received today from the publisher:


For more than 30 years, InvestorPlace has proudly published The Independent Adviser for Vanguard Investors, a product that we consider the foremost publication of its type. For decades, we have partnered with Dan Wiener (and more recently with Jeff DeMaso) to help you navigate the complex world of funds from the Vanguard universe.

Over time, subscriber interest in this style of product has waned, to the point where it’s no longer viable for us to continue publishing The Independent Adviser. The October 2022 issue coming later today will be the last one we publish. Access to the online service will expire on Nov. 30, 2022.
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Re: Dan Wiener's newsletter, The Independent Adviser for Vanguard Investors,

Post by CABob »

No mention of the fact that the Bogleheads provide better information at less cost.
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Vanguard Newsletter

Post by flblazer »

[Thread merge into here --admin LadyGeek]

Just got an e-mail from Independent advisors stating after October 1 it will no longer publish Vanguards news letter by Dan and Jeff. Whats up are Dan and Jeff retiring sure wish in their hotline last week we would have been given a heads up
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Re: Vanguard Newsletter

Post by arcticpineapplecorp. »

yeah, mentioned here: viewtopic.php?p=6899686#p6899686
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Re: Dan Wiener's newsletter, The Independent Adviser for Vanguard Investors,

Post by LadyGeek »

I merged flblazer's thread into the ongoing discussion.

(Thanks to the member who reported the post and provided a link to this thread.)
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Dan Wiener's Newsletter Shut Down After October Issue

Post by bobbyrab »

[Thread merged into here --admin LadyGeek]

I just received an email from the publisher of Dan Wiener's newsletter that the October newsletter would be his last. The publisher sited a lack of demand nowadays for such a publication and offered a plethora of newletters to take its place. Odd that the publisher believes that there is a market for newsletters that seem, at first glance, to favor those who trade rather than invest.
Remember - the tortoise DID beat the hare.
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Re: Dan Wiener's newsletter shutting down after October 2022 issue

Post by LadyGeek »

I merged bobbyrab's thread into the ongoing discussion. I also retitled the thread.

(Thanks to the member who reported the post and provided a link to this thread.)
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Re: Dan Wiener's Newsletter Shut Down After October Issue

Post by Taylor Larimore »

bobbyrab wrote: Mon Oct 03, 2022 2:54 pm I just received an email from the publisher of Dan Wiener's newsletter that the October newsletter would be his last. The publisher sited a lack of demand nowadays for such a publication and offered a plethora of newsletters to take its place. Odd that the publisher believes that there is a market for newsletters that seem, at first glance, to favor those who trade rather than invest.
bobbyrab:

Thank you for sharing information about Dan Wiener's newsletter aimed at Vanguard investors. I knew Dan quite well. He once paid me to write a "blind" article for his newsletter many years ago.

I once attended one of his workshops. A listener in the front row suddenly collapsed on the floor and was carried away in an ambulance. Afterwards I told Dan: "Your workshop bored the man to death." Dan did not laugh.

At one time Dan's newsletter contained several recommended portfolios. One was an all index fund portfolio which began outperforming the other portfolios. It was quietly dropped.

No outsider knows the Vanguard company and its funds better than Mr. Wiener. For many years I purchased his annual "Independent Guide to the Vanguard Funds." It contains the most comprehensive information (over 300 pages) about Vanguard and its funds available anywhere. I hope it is still available.

I wish him well.

Best wishes.
Taylor
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Re: Dan Wiener's newsletter shutting down after October 2022 issue

Post by nisiprius »

Dan Wiener liked to recommend Vanguard's actively managed funds.

I'm an indexer, so what he had to offer has always seemed irrelevant to me.

Vanguard's actively managed funds are perfectly good. But I don't go to Ruth's Chris Steak House for the crab cakes.
Last edited by nisiprius on Mon Oct 03, 2022 5:54 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Dan Wiener's newsletter shutting down after October 2022 issue

Post by celia »

I’m no longer a current subscriber but still hold their most-recommended funds, that I probably wouldn’t have considered without reading their newsletter. It was well worth the cost for me.

I wish them well and hope their retirement is as good as they plan going forward.
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Re: Dan Wiener's newsletter shutting down after October 2022 issue

Post by beyou »

nisiprius wrote: Mon Oct 03, 2022 4:37 pm Dan Wiener liked to recommend Vanguard's actively managed funds.

I'm an indexer, so what he had to offer has always seemed irrelevant to me.

