Why the Bogleheads are the reason International trades at lower multiples

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Tellurius
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Why the Bogleheads are the reason International trades at lower multiples

Post by Tellurius »

The title is tongue-in-cheek, my point is that International trades at lower P/E multiples because for at least the last twenty years 1. Americans, including the Bogleheads - indeed the Bogleheads might be more adventurous than most! - have a strongish home market bias 2. Americans control a huge amount of the world’s capital 3. Americans export their home country bias as they control most of the leading financial press.

So demand for international stocks is less, as less capital at each point in time is allocated to them, which keeps prices low. And because Americans control so much capital and influence so much capital allocation, this bids up prices for US stocks relative to earnings vs non-US stocks.

There was a recent thread where a Russian and a Pakistani explained why they overweight the USA in their stock market holdings. The explanation isn’t that important, merely the fact that they do.

So Bogleheads themselves are the reason why the US stock market has higher P/E ratios than the rest of the world :D

Thoughts?
Last edited by Tellurius on Wed May 18, 2022 5:10 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Why the Bogleheads are the reason International trades at lower multiples

Post by Makefile »

You'd have to look at the data to even start with this, I suppose. How are you so sure that US investors might not hold a higher percentage of stock as international today than 20 years ago? Hasn't international investing, especially international index investing, only become more mainstream in that time?
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Re: Why the Bogleheads are the reason International trades at lower multiples

Post by Triple digit golfer »

I would bet that Bogleheads have less of a home country bias than non-Bogleheads.
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Re: Why the Bogleheads are the reason International trades at lower multiples

Post by Tellurius »

Triple digit golfer wrote: Wed May 18, 2022 5:10 pm I would bet that Bogleheads have less of a home country bias than non-Bogleheads.
Yes I edited it to add that. You are probably correct, you are more “adventurous” than most. But because a lot of the capital in the world is owned by Americans, this bids up the US stock market much more
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Re: Why the Bogleheads are the reason International trades at lower multiples

Post by Tamalak »

Even if you adjust for changes in P/E and currency conversion, the underlying earnings of international companies has been poor for the last decade. This would seem to both justify and explain, in retrospect, the low P/E of intl companies.
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Re: Why the Bogleheads are the reason International trades at lower multiples

Post by alex_686 »

Tellurius wrote: Wed May 18, 2022 5:07 pm So demand for international stocks is less, as less capital at each point in time is allocated to them, which keeps prices low. And because Americans control so much capital and influence so much capital allocation, this bids up prices for US stocks relative to earnings vs non-US stocks.

...
So Bogleheads themselves are the reason why the US stock market has higher P/E ratios than the rest of the world :D
I will strongly disagree with your premise, particular in the DM.

I doubt it is your thesis that Bogleheads is the issue. US and DM are highly integrated.

You want high P/E? That is easy to do. You leverage your company up. This shifts more of the return and risk onto the equity holders, thus a higher P/E ratio. Thanks the to the US tax code, US corporations have a "debt shield" and thus are encouraged to use more leverage than their DM counterparts. From a portfolio perspective you can replicate this. More DM equities, fewer bonds.

It is also a bit of a selection issue. DM companies then to be in industries with have a lower P/E ratio.
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Re: Why the Bogleheads are the reason International trades at lower multiples

Post by whodidntante »

It would seem that American stock valuations have reached a permanently high plateau. :P
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Re: Why the Bogleheads are the reason International trades at lower multiples

Post by 000 »

No, it's because of the dollar.
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Re: Why the Bogleheads are the reason International trades at lower multiples

Post by gougou »

It's because of the huge retirement accounts that Americans own that have strong home-country bias.
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Re: Why the Bogleheads are the reason International trades at lower multiples

Post by drk »

000 wrote: Wed May 18, 2022 5:18 pm No, it's because of the dollar.
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Re: Why the Bogleheads are the reason International trades at lower multiples

Post by elderwise »

When America becomes less immigrant friendly (like Europe discourages immigration or hinders it)..

When American taxes become worse than Europe.

When the future entrepreneurs of apps such as RobinHood , FB, and othe like the founder of Chobani Hamdi Ulukya, Patel brothers, Shaukat Dhanani, Sunil Dharod.. all classic rags to riches story of ordinary people who made it big in America... when these kind of people who are foreign but moved here(immigrated) will start going to other countries say Australia for ex..

