Cost of car ownership vs. uber / lyft / ride sharing

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vfinx
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Re: Cost of car ownership vs. uber / lyft / ride sharing

Post by vfinx »

I switched to uber/lyft for my commute. I ran the numbers and the cost was pretty close, but the huge advantage is that it allowed me to avoid driving a congested route that added significant stress. In that case, there was no highway driving and the speed was pretty low so I didn't feel it was a big risk when I got the occasional aggressive/careless driver. I probably wouldn't do it if it frequently involved highway speeds. Another factor in this case is that I was paying a significant amount for parking at the transit station (Park & Ride), which could now be avoided. There was a also a daily anxiety of not getting a parking spot, if I didn't arrive at the station early enough.

So during that period, it was great to switch. Definitely an improvement to quality of life, even if it wasn't a big deal either way financially.
tj
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Re: Cost of car ownership vs. uber / lyft / ride sharing

Post by tj »

vfinx wrote: Thu Sep 23, 2021 3:19 pm I switched to uber/lyft for my commute. I ran the numbers and the cost was pretty close, but the huge advantage is that it allowed me to avoid driving a congested route that added significant stress. In that case, there was no highway driving and the speed was pretty low so I didn't feel it was a big risk when I got the occasional aggressive/careless driver. I probably wouldn't do it if it frequently involved highway speeds. Another factor in this case is that I was paying a significant amount for parking at the transit station (Park & Ride), which could now be avoided. There was a also a daily anxiety of not getting a parking spot, if I didn't arrive at the station early enough.

So during that period, it was great to switch. Definitely an improvement to quality of life, even if it wasn't a big deal either way financially.
So do you now take uber/lyft to the park and ride or to the office?
vfinx
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Re: Cost of car ownership vs. uber / lyft / ride sharing

Post by vfinx »

tj wrote: Thu Sep 23, 2021 3:27 pm
vfinx wrote: Thu Sep 23, 2021 3:19 pm I switched to uber/lyft for my commute. I ran the numbers and the cost was pretty close, but the huge advantage is that it allowed me to avoid driving a congested route that added significant stress. In that case, there was no highway driving and the speed was pretty low so I didn't feel it was a big risk when I got the occasional aggressive/careless driver. I probably wouldn't do it if it frequently involved highway speeds. Another factor in this case is that I was paying a significant amount for parking at the transit station (Park & Ride), which could now be avoided. There was a also a daily anxiety of not getting a parking spot, if I didn't arrive at the station early enough.

So during that period, it was great to switch. Definitely an improvement to quality of life, even if it wasn't a big deal either way financially.
So do you now take uber/lyft to the park and ride or to the office?
Covid shut all that down, but I was taking it to the park and ride. My public transit ride was paid for by my employer so it made more sense to keep the uber/lyft ride shorter.
Super Hans
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Re: Cost of car ownership vs. uber / lyft / ride sharing

Post by Super Hans »

I managed for nearly two decades of professional life with no car, walking or taking the subway to work (Boston/NY/Washington). I frequently rented cars to get out of town, but it generally was very cheap--and my status with the rental car companies eventually helped assure I'd drive nice cars. Early this year, I finally broke down under Covid pressure. Outdoors pursuits have replaced urban adventures (e.g., hiking instead of museums), and the rental cars became much more expensive. I leased a Volvo on the "Care by Volvo" program, supposing the outrageous price was worth it for the option of cancelling after four months. But now, after more than six months, I fear we've succumbed to lifestyle creep and the chip shortage makes it less than an ideal time to negotiate a better deal. I'm still hopeful that life will return to normal, we'll be back on the subway, and vacation will mean renting a car in a faraway land instead of regional road trips.
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Re: Cost of car ownership vs. uber / lyft / ride sharing

Post by Walkure »

namajones wrote: Thu Sep 23, 2021 4:12 am
Walkure wrote: Wed Sep 22, 2021 5:39 pm For me cost of ownership with a paid off used car was about $3k. Probably now spend half that annually on car rental / zip cars / Uber+Lyft. Does not include commuting, for which I use (subsidized) public transit.
Are you calculating purchase price in that annual cost of car ownership? I assume you are. Your calculation is a third higher than my own. Average annual cost of car ownership should probably be another thread, but it's keenly pertinent to this discussion, as well. My own annual cost of a car is down to $2K, if not a bit less now. That includes purchase price, insurance, and estimates on gas and service over the 16 years that I've had the car (Camry). I haven't heard anyone say that their annual cost of ownership is less, but I haven't been listening very hard, either.

