30 year mortgage under 3%

[1130Super]

How likely are we to see 30 year mortgage rates drop to under 3% without points? It just seems crazy to me where the US 10YR & 30YR are at now, I read an article saying the 10YR could go under 1%

Update: 10 year is at .96% so now what is the chance some Us bonds go to 0% and/or we see a 2.0% 30 year fixed mortgage?

[surfstar]

Not likely
http://www.mortgagenewsdaily.com/report ... age_rates/
http://www.mortgagenewsdaily.com/mortga ... daily.aspx

[gclancer]

I think you’re alluding you the fact that the rule of thumb is that 30 year fixed rate mortgages are typically 2% higher than the 10 year treasury rate. If the 10 year treasury rate drops below 1% I’m not sure why the 30 year fixed rate mortgage wouldn’t follow. On a percentage basis the premium of mortgage rates over the treasury rate continues to rise and treasury rates fall.

[willthrill81]

I don't know how likely a 30 year mortgage under 3% is, but we got a 2.5% 15 year mortgage back in 2013. We kept it only a year before we sold the property though.

[Mr.Chlorine]

We're getting there, but still 25 bps where I live.

Just got quoted a 3.25%, 30 year fixed. It will be my first house, but I told them 20% down so my quote should be for a conventional loan.

[simplesimon]

I locked in a 10/1 ARM at 3% a couple weeks ago for a no-cost refinance and wonder after I close on this if I should be looking again.

[AerialWombat]

If I'm willing to pay $3,000 for the privilege, I can get a 2.75% 30-year fixed on a VA refi right this second. That's from AimLoan.

[stoptothink]

I don't know how likely a 30 year mortgage under 3% is, but we got a 2.5% 15 year mortgage back in 2013. We kept it only a year before we sold the property though.

The broker who sold us our mortgage called last week. We have a 15yr at 3.125% and he said he could probably get us 2.65% right now. Would be great if we weren't a few months from having it paid off.

[whodidntante]

I don't know how likely a 30 year mortgage under 3% is, but we got a 2.5% 15 year mortgage back in 2013. We kept it only a year before we sold the property though.

The broker who sold us our mortgage called last week. We have a 15yr at 3.125% and he said he could probably get us 2.65% right now. Would be great if we weren't a few months from having it paid off.

That's where I am at. My balance remaining is so small that the rate doesn't matter much.

[willthrill81]

I don't know how likely a 30 year mortgage under 3% is, but we got a 2.5% 15 year mortgage back in 2013. We kept it only a year before we sold the property though.

The broker who sold us our mortgage called last week. We have a 15yr at 3.125% and he said he could probably get us 2.65% right now. Would be great if we weren't a few months from having it paid off.

Same. We're actually paying off our 3.375% mortgage tomorrow morning.

[abuss368]

I think you’re alluding you the fact that the rule of thumb is that 30 year fixed rate mortgages are typically 2% higher than the 10 year treasury rate. If the 10 year treasury rate drops below 1% I’m not sure why the 30 year fixed rate mortgage wouldn’t follow. On a percentage basis the premium of mortgage rates over the treasury rate continues to rise and treasury rates fall.

Is there a floor to mortgage rates?

[abuss368]

That's where I am at. My balance remaining is so small that the rate doesn't matter much.

Agreed. At some point it does not make much sense to refinance.

[abuss368]

I locked in a 10/1 ARM at 3% a couple weeks ago for a no-cost refinance and wonder after I close on this if I should be looking again.

How does a 10/1 ARM work exactly?

[1130Super]

I locked in a 10/1 ARM at 3% a couple weeks ago for a no-cost refinance and wonder after I close on this if I should be looking again.

How does a 10/1 ARM work exactly?

Fixed for 10 Years then it’s adjusts to future interest rates usually the prime rate plus a spread

[somekevinguy]

I don't think we're too far off...currently refinancing at 3.125% for a 30 yr fixed at LTV ~86% (physician) jumbo loan without points. Treasury yields are pretty low but still have some room to come down further...

[brianH]

Agreed. At some point it does not make much sense to refinance.

I explored it a few months back (my rate is 4.25%), and the fees in Pennsylvania (title, mostly) just blew out the value. My payback was around 4-5 years, and I only have less than 4 remaining, if I make no more principal payments.

