HMBradley Caution

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Topic Author
L. H.
Posts: 18
Joined: Fri Apr 30, 2021 9:14 pm

HMBradley Caution

Post by L. H. »

I recently decided (after seeing some positive posts on this forum) to set up a HMBradley account in order to get the 3% interest. I got a referral link and went through the application process, then was told that I had to wait while my data was reviewed. After a couple days, I received a reply stating
We're sorry. Unfortunately, we are unable to offer you an account at this time. This can happen for a number of reasons – especially if some of your personal information has recently changed.

Thank you,
HMBradley
Since then, I have been attempting to find out WHY I was denied. My credit history and score is excellent and has been for years, NOTHING has "recently" changed, but it would seem as though it must be something that they found in either a credit report or other financial check that caused this denial, so I want to find out what it is and get any errors resolved.

Per my understanding of the Fair Credit Reporting Act, HMBradley has a duty to notify me of which report(s) were responsible for their decision, but they do not seem interested in following those regulations. My follow-up messages with their support have gotten me only the following response:
Applications are frequently declined, especially if any of your personal information has changed. However, we are unable to share details about our account opening process.
It appears that they aren't following the law in this respect, so I figured I would share this concern in case they also are skimping laws in other areas. I am probably better off not having an account with them.
hachiko
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Joined: Fri Mar 17, 2017 1:56 pm

Re: HMBradley Caution

Post by hachiko »

Pull your chex and ews reports and see if they pulled one or both of those.
exodusNH
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Re: HMBradley Caution

Post by exodusNH »

L. H. wrote: Thu May 13, 2021 11:40 am Per my understanding of the Fair Credit Reporting Act, HMBradley has a duty to notify me of which report(s) were responsible for their decision, but they do not seem interested in following those regulations. My follow-up messages with their support have gotten me only the following response:
Applications are frequently declined, especially if any of your personal information has changed. However, we are unable to share details about our account opening process.
It appears that they aren't following the law in this respect, so I figured I would share this concern in case they also are skimping laws in other areas. I am probably better off not having an account with them.
Let them know you'll be filing a complaint.

https://www.consumerfinance.gov/complaint/
Topic Author
L. H.
Posts: 18
Joined: Fri Apr 30, 2021 9:14 pm

Re: HMBradley Caution

Post by L. H. »

hachiko wrote: Thu May 13, 2021 12:18 pm Pull your chex and ews reports and see if they pulled one or both of those.
Thanks. I've never done that. I've pulled my normal credit reports with Equifax, Experian, & TransUnion, but never ran any other reports. Learning experience here!
exodusNH wrote: Thu May 13, 2021 12:32 pm Let them know you'll be filing a complaint.

https://www.consumerfinance.gov/complaint/
Definitely.
Broken Man 1999
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Location: West coast of Florida, inland on high ground!

Re: HMBradley Caution

Post by Broken Man 1999 »

Interesting issue. I thought the Fair Credit Reporting Act covered those applying for credit.

But OP isn't applying for credit, just trying to open an account.

So would the act cover OP's issue?

Broken Man 1999
“If I cannot drink Bourbon and smoke cigars in Heaven then I shall not go." - Mark Twain
Topic Author
L. H.
Posts: 18
Joined: Fri Apr 30, 2021 9:14 pm

Re: HMBradley Caution

Post by L. H. »

Broken Man 1999 wrote: Thu May 13, 2021 2:44 pm Interesting issue. I thought the Fair Credit Reporting Act covered those applying for credit.

But OP isn't applying for credit, just trying to open an account.

So would the act cover OP's issue?

Broken Man 1999
I'm not sure. I thought it was still covered as any time that they are used for an adverse decision, but it may be a grey area.
This is what the ChexSystems report says:
You must be told if information in your file has been used against you. Anyone who uses a credit report or another type of consumer report to deny your application for credit, insurance, or employment – or to take another adverse action against you – must tell you, and must give you the name, address, and phone number of the agency that provided the information.
I just got the following back from HMBradley in my continuing attempt to find out what the heck is going on:
Thank you for contacting HMBradley support regarding your request for the reasons why we were not able to open a deposit account for you.