Vanguard's actively managed funds are perfectly good. But I don't go to Ruth's Chris Steak House for the crab cakes.
Except in this case, vanguard was originally ONLY an active manager.
Index was later the seafood added at the steakhouse.
Guess they should change the sign from Vanguard Steakhouse to Vanguard Seafood.
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Re: Dan Wiener's newsletter shutting down after October 2022 issue

Post by GG1273 »

When we were super new to investing (mid-1980's), we had Vanguard as our 401k administrator and access to all of their funds. I think I found Dan's stuff via the library as well and subscribed on an off for a few years. The biggest win for us with his recommendations was with Health Care (and we were both in medical field at the time). Ms GG kept her money in Vanguard when the employer moved on to new admins, but we've done well with many of the funds he recommended. Her 21 year ROI is 12%... :beer
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Re: Dan Wiener's newsletter shutting down after October 2022 issue

Post by blueskytoo »

I found Dan's "Classes", such as bonds 101 to be outstanding explanations of the interaction of the various features of bonds that caused seemingly weird moves. I had avoided bonds, except for I bonds, and bond funds completely.

Since then I have gradually invested in bonds, and have had the desired results in my portfolio.

His model portfolios were interesting, and I did buy some of the individual holdings that seemed a good fit in what I already owned. His explanations of his reasons to hold the various funds gave me an in depth view of those funds, and his criticism of the ones he avoided did keep me out of many of the Vanguard funds. I am sure that some of Vanguard's advisors hated him for what he wrote about the funds they managed.

His annual review of all Vanguard funds and his view of their advantages and dangers was a much read guide. He was, and is a better than average advisor, and if your portfolio is reasonably large, very cost effective. He did deep dives into the facts of each fund, and had accurate explanations of what was good or bad for each.

That said, I had quit renewing several years ago, and shortly later, found Boggleheads. Most of the sort of analysis is found here, but more fragmented in form. I have to read a hundred posts to glean the same information that Dan had in his 101 series.

Dan was also very good at keeping his clients in the buy and hold category, even in major downturns, which doubtless saved many from significant losses. He was a much better guide than a percent of assets advisor. I am solidly in the buy and hold camp, but was impressed at his ability to make it obvious that the turmoil was a passing event.
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Re: Dan Wiener's newsletter shutting down after October 2022 issue

Post by brawlrats »

Sarastro wrote: Wed Oct 05, 2022 11:28 am
Much like what people do now to watch programs on streaming networks like HBO, Netflix, Disney+, et al. One subscription is shared between up to 5 people in some cases. So you split the subscription rate along with 4 other people and you each share the password and just sign in the site and view the programs you want to view. Depending on the service, up to 5 people can be watching five different programs at the same time.
Which is often a blatant violation of the terms of service and may very well be with the new newsletter as well. The TOS of his current website specifically prohibit the sharing of credentials and copying of publications to provide to third parties.
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Re: Dan Wiener's newsletter shutting down after October 2022 issue

Post by Sarastro »

QQQQQ
Last edited by Sarastro on Thu Oct 06, 2022 11:24 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Dan Wiener's newsletter shutting down after October 2022 issue

Post by mkc »

Sarastro wrote: Wed Oct 05, 2022 12:46 pm
brawlrats wrote: Wed Oct 05, 2022 11:44 am
Sarastro wrote: Wed Oct 05, 2022 11:28 am
Much like what people do now to watch programs on streaming networks like HBO, Netflix, Disney+, et al. One subscription is shared between up to 5 people in some cases. So you split the subscription rate along with 4 other people and you each share the password and just sign in the site and view the programs you want to view. Depending on the service, up to 5 people can be watching five different programs at the same time.
Which is often a blatant violation of the terms of service and may very well be with the new newsletter as well. The TOS of his current website specifically prohibit the sharing of credentials and copying of publications to provide to third parties.
Sorry, but the TOS are; You are allowed to have multiple people watching different programs on a service at the same time for the price of the one subscription. Who those people are is up to the subscriber. They can be family members or people in different households. Makes no difference who is watching or who is paying the subscription fee.
Same with a newsletter subscription. You pay the subscription rate and you get the newsletter. What you do with the newsletter after you download it is your choice. You own that copy. You paid for it. If you so choose to let others read that copy, that is your choice. Ever bought a good book and then loaned it out for others to read? Libraries have done it forever.
Same as buying a CD and letting others hear it. Or picking up a newspaper on a seat on a train or plane, or bus that someone else bought and left behind, so you pick it up and read it.
There is no violation of terms of service. You bought and paid for the product and can do what you want with it.
What are Dan's newsletter's TOS? That/those are what is pertinent as to whether or not you could do as you suggest (share a subscription to his newsletter).
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Re: Dan Wiener's newsletter shutting down after October 2022 issue

