Vacation – Turn off water main?

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tibbitts
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Re: Vacation – Turn off water main?

Post by tibbitts »

an00j wrote: Mon Oct 25, 2021 11:57 pm New homeowner. Going on a vacation soon. Is it normal to turn off the water main to the house to mitigate risk of water damage while we are gone?

Anything else I should consider doing?
I turn mine off but the amount of torque required is such that a typical steel t-handle tool bends - a lot - in the process, and I'm a little concerned that the valve might break (and it's a new-ish valve, only a few years old.) I would make sure you have the emergency contact info for dealing with that at hand. If it's your "main" of course you can just shut off your pump and leave the water valves open.
Random Poster
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Re: Vacation – Turn off water main?

Post by Random Poster »

Are you all turning off the main shut off valve that is (usually) in your house, or are you turning off the actual water main that is (usually) near the street?

I thought that the latter was something that only the city/county water department wants to touch.

And when you talk about turning off the water heater, if you have a gas model, can’t you just turn the thermostat on it down and be okay? Mine has an electric start pilot light, but I’d rather not fiddle with it if possible.
Most experiences are better imagined.
ScubaHogg
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Re: Vacation – Turn off water main?

Post by ScubaHogg »

willthrill81 wrote: Tue Oct 26, 2021 11:28 am Yes, we turn off the water main when we go on vacation. I also turn off the water heater.
Is it fine to just turn off the water supply but leave water in the water heater? Or do you need to drain the water heater?

I have no idea, just asking
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neilpilot
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Re: Vacation – Turn off water main?

Post by neilpilot »

ScubaHogg wrote: Tue Oct 26, 2021 12:29 pm
willthrill81 wrote: Tue Oct 26, 2021 11:28 am Yes, we turn off the water main when we go on vacation. I also turn off the water heater.
Is it fine to just turn off the water supply but leave water in the water heater? Or do you need to drain the water heater?

I have no idea, just asking
OK to leave water tank full unless conditions present a freeze risk. Our tanks could easily freeze if left for an extended time during the winter.
ScubaHogg
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Re: Vacation – Turn off water main?

Post by ScubaHogg »

neilpilot wrote: Tue Oct 26, 2021 12:35 pm
ScubaHogg wrote: Tue Oct 26, 2021 12:29 pm
willthrill81 wrote: Tue Oct 26, 2021 11:28 am Yes, we turn off the water main when we go on vacation. I also turn off the water heater.
Is it fine to just turn off the water supply but leave water in the water heater? Or do you need to drain the water heater?

I have no idea, just asking
OK to leave water tank full unless conditions present a freeze risk. Our tanks could easily freeze if left for an extended time during the winter.
👍
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Slapshot
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Re: Vacation – Turn off water main?

Post by Slapshot »

We live in Mass. and have oil heat with water circulating around the house to baseboard heaters. Would turning off the water at the main shutoff prevent our heat from working? We need to leave it on if we go away in winter.
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shunkman
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Re: Vacation – Turn off water main?

Post by shunkman »

The owners manual for our fridge specifically states that when turning the water supply off the ice maker should be turned off too. I suppose it would keep trying to make ice even while there is no water supply available.
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Doom&Gloom
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Re: Vacation – Turn off water main?

Post by Doom&Gloom »

Random Poster wrote: Tue Oct 26, 2021 12:24 pm Are you all turning off the main shut off valve that is (usually) in your house, or are you turning off the actual water main that is (usually) near the street?

I thought that the latter was something that only the city/county water department wants to touch.

And when you talk about turning off the water heater, if you have a gas model, can’t you just turn the thermostat on it down and be okay? Mine has an electric start pilot light, but I’d rather not fiddle with it if possible.
The meter at the street is the only place I can shut off water to the entire house. Individual valves at toilets, sinks, and water heater (a bear to turn off). I have had a rash (three I can recall) of leaks at/near the meter in the past few years--two on my side, one on the city's side. I have never even lived in a house with another shut-off valve for the entire house.

I don't recall ever cutting off my water or my water heater when leaving home. Riding a lucky streak! *knocks wood*

ETA: I've never heard of any city complaining about the homeowner cutting off the water at the meter.
tibbitts
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Re: Vacation – Turn off water main?

Post by tibbitts »

Doom&Gloom wrote: Tue Oct 26, 2021 12:46 pm
ETA: I've never heard of any city complaining about the homeowner cutting off the water at the meter.
I'm guessing they might complain if I snap their valve/meter off and call them about the resulting gusher while I'm heading to the airport at 5am.
123
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Re: Vacation – Turn off water main?

Post by 123 »

If you turn off the ice-maker you should also empty the reservoir of ice cubes. On some refrigerators there can be more than a gallon of ice cubes in the reservoir. If there is a prolonged power-outage the cubes in the reservoir will melt and you could have significant damage to wood floors. If you empty the ice reservoir you should still keep a couple of fresh cubes in a plastic container in your freezer. When you return check the cubes in the plastic container to ensure that there were no significant power outages while you were gone (spoiled food would re-freeze).
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shunkman
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Re: Vacation – Turn off water main?