Then..perhaps..Intl will beat US..

Yes I am US biased..but I also speak as a family of immigrants .

For all the negatives we do have here...there are multitudes of pros that attracts top talent, skill set that beats many many countries, and top compensation (can't forget that!)

I do hate fatca, fbar, and the covered expat scenario..

Not a rant :sharebeer

And yes it's also because of the US Dollar..and how the world is traded around it and Midde Eastern countries have pegged it to their Fiats.
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Re: Why the Bogleheads are the reason International trades at lower multiples

Post by secondopinion »

alex_686 wrote: Wed May 18, 2022 5:18 pm
Tellurius wrote: Wed May 18, 2022 5:07 pm So demand for international stocks is less, as less capital at each point in time is allocated to them, which keeps prices low. And because Americans control so much capital and influence so much capital allocation, this bids up prices for US stocks relative to earnings vs non-US stocks.

...
So Bogleheads themselves are the reason why the US stock market has higher P/E ratios than the rest of the world :D
I will strongly disagree with your premise, particular in the DM.

I doubt it is your thesis that Bogleheads is the issue. US and DM are highly integrated.

You want high P/E? That is easy to do. You leverage your company up. This shifts more of the return and risk onto the equity holders, thus a higher P/E ratio. Thanks the to the US tax code, US corporations have a "debt shield" and thus are encouraged to use more leverage than their DM counterparts. From a portfolio perspective you can replicate this. More DM equities, fewer bonds.

It is also a bit of a selection issue. DM companies then to be in industries with have a lower P/E ratio.
I am not quite understanding how this impacts P/E. I can see how risk and return goes up, though. It seems that the highly leveraged companies I know are actually low P/E (I even worked for one at one point). Am I mistaken?

EDIT: Wait, by the time they pay for the interest, then I guess the earnings are lower. Nevermind, I got it. This does show a new take to P/E I never thought about before.
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Re: Why the Bogleheads are the reason International trades at lower multiples

Post by alex_686 »

secondopinion wrote: Wed May 18, 2022 6:08 pm I am not quite understanding how this impacts P/E. I can see how risk and return goes up, though. It seems that the highly leveraged companies I know are actually low P/E (I even worked for one at one point). Am I mistaken?

EDIT: Wait, by the time they pay for the interest, then I guess the earnings are lower. Nevermind, I got it. This does show a new take to P/E I never thought about before.
I think you might be missing the point. How familiar are you with EBITA, Enterprise Value, Weighted Average Cost of Capital (WACC), Modigliani-Miller Theorem (a.k.a. Dividend Irrelevant Theory) and the impact it has on Beta?

Consider how a company finances itself, its corporate structure. It can finance itself either though expensive equity or by cheap debt.

Example.

Company A and B have the same enterprise value. Same plants, same earnings, etc. I am going to ignore taxes and amortization for this example.

Company A has 1b in EBITA and is 100% financed by equity. It has a 10% growth. Now the equity holders earn 1 billion.

Company B has 1b in EBITA and is 50% financed by equity, 50% in bonds. It first has to use some trivial amount to service the bonds. Lets say 100m. So 900m to the stockholders. But, critically, there are only 1/2 the stock holders so the get almost twice the earnings per share.

You have also increased the volatility. A 1% change in EBITA in company A gets you a 1% change in earnings. But company B is 2x leveraged so you get a 2% change, up or down.

Thus you increase your Beta.

You have also increased the chance of bankruptcy. So that is a negative.

So there is a sweet spot in the amount of leverage you want to use. Different industries have different sweet spots. Different tax codes favor different levels. This is what you are seeing.

Take a look at different companies in the same industry in different countries. Deleverage the companies and look at performance. They tend to be similar in terms of return and volatility.
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Re: Why the Bogleheads are the reason International trades at lower multiples

Post by 3CT_Paddler »

elderwise wrote: Wed May 18, 2022 5:53 pm When America becomes less immigrant friendly (like Europe discourages immigration or hinders it)..

When American taxes become worse than Europe.

When the future entrepreneurs of apps such as RobinHood , FB, and othe like the founder of Chobani Hamdi Ulukya, Patel brothers, Shaukat Dhanani, Sunil Dharod.. all classic rags to riches story of ordinary people who made it big in America... when these kind of people who are foreign but moved here(immigrated) will start going to other countries say Australia for ex..

