TSP form upload rejected

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delamer
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TSP form upload rejected

Post by delamer »

Has anyone run into the problem of having a TSP form rejected?

I uploaded a completed withdrawal form, which I’d populated by filling it out on the website. This is for a indirect partial rollover and the money is going to be deposited in our checking account.

Both my spouse and I had our signatures notarized, as required. Notary used a stamp, not a raised seal.

But according to my online account, the form was rejected. However, no reason was given. Apparently, they are snail-mailing me an explanation.

Obviously, I’ll be contacting TSP customer service but can’t do that until Tuesday.

Maybe it’s something as simple as a problem with the file upload?
One thing that humbles me deeply is to see that human genius has its limits while human stupidity does not. - Alexandre Dumas, fils
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HueyLD
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Re: TSP form upload rejected

Post by HueyLD »

Alternatively, you can fax the form.
Bogle64Pilot
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Re: TSP form upload rejected

Post by Bogle64Pilot »

Things such as this as well as the rising ER in contradiction to the rest of the industry, is why the day I retire I’m transferring my TSP account over to a rollover IRA from Fidelity.
Mako
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Re: TSP form upload rejected

Post by Mako »

Yeah I’ve got around 15 years but I’m moving from the TSP the second I retire if nothing changes by then. Don’t care much about the G fund at this point and that’s the main draw.
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delamer
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Re: TSP form upload rejected

Post by delamer »

Bogle64Pilot wrote: Sun Jan 16, 2022 6:58 pm Things such as this as well as the rising ER in contradiction to the rest of the industry, is why the day I retire I’m transferring my TSP account over to a rollover IRA from Fidelity.
I can’t say that didn’t cross my mind.

But I’ll see how it plays out.
One thing that humbles me deeply is to see that human genius has its limits while human stupidity does not. - Alexandre Dumas, fils
chemocean
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Re: TSP form upload rejected

Post by chemocean »

Have you looked at the form and the booklets to confirm that indirect rollovers of TSP funds are allowed?
I have made a partial direct rollover last year, and I had to get the receiving custodian to sign their acceptance of the transfer.
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delamer
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Re: TSP form upload rejected

Post by delamer »

chemocean wrote: Sun Jan 16, 2022 9:13 pm Have you looked at the form and the booklets to confirm that indirect rollovers of TSP funds are allowed?
I have made a partial direct rollover last year, and I had to get the receiving custodian to sign their acceptance of the transfer.
Since the funds are going to my checking account, how would TSP even know that’s my intent? It’s just listed as a “single partial withdrawal” on the paperwork.

However, I did roll an IRA into my TSP about 60 days ago (to facilitate a Roth conversion). EDIT: It turns out the rollover was in June 2021. I was thinking of the actual Roth conversion which I didn’t do until November.

So I’m wondering if there is some restriction on moving funds in and out within a fairly short period?

Thanks.
One thing that humbles me deeply is to see that human genius has its limits while human stupidity does not. - Alexandre Dumas, fils
chemocean
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Re: TSP form upload rejected

Post by chemocean »

Just executed a small partial withdrawal this year. I was surprised to find that a 20% tax withdrawal is REQUIRED on withdrawals, not direct transfers. Could your rejection have something to do with tax withdrawal that you were requesting?
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HueyLD
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Re: TSP form upload rejected

Post by HueyLD »

chemocean wrote: Mon Jan 17, 2022 6:52 am Just executed a small partial withdrawal this year. I was surprised to find that a 20% tax withdrawal is REQUIRED on withdrawals, not direct transfers. Could your rejection have something to do with tax withdrawal that you were requesting?
It is the IRS requirement.

“ Any taxable distribution paid to you is subject to mandatory withholding of 20%, even if you intend to roll the distribution over later. If the distribution is rolled over, and you want to defer tax on the entire taxable portion, you will have to add funds from other sources equal to the amount withheld. You can choose to have your 401(k) plan transfer a distribution directly to another eligible plan or to an IRA. Under this option, no taxes are withheld.”

https://www.irs.gov/retirement-plans/pl ... tion-rules
bluegill
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Re: TSP form upload rejected

Post by bluegill »

HueyLD wrote: Sun Jan 16, 2022 6:52 pm Alternatively, you can fax the form.
A couple months ago, TSP only would accept documents created on-line.
bluegill
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Re: TSP form upload rejected

Post by bluegill »

I did a partial withdrawal recently.
I requested 97% to rollover Vanguard IRA, 3% leave in TSP.
TSP sent 97% to Vanguard and 3% to me, then closed my TSP account.
It was to exasperating to try to correct.