In any case, I'd imagine that one's expenditures on uber/lyft,etc. would have to compare very favorably to, if not beat significantly, one's cost of car ownership for the idea to seem compelling.

I do calculate mentally what I think a person's annual cost of car ownership would be if I run across the significant numbers--such as purchase price, likely length of ownership in years, likely maintenance costs and mileage--and I more typically come up with figures that start at $5K annually. That would probably buy a heckuva lot of rides on uber or lyft, depending, of course, on length of rides.

Just now I estimated that if I took 10 rides a week (and I don't drive that often in my normal car, so that's generous) at $40 per ride (city-like area, generally don't go far for most trips), I'd be at about $1,750 per month. That seems to beat by just a little my already low annual cost of car ownership. I guess the question becomes, " how much is it worth to me to have the flexibility provided by having my own car?" It's probably worth the small difference between $2,000 and $1,750 to me.

But if my annual cost of car ownership were in the $5K+ range, I'm not sure I could justify not banking that amount of savings. Over 20 years the savings would be in the range of $65,000 in today's dollars, which, if invested, might actually be worth significantly more than that in 20 years. That's not the relative chump change of, say, switching from buying coffee at Starbucks to making it at home. So that's probably when the idea would start to seem compelling to me--and that might be, of course, as soon as my current car gives up the ghost. I suppose that's why I started this thread...thinking ahead.
I believe that the purchase price was rolled into that annual cost, but that wasn't the main factor. My condo at the time did not have a parking space attached so I was paying extra for monthly parking. That was what really tipped the numbers in favor Uber/Lyft.

Also, around here I rarely pay more than $25 per ride. $40 would be like a 45-minute ride to the airport.
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namajones
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Re: Cost of car ownership vs. uber / lyft / ride sharing

Post by namajones »

Walkure wrote: Fri Sep 24, 2021 9:03 am

Also, around here I rarely pay more than $25 per ride. $40 would be like a 45-minute ride to the airport.
Same here. I was using $40 just to overestimate on purpose.
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FoundingFather
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Re: Cost of car ownership vs. uber / lyft / ride sharing

Post by FoundingFather »

senex wrote: Wed Sep 22, 2021 5:51 pm OP, I've done some partial calculations, and found it to be *highly* idiosyncratic to one's situation.

For instance, I've known people in car-centric locales like suburban Detroit and Southern California who lived years without a car, because their particular neighborhood had shopping & medical within a few blocks.

Conversely, I've known people in Manhattan who rarely walked because the sidewalks were acoustic nightmares that reeked of urine, steaming garbage, and diesel fumes.

If you travel with gear, pets, children (carseats), etc, it can significantly tip the balance in both cost and (even more so) convenience.
+1

My current life situation (long daily commute, frequently on call (physician), 3 kids with 2 still in car seats, etc) would make this a huge increase in cost and hassle compared to what I am doing now. Then again, the fact that I am driving a paid off 2003 Honda Pilot with 420,000 miles that I repair myself probably makes my ratio better than most. 8-)

I am not saying, at all, that the OP's idea is a bad one, but I think that individual circumstances are so varied that this sort of calculation is far more person/family/lifestyle specific than most questions on this forum.

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airborne
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Re: Cost of car ownership vs. uber / lyft / ride sharing

Post by airborne »

senex wrote: Wed Sep 22, 2021 5:51 pm OP, I've done some partial calculations, and found it to be *highly* idiosyncratic to one's situation.

For instance, I've known people in car-centric locales like suburban Detroit and Southern California who lived years without a car, because their particular neighborhood had shopping & medical within a few blocks.

Conversely, I've known people in Manhattan who rarely walked because the sidewalks were acoustic nightmares that reeked of urine, steaming garbage, and diesel fumes.