Then..perhaps..Intl will beat US..

Yes I am US biased..but I also speak as a family of immigrants .

For all the negatives we do have here...there are multitudes of pros that attracts top talent, skill set that beats many many countries, and top compensation (can't forget that!)

I do hate fatca, fbar, and the covered expat scenario..

Not a rant :sharebeer

And yes it's also because of the US Dollar..and how the world is traded around it and Midde Eastern countries have pegged it to their Fiats.
Developed international outperformed during the 2000s while those factors were in play.

In general I agree with your sentiments and reason for optimism. I love to strike up conversations with immigrants who come to the US to hear their story. We need more ambitious, hard working people with basic values… we seem hard pressed to generate it among our descendants these days.
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Re: Why the Bogleheads are the reason International trades at lower multiples

Post by Nathan Drake »

Tamalak wrote: Wed May 18, 2022 5:16 pm Even if you adjust for changes in P/E and currency conversion, the underlying earnings of international companies has been poor for the last decade. This would seem to both justify and explain, in retrospect, the low P/E of intl companies.
This isn't true. While US has had a tad better fundamental earnings performance, international hasn't been that far behind. The huge change in multiple really distorts the view of US equity performance because many people falsely assume that if stocks go up, that earnings must be amazing.

Surprisingly, Japanese equities actually had better fundamental growth than US equities, yet the change in valuation wasn't there and as such US stock performance was much better despite this fact.
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Re: Why the Bogleheads are the reason International trades at lower multiples

Post by Normchad »

Murican exceptionalism, am I right?

I’m doing my part though. I’ve got a lot of VSMGX, VG Life Strategy Moderate Growth.

Although I do invest internationally, I’m not completely happy about it. I just don’t know enough about any of these other companies or countries to feel comfortable with them. I know all the countries have different accounting standards. And differing levels of corruption.

So I do not trust earning reports that I see from China, India, or Russia. The reason I mention those three is that I remember all the talk of the BRIC investing, which I think was Brazil, Russia, India, China. I haven’t looked up how well those funds have done, but to me, they seem like politically and economically u stable places. And so I wonder if their economies are real or just a mirage.

They might be correct, but I just don’t know. I’m ignorant. And so I do shy away from it, honestly.
Last edited by Normchad on Wed May 18, 2022 8:51 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Why the Bogleheads are the reason International trades at lower multiples

Post by doobiedoo »

I disagree. The primary reason international stocks trade at lower PEs [over the last 20 years] is that the big tech stocks are US companies. In particular, Apple, Microsoft, Google, Facebook.
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Re: Why the Bogleheads are the reason International trades at lower multiples

Post by secondopinion »

alex_686 wrote: Wed May 18, 2022 6:32 pm
secondopinion wrote: Wed May 18, 2022 6:08 pm I am not quite understanding how this impacts P/E. I can see how risk and return goes up, though. It seems that the highly leveraged companies I know are actually low P/E (I even worked for one at one point). Am I mistaken?

EDIT: Wait, by the time they pay for the interest, then I guess the earnings are lower. Nevermind, I got it. This does show a new take to P/E I never thought about before.
I think you might be missing the point. How familiar are you with EBITA, Enterprise Value, Weighted Average Cost of Capital (WACC), Modigliani-Miller Theorem (a.k.a. Dividend Irrelevant Theory) and the impact it has on Beta?

Consider how a company finances itself, its corporate structure. It can finance itself either though expensive equity or by cheap debt.

Example.

Company A and B have the same enterprise value. Same plants, same earnings, etc. I am going to ignore taxes and amortization for this example.

Company A has 1b in EBITA and is 100% financed by equity. It has a 10% growth. Now the equity holders earn 1 billion.

Company B has 1b in EBITA and is 50% financed by equity, 50% in bonds. It first has to use some trivial amount to service the bonds. Lets say 100m. So 900m to the stockholders. But, critically, there are only 1/2 the stock holders so the get almost twice the earnings per share.

You have also increased the volatility. A 1% change in EBITA in company A gets you a 1% change in earnings. But company B is 2x leveraged so you get a 2% change, up or down.

Thus you increase your Beta.

You have also increased the chance of bankruptcy. So that is a negative.

So there is a sweet spot in the amount of leverage you want to use. Different industries have different sweet spots. Different tax codes favor different levels. This is what you are seeing.

