excessively long quotes

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F150HD
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Re: excessively long quotes

Post by F150HD »

Peculiar_Investor wrote: Fri Jan 01, 2021 1:50 pm That's been the case since the Bogleheads upgraded to phpBB 3.2
do not recall seeing that before today. Of course with things getting posted over and over in the same thread it hasn't stood out :happy
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Re: excessively long quotes

Post by Peculiar_Investor »

F150HD wrote: Fri Jan 01, 2021 4:41 pm do not recall seeing that before today.
It is somewhat subtle and wasn't explained very well.
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Re: excessively long quotes

Post by Peculiar_Investor »

terran wrote: Fri Jan 01, 2021 9:29 am I usually skip to the end of threads with more than a few replies and read backwards to catch up and/or see if what I would say has already been said. This makes reading quotes annoying.
But that's your choice. Quoted material comes from previous posts. So why not just read the post in the context that the post author intended? I fail to understand many of the arguments being made that the material inside a quote in another members post is somehow more important than the member who posted it originally.

As many have pointed out, it should be common courtesy when quoting to only quoted the specific and relevant portion of a previous post. That's what I understood as the basic premise of the original poster (OP) on this topic.

The more important content is how you (or someone else) replies to the quoted content. That's the part of the message I want to read.

My $0.02.
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Re: excessively long quotes

Post by NAVigator »

F150HD wrote: Wed Dec 30, 2020 10:21 pm Sometimes in a thread someone types a lengthy reply that then gets quoted (sometimes multiple times) and you have to scroll through all of them to see someones one line response to it or move down the page. :|
Since the original topic was a concern about having excessively long quotes in a reply, perhaps it could be resolved by changing the behavior of the quote button. It defaults to EVERYTHING. Could the quote button functionality be modified so it only includes highlighted areas? if nothing is highlighted, a one line message "Nothing highlighted" could be displayed instead of invoking the reply screen. In this way the replying person needs to identify what they are replying about, thus making the reply more relevant and succinct.
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Fat Tails
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Re: excessively long quotes

Post by Fat Tails »

F150HD wrote: Wed Dec 30, 2020 10:46 pm
6bquick wrote: Wed Dec 30, 2020 10:24 pm I do hate changing spark plugs in aluminum heads!! :sharebeer
:beer

______

Example of what I'm talking about; long quote, gets quoted 2x within three posts.

viewtopic.php?p=5695634#p5695634
Spark plugs in aluminum heads can be difficult. What thread lubricant do you all recommend?
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Re: excessively long quotes

Post by Peculiar_Investor »

NAVigator wrote: Fri Jan 01, 2021 10:02 pm
F150HD wrote: Wed Dec 30, 2020 10:21 pm Sometimes in a thread someone types a lengthy reply that then gets quoted (sometimes multiple times) and you have to scroll through all of them to see someones one line response to it or move down the page. :|
Since the original topic was a concern about having excessively long quotes in a reply, perhaps it could be resolved by changing the behavior of the quote button. It defaults to EVERYTHING. Could the quote button functionality be modified so it only includes highlighted areas?
User behaviour needs to change, not the software. This is nothing new. Excessive quoting has been a problem on the internet since the days of Usenet.

Reading back through the topic you will see that changing the function of the quote button isn't going to happen.
Mudpuppy wrote: Thu Dec 31, 2020 12:08 am If it's an extension, it won't be added. The forum owners and moderators have been pretty clear that this site will only support standard phpBB features and won't use extensions.
LadyGeek wrote: Fri Jan 01, 2021 7:38 am That's not quite true. We already use a few extensions, such as Password Strength and Board rules (titled in the header as "Forum policies"). Extensions are kept up-to-date.

If an extension has been vetted by the phpBB developers and it has clear benefit for the forum, we'll consider adding it.
That's also why I previously tried to help out by posting, and now repeating, some hopefully help tips on how members can use the existing quoting functionality to keep their quoting to the appropriate amount.

On the subject of quote materials, wherever possible when quoting another member's post please try to use the Image button in your replies as it provides context of who you are quoting, a link (the little up-arrow) beside the member's name, and the timestamp of the original quoted material. It also provides notifications to the member you are quoting, which can alert them to your quoted reply.

An additional pro tip on the board software. If you only want to quote a small amount of someone's post, use the Reply button and then look below the text input area for the post. There is a section below labelled TOPIC REVIEW that shows previous posts in the topic. Click on the EXPAND VIEW and the full text of the replies will appear. If you only want to quote a part of someone's post, select the text in their post, then click theImage button in the top right of their post. That will insert ONLY the selected text into your reply with the appropriate quoted information (poster, link to post, post time).
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Re: excessively long quotes

Post by NAVigator »

I DID read all of the posts in this thread. What I was suggesting was to change the default of the existing quote button from ALL to SOME of the current post to encourage use behavior to that which you are also arguing for.
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Re: excessively long quotes

Post by Peculiar_Investor »

NAVigator wrote: Sat Jan 02, 2021 8:10 am I DID read all of the posts in this thread. What I was suggesting was to change the default of the existing quote button ...
That would be a solution to the problem but getting it implemented is the issue. The only way that would happen is if you (or someone) submit a bug report to the phpBB developers and convince them to change the default action of the quote feature.

I don't recall any software that implements a quote function (or reply/forward) that implements anything but including all the previous materials, so that would be very much non-standard behaviour.