If you travel with gear, pets, children (carseats), etc, it can significantly tip the balance in both cost and (even more so) convenience.
This is all very true. To find a truly helpful answer, OP would need to talk to someone who is in a similar location/situation/etc to get a good handle on which way is best to go.

I ditched the car years ago in favor of public transport and Uber/Lyft. From September 2016 through end of August 2021 I have spent $10,900 on those transportation costs ($9,300 if you exclude public transport) which works out to $2,180/year or $182/month on average. This is most certainly less than the cost of car ownership would be for me, not to mention eliminating the headaches of ownership. But, as the saying goes--and pardon the pun--your mileage may vary.

No fuel or insurance costs. No car payment. Once you get to your destination, no hunting for street parking or paying for a garage. No driving stress. Some of these are hard to put a dollar value on but can be added to the equation depending on your circumstances.
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Re: Cost of car ownership vs. uber / lyft / ride sharing

Post by randomguy »

tj wrote: Thu Sep 23, 2021 2:53 pm
Unless you can sell your car for what you had purchased it for, I'm not sure the purchase price is relevant. It's a sunk cost.

10 rides a week seems like not much if you don't have a vehicle. Even if I never went out to a restaurant, what about going to the gym?

And what about road trip when going somewhere that flying is not pratical?


I would need to see some serious savings to forego a vehicle, and I just haven't seen it. Uber/Lyft seem a lot less reliable this year, too.
You walk the 5 mins to the gym and count it as part of your warm up. Uber is up around .80-1.00mile. My costs are down <.40 mile. This is all going to be about usage patterns and expenses. If you are driving 2x/week, things like Uber and renting a car are no brainers. If you start doing 4+ drives day (commute to work, kids to activities,...) it makes no sense. If you live an area without a lot of drivers, the inconvenience is high of having to wait for the car. But there are also places where the cost of car ownership is super high. Paying 500+/month for parking really ups your cost of ownership.
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Re: Cost of car ownership vs. uber / lyft / ride sharing

Post by tj »

randomguy wrote: Fri Sep 24, 2021 6:46 pm
tj wrote: Thu Sep 23, 2021 2:53 pm
Unless you can sell your car for what you had purchased it for, I'm not sure the purchase price is relevant. It's a sunk cost.

10 rides a week seems like not much if you don't have a vehicle. Even if I never went out to a restaurant, what about going to the gym?

And what about road trip when going somewhere that flying is not pratical?


I would need to see some serious savings to forego a vehicle, and I just haven't seen it. Uber/Lyft seem a lot less reliable this year, too.
You walk the 5 mins to the gym and count it as part of your warm up. Uber is up around .80-1.00mile. My costs are down <.40 mile. This is all going to be about usage patterns and expenses. If you are driving 2x/week, things like Uber and renting a car are no brainers. If you start doing 4+ drives day (commute to work, kids to activities,...) it makes no sense. If you live an area without a lot of drivers, the inconvenience is high of having to wait for the car. But there are also places where the cost of car ownership is super high. Paying 500+/month for parking really ups your cost of ownership.
If you live a 5 minute walk from a gym, you must live close to a lot of things, and of course you don't need a car.
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Re: Cost of car ownership vs. uber / lyft / ride sharing

Post by cheese_breath »

Convenience, ability to go wherever I want whenever I want is worth the cost. I had to rely on Uber to get between the apartment and DW's nursing home when I was unable to drive due to my broken neck. Had to wait hours one Sunday morning because a driver had forgotten to turn his app off when he went off duty. Don't ask me how, but somehow Uber scheduled him to pick me up while he was in bed sleeping.
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mrmass
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Re: Cost of car ownership vs. uber / lyft / ride sharing

Post by mrmass »

Hey honey let’s order a Lyft and take a ride to the mountains. Me you and the driver. Just the 3 of us :mrgreen:
JackoC
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Re: Cost of car ownership vs. uber / lyft / ride sharing

Post by JackoC »

senex wrote: Wed Sep 22, 2021 5:51 pm OP, I've done some partial calculations, and found it to be *highly* idiosyncratic to one's situation.

For instance, I've known people in car-centric locales like suburban Detroit and Southern California who lived years without a car, because their particular neighborhood had shopping & medical within a few blocks.