Take a look at different companies in the same industry in different countries. Deleverage the companies and look at performance. They tend to be similar in terms of return and volatility.
Any good books on the subject? I have a good mathematics background, but I am a bit shallow on these topics (know what they are but that is about it). Maybe I just need to read more.
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Re: Why the Bogleheads are the reason International trades at lower multiples

Post by alex_686 »

secondopinion wrote: Wed May 18, 2022 8:55 pm Any good books on the subject? I have a good mathematics background, but I am a bit shallow on these topics (know what they are but that is about it). Maybe I just need to read more.
I am not sure where I would start. We are talking about intermediate level corporate finance subjects which requires prior knowledge of investment accounting and investment theory. So we are talking textbook level stuff here.

Let me see if I can simplify things down. I think the key here is Modigliani-Miller Theorem. Lets say you have a company with a Enterprise Value of 1T. You can finance that company anyway you like. You could finance it with 250b equity / 750b bonds. Or 750b equity or 250b. The economic value of the company is fixed. You can't magic more money out of thin air by borrowing more money or issuing share buy backs or whatever. M&M makes a fair number of stringent assumptions about how the world works. But as a first order principle it holds up pretty well.

So lets say you are the CFO of the company. Your company produces free cash. You can move the debt/equity slider in whatever direction you like. You can slide it towards equity heavy and a debt light load. Safe, low volatility. Or you can slide it towards light equity and heavy debt. Lets say you borrow more to finance a stock buy back. If you follow M&M's logic you should realize that a stock buy back does not increase a stock's price. (This holds up pretty well in real life.) You are just swapping equity for debt. So keep following the logic. The share price is fixed, but there are few shares. i.e., the P in the P/E ratio is fixed. Since equity is cheaper than debt this means more cash flows towards equity. Hence a higher E in the P/E ratio. Also more risk, hence a higher Beta.

Does that help?

The math is not that hard. The M&M / accounting stuff only requires basic high school math. The math behind investment theory / corporate finance is not that too hard to handle either. The problem of telling you were to start is the subject to me is like a coral reef. Concept built on top of concept from different disciplines all nicely packaged into a cohesive package.
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Re: Why the Bogleheads are the reason International trades at lower multiples

Post by secondopinion »

alex_686 wrote: Wed May 18, 2022 9:49 pm
secondopinion wrote: Wed May 18, 2022 8:55 pm Any good books on the subject? I have a good mathematics background, but I am a bit shallow on these topics (know what they are but that is about it). Maybe I just need to read more.
I am not sure where I would start. We are talking about intermediate level corporate finance subjects which requires prior knowledge of investment accounting and investment theory. So we are talking textbook level stuff here.

Let me see if I can simplify things down. I think the key here is Modigliani-Miller Theorem. Lets say you have a company with a Enterprise Value of 1T. You can finance that company anyway you like. You could finance it with 250b equity / 750b bonds. Or 750b equity or 250b. The economic value of the company is fixed. You can't magic more money out of thin air by borrowing more money or issuing share buy backs or whatever. M&M makes a fair number of stringent assumptions about how the world works. But as a first order principle it holds up pretty well.

So lets say you are the CFO of the company. Your company produces free cash. You can move the debt/equity slider in whatever direction you like. You can slide it towards equity heavy and a debt light load. Safe, low volatility. Or you can slide it towards light equity and heavy debt. Lets say you borrow more to finance a stock buy back. If you follow M&M's logic you should realize that a stock buy back does not increase a stock's price. (This holds up pretty well in real life.) You are just swapping equity for debt. So keep following the logic. The share price is fixed, but there are few shares. i.e., the P in the P/E ratio is fixed. Since equity is cheaper than debt this means more cash flows towards equity. Hence a higher E in the P/E ratio. Also more risk, hence a higher Beta.

Does that help?

The math is not that hard. The M&M / accounting stuff only requires basic high school math. The math behind investment theory / corporate finance is not that too hard to handle either. The problem of telling you were to start is the subject to me is like a coral reef. Concept built on top of concept from different disciplines all nicely packaged into a cohesive package.
Makes sense. Thank you for the summary. I think it is simple logic if one takes the time to think about it.
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Re: Why the Bogleheads are the reason International trades at lower multiples

Post by ncbill »

The simpler answer is the low quality of financial reporting in general outside the U.S.