Post by shunkman »

Slapshot wrote: Tue Oct 26, 2021 12:42 pm We live in Mass. and have oil heat with water circulating around the house to baseboard heaters. Would turning off the water at the main shutoff prevent our heat from working? We need to leave it on if we go away in winter.
Possibly. Some boiler systems may need to have water added periodically due to a slow leak or seepage. These days I think most systems add water automatically. If the water level falls below a certain point, the boiler should shut off to prevent damage but then also your house would be without heat.
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Doom&Gloom
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Re: Vacation – Turn off water main?

Post by Doom&Gloom »

tibbitts wrote: Tue Oct 26, 2021 1:01 pm
Doom&Gloom wrote: Tue Oct 26, 2021 12:46 pm
ETA: I've never heard of any city complaining about the homeowner cutting off the water at the meter.
I'm guessing they might complain if I snap their valve/meter off and call them about the resulting gusher while I'm heading to the airport at 5am.
They probably wouldn't even want you to know where the meter and valve were :wink:
Random Poster
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Re: Vacation – Turn off water main?

Post by Random Poster »

Doom&Gloom wrote: Tue Oct 26, 2021 12:46 pm
Random Poster wrote: Tue Oct 26, 2021 12:24 pm Are you all turning off the main shut off valve that is (usually) in your house, or are you turning off the actual water main that is (usually) near the street?

I thought that the latter was something that only the city/county water department wants to touch.

And when you talk about turning off the water heater, if you have a gas model, can’t you just turn the thermostat on it down and be okay? Mine has an electric start pilot light, but I’d rather not fiddle with it if possible.
The meter at the street is the only place I can shut off water to the entire house. Individual valves at toilets, sinks, and water heater (a bear to turn off). I have had a rash (three I can recall) of leaks at/near the meter in the past few years--two on my side, one on the city's side. I have never even lived in a house with another shut-off valve for the entire house.

I don't recall ever cutting off my water or my water heater when leaving home. Riding a lucky streak! *knocks wood*

ETA: I've never heard of any city complaining about the homeowner cutting off the water at the meter.
Hmm.

My house has a shut off valve in the garage, by the water heater, that turns off water to everything inside and within the house, but you also have to turn two other valves and unplug a hot water recirculating pump (all of which are also by the water heater) to actually stop the flow of water.

To turn off the irrigation system and to stop water from entering the house, I have to turn off the water main at the street.

To turn off the water main at the street though, you technically need a pentagon shaped socket to open the cover (but you can do it with a pair of pliers if you can grip the screw/bolt correctly), and then you have to stretch out several feet to turn the actual valve. The lack of easy access indicates that the government doesn’t really want me messing with it, plus a plumber I hired recently said that the county doesn’t like for them to open and close it either.
Most experiences are better imagined.
neilpilot
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Re: Vacation – Turn off water main?

Post by neilpilot »

Doom&Gloom wrote: Tue Oct 26, 2021 12:46 pm

The meter at the street is the only place I can shut off water to the entire house. Individual valves at toilets, sinks, and water heater (a bear to turn off). I have had a rash (three I can recall) of leaks at/near the meter in the past few years--two on my side, one on the city's side. I have never even lived in a house with another shut-off valve for the entire house.

I don't recall ever cutting off my water or my water heater when leaving home. Riding a lucky streak! *knocks wood*

ETA: I've never heard of any city complaining about the homeowner cutting off the water at the meter.
I've owned 6 homes, and I've never lived in a house where there wasn't an internal shutoff in addition to the one at the meter.
Random Poster
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Re: Vacation – Turn off water main?

Post by Random Poster »

neilpilot wrote: Tue Oct 26, 2021 12:35 pm
ScubaHogg wrote: Tue Oct 26, 2021 12:29 pm
Is it fine to just turn off the water supply but leave water in the water heater? Or do you need to drain the water heater?

I have no idea, just asking
OK to leave water tank full unless conditions present a freeze risk. Our tanks could easily freeze if left for an extended time during the winter.
If you keep your water heater running (even on vacation mode where it only keeps the water at 80 degrees or whatever), how would you run a freeze risk? I guess if the power went out for several days—if you have an electric heater or, I guess, even if you have a gas heater that requires electricity to fire up the burner?
Most experiences are better imagined.
neilpilot
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Re: Vacation – Turn off water main?

Post by neilpilot »

Random Poster wrote: Tue Oct 26, 2021 2:25 pm
neilpilot wrote: Tue Oct 26, 2021 12:35 pm
ScubaHogg wrote: Tue Oct 26, 2021 12:29 pm
Is it fine to just turn off the water supply but leave water in the water heater? Or do you need to drain the water heater?

I have no idea, just asking
OK to leave water tank full unless conditions present a freeze risk. Our tanks could easily freeze if left for an extended time during the winter.
If you keep your water heater running (even on vacation mode where it only keeps the water at 80 degrees or whatever), how would you run a freeze risk? I guess if the power went out for several days—if you have an electric heater or, I guess, even if you have a gas heater that requires electricity to fire up the burner?
OK, I agree. I was "assuming" that he was asking about leaving the water tank full, with both water feed and heat to the tank off.

BTW our 2 tanks are in the attic, so HVAC heat to our home would not in itself save our tanks from freezing.
hoofaman
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Re: Vacation – Turn off water main?