Conversely, I've known people in Manhattan who rarely walked because the sidewalks were acoustic nightmares that reeked of urine, steaming garbage, and diesel fumes.

If you travel with gear, pets, children (carseats), etc, it can significantly tip the balance in both cost and (even more so) convenience.
Obviously very idiosyncratic. I like to walk long distances either in Manhattan or where I live in NJ, virtually an annex of Manhattan. Besides Uber/Lyft there are Zipcars parked on street (not usually true in the City though plenty of Zipcar locations there). I can reserve with app, walk two blocks over and get in. But we have two cars actually and while one is quite old the other is brand new and pretty expensive. I like to drive performance cars on long road trips, last trip 7,000 miles on the newer car we just traded in, but its replacement is still on order. So lately we've used Zipcar sometimes when a grown kid needs to borrow the 16 yr old car, which is also just parked on street as close to our house as possible. Zipcar is around $35-40 all in for an outing to shopping locations beyond walking distance (Costco, Asian supermarkets, malls etc.), we can walk to supermarket(s) and various other stores and dozens of restaurants, though still some places we like to eat are drives. At that rate even vs. the 16 yr old car's pretty attractive economics in terms of depreciation, it's still dozens of Zipcar trips per year to match annual cost of the car. But I don't really like the ZC experience, having to look at watch, wife would never consider not having a car for local trips even if I would. And when the new car gets here, while depreciation cost will be far higher and garaged for $3.5k/yr, theoretically in the few 100 Zipcar outings per year range, it will again be used for long trips for most of its miles and enjoyed for its performance: there's no nearly direct substitute in terms of a rental or service.

Given that a very high % of people in the US live in less walking-friendly place than we do, I think car sharing (own driving like Zipcar, somebody else driving like Uber, or self driving at some point perhaps) making major inroads into owning a car depends on attitude differences or changes, besides economics.
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Re: Cost of car ownership vs. uber / lyft / ride sharing

Post by tj »

cheese_breath wrote: Sat Sep 25, 2021 8:03 am Convenience, ability to go wherever I want whenever I want is worth the cost. I had to rely on Uber to get between the apartment and DW's nursing home when I was unable to drive due to my broken neck. Had to wait hours one Sunday morning because a driver had forgotten to turn his app off when he went off duty. Don't ask me how, but somehow Uber scheduled him to pick me up while he was in bed sleeping.
You should have been able to cancel it and roll the dice with someone else.
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Re: Cost of car ownership vs. uber / lyft / ride sharing

Post by SchruteB&B »

runswithscissors wrote: Thu Sep 23, 2021 9:21 am

Personally, I can't wait til self driving and/or remote controlled taxis proliferate. Not having to engage with a driver and having the entire vehicle to myself would make ride sharing much more compelling and attractive for me.
This is something I have encountered now that we live in a major urban area and are using uber etc more often. The drivers I have had the last few times ALL want to engage in what I consider fairly controversial political conversations with me. They just bring things up when I am trying to sit quietly minding my own business in the backseat. I dislike this intensely. We considered briefly getting rid of all of our cars when we moved here but the pandemic changed my mind on that completely. I value my flexibility, convenience and privacy very highly now. Plus, we have found you can not rely on uber at all. You call a car and sometimes it comes within 5 minutes. Other times, the drivers cancel repeatedly or just take forever to arrive. It is impossible to plan around them if you need to allot between 5 and 35 minutes for their arrival. The pricing has become very erratic too. Surge pricing at times that you would never expect it to be.
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Re: Cost of car ownership vs. uber / lyft / ride sharing

Post by cheese_breath »

tj wrote: Sat Sep 25, 2021 1:25 pm
cheese_breath wrote: Sat Sep 25, 2021 8:03 am Convenience, ability to go wherever I want whenever I want is worth the cost. I had to rely on Uber to get between the apartment and DW's nursing home when I was unable to drive due to my broken neck. Had to wait hours one Sunday morning because a driver had forgotten to turn his app off when he went off duty. Don't ask me how, but somehow Uber scheduled him to pick me up while he was in bed sleeping.
You should have been able to cancel it and roll the dice with someone else.
I did after I got tired of waiting and him not answering the messages I sent him. But there weren't many Uber drivers out yet that early Sunday morning, so I had to wait a little more.
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jmw
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Re: Cost of car ownership vs. uber / lyft / ride sharing

Post by jmw »

Prices for ride sharing have gone to the moon. I used to do UberPool/Expresspool where the cost is very low. Now I have to use UberX and the Lyft equivalent. Now I only use Uber/Lyft for emergencies. I don't even consider them a viable non-emergency option when out-of-town. Like someone said, I'm only doing regional trips unless someone is giving me free rides.