Even if it was slightly better, I'd be less likely to pay more towards principal if I knew I'd be 'losing' money. Maybe throwing the money in the market would be better, but it's funny how those threads have been quieter recently...

[ARoseByAnyOtherName]

If I'm willing to pay $3,000 for the privilege, I can get a 2.75% 30-year fixed on a VA refi right this second. That's from AimLoan.

Jeez if I could get 2.75 for a 30 fixed I would take it in a heartbeat and never think about my mortgage again for the rest of my life.

Well, rest of my life OR if mortgage rates fall below 2.0.

I bought a house early last year and got 4.0% on a 30 year fixed jumbo. I tried real hard for that rate and it was real good at the time. Not so much anymore.... eyeing the refi real hard.

[amindu]

I don't know how likely a 30 year mortgage under 3% is, but we got a 2.5% 15 year mortgage back in 2013. We kept it only a year before we sold the property though.

The broker who sold us our mortgage called last week. We have a 15yr at 3.125% and he said he could probably get us 2.65% right now. Would be great if we weren't a few months from having it paid off.

Hi do you mind sharing the info of your broker, i would be interested if i can get a 15 yr at 2.65%, thanks.

[Cash]

I thought about pulling the trigger on 2.875 with 3 points but decided to wait. I’m currently 3 years in on a 3.375 30 year, so it needs to be 3 or lower to be worth it for me. And I would drag it out to the last day.

[abuss368]

Agreed. At some point it does not make much sense to refinance.

I explored it a few months back (my rate is 4.25%), and the fees in Pennsylvania (title, mostly) just blew out the value. My payback was around 4-5 years, and I only have less than 4 remaining, if I make no more principal payments.

Even if it was slightly better, I'd be less likely to pay more towards principal if I knew I'd be 'losing' money. Maybe throwing the money in the market would be better, but it's funny how those threads have been quieter recently...

And the all stock no bonds threads!

[gclancer]

I think you’re alluding you the fact that the rule of thumb is that 30 year fixed rate mortgages are typically 2% higher than the 10 year treasury rate. If the 10 year treasury rate drops below 1% I’m not sure why the 30 year fixed rate mortgage wouldn’t follow. On a percentage basis the premium of mortgage rates over the treasury rate continues to rise and treasury rates fall.

Is there a floor to mortgage rates?

Is there a floor to 10 year treasuries? The good news is you don’t actually have to know the answer in advance - here’s an old article from The Finance Buff that advocates for doing no cost refinances anytime you’re able to cut your rate: https://thefinancebuff.com/cost-mortgag ... -down.html hard to argue with the rationale in my opinion, all it costs you is your time and effort (and some frustration).

[ArmchairArchitect]

I've always used Zillow's mortgage/refinance marketplace to get tons of customized rate quotes all at once, then sort by APR:
https://www.zillow.com/refinance/#/

Just make sure to pick a company with stellar reviews.

[AlphaLess]

How likely are we to see 30 year mortgage rates drop to under 3% without points? It just seems crazy to me where the US 10YR & 30YR are at now, I read an article saying the 10YR could go under 1%

Looking forward to:
- 10 year going under 1%,
- front of the curve being at zero,
- 30 year being available at below 3%,
- 5x1 ARM being available at 2.5%

It will happen. It is only a matter of time.

Economy (WAS) firing at all cylinders just 2 weeks ago, and interest rates were very low.

Wait until we have a double whammy of recession and a health crisis.

[AerialWombat]

I've always used Zillow's mortgage/refinance marketplace to get tons of customized rate quotes all at once, then sort by APR:
https://www.zillow.com/refinance/#/

Just make sure to pick a company with stellar reviews.

The rates I see here on the Zillow tool are significantly higher than LenderFI, AimLoan, and even the USAA page for the same loan product as shown on Zillow.

[mortfree]

I always like to give info from PSECU as a data point for others.

As of Feb 25, 2020
10-year: 2.625
15-year: 2.75
20-year: 3.125
30-year: 3.25

I am currently 2 years in on a 30-year at 3.875. 200k paid down to 180k with a few extra payments.

Refi would cost 3650 or so.

[silverlitegs]

I always like to give info from PSECU as a data point for others.

