Thinking of buying a boat during pandemic – am I CRAZY?

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SomedaySoon
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Thinking of buying a boat during pandemic – am I CRAZY?

Post by SomedaySoon »

My wife and I have been going back and forth on purchasing a boat. We recently bought a new lakeside house, and I have been wanting a boat for a *long long* time. Am I crazy to think about this given the current economic climate? The boat I’m looking at is listed at 65k, and I’ve been going back and forth on this endlessly.

More details - we have been in progress of remodeling our new house – looking at 50k to finish the remodel, with a potential further kitchen remodel in the fall (150k).

Pros: Life is short, kids growing up. Wanted this for a long time. My projections say I can afford it.
Cons: RECESSION! Given meta-uncertainty plus remodel, isn’t it better to wait until next year?

Other options – smaller boat (with no bathroom),or buy with financing.

Details on my financial situation below:

Senior manager at a mega-tech. Job appears to be stable (of course there’s uncertainty everywhere).
Salary: ~1.2 Million annual. ( 280k base, 150-200k bonus, ~650 k stock that vests over 5 years).
I’m expecting a $140k bonus in September, plus a vesting of $350k stock (post tax) through Sep/Nov.

Fincancial Assets
Vanguard/eTrade/Betterment: 4.05 Million.
Cash : 605k.

Assets
House 1: Value- 2.5 million. Remaining loan balance: 740k.
House 2: Value – 800k, Remaining loan balance: 180k. (House 2 also rents for approx 25k a year, although I'm not expecting much this year).

In general I have been contributing 350k yearly to investment accounts, and 60-80k on paying off principal on loans. My plan is to retire in 5 years, with a projected spend of 200k year. I normally keep 200-300k cash on hand, although this is higher right now due to the pandemic, plus our remodel.

I didn’t want to make this into a portfolio review so appreciate everyone’s focus on the “boat” question. :D

Thanks
Lalamimi
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Re: Thinking of buying a boat during pandemic – am I CRAZY?

Post by Lalamimi »

Buy the boat. Make a salesman very happy.
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Watty
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Re: Thinking of buying a boat during pandemic – am I CRAZY?

Post by Watty »

am I CRAZY?

The boat I’m looking at is listed at 65k,....

I did not add it all up but you have a net worth of something like $8 million dollars and you are saving around $400K a year including paying down debt early.

The boat will also have significant ongoing costs but you can so easily afford it it doesn't really matter if you are crazy or not since it will barely make a blip in your financial situation.

The only things I would consider are;

1) Is this boat in addition to things like expensive sports cars, RV's, expensive luxury travel, jewelry, etc. You can easily afford anything you want but not everything you might want.

2) Do you have the skills to operate the boat safely even when the weather suddenly turns bad or you are unexpectedly operating it at night because of a delay? There might be a significant learning curve to upgrade your skills so that should be part of your plan. If you don't have a lot of boating experience then it might make sense to learn on a simpler less powerful boat for a year before you buy one where you might be in over your head.

3) Do you have enough time to make it worthwhile? Even if you hire people to do work on it the mechanics of keeping the boat running will still take a lot of time. If you end up spending more time dealing with it than playing with it that might not work out.

4) Are you going to tow the boat anywhere? If so be sure to budget to buy a vehicle that can do that.
Last edited by Watty on Sat May 16, 2020 5:49 pm, edited 2 times in total.
magicrat
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Re: Thinking of buying a boat during pandemic – am I CRAZY?

Post by magicrat »

What kind of boat! Just curious
magicrat
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Re: Thinking of buying a boat during pandemic – am I CRAZY?

Post by magicrat »

What kind of boat! Just curious
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FIREchief
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Re: Thinking of buying a boat during pandemic – am I CRAZY?

Post by FIREchief »

SomedaySoon wrote: Sat May 16, 2020 4:57 pm We recently bought a new lakeside house, and I have been wanting a boat for a *long long* time. Am I crazy to think about this given the current economic climate? The boat I’m looking at is listed at 65k, and I’ve been going back and forth on this endlessly.
I've never owned a boat and no absolutely nothing (I can prove it!). That said, if you have a lakeside house, couldn't you make due with a much simpler boat? Put around the lake all morning but go back home for lunch, to use the restroom, refresh the cooler, etc? I would think a $65K boat would include a lot of crap that you don't need if you live just around the lake. Kind of like the guy who buys a Corvette to commute to work (I've known several :P )
I am not a lawyer, accountant or financial advisor. Any advice or suggestions that I may provide shall be considered for entertainment purposes only.
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Helo80
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Re: Thinking of buying a boat during pandemic – am I CRAZY?