HMBradley uses third-party service providers to verify the identity of consumers who apply to open deposit accounts at Hatch Bank. These service providers compare information provided by the applicant against information contained in public and private databases. If the applicant for a deposit account provides information that is not consistent with the information that is available in these public and private databases such that HMBradley cannot confirm the applicant’s identity, HMBradley will not open the deposit account.

Occasionally, there are valid reasons why the information provided by the applicant is not consistent with the information HMBradley uses to verify the applicant’s identity. In those cases, HMBradley may request from the applicant additional documentary evidence to verify the applicant’s identity. However, if the information provided by the applicant and the information from these third-party providers is significantly inconsistent (e.g., name and Social Security number do not match), HMBradley will not request documentary evidence to verify the identity of the applicant and will decline to open the deposit account.

While federal law requires lenders to provide reasons for declining credit accounts, it does not require a lender to provide a reason for declining a deposit account.
So, basically, there is something that is inconsistent between my application and their "third-party service providers" but they won't tell me what it is. Since I know that my finances are sound and that my SS# is correct, it could either be an error in their system or else identity theft. And they don't care and have no intention of helping me find out what is going on. Definitely NOT the level of customer service I'd want to see. Glad to find it out before I had an actual account with them, I guess.

I'm going ahead and doing all the checks that I can (such as ChexSystems as suggested above) and am going to try to figure out whether someone actually has tried to steal my identity or whether HMBradley is just daft. If they all come back clean, I'll try getting an account at another bank and see what happens. :)
exodusNH
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Re: HMBradley Caution

Post by exodusNH »

L. H. wrote: Thu May 13, 2021 4:35 pm I'm going ahead and doing all the checks that I can (such as ChexSystems as suggested above) and am going to try to figure out whether someone actually has tried to steal my identity or whether HMBradley is just daft. If they all come back clean, I'll try getting an account at another bank and see what happens. :)
I'd file the complaint anyway. While I don't see that savings accounts are covered, it seems that being denied a checking account could be considered an adverse action.
Broken Man 1999
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Location: West coast of Florida, inland on high ground!

Re: HMBradley Caution

Post by Broken Man 1999 »

Well, at the least you should continue checking any databases that have your info to make sure they do not have incorrect info that might bite you sometime later.

Good luck in your vetting activities. Time consuming, but important.

Broken Man 1999
“If I cannot drink Bourbon and smoke cigars in Heaven then I shall not go." - Mark Twain
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Duckie
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Re: HMBradley Caution

Post by Duckie »

L. H. wrote: Thu May 13, 2021 4:35 pm So, basically, there is something that is inconsistent between my application and their "third-party service providers" but they won't tell me what it is. Since I know that my finances are sound and that my SS# is correct, it could either be an error in their system or else identity theft. And they don't care and have no intention of helping me find out what is going on.
Is your credit frozen? If the "third-party service providers" can't access your credit reports/scores that may be the problem. I know you're trying to open a bank account not apply for credit, but many banks are now checking credit reports/scores before accepting customers.
Topic Author
L. H.
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Re: HMBradley Caution

Post by L. H. »

Duckie wrote: Thu May 13, 2021 5:36 pm
L. H. wrote: Thu May 13, 2021 4:35 pm So, basically, there is something that is inconsistent between my application and their "third-party service providers" but they won't tell me what it is. Since I know that my finances are sound and that my SS# is correct, it could either be an error in their system or else identity theft. And they don't care and have no intention of helping me find out what is going on.
Is your credit frozen? If the "third-party service providers" can't access your credit reports/scores that may be the problem. I know you're trying to open a bank account not apply for credit, but many banks are now checking credit reports/scores before accepting customers.
Good idea, but no, I don't have any of my credit frozen. Definitely an odd situation, for sure.