As of Feb 25, 2020
10-year: 2.625
15-year: 2.75
20-year: 3.125
30-year: 3.25

I am currently 2 years in on a 30-year at 3.875. 200k paid down to 180k with a few extra payments.

Refi would cost 3650 or so.

PSECU actual rates after everything are almost .25 higher than posted above

[silverlitegs]

I don't know how likely a 30 year mortgage under 3% is, but we got a 2.5% 15 year mortgage back in 2013. We kept it only a year before we sold the property though.

The broker who sold us our mortgage called last week. We have a 15yr at 3.125% and he said he could probably get us 2.65% right now. Would be great if we weren't a few months from having it paid off.

2.65 is the apr?

[Harry Livermore]

I don't know how likely a 30 year mortgage under 3% is, but we got a 2.5% 15 year mortgage back in 2013. We kept it only a year before we sold the property though.

The broker who sold us our mortgage called last week. We have a 15yr at 3.125% and he said he could probably get us 2.65% right now. Would be great if we weren't a few months from having it paid off.

Same. We're actually paying off our 3.375% mortgage tomorrow morning.

Wow, congratulations Will!
We are 1,282 days away from paying off our rental, and 3,017 days away from paying off our residence.
My wife keeps a countdown clock app on her phone... other fun dates: oldest graduates college in 443 days, middle graduates high school in 107 days, youngest graduates high school in 1,581 days.
Sorry, slightly OT.
Cheers

[F150HD]

Sure, point us to under 3% without significant fees loaded on top, thanks.

[60B4E24B]

I was recently quoted 30 year @ 3.25% and 7/1 ARM @ 2.375%. Those are for jumbos in NYC, before relationship discounts.

[9-5 Suited]

I don't know how likely a 30 year mortgage under 3% is, but we got a 2.5% 15 year mortgage back in 2013. We kept it only a year before we sold the property though.

The broker who sold us our mortgage called last week. We have a 15yr at 3.125% and he said he could probably get us 2.65% right now. Would be great if we weren't a few months from having it paid off.

Same. We're actually paying off our 3.375% mortgage tomorrow morning.

Congrats!! Well done.

[jharkin]

I just refinanced to 3.75 a little over a month ago. If it drops under 3% I will refi again even if it costs a couple bucks to do so.

[HobbesMB]

We paid off our mortgage a few months back (14 years early). I almost wish I needed a new mortgage at these kind of rates.

[Abarn]

I always like to give info from PSECU as a data point for others.

As of Feb 25, 2020
10-year: 2.625
15-year: 2.75
20-year: 3.125
30-year: 3.25

I am currently 2 years in on a 30-year at 3.875. 200k paid down to 180k with a few extra payments.

Refi would cost 3650 or so.

I'm in a very similar situation. Currently 2 years into a 30 year at 3.875% and had an offer yesterday to refinance to a 15 year at 2.875%. I'm having a really hard time deciding if I should pull the trigger now or wait and see if rates continue to go down. Does anyone have thoughts in general on waiting to see if rates will continue to fall?

[Quirkz]

I'm in a very similar situation. Currently 2 years into a 30 year at 3.875% and had an offer yesterday to refinance to a 15 year at 2.875%. I'm having a really hard time deciding if I should pull the trigger now or wait and see if rates continue to go down. Does anyone have thoughts in general on waiting to see if rates will continue to fall?

If you're getting a full percentage point off, that seems like a clear win. I don't know if I'd put off saving a dollar over waiting to see if I can get a few more pennies from the deal, at least not too long. How much closer to zero would they have to go for you to feel unhappy with being locked in a 2.875? How upset would be if it bottomed at 2.5% a while later? How upset would you be if it went back up to 3.2%?

[willthrill81]

I don't know how likely a 30 year mortgage under 3% is, but we got a 2.5% 15 year mortgage back in 2013. We kept it only a year before we sold the property though.

The broker who sold us our mortgage called last week. We have a 15yr at 3.125% and he said he could probably get us 2.65% right now. Would be great if we weren't a few months from having it paid off.

Same. We're actually paying off our 3.375% mortgage tomorrow morning.

Wow, congratulations Will!

Congrats!! Well done.

Thanks to you both! It's quite satisfying.

[Ron Ronnerson]

I don't know how likely a 30 year mortgage under 3% is, but we got a 2.5% 15 year mortgage back in 2013. We kept it only a year before we sold the property though.