Post by hoofaman »

Ive always shutoff water at the meter, we have a valve on the main waterline inside our house too but shutting it off at the street behind the meter always seemed safer. Others are mentioning that water municipality doesnt like that, Ive never considered they would have an issue with it,
Californiastate
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Re: Vacation – Turn off water main?

Post by Californiastate »

neilpilot wrote: Tue Oct 26, 2021 2:21 pm
Doom&Gloom wrote: Tue Oct 26, 2021 12:46 pm

The meter at the street is the only place I can shut off water to the entire house. Individual valves at toilets, sinks, and water heater (a bear to turn off). I have had a rash (three I can recall) of leaks at/near the meter in the past few years--two on my side, one on the city's side. I have never even lived in a house with another shut-off valve for the entire house.

I don't recall ever cutting off my water or my water heater when leaving home. Riding a lucky streak! *knocks wood*

ETA: I've never heard of any city complaining about the homeowner cutting off the water at the meter.
I've owned 6 homes, and I've never lived in a house where there wasn't an internal shutoff in addition to the one at the meter.
Building shut off valves are notoriously terrible at permanent positive shutoff. Mine is toast but luckily it's toast fully open. I've installed high spec building gate valves. Most aren't. Stems break and gates erode if not fully opened. Meter stops usually work pretty good.
neilpilot
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Re: Vacation – Turn off water main?

Post by neilpilot »

Californiastate wrote: Tue Oct 26, 2021 2:56 pm
neilpilot wrote: Tue Oct 26, 2021 2:21 pm
Doom&Gloom wrote: Tue Oct 26, 2021 12:46 pm

The meter at the street is the only place I can shut off water to the entire house. Individual valves at toilets, sinks, and water heater (a bear to turn off). I have had a rash (three I can recall) of leaks at/near the meter in the past few years--two on my side, one on the city's side. I have never even lived in a house with another shut-off valve for the entire house.

I don't recall ever cutting off my water or my water heater when leaving home. Riding a lucky streak! *knocks wood*

ETA: I've never heard of any city complaining about the homeowner cutting off the water at the meter.
I've owned 6 homes, and I've never lived in a house where there wasn't an internal shutoff in addition to the one at the meter.
Building shut off valves are notoriously terrible at permanent positive shutoff. Mine is toast but luckily it's toast fully open. I've installed high spec building gate valves. Most aren't. Stems break and gates erode if not fully opened. Meter stops usually work pretty good.
That's nice. So maybe I've been lucky, since starting with my first home in 1975 I can't recall any issues with a shutoff valve.

IIRC all or most of my shutoffs were gate valves. I know enough about valves (retired ChE) to exercise annually if unused along with a dab of grease, and to fully open when in the normal position.
Californiastate
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Re: Vacation – Turn off water main?

Post by Californiastate »

neilpilot wrote: Tue Oct 26, 2021 3:06 pm
Californiastate wrote: Tue Oct 26, 2021 2:56 pm
neilpilot wrote: Tue Oct 26, 2021 2:21 pm
Doom&Gloom wrote: Tue Oct 26, 2021 12:46 pm

The meter at the street is the only place I can shut off water to the entire house. Individual valves at toilets, sinks, and water heater (a bear to turn off). I have had a rash (three I can recall) of leaks at/near the meter in the past few years--two on my side, one on the city's side. I have never even lived in a house with another shut-off valve for the entire house.

I don't recall ever cutting off my water or my water heater when leaving home. Riding a lucky streak! *knocks wood*

ETA: I've never heard of any city complaining about the homeowner cutting off the water at the meter.
I've owned 6 homes, and I've never lived in a house where there wasn't an internal shutoff in addition to the one at the meter.
Building shut off valves are notoriously terrible at permanent positive shutoff. Mine is toast but luckily it's toast fully open. I've installed high spec building gate valves. Most aren't. Stems break and gates erode if not fully opened. Meter stops usually work pretty good.
That's nice. So maybe I've been lucky, since starting with my first home in 1975 I can't recall any issues with a shutoff valve.

IIRC all or most of my shutoffs were gate valves. I know enough about valves (retired ChE) to exercise annually if unused along with a dab of grease, and to fully open when in the normal position.
It would be nice if every homeowner did their own preventative maintenance. Kudos on your effort. The vast majority of building shutoff valves I've worked on (thousands) didn't have your TLC. They either don't hold or they fail closed.
For example an average homeowner wants to shut off the water to their home. The are lucky when the stem isn't seized and it turns. Unfortunately their luck stops there. They are able to close the gate valve but it doesn't seal. They tighten it more and it seals a little better. They tighten it more and break the stem. Now the valve is stuck closed and their HD skills have reached their limit. They call a plumber but it's Christmas Eve and there are few responses. I've seen it too many times. Everybody hates to see it except the plumber who is charging golden time.
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an00j
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Re: Vacation – Turn off water main?

Post by an00j »

Californiastate wrote: Tue Oct 26, 2021 3:26 pm
neilpilot wrote: Tue Oct 26, 2021 3:06 pm
Californiastate wrote: Tue Oct 26, 2021 2:56 pm
neilpilot wrote: Tue Oct 26, 2021 2:21 pm
Doom&Gloom wrote: Tue Oct 26, 2021 12:46 pm

The meter at the street is the only place I can shut off water to the entire house. Individual valves at toilets, sinks, and water heater (a bear to turn off). I have had a rash (three I can recall) of leaks at/near the meter in the past few years--two on my side, one on the city's side. I have never even lived in a house with another shut-off valve for the entire house.