I'm wondering if it is actually something simple like if I typed my SS# incorrectly (transposing a digit or something), but if it is something that simple and they don't give me the opportunity to fix, they're still bad customer service for not asking me to verify the information and giving me the chance to fix it.

I once had something like that happen elsewhere, I had accidentally typed my husband's SS# instead of my own, but the place that that happened at just contacted me securely and asked me to verify that they had my information correctly, and it was resolved almost instantly.

I got to a dead end with HMBradley, they now only reply with
Unfortunately, we are unable to share details about our account opening process.

While federal law requires lenders to provide reasons for declining credit accounts, it does not require a lender to provide a reason for declining a deposit account.
I have requested that they simply delete my account and remove all my personal information, we will see if they can even comply with that.
mhop
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Re: HMBradley Caution

Post by mhop »

Each HMBradley response seems well formed on their part. Wouldn’t call that bad customer service, more like you aren’t getting a favorable response you were seeking. If you’ve set off a red flag internally I can see why they don’t want you knowing what that process looks like, a legit scammer could attempt to take that info and bypass that protocol with another account submission.
TetrisCollider
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Re: HMBradley Caution

Post by TetrisCollider »

This happened to me with another online bank - pretty much the same thing. I suggest you don't fret too much about it and move on. There is so much information on you out there that depending on what these institutions actually look at (their internal algorithms), they will consider certain information as the Bible, yet if you knew what they were looking at, you would say that is completely wrong - except they don't know this - they are completely owned by the systems and data that is being supplied to them. Also, NONE of them care about you as a person, they only care about you as a financial source to them and a specific risk factor. You have to take emotions out of the picture - I know it is not easy to do.

Since you are going to dive into getting the information/reports on yourself, I highly suggest getting info not only from ChexSystems, but from LexisNexis. Not many people know that LexisNexis is one of the largest (if not the largest) providers of consumer data to companies.

https://consumer.risk.lexisnexis.com/consumer

Get the report from them - you will be amazed how much data they have on you and how much of that data is actually incorrect. This is how I was able to figure out why the heck I am being asked about a certain address/location (during a bank application) that I have never lived at in my life.

A while ago I stopped fighting the system and decided to learn it to my advantage.
For some reason, people that know nothing, seem to know everything...
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tooluser
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Re: HMBradley Caution

Post by tooluser »

mhop wrote: Thu May 13, 2021 9:43 pm Each HMBradley response seems well formed on their part. Wouldn’t call that bad customer service, more like you aren’t getting a favorable response you were seeking. If you’ve set off a red flag internally I can see why they don’t want you knowing what that process looks like, a legit scammer could attempt to take that info and bypass that protocol with another account submission.
Not at all. This is extremely poor customer service. Every exacting detail should be provided. Why not, unless HMBradley are engaging in illegal activity? They have not stated any scam-like activity is in play on the part of the OP. They are replying to the OP, which indicates they believe the OP is a legitimate applicant. They need to allege an exact description of the issue they have, or they are B.S.'ing their way out of something. No hiding of denials, ever.
hachiko
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Re: HMBradley Caution

Post by hachiko »

For deposit accounts they don't have to tell you necessarily why they declined to open up an account (which is what is different from an application for credit where they are required to provide legitimate reasons), but if they used information in a report from a consumer reporting company to deny you're account they are required to tell you which consumer reporting company they pulled from and give you information on contacting them/obtaining a report from them. As a matter of course, most banks provide you with contact information of all consumer reporting companies they pull from if they take adverse action, but I suppose it may not technically be illegal if they obtain a report, but deny you for some reason separate from the information in the report.