Back to car or cheap public transportation, just like before ride sharing existed. Unreliable public transportation (buses) are tolerable now since I can Uber if the bus never shows up or passes me up.
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rocket354
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Re: Cost of car ownership vs. uber / lyft / ride sharing

Post by rocket354 »

My car is 9 years old, Japanese, and paid off. I drive <3000 miles/year. My insurance is $30/month, my gas is anywhere from $15-30/month depending on prices. But once I add in all costs over time (oil changes, tire rotations, batteries, tires, air filters, and a small allocation to repairs even though those haven't been necessary, yet) and add in opportunity cost of the current value of the car not being invested, I come out to an average monthly cost of $275. So I am paying > $1 per mile I drive.

If I lived any closer to an urban area I would not have a car. But I am on the rural/suburban outskirts of a major metropolitan area (40mins to downtown) and so the convenience of a car is worth it to me.

Uber/Lyft are not all they are cracked up to be. Once, I scheduled an Uber pickup a day in advance for 8am to go to the airport. At 8:10am, after waiting anxiously, I get a message that the first driver has cancelled, and they are finding me another driver. That one was estimated to be another 45 minutes until he got there. The Lyft app was not connecting for some reason. I did not want to risk missing my flight, so I just drove my own car and paid for parking the entire time I was away. Issues like that are rare, but missing a flight can be a huge pain.

All told, I am keeping my car for now. But my hope is that by the time it is ready to be replaced (in another 8-10 years, fingers crossed), there are better and more reliable options available so that I do not actually have to replace it--I can just use the existing ride shares/autonomous vehicle network/etc.
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Re: Cost of car ownership vs. uber / lyft / ride sharing

Post by JackoC »

SchruteB&B wrote: Sat Sep 25, 2021 1:42 pm
runswithscissors wrote: Thu Sep 23, 2021 9:21 am

Personally, I can't wait til self driving and/or remote controlled taxis proliferate. Not having to engage with a driver and having the entire vehicle to myself would make ride sharing much more compelling and attractive for me.
This is something I have encountered now that we live in a major urban area and are using uber etc more often. The drivers I have had the last few times ALL want to engage in what I consider fairly controversial political conversations with me. They just bring things up when I am trying to sit quietly minding my own business in the backseat. I dislike this intensely. We considered briefly getting rid of all of our cars when we moved here but the pandemic changed my mind on that completely. I value my flexibility, convenience and privacy very highly now. Plus, we have found you can not rely on uber at all. You call a car and sometimes it comes within 5 minutes. Other times, the drivers cancel repeatedly or just take forever to arrive. It is impossible to plan around them if you need to allot between 5 and 35 minutes for their arrival. The pricing has become very erratic too. Surge pricing at times that you would never expect it to be.
We've only ever used Uber twice (Lyft never), home to Newark Airport, LAX to where our car got trucked so we could drive it around out West and back to NJ without having to drive it all the way out to LA too. It went fine. But our grown kids used to use those service locally more than they do now. One thing I noticed about them and friends is they used it for trips in town, 'walking score=99' type area, 10-20 minute walks I would just walk. The effect was definitely not a save the planet or decongesting one in our town. But the increase in prices has made them cut down a lot.