I don't recall ever cutting off my water or my water heater when leaving home. Riding a lucky streak! *knocks wood*

ETA: I've never heard of any city complaining about the homeowner cutting off the water at the meter.
I've owned 6 homes, and I've never lived in a house where there wasn't an internal shutoff in addition to the one at the meter.
Building shut off valves are notoriously terrible at permanent positive shutoff. Mine is toast but luckily it's toast fully open. I've installed high spec building gate valves. Most aren't. Stems break and gates erode if not fully opened. Meter stops usually work pretty good.
That's nice. So maybe I've been lucky, since starting with my first home in 1975 I can't recall any issues with a shutoff valve.

IIRC all or most of my shutoffs were gate valves. I know enough about valves (retired ChE) to exercise annually if unused along with a dab of grease, and to fully open when in the normal position.
It would be nice if every homeowner did their own preventative maintenance. Kudos on your effort. The vast majority of building shutoff valves I've worked on (thousands) didn't have your TLC. They either don't hold or they fail closed.
For example an average homeowner wants to shut off the water to their home. The are lucky when the stem isn't seized and it turns. Unfortunately their luck stops there. They are able to close the gate valve but it doesn't seal. They tighten it more and it seals a little better. They tighten it more and break the stem. Now the valve is stuck closed and their HD skills have reached their limit. They call a plumber but it's Christmas Eve and there are few responses. I've seen it too many times. Everybody hates to see it except the plumber who is charging golden time.
I'm struggling to make this anecdotal evidence actionable. Do I just test it out during business hours and try to call a plumber if things go wrong?
Californiastate
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Re: Vacation – Turn off water main?

Post by Californiastate »

an00j wrote: Tue Oct 26, 2021 3:34 pm
Californiastate wrote: Tue Oct 26, 2021 3:26 pm
neilpilot wrote: Tue Oct 26, 2021 3:06 pm
Californiastate wrote: Tue Oct 26, 2021 2:56 pm
neilpilot wrote: Tue Oct 26, 2021 2:21 pm
I've owned 6 homes, and I've never lived in a house where there wasn't an internal shutoff in addition to the one at the meter.
Building shut off valves are notoriously terrible at permanent positive shutoff. Mine is toast but luckily it's toast fully open. I've installed high spec building gate valves. Most aren't. Stems break and gates erode if not fully opened. Meter stops usually work pretty good.
That's nice. So maybe I've been lucky, since starting with my first home in 1975 I can't recall any issues with a shutoff valve.

IIRC all or most of my shutoffs were gate valves. I know enough about valves (retired ChE) to exercise annually if unused along with a dab of grease, and to fully open when in the normal position.
It would be nice if every homeowner did their own preventative maintenance. Kudos on your effort. The vast majority of building shutoff valves I've worked on (thousands) didn't have your TLC. They either don't hold or they fail closed.
For example an average homeowner wants to shut off the water to their home. The are lucky when the stem isn't seized and it turns. Unfortunately their luck stops there. They are able to close the gate valve but it doesn't seal. They tighten it more and it seals a little better. They tighten it more and break the stem. Now the valve is stuck closed and their HD skills have reached their limit. They call a plumber but it's Christmas Eve and there are few responses. I've seen it too many times. Everybody hates to see it except the plumber who is charging golden time.
I'm struggling to make this anecdotal evidence actionable. Do I just test it out during business hours and try to call a plumber if things go wrong?
Hope for the best but plan for the worst.
tibbitts
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Re: Vacation – Turn off water main?

Post by tibbitts »

an00j wrote: Tue Oct 26, 2021 3:34 pm
I'm struggling to make this anecdotal evidence actionable. Do I just test it out during business hours and try to call a plumber if things go wrong?
Yes. Beware that many valve leaks are very gradual and if the valve is in a wall (mine, except for the stem/handle, was behind drywall) you may not notice those leaks immediately.
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an00j
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Re: Vacation – Turn off water main?

Post by an00j »

tibbitts wrote: Tue Oct 26, 2021 3:55 pm
an00j wrote: Tue Oct 26, 2021 3:34 pm
I'm struggling to make this anecdotal evidence actionable. Do I just test it out during business hours and try to call a plumber if things go wrong?
Yes. Beware that many valve leaks are very gradual and if the valve is in a wall (mine, except for the stem/handle, was behind drywall) you may not notice those leaks immediately.
Mine is exposed on an exterior wall at the front of the home. I have turned the valve last year when we diagnosed water hammer issues. So I'm hopeful it's relatively functional.
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Padlin
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Re: Vacation – Turn off water main?

Post by Padlin »

Slapshot wrote: Tue Oct 26, 2021 12:42 pm We live in Mass. and have oil heat with water circulating around the house to baseboard heaters. Would turning off the water at the main shutoff prevent our heat from working? We need to leave it on if we go away in winter.
I live in MA too and have gone away 7 of the last 8 years for 3 months, Jan-Mar. We have an oil boiler for baseboard heat. I turn off the water and leave the heat on at 50 or 55, I forget which. I do shutoff the water where it comes in the house and have never had a problem. Can only protect against so many things.