Post by Helo80 »

Generally buying a boat is a bad idea, and the saying I've heard is: The best two days of a boat owners life are the day he buys the boat, and the day he sells the boat.

That being said, as long as you don't buy anything too extravagant, it shouldn't make a hill of beans difference in the long run for you.
Thank God for Wall Street Bets.
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Helo80
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Re: Thinking of buying a boat during pandemic – am I CRAZY?

Post by Helo80 »

SomedaySoon wrote: Sat May 16, 2020 4:57 pm The boat I’m looking at is listed at 65k, and I’ve been going back and forth on this endlessly.
You can easily afford it.

The other option is to join a boat club and if you find yourself using it constantly, then go buy a boat for yourself. Or, hopefully you know that this $65k boat is going to fit all of your and your family's needs/wants.
Thank God for Wall Street Bets.
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sergeant
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Re: Thinking of buying a boat during pandemic – am I CRAZY?

Post by sergeant »

Enjoy your 65k boat. You have my approval. You just might get a really great deal too.
AA- 20+ Years of Expenses Fixed Income/The remainder in Equities.
Poorman
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Re: Thinking of buying a boat during pandemic – am I CRAZY?

Post by Poorman »

To each their own. You can afford to try out a new hobbie.
livesoft
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Re: Thinking of buying a boat during pandemic – am I CRAZY?

Post by livesoft »

The boat is cheap. It is the boat house, the dock with its electric lifts, the boardwalk down to the dock, winter storage, and all the peripherals that are expensive.

I have a few relatives in the boat building business, so get the boat.
Last edited by livesoft on Sat May 16, 2020 5:45 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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jibantik
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Re: Thinking of buying a boat during pandemic – am I CRAZY?

Post by jibantik »

It will be the happiest day of your life until you sell it. Enjoy!
aaronjb_ME
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Re: Thinking of buying a boat during pandemic – am I CRAZY?

Post by aaronjb_ME »

Is this a net worth/asset humblebrag disguised as a question about a luxury purchase that it's clear you can, without doing any math at all, afford?

I really like that the boat is a very reasonable price, by just about any standards (even Boglehead ones): "$65k". There's literally no discussion to be had here, even factoring in maintenance, associated costs such as mooring fees, and storage.

Some people in your situation buy boats that cost hundreds of thousands of dollars, and if they mange to not go bankrupt, you probably won't either.
Woodshark
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Re: Thinking of buying a boat during pandemic – am I CRAZY?

Post by Woodshark »

We live (retired) at our lakehouse and own a (smaller) boat. Here are a few truths for you.

1. Unless you hire it out, you will spend more hours cleaning and maintaining a boat then you will using it.
2. The people who use their boats the most are people who DO NOT live on the water. Once you've lived on the water for awhile, you're get pretty happy with just access to the water from you dock. Not to mention access to the kitchen, bathroom, etc. The desire to take the boat out greatly declines.
2a. 90% of the boats out there get used less than 14 days a year. It's usually cheaper to rent or be in a club.
3. There is always something needing done to a boat. New or used doesn't matter.
4. On the right day with the right weather, there is nothing finer than being on a boat.
sd323232
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Re: Thinking of buying a boat during pandemic – am I CRAZY?

Post by sd323232 »

buy the boat, this will be good for our economy.
RadAudit
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Re: Thinking of buying a boat during pandemic – am I CRAZY?

Post by RadAudit »

Helo80 wrote: Sat May 16, 2020 5:33 pm The other option is to join a boat club and if you find yourself using it constantly, then go buy a boat for yourself.
How much time do you spend on boats now? One observation - rent your fantasizes.
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Katietsu
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Re: Thinking of buying a boat during pandemic – am I CRAZY?

Post by Katietsu »

I am with the you can afford whatever you want just not everything you might see. From a personal observation point of view, if lakeside means Lake Superior or Lake Tahoe kind of venue then a $65k boat might be appropriate. Having lived on a smallish lake, I do not understand the boat owner’s that whiz by you at high speed multiple times a day as they drive back and forth. I also get nauseous as I calculate the amount of fuel they are burning from both a cost and climate change point of view when an engine with a third the horsepower would be more appropriate, IMO.