This is an ages old problem and isn't specific to phpBB nor this community. Not easily solved.
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F150HD
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Re: excessively long quotes

Post by F150HD »

NAVigator wrote: Fri Jan 01, 2021 10:02 pm Since the original topic was a concern about having excessively long quotes in a reply, perhaps it could be resolved by changing the behavior of the quote button...
viewtopic.php?p=5701215#p5701215

That or manually delete parts of a long quote if not needed.
Fat Tails wrote: Sat Jan 02, 2021 12:50 am Spark plugs in aluminum heads can be difficult. What thread lubricant do you all recommend?
NGK plugs do not require anti-seize :thumbsup
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Re: excessively long quotes

Post by Katietsu »

Peculiar_Investor wrote: Fri Jan 01, 2021 8:39 am An additional pro tip on the board software. If you only want to quote a small amount of someone's post, use the Reply button and then look below the text input area for the post. There is a section below labelled TOPIC REVIEW that shows previous posts in the topic.
This does not seem to be applicable on my phone (which is close to all my BH usage). Is that true?
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Re: excessively long quotes

Post by Chip »

Peculiar_Investor wrote: Sat Jan 02, 2021 8:34 am I don't recall any software that implements a quote function (or reply/forward) that implements anything but including all the previous materials, so that would be very much non-standard behaviour.
It's not forum software, but the Thunderbird mail client implements the quote function this way; whatever is selected in the message being replied to is quoted in the reply.

Using your tip and enjoying it!
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Re: excessively long quotes

Post by Peculiar_Investor »

Katietsu wrote: Sat Jan 02, 2021 9:58 am
Peculiar_Investor wrote: Fri Jan 01, 2021 8:39 am An additional pro tip on the board software. If you only want to quote a small amount of someone's post, use the Reply button and then look below the text input area for the post. There is a section below labelled TOPIC REVIEW that shows previous posts in the topic.
This does not seem to be applicable on my phone (which is close to all my BH usage). Is that true?
Yes it is true. After hitting "Reply", on the bottom of the screen you'll see the "Save draft" "Preview" and "Submit". Depending on the device there is a scroll bar (hidden on iOS devices) because there is additional content below those buttons.

Scroll down and you'll find the additional functionality that I've posted about. First below those buttons is Options and Attachment tabs. Below them is the TOPIC REVIEW and EXPAND VIEW items that can be very helpful when quoting others.
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Re: excessively long quotes

Post by the way »

F150HD wrote: Wed Dec 30, 2020 10:21 pm Sometimes in a thread someone types a lengthy reply that then gets quoted (sometimes multiple times) and you have to scroll through all of them to see someones one line response to it or move down the page. :|
Here's a simple bookmarklet which you can press whenever you find yourself on a page of endlessly long quotes:

Code: Select all

javascript:(function(){const topquotes = document.querySelectorAll(".content > blockquote"); topquotes.forEach(quote => { quote.style.maxHeight="100px"; quote.onclick = function(event){this.style.maxHeight="";} });})();
Pressing it will cause all the blockquotes to be truncated at 100px (you can adjust that to your tastes). Then simply click within any of the shortened quotes to revert it back to its normal size if you want to read it. Anytime you refresh or change pages, the quotes will also revert.

(To create a bookmarklet, save a regular bookmark and then edit it and replace the URL with the javascript above.)

[Note: I only tested this on Chrome]
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Re: excessively long quotes

Post by BlueCable »

Thank you for rolling back. My thumb managed to find a quote on almost every thread I read and it was driving me crazy.
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Re: excessively long quotes

Post by the way »

the way wrote: Sat Jan 02, 2021 7:13 pm (To create a bookmarklet, save a regular bookmark and then edit it and replace the URL with the javascript above.)

[Note: I only tested this on Chrome]
Here's a different version of the bookmarklet that only collapses the inner quotes. You still click anywhere in a quote to re-expand it. Which version is better depends on your preference - with this one you will still see very long quotes if the outer quote is long, but it saves you a click since these are mainly the ones you will want to read (and OP was really only complaining about the super nested ones).

Code: Select all

javascript:(function(){const topquotes = document.querySelectorAll(".content > blockquote > div > blockquote"); topquotes.forEach(quote => { quote.style.maxHeight="42px"; quote.parentNode.parentNode.onclick = function(event){quote.style.maxHeight="";} });})();
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Re: excessively long quotes

Post by F150HD »

Last edited by F150HD on Tue Jan 19, 2021 12:08 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: excessively long quotes

Post by JupiterJones »

Peculiar_Investor wrote: Sat Jan 02, 2021 7:21 am User behaviour needs to change, not the software. This is nothing new. Excessive quoting has been a problem on the internet since the days of Usenet.
Yup. As a former USENET denizen myself, I can vouch that "only quote relevant portions of a post" has been standard netiquette for ages.

Maybe not as annoying these days as it was at 9600 baud, but still... 8-)
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The Electrician
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Re: excessively long quotes

Post by The Electrician »

JupiterJones wrote: Mon Jan 04, 2021 1:48 pm "only quote relevant portions of a post"
Right arm brutha.
I can recall when using a 300 baud and thinking V.32bis was going to be soooo fast!
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Re: excessively long quotes

Post by Exchme »

My problem is I can't ever figure out how to delete unwanted parts of a quote without messing it all up. I'm sure it's explained somewhere, but that would require reading the instructions.
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Re: excessively long quotes

Post by Peculiar_Investor »

Exchme wrote: Tue Feb 02, 2021 5:57 pm I'm sure it's explained somewhere, but that would require reading the instructions.
I tried to explain it here and here. It is trivial on a desktop or laptop and takes a small amount of effort on a tablet or smartphone.

When it doubt, click the Preview button to see ensure it looks like you wanted it to look.
Normal people… believe that if it ain’t broke, don’t fix it. Engineers believe that if it ain’t broke, it doesn’t have enough features yet. – Scott Adams
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