I do have my son stop in weekly, or so, to check things. I also bought a thermometer that you can set alarms on, it sends me texts via wifi if the temp drops below whatever I have it set for.

You can also get an alarm that watches for water via a floor sensor and the temp. I had one till I got rid of the land line.
Regards | Bob
marcopolo
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Re: Vacation – Turn off water main?

Post by marcopolo »

stormswami wrote: Tue Oct 26, 2021 1:58 am Yes, we turn the water off at the entry point of the house every time we are going to be gone for a couple of days or more. We once had a toilet supply line break. I heard something strange, but couldn't figure out what it was at first. I was at home but thought the running water sound I heard was just the sprinkler outside. But, I finally figured it out and ran into the bathroom to see water gushing. The amount of water and damage done in just ~5 minutes left a BIG impression on me.

I have never thought to do this.
But, do you do this every day you go to work?!?
If it causes that much damage in 5 minutes, it seems the damage probably becomes saturated after a few hours, not sure there would be that much more damage over a weekend/week than over a 10 hour day, except a bigger water bill?
Once in a while you get shown the light, in the strangest of places if you look at it right.
Californiastate
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Re: Vacation – Turn off water main?

Post by Californiastate »

marcopolo wrote: Tue Oct 26, 2021 4:23 pm
stormswami wrote: Tue Oct 26, 2021 1:58 am Yes, we turn the water off at the entry point of the house every time we are going to be gone for a couple of days or more. We once had a toilet supply line break. I heard something strange, but couldn't figure out what it was at first. I was at home but thought the running water sound I heard was just the sprinkler outside. But, I finally figured it out and ran into the bathroom to see water gushing. The amount of water and damage done in just ~5 minutes left a BIG impression on me.

I have never thought to do this.
But, do you do this every day you go to work?!?
If it causes that much damage in 5 minutes, it seems the damage probably becomes saturated after a few hours, not sure there would be that much more damage over a weekend/week than over a 10 hour day, except a bigger water bill?
My brother built some custom homes in ****** Valley. One was set to close on a Monday. The previous Friday, the finishing touches were being complete including setting plumbing fixtures. A improperly installed water closet supply leaked on the 3rd floor. It wasn’t discovered until Monday. The home interior was for all intents and purposes totaled. Needless to say it didn’t close on Monday.
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quantAndHold
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Re: Vacation – Turn off water main?

Post by quantAndHold »

So do none of you people have any landscaping? If we turned off the water anytime we left town, all of our plants would be dead when we got home.

We just have someone check things every couple of days when they come to pick up the mail.
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Metsfan91
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Re: Vacation – Turn off water main?

Post by Metsfan91 »

I have taken many weeks long vacation over the years. The thought of "Turn off water main" never occurred once...This post isn't causing me to have a second thought, for future, either.
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Gary Guss
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Re: Vacation – Turn off water main?

Post by Gary Guss »

I always turned off the water at our summer home when we weren't there, also always turned off water heater, so it would'nt be wrecked by getting drained down by a water leak somewhere and then frying the element (electric water heater). Cheap insurance

GG
FlyingMoose
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Re: Vacation – Turn off water main?

Post by FlyingMoose »

I got discouraged by this type of thing when it said “turn off water and unplug when not in use” in my washing machine manual (along with a bunch of other ridiculous warnings like not leaving it out in the rain or dropping it, and everything causing cancer but only in California), and some other appliances like my TV and air conditioner said to unplug when not in use. I’ve even seen warnings that can’t apply to an appliance, like my blender manual said not to stick a knife into the toast slots (and of course to unplug it when not in use and not immerse it in water).

I would be unplugging and plugging things every day or multiple times per day and wearing out my outlets, just because they want to have an excuse if some shoddy appliance burns down a house they’ll say “but you should have unplugged it!”

There’s never any indication of which warnings are important and which are frivolous…
phxjcc
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Re: Vacation – Turn off water main?

Post by phxjcc »

an00j wrote: Tue Oct 26, 2021 3:34 pm
Californiastate wrote: Tue Oct 26, 2021 3:26 pm
neilpilot wrote: Tue Oct 26, 2021 3:06 pm
Californiastate wrote: Tue Oct 26, 2021 2:56 pm
neilpilot wrote: Tue Oct 26, 2021 2:21 pm
I've owned 6 homes, and I've never lived in a house where there wasn't an internal shutoff in addition to the one at the meter.
Building shut off valves are notoriously terrible at permanent positive shutoff. Mine is toast but luckily it's toast fully open. I've installed high spec building gate valves. Most aren't. Stems break and gates erode if not fully opened. Meter stops usually work pretty good.
That's nice. So maybe I've been lucky, since starting with my first home in 1975 I can't recall any issues with a shutoff valve.