I do wonder about your retirement plans though. You seem to be describing a lifestyle that would be hard to maintain on $200k a year. You also seem to be expecting your salary and the value of your investments to continue to rise. Being about five years from retirement myself, I feel that I need to be prepared for incoming cashflow to end tomorrow, be it for a personal reason, eg health of myself or spouse, or a global reason, eg severe economic downturn or worsening pandemic. You obviously are not going to need to worry about being homeless and hungry no matter what, but you could end up needing to dial back it seems.
mortfree
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Re: Thinking of buying a boat during pandemic – am I CRAZY?

Post by mortfree »

It’s probably a violation to not have a boat if you have a lake house.
dukeblue219
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Re: Thinking of buying a boat during pandemic – am I CRAZY?

Post by dukeblue219 »

Buy the boat. Buy some fun toys for the lake. You can't take the money with you and you only have so long to enjoy it!
buhlaxtus
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Re: Thinking of buying a boat during pandemic – am I CRAZY?

Post by buhlaxtus »

Consider donating $65k to a cause who can make better use of it than you. If that doesn't work for you, buy the boat. This is not a serious dilemma.
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AerialWombat
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Re: Thinking of buying a boat during pandemic – am I CRAZY?

Post by AerialWombat »

.....
Last edited by AerialWombat on Sun May 17, 2020 2:09 pm, edited 1 time in total.
For entertainment purposes only.
RiotAct
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Re: Thinking of buying a boat during pandemic – am I CRAZY?

Post by RiotAct »

I think you can just afford it, might have to do rice and beans for a couple years though.
inbox788
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Re: Thinking of buying a boat during pandemic – am I CRAZY?

Post by inbox788 »

SomedaySoon wrote: Sat May 16, 2020 4:57 pm My wife and I have been going back and forth on purchasing a boat. We recently bought a new lakeside house, and I have been wanting a boat for a *long long* time....
Other options – smaller boat (with no bathroom),or buy with financing.
Yes, buy the boat or a boat or two. Or maybe add a couple of jet skis. How big is the lake? Bathroom is definitely useful on longer trips.

What size/length? Make/model? for both boats you're considering

What type of boat?
https://www.godownsize.com/average-boat-prices/

Does the $65k boat have a galley and how many does it sleep?

What kind of boat might depend on what kinds of activities you're looking to do. Fishing, jet skiing, or parting? Day trips or overnight?

Pontoon Boat Recommendations?
viewtopic.php?t=287368
Last edited by inbox788 on Sat May 16, 2020 6:42 pm, edited 1 time in total.
MWONE
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Re: Thinking of buying a boat during pandemic – am I CRAZY?

Post by MWONE »

That's a tough one. I think you are exceeding your boat budget and should consider a kayak.
mslaw
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Re: Thinking of buying a boat during pandemic – am I CRAZY?

Post by mslaw »

Absolutely love boats. Own a small navy. However, we don’t have pets. Similar commitment, in some ways.

Bought my first boat for $110 and I still own it. So consider starting with small, non motorized boats and working up. Boat insurance usually requires some prior experience.

At this point, I own an embarrassing number of boats. However, they definitely enrich my life, regardless of the financial commitment. Present big boat is better than I imagined. Literally opens up the world.
SethJane42
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Re: Thinking of buying a boat during pandemic – am I CRAZY?

Post by SethJane42 »

Deleted--I was wrong
Last edited by SethJane42 on Mon Jun 08, 2020 7:01 am, edited 1 time in total.
Scatterbrain
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Re: Thinking of buying a boat during pandemic – am I CRAZY?

Post by Scatterbrain »

Buy the boat. Have fun.
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mrspock
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Re: Thinking of buying a boat during pandemic – am I CRAZY?

Post by mrspock »

Buy one... I only ask it’s from a company in the s&p 500. We have earnings to pump up! :D
Van
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Re: Thinking of buying a boat during pandemic – am I CRAZY?

Post by Van »

It will be the second happiest day of your life.
basspond
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Re: Thinking of buying a boat during pandemic – am I CRAZY?

Post by basspond »

We have a boat we use for both fishing and skiing. We also just take it out for a spin and some of our best times have pulling up to a bar or restaurant and enjoying the atmosphere. Have fun.
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SomedaySoon
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Re: Thinking of buying a boat during pandemic – am I CRAZY?