Even developed nations until recently did not have as strict as reporting standards as here in the U.S.

So it has been easier for foreign forms to cover up their financial gaffes from potential investors.
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Re: Why the Bogleheads are the reason International trades at lower multiples

Post by ignition »

ncbill wrote: Thu May 19, 2022 9:30 am The simpler answer is the low quality of financial reporting in general outside the U.S.

Even developed nations until recently did not have as strict as reporting standards as here in the U.S.

So it has been easier for foreign forms to cover up their financial gaffes from potential investors.
Really? Ever heard about Enron, Worldcom, AIG, Lehman Brothers, General Electric, Bernie Madoff, ...?
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Re: Why the Bogleheads are the reason International trades at lower multiples

Post by wolf359 »

ignition wrote: Thu May 19, 2022 11:13 am
ncbill wrote: Thu May 19, 2022 9:30 am The simpler answer is the low quality of financial reporting in general outside the U.S.

Even developed nations until recently did not have as strict as reporting standards as here in the U.S.

So it has been easier for foreign forms to cover up their financial gaffes from potential investors.
Really? Ever heard about Enron, Worldcom, AIG, Lehman Brothers, General Electric, Bernie Madoff, ...?
The fact is that most of those were breaking the law when they conducted their particular scandals. You probably heard about them yourself because of the trials or enforcement actions being in the news.

In the case of China, the Chinese government's laws disallow independent auditing under the auspices of national security. Since foreign investors distrust stock markets where there is no accounting oversight, many Chinese companies have listed in the US. The SEC is in the process of delisting them because the Chinese government continues to shield them from US financial disclosure laws. Source: https://asia.nikkei.com/Politics/Intern ... -delisting

The fact that the fraud continues to occur in the US even with its stricter laws does not invalid the point that fraud is easier to commit in areas with less restrictive enforcement or laws, or where the government is on the side of the fraudsters.

To invalidate the point, you would need to identify some prominent examples where the existing laws in foreign developed nations were applied to reveal financial gaffes.

Personally, I think the statement is incorrect, and that EU, British, and Japanese markets probably have adequate securities laws. But what do I know, it's not like I'm going to invest in individual foreign companies. I'm sticking with index funds.
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Re: Why the Bogleheads are the reason International trades at lower multiples

Post by Nathan Drake »

wolf359 wrote: Thu May 19, 2022 11:45 am
ignition wrote: Thu May 19, 2022 11:13 am
ncbill wrote: Thu May 19, 2022 9:30 am The simpler answer is the low quality of financial reporting in general outside the U.S.

Even developed nations until recently did not have as strict as reporting standards as here in the U.S.

So it has been easier for foreign forms to cover up their financial gaffes from potential investors.
Really? Ever heard about Enron, Worldcom, AIG, Lehman Brothers, General Electric, Bernie Madoff, ...?
The fact is that most of those were breaking the law when they conducted their particular scandals. You probably heard about them yourself because of the trials or enforcement actions being in the news.

In the case of China, the Chinese government's laws disallow independent auditing under the auspices of national security. Since foreign investors distrust stock markets where there is no accounting oversight, many Chinese companies have listed in the US. The SEC is in the process of delisting them because the Chinese government continues to shield them from US financial disclosure laws. Source: https://asia.nikkei.com/Politics/Intern ... -delisting

The fact that the fraud continues to occur in the US even with its stricter laws does not invalid the point that fraud is easier to commit in areas with less restrictive enforcement or laws, or where the government is on the side of the fraudsters.

To invalidate the point, you would need to identify some prominent examples where the existing laws in foreign developed nations were applied to reveal financial gaffes.

Personally, I think the statement is incorrect, and that EU, British, and Japanese markets probably have adequate securities laws. But what do I know, it's not like I'm going to invest in individual foreign companies. I'm sticking with index funds.
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Re: Why the Bogleheads are the reason International trades at lower multiples

Post by Hola »

whodidntante wrote: Wed May 18, 2022 5:18 pm It would seem that American stock valuations have reached a permanently high plateau. :P
Based on history I assume this means “buy” then? :-)
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Re: Why the Bogleheads are the reason International trades at lower multiples

Post by ncbill »

wolf359 wrote: Thu May 19, 2022 11:45 am
ignition wrote: Thu May 19, 2022 11:13 am
ncbill wrote: Thu May 19, 2022 9:30 am The simpler answer is the low quality of financial reporting in general outside the U.S.