IIRC all or most of my shutoffs were gate valves. I know enough about valves (retired ChE) to exercise annually if unused along with a dab of grease, and to fully open when in the normal position.
It would be nice if every homeowner did their own preventative maintenance. Kudos on your effort. The vast majority of building shutoff valves I've worked on (thousands) didn't have your TLC. They either don't hold or they fail closed.
For example an average homeowner wants to shut off the water to their home. The are lucky when the stem isn't seized and it turns. Unfortunately their luck stops there. They are able to close the gate valve but it doesn't seal. They tighten it more and it seals a little better. They tighten it more and break the stem. Now the valve is stuck closed and their HD skills have reached their limit. They call a plumber but it's Christmas Eve and there are few responses. I've seen it too many times. Everybody hates to see it except the plumber who is charging golden time.
I'm struggling to make this anecdotal evidence actionable. Do I just test it out during business hours and try to call a plumber if things go wrong?
Your actions:
1. Install ball valves to replace you gate valves.
2. Install a manifold such that:
A. you have the main supply in from the city.
Ball valve
B after that flows into manifold that….
x. One circuit to house, controlled by ball valve
y. One circuit to irrigation, controlled by ball valve
z. additional circuits (pool, out buildings), as required and configured as above.

…and yes…
Empty ice maker
Turn ice maker off
Turn water heater to vacation mode
If freezing conditions, drain all pipes, especially hose bibs.
LittleMaggieMae
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Re: Vacation – Turn off water main?

Post by LittleMaggieMae »

How long will you be gone? Will someone be checking your house daily (picking up mail, making your house looked lived in)? How old is your house? Does your house have a water shutoff OR do you have to go out to the street and shut off the water with a special tool :)

I've gone on vacations for up to 2 weeks and didn't shut off the water to my house. I had a house sitter coming every day to pick up the mail and check the house. I didn't see how this was a different risk than me being away from my house for 14 hours a day monday thru friday and then sometimes 20 hours or more on the weekends.

I get anxiety when someone says they shut off the water to their home:

I live in a densely populated urban area in currently 75 year old house. It's more "dangerous" to shut off the water to the house than to leave it on. Actually, I had to shut off the water to the whole house to replace the water heater (we also replaced the old water shut offs or added new shutoffs to the basement sink, the washer and to the outside spigot while we had the water off). All the replacements went GREAT! but, when we went to turn the water to the house back on - that shut off started leaking. We decided to call a plumber - because old lead pipes and if we screwed up replacing the shut off this became a really expensive repair that would require a plumber and probably permits. The plumber couldn't get the water shut off at the street - so they could replace the shutoff- the City was called. The city couldn't get the water shut off at the street. It took 6 weeks for the City to repair the buffalo box at the street. and then it took 2 hours for the plumber to repair my basement "water feature". Yes, I had a flow of water from the broken shutoff to a drain for almost 7 weeks. Because we had to turn of the water to whole house to replace the water heater. On the plus side - I have a new whole house water shut off AND all the sinks/toilets/washer/outside spigots and water heater have their own shutoffs. WE knew the risk of shutting off the water when we were replacing the water heater - that's why we also did a bunch of other maintenance while the water was off... didn't want to risk having to turn it off and on multiple times over time...

The take away from that is if you live in house where you don't routinely shut off the water to the whole house and if it's an older home - you might want to think twice about doing it. In theory- your house should have shut offs under all the sinks and toilets (and for the washer and water heater).
joeblow
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Re: Vacation – Turn off water main?

Post by joeblow »

Posting so I can find this thread again before my next vacation...and by "before" I mean right before so I can run around and stress about everything at the last minute. LOL!

Really good advice here. We already do a lot of it and felt pretty good when we leave town. But some of you, as always, are quite impressive with your attention to detail and level of commitment.
LittleMaggieMae
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Re: Vacation – Turn off water main?

Post by LittleMaggieMae »

Doesn't this beg the question about 'sewer gas'? If you will be gone from your house for so long that you will shut off the water - and no one will be checking your house while you are gone - what happens when the water in your toilet and drains evaporates and the sewer odor wafts thru your house?

This wouldn't happen over the course of few weeks. More like a month or two or three.

(which also makes me wonder about people who have houses with way more bathrooms than people living in the house - do they go around every month and check each unused bathroom - run the water in the tub/sink and flush the toilet? or do they just wait until they notice the smell?? Or maybe they have a housekeeping service that cleans routinely and so runs water thru the drains/toilets. )
Californiastate
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Re: Vacation – Turn off water main?

Post by Californiastate »

FYI
There are companies that do hot taps and pipe freezing when shutoff valves fail. I’ve only used them in large commercial situations because of their cost. I’ve also seen kits that use CO2 IIRC. I wouldn’t recommend these for the average homeowner. The poster who couldn’t get their water off for 7 weeks would be the perfect example.
Luckywon
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Re: Vacation – Turn off water main?

Post by Luckywon »

LittleMaggieMae wrote: Tue Oct 26, 2021 11:30 pm
The take away from that is if you live in house where you don't routinely shut off the water to the whole house and if it's an older home - you might want to think twice about doing it.
If I was in the situation I would call a plumber to inspect the shut-off valve and replace it if necessary. Any other ending sounds likely to be very unpleasant.
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Padlin
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Re: Vacation – Turn off water main?