I rolled over due to estate planning issues with TSP.
ChrisC
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Re: TSP form upload rejected

Post by ChrisC »

delamer wrote: Sun Jan 16, 2022 10:52 pm
chemocean wrote: Sun Jan 16, 2022 9:13 pm Have you looked at the form and the booklets to confirm that indirect rollovers of TSP funds are allowed?
I have made a partial direct rollover last year, and I had to get the receiving custodian to sign their acceptance of the transfer.
Since the funds are going to my checking account, how would TSP even know that’s my intent? It’s just listed as a “single partial withdrawal” on the paperwork.

However, I did roll an IRA into my TSP about 60 days ago (to facilitate a Roth conversion). EDIT: It turns out the rollover was in June 2021. I was thinking of the actual Roth conversion which I didn’t do until November.

So I’m wondering if there is some restriction on moving funds in and out within a fairly short period?

Thanks.
I did a direct transfer from traditional TSP to a Wells Fargo Roth IRA in May 2021 (a conversion that Wells Fargo some how managed to fumble). Then I did an indirect rollover from tradtional TSP to my checking account and then to a Wells Fargo Roth IRA in December 2021 (a conversion that Wells Fargo fumbled again). I'm CSRS and in each case for us there's simple spousal notification process. For the direct transfer, I had to have my signature notarized and Wells Fargo had to fill out information on page 4 of the TSP-99 form -- basically the address and account info of where the direct transfer check was to be sent by TSP to Wells Fargo. For the indirect rollover, the process was completed online, with no notarization of my signature required, and from start to finish it took 6 business days for the funds to be in my checking account. The indirect rollover (or any distribution other than a direct trustee to trustee transfer) requires Federal tax withholding.

In each case, I received a confirmation from TSP. The confirmation for the indirect rollover included the following statement:

"This payment is considered an "eligible rollover distribution" for purposes of federal income tax
withholding. Any taxable portion of an eligible rollover distribution that is paid directly to you is subject to
mandatory 20% federal income tax withholding; this tax withholding cannot be waived. Consult your tax
advisor or the Internal Revenue Service (IRS) if you have additional questions about your payment,
including the opportunity to roll over part or all of it into a traditional or Roth IRA or eligible employer
plan."
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HueyLD
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Re: TSP form upload rejected

Post by HueyLD »

bluegill wrote: Mon Jan 17, 2022 7:18 am
HueyLD wrote: Sun Jan 16, 2022 6:52 pm Alternatively, you can fax the form.
A couple months ago, TSP only would accept documents created on-line.
I think the OP created the document online, but it required notarized signatures and thus a paper printout was generated.

And the paper document can be sent via fax.
FedGuy
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Re: TSP form upload rejected

Post by FedGuy »

I tried to upload a TSP 3 (beneficiary designation) this past weekend, and it was rejected as well. It listed various possible reasons for the rejection, but I couldn't see one that applied. I wonder if there's some kind of systemic glitch preventing the system from accepting any uploads at the moment?
HeelaMonster
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Re: TSP form upload rejected

Post by HeelaMonster »

delamer wrote: Sun Jan 16, 2022 10:52 pm Since the funds are going to my checking account, how would TSP even know that’s my intent? It’s just listed as a “single partial withdrawal” on the paperwork.

However, I did roll an IRA into my TSP about 60 days ago (to facilitate a Roth conversion). EDIT: It turns out the rollover was in June 2021. I was thinking of the actual Roth conversion which I didn’t do until November.

So I’m wondering if there is some restriction on moving funds in and out within a fairly short period?

Thanks.
There is a 30-day requirement between withdrawals for all participants (active and retired alike), with additional cap of 4 partial withdrawals per year for those older than 59.5 yrs and still in federal service. But doesn't sound like any of that applies to your scenario.

https://federalnewsnetwork.com/tsp/2018 ... dar%20year.
Topic Author
delamer
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Re: TSP form upload rejected

Post by delamer »

FedGuy wrote: Mon Jan 17, 2022 9:06 am I tried to upload a TSP 3 (beneficiary designation) this past weekend, and it was rejected as well. It listed various possible reasons for the rejection, but I couldn't see one that applied. I wonder if there's some kind of systemic glitch preventing the system from accepting any uploads at the moment?
Very interesting. I hope it’s some system malfunction rather than a problem with my form. (Not that I’m wishing trouble on others.)

I’ve reviewed everything on the form and don’t see anything that I inadvertently left blank or filled out in error. The 20% required withholding is noted on the form.

I don’t have access to a fax machine at home, so scanning is my go-to.

I checked TSP Twitter and that was no help. I’m not on Facebook.

Thanks to all. I’ll report back tomorrow when their offices reopen.
One thing that humbles me deeply is to see that human genius has its limits while human stupidity does not. - Alexandre Dumas, fils
Topic Author
delamer
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Re: TSP form upload rejected

Post by delamer »

One of the dates couldn’t be seen clearly on the uploaded document.