The broker who sold us our mortgage called last week. We have a 15yr at 3.125% and he said he could probably get us 2.65% right now. Would be great if we weren't a few months from having it paid off.

Same. We're actually paying off our 3.375% mortgage tomorrow morning.

Wow, congratulations Will!

Congrats!! Well done.

Thanks to you both! It's quite satisfying.

Congrats! It’s got to be a great feeling!

[willthrill81]

The broker who sold us our mortgage called last week. We have a 15yr at 3.125% and he said he could probably get us 2.65% right now. Would be great if we weren't a few months from having it paid off.

Same. We're actually paying off our 3.375% mortgage tomorrow morning.

Wow, congratulations Will!

Congrats!! Well done.

Thanks to you both! It's quite satisfying.

Congrats! It’s got to be a great feeling!

Yes, especially with the current uncertainty in the markets.

[mervinj7]

I just refinanced to 3.75 a little over a month ago. If it drops under 3% I will refi again even if it costs a couple bucks to do so.

I'm refinancing from 3.75% down to 3.25% this week with no expenses. With no-cost refinancing (e.g. negative points to cover closing costs), you can keep refinancing down the ladder (unless you are close to finishing off the loan like some folks above).

[LiterallyIronic]

Where are you all finding these insane rates? I'm seeing 3.625% to refinance with my lender (we got 3.875% in 2017), so barely any difference, and that's with paying thousands of dollars to refinance.

[stoptothink]

I don't know how likely a 30 year mortgage under 3% is, but we got a 2.5% 15 year mortgage back in 2013. We kept it only a year before we sold the property though.

The broker who sold us our mortgage called last week. We have a 15yr at 3.125% and he said he could probably get us 2.65% right now. Would be great if we weren't a few months from having it paid off.

2.65 is the apr?

That's what I recall from the 20sec call from our broker a few days ago. I could have heard wrong as I was just waiting for him to finish so I could tell him we are a few months from payoff so a refinance was pointless.

[Admiral]

I have a 15 year fixed at 2.25%, originated in September, 2016.

[softwaregeek]

Message from major bank last night is that they can do 3.00 in exceptional situations. But I am at 808 credit and need 820. This is with relationship mortgage and large asset move, loan officer from megabank.

[jharkin]

I just refinanced to 3.75 a little over a month ago. If it drops under 3% I will refi again even if it costs a couple bucks to do so.

I'm refinancing from 3.75% down to 3.25% this week with no expenses. With no-cost refinancing (e.g. negative points to cover closing costs), you can keep refinancing down the ladder (unless you are close to finishing off the loan like some folks above).

Yep... I just bought a new house and my loan unfortunately falls into that "super conforming" place in between the national conforming limit (510) and the cutoff for a true jumbo in my county (690+ ) where they all change a .25 premium over the best conforming rate offered. I did 4.125 to 3.75 already... right now I dont think I can get better than 3.5 or 3.6 no cost.... If conforming go under 3, I will be able to get 3.25 I think and that will be worthwhile.

[abuss368]

I just refinanced to 3.75 a little over a month ago. If it drops under 3% I will refi again even if it costs a couple bucks to do so.

I'm refinancing from 3.75% down to 3.25% this week with no expenses. With no-cost refinancing (e.g. negative points to cover closing costs), you can keep refinancing down the ladder (unless you are close to finishing off the loan like some folks above).

That is a nice decrease and will result in savings.

[mortfree]

I always like to give info from PSECU as a data point for others.

As of Feb 25, 2020
10-year: 2.625
15-year: 2.75
20-year: 3.125
30-year: 3.25

I am currently 2 years in on a 30-year at 3.875. 200k paid down to 180k with a few extra payments.

Refi would cost 3650 or so.

I'm in a very similar situation. Currently 2 years into a 30 year at 3.875% and had an offer yesterday to refinance to a 15 year at 2.875%. I'm having a really hard time deciding if I should pull the trigger now or wait and see if rates continue to go down. Does anyone have thoughts in general on waiting to see if rates will continue to fall?

I have total analysis paralysis.

Do I do a 15 but then payment will be 260 or so higher?

Do I go back to a 30 and the payment would be 750 or so?