Post by Padlin »

LittleMaggieMae wrote: Tue Oct 26, 2021 11:40 pm Doesn't this beg the question about 'sewer gas'? If you will be gone from your house for so long that you will shut off the water - and no one will be checking your house while you are gone - what happens when the water in your toilet and drains evaporates and the sewer odor wafts thru your house?
I had thought about this but in reality it didn't happen for many 3 month or so trips, the water level dropped maybe a 1/2". May be effected by where you live, here in New England it's fairly humid. I read somewhere that you could put a coating of oil in the bowls, not that I've done it.
Regards | Bob
Dagwood
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Re: Vacation – Turn off water main?

Post by Dagwood »

We turn it off if gone for more than a few days. We have a cat sitter to check on the cats - we leave several large pitchers of water in the fridge for the automatic water bowls and she knows where the main valve is if she needs more water. We also turn off the ice maker by switching it off.

On another related leak story, so people can learn from our experience, we had the condensation line from the AC unit block itself while we were away. Luckily the damage was not bad - really some dampness and a few minor puddles on the boiler room floor, but could have been worse had we been away longer. I unclogged the lines and got things in order again, but wanted an HVAC guy to come and check since anything with flooding, an ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure kind of thing. They installed a water cut off reed switch on the HVAC drain, so if this were to ever happen again, it would turn off the AC. The only issue with this solution is that then the kitties would not be comfortable in the heat of the summer, but with the cat sitter checking them multiple times a day when we are gone, we figure this is a problem we could deal with if it ever materialized.

Hope this helps others to avoid the same thing.
neilpilot
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Re: Vacation – Turn off water main?

Post by neilpilot »

LittleMaggieMae wrote: Tue Oct 26, 2021 11:40 pm Doesn't this beg the question about 'sewer gas'? If you will be gone from your house for so long that you will shut off the water - and no one will be checking your house while you are gone - what happens when the water in your toilet and drains evaporates and the sewer odor wafts thru your house?

This wouldn't happen over the course of few weeks. More like a month or two or three.

(which also makes me wonder about people who have houses with way more bathrooms than people living in the house - do they go around every month and check each unused bathroom - run the water in the tub/sink and flush the toilet? or do they just wait until they notice the smell?? Or maybe they have a housekeeping service that cleans routinely and so runs water thru the drains/toilets. )
First of all, isn't the "sewer gas" issue you mention independent of the water shutoff? Even if the water remains on, those sink and toilet traps would be subject to the same risk of evaporation.

If I was in the position of leaving a home unoccupied long term, I'd cover the toilet bowl and possibly also all sink drains with plastic wrap to extend water retention. Also, if heat is off and winter temperatures posed a freeze risk, the drain would first receive a dose of an appropriate antifreeze, which is of course also less likely to evaporate than plain water in the trap.
hudson
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Re: Vacation – Turn off water main?

Post by hudson »

an00j wrote: Mon Oct 25, 2021 11:57 pm New homeowner. Going on a vacation soon. Is it normal to turn off the water main to the house to mitigate risk of water damage while we are gone?

Anything else I should consider doing?
I can cut off all water at the meter with a T handle wrench: https://www.amazon.com/Water-Meter-Key- ... 1719951495

For my house cut off, I replaced the frozen valve with a ball valve. I also enclosed the valve with one of these so that I don't have to dig. https://www.lowes.com/pd/NDS-0-in-L-x-1 ... lsrc=aw.ds

My outside sewer clean out was also buried. I added an extension to that. Now my cut off and clean out are easy to find.

When I remodeled, I put in quality new stuff with high quality hoses. I added a water sensing cutoff to my water heater with drip pan and outside drain. I replace the water heater every 10 years if it needs it or not. I probably should go around yearly and check all water connections and potential problem areas. I'll put it on the list for November and then add it to Google Calendar.

I flush my water heater yearly...at least that's the plan. Here's a link to the water sensing cutoff device. https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00EA ... UTF8&psc=1

I recently found a leaking dehumidifier in the crawl space. It pays to check stuff.
Last edited by hudson on Wed Oct 27, 2021 10:47 am, edited 2 times in total.
MathWizard
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Re: Vacation – Turn off water main?

Post by MathWizard »

I have never turned off the house supply of water just for vacation

Of course, the longest vacation I have ever had was 3 weeks.

I have only had water in the house when an extreme cold snap
(-25 F at night every night for 2 weeks) happened. I was poor and hadn't kept the propane tank full and it ran out. Pipes froze and when I restored heat, a joint leaked. With natural gas, this wouldn't have happened.
Figaro
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Re: Vacation – Turn off water main?

Post by Figaro »

I never turned off the water main before. But someone told me that it was a wise thing so I tried it. Well when I came back, my ice maker in the fridge would no longer produce ice. Apparently you need to shut that switch in the fridge off to go on vacation mode first. Took a while to thaw out (along with having to eat through alot of food) and finally had ice about a year later. That was my only concern.

It's probably a good idea to do a water supply shutoff to the faucets/toilets as well in addition to the main water supply.
neilpilot
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Re: Vacation – Turn off water main?

Post by neilpilot »

Figaro wrote: Wed Oct 27, 2021 8:50 am I never turned off the water main before. But someone told me that it was a wise thing so I tried it. Well when I came back, my ice maker in the fridge would no longer produce ice. Apparently you need to shut that switch in the fridge off to go on vacation mode first. Took a while to thaw out (along with having to eat through alot of food) and finally had ice about a year later. That was my only concern.