And, admittedly, it was a little indistinct. So I cleaned it up a bit without actually retracing because the rep said it could be rejected for that.

So now I’m going to try faxing it. (From somewhere.)
One thing that humbles me deeply is to see that human genius has its limits while human stupidity does not. - Alexandre Dumas, fils
rkhusky
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Re: TSP form upload rejected

Post by rkhusky »

delamer wrote: Tue Jan 18, 2022 11:57 am One of the dates couldn’t be seen clearly on the uploaded document.

And, admittedly, it was a little indistinct. So I cleaned it up a bit without actually retracing because the rep said it could be rejected for that.

So now I’m going to try faxing it. (From somewhere.)
Faxing will add additional distortion, which could be good or bad, depending on whether or not faxes are held to the same standard as uploaded documents.
Faith20879
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Re: TSP form upload rejected

Post by Faith20879 »

delamer wrote: Sun Jan 16, 2022 6:46 pm Has anyone run into the problem of having a TSP form rejected?
Yes, DH tried to upload his filled form 99 last year 2021 and was rejected. The instruction for uploading mentioned something about scanning with certain minimum resolution (don't quite remember the number now). We just assumed that our scanner quality was not up to the task. He ended up faxing it and had no problem after that.

I have read on this board that some did have success uploading so I am thinking it really is about the scanned quality.
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delamer
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Re: TSP form upload rejected

Post by delamer »

Faith20879 wrote: Tue Jan 18, 2022 1:07 pm
delamer wrote: Sun Jan 16, 2022 6:46 pm Has anyone run into the problem of having a TSP form rejected?
Yes, DH tried to upload his filled form 99 last year 2021 and was rejected. The instruction for uploading mentioned something about scanning with certain minimum resolution (don't quite remember the number now). We just assumed that our scanner quality was not up to the task. He ended up faxing it and had no problem after that.

I have read on this board that some did have success uploading so I am thinking it really is about the scanned quality.
I too suspect that our home scanner wasn’t up-to-snuff. Although one of the handwritten dates was pretty indistinct even on the original (mea culpa!).

In the future and/or if I have to redo this one, I think I’ll just have the notary fax it at the store.
One thing that humbles me deeply is to see that human genius has its limits while human stupidity does not. - Alexandre Dumas, fils
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HueyLD
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Re: TSP form upload rejected

Post by HueyLD »

delamer wrote: Tue Jan 18, 2022 11:57 am One of the dates couldn’t be seen clearly on the uploaded document.

And, admittedly, it was a little indistinct. So I cleaned it up a bit without actually retracing because the rep said it could be rejected for that.

So now I’m going to try faxing it. (From somewhere.)
You can get one of those Brother MFC printers so that you can fax, scan and print from the comfort of your home.

I have used the fax feature to help a family member faxing forms to the TSP and it was successfully received every time.
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delamer
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Re: TSP form upload rejected

Post by delamer »

HueyLD wrote: Tue Jan 18, 2022 3:06 pm
delamer wrote: Tue Jan 18, 2022 11:57 am One of the dates couldn’t be seen clearly on the uploaded document.

And, admittedly, it was a little indistinct. So I cleaned it up a bit without actually retracing because the rep said it could be rejected for that.

So now I’m going to try faxing it. (From somewhere.)
You can get one of those Brother MFC printers so that you can fax, scan and print from the comfort of your home.

I have used the fax feature to help a family member faxing forms to the TSP and it was successfully received every time.
I actually have a Brother printer/scanner but it doesn’t fax.

I probably won’t need to do this for another 3 years though.

Fortunately.
One thing that humbles me deeply is to see that human genius has its limits while human stupidity does not. - Alexandre Dumas, fils
chemocean
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Re: TSP form upload rejected

Post by chemocean »

delamer wrote: Tue Jan 18, 2022 11:57 am One of the dates couldn’t be seen clearly on the uploaded document.

And, admittedly, it was a little indistinct. So I cleaned it up a bit without actually retracing because the rep said it could be rejected for that.

So now I’m going to try faxing it. (From somewhere.)
TSP is very particular (others would a different word) about everything being perfect on the form. I flunked penmanship in 5th grade and it took me four tries to get a TSP-3 accepted when the entire form was filled in by hand and before most of the form was machine prepared.
kelvan80
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Re: TSP form upload rejected

Post by kelvan80 »

If you have a smart phone there are multiple free scanning apps. I've had to use them to get documents for lenders etc and they've worked very well for me.
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delamer
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Re: TSP form upload rejected

Post by delamer »

chemocean wrote: Tue Jan 18, 2022 4:32 pm
delamer wrote: Tue Jan 18, 2022 11:57 am One of the dates couldn’t be seen clearly on the uploaded document.