'As soon as we get self driving taxi fleets' sounds ca. 2018, :happy I think more recently people have realized that's probably not coming for quite awhile. Realistically for the medium term future with human drivers, dealing with them is a major drawback, to me. I've always felt that way, being a native NY'er and riding taxi's was very common here before the ride services became common in less dense areas. I'm not especially sensitive about strangers voicing political opinions I don't agree with, to me it's more just dealing with strangers generally is a mental tax. But some people's lives are brightened up by the opportunity to talk to strangers (it's not always the driver forcing there to be a conversation, sometimes it's the passenger, I've ridden with people like that). People really differ in that respect. In a few cases where I speak a non-English local language taxi drivers are a way for me to warm up at the beginning of a trip and I'll start a conversation. Otherwise taxi's and rideshares have an awkwardness factor to me whether there ends up being a conversation or not.
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Re: Cost of car ownership vs. uber / lyft / ride sharing

Post by calwatch »

JackoC wrote: Sat Sep 25, 2021 4:19 pm 'As soon as we get self driving taxi fleets' sounds ca. 2018, :happy I think more recently people have realized that's probably not coming for quite awhile. Realistically for the medium term future with human drivers, dealing with them is a major drawback, to me. I've always felt that way, being a native NY'er and riding taxi's was very common here before the ride services became common in less dense areas. I'm not especially sensitive about strangers voicing political opinions I don't agree with, to me it's more just dealing with strangers generally is a mental tax. But some people's lives are brightened up by the opportunity to talk to strangers (it's not always the driver forcing there to be a conversation, sometimes it's the passenger, I've ridden with people like that). People really differ in that respect. In a few cases where I speak a non-English local language taxi drivers are a way for me to warm up at the beginning of a trip and I'll start a conversation. Otherwise taxi's and rideshares have an awkwardness factor to me whether there ends up being a conversation or not.
As a sometimes driver I would recommend either putting on headphones or just telling the driver you'd like it quiet. It may seem rude at first but we'll get over it by the next trip.
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Re: Cost of car ownership vs. uber / lyft / ride sharing

Post by hoofaman »

ResearchMed wrote: Wed Sep 22, 2021 5:23 pm
Gryphon wrote: Wed Sep 22, 2021 5:18 pm I can't imagine needing to call for a ride every time I needed to go to the grocery store, or waiting for a driver to show up to take me home while frozen foods melt. I don't care if ownership is more expensive, the convenience & utility are worth the extra cost.
This ^^

It's the convenience, mostly.

And forget surge pricing... what about surge availability!?? That's potentially a huge problem.

Also, whereas neither of us would hesitate to run out to pick up <x> at the corner pharmacy or grocers, we wouldn't ever call an Uber for something like that.

RM
Fair points, but why waste time going to a grocery store or pharmacy yourself in the first place? Why not just have your Rx and grocery order picked and delivered to your house?
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Re: Cost of car ownership vs. uber / lyft / ride sharing

Post by JackoC »

calwatch wrote: Sat Sep 25, 2021 4:38 pm
JackoC wrote: Sat Sep 25, 2021 4:19 pm 'As soon as we get self driving taxi fleets' sounds ca. 2018, :happy I think more recently people have realized that's probably not coming for quite awhile. Realistically for the medium term future with human drivers, dealing with them is a major drawback, to me. I've always felt that way, being a native NY'er and riding taxi's was very common here before the ride services became common in less dense areas. I'm not especially sensitive about strangers voicing political opinions I don't agree with, to me it's more just dealing with strangers generally is a mental tax. But some people's lives are brightened up by the opportunity to talk to strangers (it's not always the driver forcing there to be a conversation, sometimes it's the passenger, I've ridden with people like that). People really differ in that respect. In a few cases where I speak a non-English local language taxi drivers are a way for me to warm up at the beginning of a trip and I'll start a conversation. Otherwise taxi's and rideshares have an awkwardness factor to me whether there ends up being a conversation or not.
As a sometimes driver I would recommend either putting on headphones or just telling the driver you'd like it quiet. It may seem rude at first but we'll get over it by the next trip.
I'd rather just take the subway (again I'm from NY), walk or drive my car. To each his own but I don't enjoy being driven, do it only when necessary.
calvin111
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Re: Cost of car ownership vs. uber / lyft / ride sharing

Post by calvin111 »

Hi,

I actually did it...sold my commute car, it was 10 years old (Sold for approx 10K) and switched to Uber for my regular commute. I was commuting for 10 years with my own car. I was paying close to $500 per month (DMV fees, Insurance, Servicing, Repairs, Tickets, Parking, Car Wash, Gas Cost, etc...) and with depreciation of $2k per year extra. On top of that I was driving long hours, stuck in traffic, spent time finding parking for car and fill up gas. I calculated if my Uber cost is approx 500 per month then I am even or better. I had another family car for shopping and weekend and school drop offs etc. So I switched for my commute to Uber.