Post by SomedaySoon »

Thanks all ! FWIW - I am in a boat club and have been the past few years. It's been good but has drawbacks -- namely you need to reserve ahead of time and you can never be spontaneous about just taking it out for a spin. The boat club has made me want to be an owner even more.

It is good food for thought if I need that much boat. The main thing driving the price is a desire for a marine head.

Thanks again all...
aristotelian
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Re: Thinking of buying a boat during pandemic – am I CRAZY?

Post by aristotelian »

Sure, you can afford it. Personally, someone could offer me a boat for free and I wouldn't want it.
TIAX
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Re: Thinking of buying a boat during pandemic – am I CRAZY?

Post by TIAX »

Why are you still working and buy the boat.
tim1999
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Re: Thinking of buying a boat during pandemic – am I CRAZY?

Post by tim1999 »

I don't even know why you needed to ask us with that income and asset level compared to the price of the boat. Buy the boat if it's what you want. An equivalent comparison would be like me asking if I could buy a good quality new riding lawn mower, and I'm not exactly broke myself.
IMO
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Re: Thinking of buying a boat during pandemic – am I CRAZY?

Post by IMO »

You make 1.2 million per year and you have a lakeside home and you have children and your looking at a 65K boat which is relatively inexpensive when it comes to something like the current model wakeboard boats.

What does/doesn't a pandemic with self-infected recession have to do with your decision.
I got a boat at a steal of a deal during the last recession.

You'll get a great deal of "Bust out another thousand", "best day is the day you sell it" comments on this forum like it's some kind of original never before heard saying. But, buy a 75K car that is a fortune for basic maintenance once it's out of it's 1st 3 yr's, that's all good.

Buy the boat. Enjoy, you kids will only be young once.
bltn
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Re: Thinking of buying a boat during pandemic – am I CRAZY?

Post by bltn »

Katietsu wrote: Sat May 16, 2020 6:07 pm I am with the you can afford whatever you want just not everything you might see. From a personal observation point of view, if lakeside means Lake Superior or Lake Tahoe kind of venue then a $65k boat might be appropriate. Having lived on a smallish lake, I do not understand the boat owner’s that whiz by you at high speed multiple times a day as they drive back and forth. I also get nauseous as I calculate the amount of fuel they are burning from both a cost and climate change point of view when an engine with a third the horsepower would be more appropriate, IMO.

I do wonder about your retirement plans though. You seem to be describing a lifestyle that would be hard to maintain on $200k a year. You also seem to be expecting your salary and the value of your investments to continue to rise. Being about five years from retirement myself, I feel that I need to be prepared for incoming cashflow to end tomorrow, be it for a personal reason, eg health of myself or spouse, or a global reason, eg severe economic downturn or worsening pandemic. You obviously are not going to need to worry about being homeless and hungry no matter what, but you could end up needing to dial back it seems.
The overwhelming consensus is that you re rich and can afford a 65,000 boat.
But you re telling us that you get about 450,000 a year in salary and bonuses, and spend 200,000 a year , that tells me you are frugal.
People think that having almost 2,500,000 tied up in houses worth 3,500,000 means one is rich. Actually the more one has in residence value, the more one has in residence expense, and the more money one needs to maintain the lifestyle. With all the lake house remodeling, it sounds as though rentals may be a thing of the past. The boat maintenance will add considerably to your budget.

In your position, I would also be thinking about the long term effect of the pandemic on the economy. The stock market may take more than five years to start making investments pay. The bond market, with the current interest rates, doesn't t seem to have a rosy outlook for the near future. Your personal real estate investment may or may not do well, but the only way to capitalize on any good fortune in this area is to liquidate or rent.

I agree with Katiesu, that maintaining two nice houses and a big boat, and educating children on a budget of 200,000 a year may be a bit tight. Before the boat expense. There is a significant chance that in 5 years you may decide you don t want to retire.

I might consider a smaller boat for now. But I also am frugal. Most would buy the boat, as noted above.
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cchrissyy
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Re: Thinking of buying a boat during pandemic – am I CRAZY?

Post by cchrissyy »

do you think now that you live on the lake and can see the water from your patio or deck or whatever, you might lose some of the desire to be actually on the water?

also, do you think the tradeoff of owning vs renting the boat will actually be more convenient? it sounds like renting is a hassle because of the reservation system but owning means you have to organize all the maintenance, and there will still be times when your boat is not available for a spontaneous outing.
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TxAg
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Re: Thinking of buying a boat during pandemic – am I CRAZY?