Even developed nations until recently did not have as strict as reporting standards as here in the U.S.

So it has been easier for foreign forms to cover up their financial gaffes from potential investors.
Really? Ever heard about Enron, Worldcom, AIG, Lehman Brothers, General Electric, Bernie Madoff, ...?
The fact is that most of those were breaking the law when they conducted their particular scandals. You probably heard about them yourself because of the trials or enforcement actions being in the news.

In the case of China, the Chinese government's laws disallow independent auditing under the auspices of national security. Since foreign investors distrust stock markets where there is no accounting oversight, many Chinese companies have listed in the US. The SEC is in the process of delisting them because the Chinese government continues to shield them from US financial disclosure laws. Source: https://asia.nikkei.com/Politics/Intern ... -delisting

The fact that the fraud continues to occur in the US even with its stricter laws does not invalid the point that fraud is easier to commit in areas with less restrictive enforcement or laws, or where the government is on the side of the fraudsters.

To invalidate the point, you would need to identify some prominent examples where the existing laws in foreign developed nations were applied to reveal financial gaffes.

Personally, I think the statement is incorrect, and that EU, British, and Japanese markets probably have adequate securities laws. But what do I know, it's not like I'm going to invest in individual foreign companies. I'm sticking with index funds.
Didn't work with British or Japanese financial data so much during one phase of my working career, couple of decades ago.

European countries...not so much, maybe just because it was a Europe before the EU, but some "developed" countries there had surprisingly lax financial reporting standards back then.
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Re: Why the Bogleheads are the reason International trades at lower multiples

Post by cheezit »

I personally blame Norway's sovereign wealth fund for driving US P/E multiples up and thus lowering future expected returns. They're right around 50% US in their equity exposure, if memory serves.
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Re: Why the Bogleheads are the reason International trades at lower multiples

Post by asif408 »

cheezit wrote: Thu May 19, 2022 2:54 pm I personally blame Norway's sovereign wealth fund for driving US P/E multiples up and thus lowering future expected returns. They're right around 50% US in their equity exposure, if memory serves.
This is more likely the truth, performance chasers from other countries piling in to bid up prices here. Same thing happened in late 2000s to emerging markets and in the late 1980s to Japan.

The Bogleheads forum is more or less a sign of what's going on just because it's become a popular website. As a whole the posters on Bogleheads aren't immune to performance chasing, especially the newer posters. I will say, though, when I speak to people outside the online forums here I gather most don't invest much if anything internationally or only do if they are in a target date fund and don't even realize it. At least there is a decent contingent of regulars here that are open to and promote some international investing and staying the course with your chosen allocation.
Last edited by asif408 on Thu May 19, 2022 3:10 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Why the Bogleheads are the reason International trades at lower multiples

Post by Tamalak »

I didn't know Bogleheads had so much power

Let's crash New Zealand for fun, fellas :twisted:
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Re: Why the Bogleheads are the reason International trades at lower multiples

Post by ignition »

asif408 wrote: Thu May 19, 2022 2:58 pm
cheezit wrote: Thu May 19, 2022 2:54 pm I personally blame Norway's sovereign wealth fund for driving US P/E multiples up and thus lowering future expected returns. They're right around 50% US in their equity exposure, if memory serves.
This is more likely the truth, performance chasers from other countries piling in to bid up prices here. Same thing happened in late 2000s to emerging markets and in the late 1980s to Japan.
How is 50% US performance chasing? That's below market cap weight.
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Tellurius
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Re: Why the Bogleheads are the reason International trades at lower multiples

Post by Tellurius »

ncbill wrote: Thu May 19, 2022 9:30 am The simpler answer is the low quality of financial reporting in general outside the U.S.

Even developed nations until recently did not have as strict as reporting standards as here in the U.S.

So it has been easier for foreign forms to cover up their financial gaffes from potential investors.
I don't agree as the same Big 8 which have condensed into the Big 4 USA / UK auditing companies have been auditing large companies for at least the past 30 years
“And how shall I think of you?' He considered a moment and then laughed. 'Think of me with my nose in a book!” | ― Susanna Clarke, Jonathan Strange & Mr Norrell
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