And, admittedly, it was a little indistinct. So I cleaned it up a bit without actually retracing because the rep said it could be rejected for that.

So now I’m going to try faxing it. (From somewhere.)
TSP is very particular (others would a different word) about everything being perfect on the form. I flunked penmanship in 5th grade and it took me four tries to get a TSP-3 accepted when the entire form was filled in by hand and before most of the form was machine prepared.
While I could see that one of the dates could have been “crisper,” I thought it was a pretty silly objection. The dates entered by the notary were clear.
One thing that humbles me deeply is to see that human genius has its limits while human stupidity does not. - Alexandre Dumas, fils
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TimeRunner
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Re: TSP form upload rejected

Post by TimeRunner »

delamer wrote: Tue Jan 18, 2022 3:30 pm
HueyLD wrote: Tue Jan 18, 2022 3:06 pm
delamer wrote: Tue Jan 18, 2022 11:57 am One of the dates couldn’t be seen clearly on the uploaded document.

And, admittedly, it was a little indistinct. So I cleaned it up a bit without actually retracing because the rep said it could be rejected for that.

So now I’m going to try faxing it. (From somewhere.)
You can get one of those Brother MFC printers so that you can fax, scan and print from the comfort of your home.

I have used the fax feature to help a family member faxing forms to the TSP and it was successfully received every time.
I actually have a Brother printer/scanner but it doesn’t fax.

I probably won’t need to do this for another 3 years though.

Fortunately.
Ditto, because we don't have a landline. I didn't trust 'free fax online' because they probably keep a copy of your form for marketing or something darker. The local UPS store will fax for 25 cents a page.
One cannot enlighten the unconscious. | "All I need are some tasty waves, a cool buzz, and I'm fine." -Jeff Spicoli
Topic Author
delamer
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Re: TSP form upload rejected

Post by delamer »

The TSP site lists my faxed request as “Pending” as compared to “Rejected” for the original upload.

So I’m hopeful.
One thing that humbles me deeply is to see that human genius has its limits while human stupidity does not. - Alexandre Dumas, fils
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delamer
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Re: TSP form upload rejected

Post by delamer »

Issue resolved.

The fax was of sufficient quality, apparently.

I did get a voicemail from TSP that I needed to call in to verify the withdrawal.

I did so, they asked me a series of questions (including my separation date), and said the funds will be sent in 3-5 business days.

The motto is make sure that any handwriting on the form is crisp.

I withdrew enough to cover Roth conversions for a few years, so I doubt that I’ll be contacting them again until RMD time.
One thing that humbles me deeply is to see that human genius has its limits while human stupidity does not. - Alexandre Dumas, fils
jlumkes
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Re: TSP form upload rejected

Post by jlumkes »

We are having a problem even getting the TSP-99 uploaded to complete. We cannot get to the point to even make an election which would allow us to then upload the form.
If anyone has any suggestions whatsoever, we are open.

Thank You!!
jlumkes
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Re: TSP form upload rejected

Post by jlumkes »

I forgot to mention, I have been separated from service for four years, and I am trying to effect a full transfer into a new IRA I am setting up.

Any Suggestions?
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TimeRunner
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Re: TSP form upload rejected

Post by TimeRunner »

Per TSP email:

May 16 to the first week of June: Certain My Account transactions, online tools, and forms will be temporarily unavailable.
May 26 to the first week of June: All transactions will be temporarily unavailable, including changes to investments. My Account and the ThriftLine will also be unavailable during this time.
First week of June: Full TSP service returns with new features, expanded support options, efficient online transactions, a new My Account with convenient navigation, and much more.

I'd wait until June and then try with the new process (including e-signatures) and updated website and TSP phone app.
One cannot enlighten the unconscious. | "All I need are some tasty waves, a cool buzz, and I'm fine." -Jeff Spicoli
rkhusky
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Re: TSP form upload rejected

Post by rkhusky »

jlumkes wrote: Wed May 11, 2022 3:53 pm We are having a problem even getting the TSP-99 uploaded to complete. We cannot get to the point to even make an election which would allow us to then upload the form.
If anyone has any suggestions whatsoever, we are open.

Thank You!!
You need to initiate the rollover on the TSP web site, download the partially completed form, set up the receiving IRA, get the receiving brokerage to fill out their portion of the form, get your signatures notarized, and then send the form to TSP (via mail, fax, upload). If you don't have the first 4 steps done, you will need to wait until June.

If you have the completed form in hand, then scan it to a .pdf, make sure everything is legible, and upload it on the TSP web site.
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