Do I keep what I have and payoff on a 20 year schedule?

The above payments may not match exactly as I was playing around with borrowing 170-175-180k

Age 43

[Admiral]

I always like to give info from PSECU as a data point for others.

As of Feb 25, 2020
10-year: 2.625
15-year: 2.75
20-year: 3.125
30-year: 3.25

I am currently 2 years in on a 30-year at 3.875. 200k paid down to 180k with a few extra payments.

Refi would cost 3650 or so.

I'm in a very similar situation. Currently 2 years into a 30 year at 3.875% and had an offer yesterday to refinance to a 15 year at 2.875%. I'm having a really hard time deciding if I should pull the trigger now or wait and see if rates continue to go down. Does anyone have thoughts in general on waiting to see if rates will continue to fall?

I have total analysis paralysis.

Do I do a 15 but then payment will be 260 or so higher?

Do I go back to a 30 and the payment would be 750 or so?

Do I keep what I have and payoff on a 20 year schedule?

The above payments may not match exactly as I was playing around with borrowing 170-175-180k

Age 43

My advice with mortgages is usually the same: If you can afford it, 15 years is the way to go, hands down. Based on what's above 15 yr looks like the sweet spot to me, more than 1% reduction in your current rate. When do you plan to retire? Do you want a mortgage into your 70s? I didn't.

Only you know your situation: job security, other savings, etc. For me, I went from a 4% 30 year to a 2.25% 15 year. The payments were maybe $300/mo more. Since then our household income has gone up considerably. Only you can answer if this will likely be your situation, if this is your forever home, and so on.

Don't forget, you can always go BACK to a 30 from a 15 if you need to. Not recommended but it is an option. You will be amazed at how fast you pay down principal with a 15. I went from a 30 year loan that was 2/3 interest and 1/3 principal to 2/3 principal to 1/3 interest, overnight. Now 4 years later it's 78% principal, 22% interest. My bond holdings now pay more, monthly, than the loan is costing me.

[unclescrooge]

I locked in a 10/1 ARM at 3% a couple weeks ago for a no-cost refinance and wonder after I close on this if I should be looking again.

Who's the lender?

[mortfree]

I always like to give info from PSECU as a data point for others.

As of Feb 25, 2020
10-year: 2.625
15-year: 2.75
20-year: 3.125
30-year: 3.25

I am currently 2 years in on a 30-year at 3.875. 200k paid down to 180k with a few extra payments.

Refi would cost 3650 or so.

I'm in a very similar situation. Currently 2 years into a 30 year at 3.875% and had an offer yesterday to refinance to a 15 year at 2.875%. I'm having a really hard time deciding if I should pull the trigger now or wait and see if rates continue to go down. Does anyone have thoughts in general on waiting to see if rates will continue to fall?

I have total analysis paralysis.

Do I do a 15 but then payment will be 260 or so higher?

Do I go back to a 30 and the payment would be 750 or so?

Do I keep what I have and payoff on a 20 year schedule?

The above payments may not match exactly as I was playing around with borrowing 170-175-180k

Age 43

My advice with mortgages is usually the same: If you can afford it, 15 years is the way to go, hands down. Based on what's above 15 yr looks like the sweet spot to me, more than 1% reduction in your current rate. When do you plan to retire? Do you want a mortgage into your 70s? I didn't.

Only you know your situation: job security, other savings, etc. For me, I went from a 4% 30 year to a 2.25% 15 year. The payments were maybe $300/mo more. Since then our household income has gone up considerably. Only you can answer if this will likely be your situation, if this is your forever home, and so on.

Don't forget, you can always go BACK to a 30 from a 15 if you need to. Not recommended but it is an option. You will be amazed at how fast you pay down principal with a 15. I went from a 30 year loan that was 2/3 interest and 1/3 principal to 2/3 principal to 1/3 interest, overnight. Now 4 years later it's 78% principal, 22% interest. My bond holdings now pay more, monthly, than the loan is costing me.

Thank you for sharing your thoughts.

I’ve been through the mortgage refi (30 to 15 to 10) and eventual payoff with my previous house so I completely understand what you are saying.

Thanks again.

[mister_sparkle]

I have made literally one payment on my 3.625% 30-year mortgage.

Am I insane for even considering a re-fi?