Post by 8foot7 »

mkc wrote: Wed Oct 05, 2022 1:02 pm
Sarastro wrote: Wed Oct 05, 2022 12:46 pm
brawlrats wrote: Wed Oct 05, 2022 11:44 am
Sarastro wrote: Wed Oct 05, 2022 11:28 am
Much like what people do now to watch programs on streaming networks like HBO, Netflix, Disney+, et al. One subscription is shared between up to 5 people in some cases. So you split the subscription rate along with 4 other people and you each share the password and just sign in the site and view the programs you want to view. Depending on the service, up to 5 people can be watching five different programs at the same time.
Which is often a blatant violation of the terms of service and may very well be with the new newsletter as well. The TOS of his current website specifically prohibit the sharing of credentials and copying of publications to provide to third parties.
Sorry, but the TOS are; You are allowed to have multiple people watching different programs on a service at the same time for the price of the one subscription. Who those people are is up to the subscriber. They can be family members or people in different households. Makes no difference who is watching or who is paying the subscription fee.
Same with a newsletter subscription. You pay the subscription rate and you get the newsletter. What you do with the newsletter after you download it is your choice. You own that copy. You paid for it. If you so choose to let others read that copy, that is your choice. Ever bought a good book and then loaned it out for others to read? Libraries have done it forever.
Same as buying a CD and letting others hear it. Or picking up a newspaper on a seat on a train or plane, or bus that someone else bought and left behind, so you pick it up and read it.
There is no violation of terms of service. You bought and paid for the product and can do what you want with it.
What are Dan's newsletter's TOS? That/those are what is pertinent as to whether or not you could do as you suggest (share a subscription to his newsletter).
It doesn't matter what the newsletter's TOS are. Doctrine of first sale.
To be clear I am referring to a physical newsletter that you receive, or perhaps an email attachment you receive electronically, not logging into a website and downloading something, and certainly not sharing a single subscription to Netflix...
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Re: Dan Wiener's newsletter shutting down after October 2022 issue

Post by LadyGeek »

Discussions of dishonest behavior or bypassing the law is totally unacceptable. I removed a post soliciting to share a subscription. This violates the Terms of Use which states:
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In no event shall you use any Content available through the Services for any other purpose, or provide access to any Service, or copy, disclose, share or redistribute any such Content to any third party for any other use.
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Re: Dan Wiener's newsletter shutting down after October 2022 issue

Post by sperry8 »

celia wrote: Mon Oct 03, 2022 5:52 pm I’m no longer a current subscriber but still hold their most-recommended funds, that I probably wouldn’t have considered without reading their newsletter. It was well worth the cost for me.

I wish them well and hope their retirement is as good as they plan going forward.
Agreed. I too hold some of the primecap funds (specifically POAGX) because of Weiner. They didn't retire... they offer an online newsletter now.
You can read about Dan's journey here:
https://www.barrons.com/advisor/article ... 1665084532
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Re: Dan Wiener's Newsletter Shut Down After October Issue

Post by catdoctor »

Taylor Larimore wrote: Mon Oct 03, 2022 3:36 pm

I once attended one of his workshops. A listener in the front row suddenly collapsed on the floor and was carried away in an ambulance. Afterwards I told Dan: "Your workshop bored the man to death." Dan did not laugh.
Taylor
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I did!

As a former subscriber, I still own some recommended funds that I would not have bought otherwise. It was worth the investment.
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Re: Dan Wiener's newsletter shutting down after October 2022 issue

Post by communipaw »

When I began investing around 1990 I read the available information that was common wisdom and accepted by most, including me, but didn't have the confidence to jump in. Then I subscribed to the Weiner newsletter and felt more confident about buying mutual funds. Moreover, without his newsletter I never would have bought the Health Fund or what used to be called the Short Term Investment Grade Bond fund which both have been very advantageous for me. I used his annual reference book of all the Vanguard funds over and over.
By the teens when I retired I started skipping years of renewal and haven't used Weiner for 5 or more years.
But not having confidence in my financial abilities, I did much better with Weiner than if I had gone it alone.
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Re: Dan Wiener's newsletter shutting down after October 2022 issue

Post by Mortman »

I was a subscriber to Dan's newsletter for maybe 20 years or more. I believe Dan's (and eventually Jeff "DiMaso") advice regarding Vanguard Funds is not information generally available on the various services or public forums for at least one of perhaps many reasons: They provide insight and observations associated with the leadership of actively managed funds and not the simply current performance. This is not easily acquired insight.

"Current" performance is potentially yesterday's success. Insight into the skills of various managers can be a decided advantage. Additionally, you were able to reach out to Dan and Jeff on virtually any Vanguard investment topic.

My only gripe is I was one who purchased a lifetime ($800) membership several months before they announced they were being shut down. I believe someone knew their future was in jeopardy, whether Dan and/or Jeff had any idea, I do not know. I believe this could have been an InvestorPlace tactic to grab cash prior to the announcement. InvestorPlace has offered / provided some financial advice as part of the ongoing residual relationship for people that are lifelong members, however it is clouded in their myriad selling platforms. The "play-the-market" focus is focus is inconsistent of the needs for retirement portfolio management.
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