I calculated my number of days to office was about 20 days in a month and sometimes I would work from home, or sick day or vacation days, public holidays etc. So average i calculated that I would go to office 15 days in a month = 15*12 = 180 days of Uber. My commute cost for Uber was $15 one way. Many days I was taking my car to a park-n-ride and taking public transport. So total calculated cost was 180 days * 2 ways * $15 per trip = $6000 = $450 per month.

I enjoyed the experience of not driving, not doing car wash, not filling up gas and not finding parking. The cost of Uber was cheaper to owning a car. Plus I got a chauffeur driven service that would pick me up from my door and drop me in front of my office door. There were some restrictions as I would not go out anywhere far from office. Mostly go to office and come back to home. However, this helped me to have a discipline to come home. If I have to go out then I would go on weekends or take personal car later in evening.

Many times, I was taking my car to park-n-ride and take a public transport so i really felt i was wasting my car to just go to park-n-ride.

I personally feel that if you are driving very little and if you can have a discipline then its great using Uber and get rid of your car. Lot of peace of mind and flexibility. And I used to get lot of promotion, discount, deals which would make rides further cheaper.

Then we hit covid and for last 18 months I saved a ton of money by not owning a car. So that was really nice bonus of not owning a car.

It is worth exploring this model of using Uber for your commute (but should have atleast one personal/family car)
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Re: Cost of car ownership vs. uber / lyft / ride sharing

Post by runswithscissors »

H-Town wrote: Thu Sep 23, 2021 9:46 am
runswithscissors wrote: Thu Sep 23, 2021 9:21 am

Personally, I can't wait til self driving and/or remote controlled taxis proliferate. Not having to engage with a driver and having the entire vehicle to myself would make ride sharing much more compelling and attractive for me. I could see commercial fleets of these operating within the next 5 years in many urban centers. I don't think fully self driving taxis will be here within 5 years but hybrid self driving and remote controlled (when needed) vehicles are already operating on roads today. These will be a game changer IMO and make many more people ditch their cars.
Can you look up the statistics and youtube video of crashes caused by self-driving cars?

There is only one thing I don't trust: a computer that drives your car.
Waymo has been operating self driving taxis for years and their driving record is impeccable. There wasn't a single accident that was caused by the Waymo vehicle but they were involved in accidents caused by others (e.g. being rear ended, sideswiped, etc). I also don't believe we will have truly self driving cars (level 5) in at least the next 10-15 years. Maybe 20 or more. But my guess is very soon (2-3 years) commercial taxi fleets will be driven by remote drivers no different than Waymo is doing today but with much more involvement with the remote driver. Remote drivers will have full control of vehicles and will engage whenever it's necessary. For example when they are looking to pick up a passenger or when they are dropping off a passenger. Or when they enter an area known to be challenging for autonomous vehicles (e.g. construction zones, etc). The passenger can also engage with a remote driver as needed by pressing a call button. Current camera and visualization technology allows any remote driver to be "sitting" in the driver's seat even if they are not.

If companies like waymo can safely get the remote driver participation time down to 5% they have effectively reduced the labor component by 95%, drastically reducing the cost of taxi rates. Also having remote drivers will be much less costly than having real physical drivers. Imagine hundreds of them working in a call center type building with virtual driving stations.

Regulators would be far more open to allowing remote control drivers than a fully computer controlled vehicle. They also reduce much of the anxiety for those including yourself.

Everyone talks about (fully) autonomous driving as being the big disruptor. I disagree and see remote control driving coupled with autonomous capability as being the real big disruptor. I would think Tesla is planning on something similar for their robotaxi fleet as their self driving capability is weak at best. This could bridge the potential multi decade gap before true level 5 taxis. This would make sense because they are focusing heavy on cameras which have limitations but can be the most important component for human remote driving.

If companies go with this "baby step" approach I think the popularity of ride hailing service would skyrocket.
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