There are verification systems where they do not obtain a report from such a classified entity, but still deny you, so maybe that's the case here. It's really a grey area if they use something like ID Verify where technically they may not get the report, but ID Verify provides something akin to a risk score and possibly makes the ultimate decision. The two most commonly used companies for bank accounts are chexsystems and EWS. I think sagestream is seeing an increase in use as well. Possibly Innovis too.

On top of all this, banks also have to balance transparency with their federal AML/KYC requirements, so they may be given some additional leeway in terms of the requirement to disclose identity verification methodology.

My suggestion, based on my experiences of getting angry about this kind of stuff, is to just walk away. Maybe file a complaint with the cfpb. But don't spend too much time trying to fight with the bank, as you're not going to get anywhere.

I still recommend you pull the various reports just to see. And tell everyone you know to pull their EWS reports and see what's in there. I don't bank with certain banks anymore at all because of the vast amount of unnecessary information they share with other banks.
mhop
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Re: HMBradley Caution

Post by mhop »

tooluser wrote: Thu May 13, 2021 10:13 pm
mhop wrote: Thu May 13, 2021 9:43 pm Each HMBradley response seems well formed on their part. Wouldn’t call that bad customer service, more like you aren’t getting a favorable response you were seeking. If you’ve set off a red flag internally I can see why they don’t want you knowing what that process looks like, a legit scammer could attempt to take that info and bypass that protocol with another account submission.
Not at all. This is extremely poor customer service. Every exacting detail should be provided. Why not, unless HMBradley are engaging in illegal activity? They have not stated any scam-like activity is in play on the part of the OP. They are replying to the OP, which indicates they believe the OP is a legitimate applicant. They need to allege an exact description of the issue they have, or they are B.S.'ing their way out of something. No hiding of denials, ever.
For one, the OP did not pass a verification. There’s precisely 0% chance you’ll get a reason to the failure if your data doesn’t align with the database precisely because they don’t think you are who you say, despite what they may indicate in a message. At this point you become a fraud risk as you failed their risk management criteria, they aren’t obligated to help you clear that up especially by divulging their process or your particular shortcomings as you aren’t entitled to an account there.

I’ll also add that HMBradley is not a bank. I’m not sure how that affects what they’re “legally supposed to do” in this situation. The bank you’re using here is Hatch and I suspect HMBradley is tapping into their approval process as Hatch is the responsible party from the banking perspective.
Topic Author
L. H.
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Re: HMBradley Caution

Post by L. H. »

Thanks all. As previously posted, I've requested that HMBradley remove my information from their system (delete my account), and I will go on to somewhere else that values me as a person, even if the interest rates are much lower. :) Not worth my time, and obviously they won't help me figure out what is going on anyway.
hachiko wrote: Thu May 13, 2021 10:15 pm I still recommend you pull the various reports just to see. And tell everyone you know to pull their EWS reports and see what's in there. I don't bank with certain banks anymore at all because of the vast amount of unnecessary information they share with other banks.
I pulled my ChexSystems document, but am unfamiliar with EWS. Can you point me in the right direction for that? Thanks!
808
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Re: HMBradley Caution

Post by 808 »

L. H. wrote: Thu May 13, 2021 11:34 pm Thanks all. As previously posted, I've requested that HMBradley remove my information from their system (delete my account), and I will go on to somewhere else that values me as a person, even if the interest rates are much lower. :) Not worth my time, and obviously they won't help me figure out what is going on anyway.
hachiko wrote: Thu May 13, 2021 10:15 pm I still recommend you pull the various reports just to see. And tell everyone you know to pull their EWS reports and see what's in there. I don't bank with certain banks anymore at all because of the vast amount of unnecessary information they share with other banks.
I pulled my ChexSystems document, but am unfamiliar with EWS. Can you point me in the right direction for that? Thanks!
https://www.earlywarning.com/consumer-information
barnaby444
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Re: HMBradley Caution

Post by barnaby444 »

Tweeting at @_HMBradley might get their attention better.
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