It's probably a good idea to do a water supply shutoff to the faucets/toilets as well in addition to the main water supply.
If the main water supply is valved off what do you gain by closing the individual user shutoffs? Unless your supply valve is defective there should be little or no residual water or pressure.
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Marmot
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Re: Vacation – Turn off water main?

Post by Marmot »

6bquick wrote: Tue Oct 26, 2021 8:03 am Man, I admit, I'm not the target audience here. two little kids at home and one on the way means we don't travel much (read: at all).

But, what kind of 'vacations' are y'all talking about? is this "snowbird-ing in Cabo for 4 months" so killing the water is part of some prophylactic checklist prior to departure or is this a "weekend trip to Muncie" so I better kill the water? because if it's the latter, I'm thanking my lucky stars we've never had an issue with this!
In my Insurance companies 2020 yearly report they said they had there most expensive water claim ever (9 million). it was a 3 level townhouse, and it was caused by a plastic connection to the back of the toilet. If I recall correctly, 60% of their claims are water related.

Page 10 for those who want to read it:
https://www.pureinsurance.com/newsroom/ ... to-members
Last edited by Marmot on Wed Oct 27, 2021 11:03 am, edited 1 time in total.
Marty....don't go to the year 2020....Dr. Emmett Brown
Nicolas
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Re: Vacation – Turn off water main?

Post by Nicolas »

quantAndHold wrote: Tue Oct 26, 2021 10:26 pm So do none of you people have any landscaping? If we turned off the water anytime we left town, all of our plants would be dead when we got home.

We just have someone check things every couple of days when they come to pick up the mail.
I’m not in a drought zone. We get plenty of rainfall to keep things green. I have no irrigation system and do not water anything outdoors.
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illumination
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Re: Vacation – Turn off water main?

Post by illumination »

quantAndHold wrote: Tue Oct 26, 2021 10:26 pm So do none of you people have any landscaping? If we turned off the water anytime we left town, all of our plants would be dead when we got home.

We just have someone check things every couple of days when they come to pick up the mail.
My home has a separate shutoff for irrigation, I've found that fairly common, but maybe its a regional thing?

If I ever move to a home and it doesn't have this, I plan to a pay a plumber to put one in.

I've just seen so many personal anecdotes of floods happening inside the home. So many points of failure and even if insurance pays every penny, it's a nightmare.
neilpilot
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Re: Vacation – Turn off water main?

Post by neilpilot »

illumination wrote: Wed Oct 27, 2021 10:18 am
quantAndHold wrote: Tue Oct 26, 2021 10:26 pm So do none of you people have any landscaping? If we turned off the water anytime we left town, all of our plants would be dead when we got home.

We just have someone check things every couple of days when they come to pick up the mail.
My home has a separate shutoff for irrigation, I've found that fairly common, but maybe its a regional thing?

If I ever move to a home and it doesn't have this, I plan to a pay a plumber to put one in.

I've just seen so many personal anecdotes of floods happening inside the home. So many points of failure and even if insurance pays every penny, it's a nightmare.
My experience from the 3 homes I’ve owned with irrigation is that there’s a valve to the irrigation between the meter shutoff and the secondary shutoff valve in the home. So if I want to shutoff my house but maintain irrigation I simply use the in-home shutoff valve.
Living Free
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Re: Vacation – Turn off water main?

Post by Living Free »

Eat33 wrote: Tue Oct 26, 2021 1:17 am As I was leaving for my three week European trip I suddenly realized the bedroom carpet was wet. Not knowing where the water leak was I ran outside and turned off the main water pipe entering the house. I also turned on several fans to dry out the carpet.
From the airport I called a neighbor to check on the house.
The leak was caused by a plastic washer failure on the back of the new master bath toilet.

Two months later it happended again. Same connection with the toilet.

My home owner's insurance was canceled some time later and finding new insurance cost several times the original insurance cost.
Seems like two water claims in one year is not allowed. By the way the cost of repair was $4200.00. I offered to refund the money, no chance.The only claim I have had in my life.
Finding new homeowner's insurance took up several weeks and I needed to wait three years to finally buy a normal policy.

So yes turn off the water anytime you take a long absence from home.
(bold added by me)
This is why I keep my deductible for my homeowner's insurance fairly high. Because they will drop a client with too many claims, and also to reduce the premiums, keeping a high deductible and viewing it as "catastrophic insurance" against a huge loss seems like the better plan with regards to the homeowner's insurance. I recall a recent thread about homeowner's insurance deductible levels and was surprised so many bogleheads had what I consider to be low deductibles ($4k or less).
tibbitts
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Re: Vacation – Turn off water main?

Post by tibbitts »

Figaro wrote: Wed Oct 27, 2021 8:50 am I never turned off the water main before. But someone told me that it was a wise thing so I tried it. Well when I came back, my ice maker in the fridge would no longer produce ice. Apparently you need to shut that switch in the fridge off to go on vacation mode first. Took a while to thaw out (along with having to eat through alot of food) and finally had ice about a year later. That was my only concern.

It's probably a good idea to do a water supply shutoff to the faucets/toilets as well in addition to the main water supply.
I'm not following the refrigerator situation. If you're gone the refrigerator would never deplete the existing ice so it would never attempt to make more. Why would you have to thaw anything out?
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