Post by TxAg »

You can afford the boat plus two jet skis. Stimulate the economy :sharebeer
Andymoler58
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Re: Thinking of buying a boat during pandemic – am I CRAZY?

Post by Andymoler58 »

I just bought a new cobalt 220s for 65k and I have far less in assets, I’m 37.

It seems like a good hobby and good way to meet people.

I figure I’ll keep it for a while. Boat sales are going crazy right now, check Mbuu stock
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ClevrChico
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Re: Thinking of buying a boat during pandemic – am I CRAZY?

Post by ClevrChico »

Go for it. You can always sell it when you're ready.

It's cheaper than an airplane, right? 🙂
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ClevrChico
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Re: Thinking of buying a boat during pandemic – am I CRAZY?

Post by ClevrChico »

Duplicate
travelspot
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Re: Thinking of buying a boat during pandemic – am I CRAZY?

Post by travelspot »

Yes you should do this. Boats are great. You have a seven figure income and a house on a lake. You can certainly afford it. Don’t worry about the money. The memories you will make with your family will be worth it.

We had the boat itch like you do. Scratch it! We bought a used boat (with a cabin/head) in great condition, and had it for eight years while the kids were growing up. Sold it, have great memories and no regrets.
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tibbitts
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Re: Thinking of buying a boat during pandemic – am I CRAZY?

Post by tibbitts »

I would buy a boat but am not familiar with models or costs. Being familiar with both a house on a lake and a boat, the boat is really a necessity in that situation. The size of boat you'd want depends on the size of the lake.
JD2775
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Re: Thinking of buying a boat during pandemic – am I CRAZY?

Post by JD2775 »

aaronjb_ME wrote: Sat May 16, 2020 5:56 pm Is this a net worth/asset humblebrag disguised as a question about a luxury purchase that it's clear you can, without doing any math at all, afford?
That would actually be pretty funny. I don’t think the OP meant it in that way, but it would be funny if they did
Teague
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Re: Thinking of buying a boat during pandemic – am I CRAZY?

Post by Teague »

Might want to double check that your lakes are open, most of ours are closed at this point.
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Re: Thinking of buying a boat during pandemic – am I CRAZY?

Post by Pacific »

SomedaySoon wrote: Sat May 16, 2020 4:57 pm My wife and I have been going back and forth on purchasing a boat. We recently bought a new lakeside house, and I have been wanting a boat for a *long long* time. Am I crazy to think about this given the current economic climate? The boat I’m looking at is listed at 65k, and I’ve been going back and forth on this endlessly.
That's a no brainer.

The more important question is can you afford the Cirrus to fly you to the lakeside house?
vested1
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Re: Thinking of buying a boat during pandemic – am I CRAZY?

Post by vested1 »

inbox788 wrote: Sat May 16, 2020 6:38 pm
Pontoon Boat Recommendations?
viewtopic.php?t=287368
Thanks for the reminder. Just updated.
Prodiver
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Re: Thinking of buying a boat during pandemic – am I CRAZY?

Post by Prodiver »

I’ve been a boater all my life.

Same net worth, business owner, almost 70 yo. Owned about 10 boats...

Bought a 90k pontoon 18 months ago with a porta potty to keep the women happy.

Now, have decided to sell it, buy a small Boston Whaler for the kids/grandchildren, and buy a $500 k live a board for traveling. Enjoy life.
aaronjb_ME
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Re: Thinking of buying a boat during pandemic – am I CRAZY?

Post by aaronjb_ME »

JD2775 wrote: Sun May 17, 2020 12:50 am
aaronjb_ME wrote: Sat May 16, 2020 5:56 pm Is this a net worth/asset humblebrag disguised as a question about a luxury purchase that it's clear you can, without doing any math at all, afford?
That would actually be pretty funny. I don’t think the OP meant it in that way, but it would be funny if they did
I don't think so either, but it's such an odd thing to ask, especially given the properties OP owns and the assets in total. By writing that post, the OP has port more analysis than is necessary to determine whether a discretionary purchase amounting to about 5.4% of annual gross income, and about 1.5% of total stated net worth.

As someone else said in a different way, owning a lake house without a boat is like owning a car without wheels.
newyorker
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Re: Thinking of buying a boat during pandemic – am I CRAZY?

Post by newyorker »

Go for it. Life is short and you are not gonna take extra 65k or any of that 8mil NW to the grave.
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