MacBook Pro any issues to upgrade OS from Sierra to Big Sur? Noob Help Needed?

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Sandtrap
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MacBook Pro any issues to upgrade OS from Sierra to Big Sur? Noob Help Needed?

Post by Sandtrap »

I have:
MacBook Pro (2017) 13" with OS High Sierra V 10.13.1
Should I upgrade to:
Mac OS Big Sur ???

I have enough storage space.
I just did a full backup to external SSD.

Important:
****The only reason for this upgrade right now is I keep getting messages on the screen that my browser is out of date on certain webpages.
**(Is there a way to fix this other than an upgrade of the OS?)

My laptop is very stable right now.
If I'm better off not upgrading, then that's great too. Why?
Would I have any instability issues or other possible issues with this upgrade?

thanks everyone for your help and any suggestions.
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finsterfolly
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Re: MacBook Pro any issues to upgrade OS from Sierra to Big Sur? Noob Help Needed?

Post by finsterfolly »

Your mileage may vary, but I just upgraded my wife's early 2015 MacBook Air to Big Sur without a problem. She uses it at home only, largely for surfing and streaming. For that reason, I was putting off upgrading so that it wouldn't introduce more problems. Mounting performance issues, potential security issues, problems with iTunes, and the browser issue you mentioned all added up to needing an upgrade. Now I wish I had done it sooner. I have an older MacBook Pro that is approximately that age that I upgraded too.

Things to watch out for are other programs that you use that do not work on later OS versions. Usually, you can track down an upgrade, but as someone that has used Macs for decades, I've lost a few programs over the years after an upgrade.

You might be able to go into he App Store and update the browser only (Safari?) or find the upgrade on Apple's website. I'm not sure if Safari is tied to specific OS versions. If you are using Chrome or other, you can update directly from the website or sometimes within the app.
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Re: MacBook Pro any issues to upgrade OS from Sierra to Big Sur? Noob Help Needed?

Post by CJC000 »

Yes, you should update, but with caution. You are currently 3 OS behind, the updates will help with security, compatibility, and stability.
BUT: Your biggest concern is the transition from 32-bit to 64-bit software! Mojave (10.14) was the last update supporting 32-bit. Anything newer is 64-bit. If you use Office (Word, Excel etc) your old software will not run. You will need to buy a new version in 64-bit (I bought mine from Costco). You may have other applications that will not run.
Be sure to clean up your system, delete any unnecessary files, empty trash etc then run Time Machine. The update will take quite some time (1hr or so). Then you'll have to install any new applications that won't run in 64-bit. All your data files will be fine.
If I can do it, I have confidence you can too!
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Re: MacBook Pro any issues to upgrade OS from Sierra to Big Sur? Noob Help Needed?

Post by Sandtrap »

CJC000 wrote: Tue Oct 19, 2021 11:42 am Yes, you should update, but with caution. You are currently 3 OS behind, the updates will help with security, compatibility, and stability.
BUT: Your biggest concern is the transition from 32-bit to 64-bit software! Mojave (10.14) was the last update supporting 32-bit. Anything newer is 64-bit. If you use Office (Word, Excel etc) your old software will not run. You will need to buy a new version in 64-bit (I bought mine from Costco). You may have other applications that will not run.
Be sure to clean up your system, delete any unnecessary files, empty trash etc then run Time Machine. The update will take quite some time (1hr or so). Then you'll have to install any new applications that won't run in 64-bit. All your data files will be fine.
If I can do it, I have confidence you can too!
Huge thanks!
Questions:
1. Can I upgrade to Mojave 10.14 instead and leave things at that forever?
I don't want to mess with the software that I have now. There's no sense in it.
2. Or, should I not even upgrade to Mojave 10.14 and just leave my computer alone forever. Maybe use FireFox on the webpages that give me a "browser not supported" nag screen?

Standing by.
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Re: MacBook Pro any issues to upgrade OS from Sierra to Big Sur? Noob Help Needed?

Post by CJC000 »

I understand your feelings about updating all the software. Sure you can go with Mojave 10.14, it won't hurt.
You can update Safari too by following the info on this web site:
https://browserhow.com/how-to-update-sa ... ing-macos/

Firefox is fine and lots of folks use Google Chrome as alternatives to Safari
You'll be fine for now, but be prepared to be forced to move to 64-bit operating systems in the very near future. If you buy a new machine, it will only be 64-bit...
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Re: MacBook Pro any issues to upgrade OS from Sierra to Big Sur? Noob Help Needed?

Post by SpaceMonkey »

You should be able to upgrade to Mojave from this page on Apple's Support site: How to get old versions of macOS.

You could theoretically remain at Mojave until you encountered some other future software or browser incompatibility. However, be advised that Mojave is scheduled to stop receiving security updates from Apple after November 30, 2021.
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Re: MacBook Pro any issues to upgrade OS from Sierra to Big Sur? Noob Help Needed?

Post by Cheez-It Guy »

You could start by upgrading from 10.13.1 to 10.13.6, which was the last point release of that series. Unfortunately, with my processor and graphics card, I'm stuck at 10.13.6.

Another way to avoid a major OS upgrade might be to use another browser that still supports your OS. You cannot get the latest version of Safari even for 10.13.6. However, the latest version of Firefox (a worthy substitute not owned by Google with an extensive library of add-ons) only requires a minimum OS of 10.12.0, so you can likely expect a couple more years of support with the latest Firefox releases being able to run on 10.13.6. I tend to use Safari, and I have not seen the page errors you describe. The first thing that really impacted me was Intuit's lack of support for 10.13.6 on TurboTax desktop edition starting in tax year 2020. They only support the 3 latest major OS releases. This is kind of lazy in my opinion, but that's their policy.
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Re: MacBook Pro any issues to upgrade OS from Sierra to Big Sur? Noob Help Needed?

Post by Hockey10 »

I have a 2014 MacBook Pro and had no problems with the Big Sur upgrade.
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Re: MacBook Pro any issues to upgrade OS from Sierra to Big Sur? Noob Help Needed?

Post by bondsr4me »

I have a mid-2015 MBP running Catalina 10.15.7.

I don't want to upgrade to Big Sur because of TurboTax.
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Re: MacBook Pro any issues to upgrade OS from Sierra to Big Sur? Noob Help Needed?

Post by UpperNwGuy »

I had a terrible time upgrading my 2017 Macbook Pro to Big Sur a year ago because it never occurred to me that it would require so much empty storage space during the upgrade.
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Re: MacBook Pro any issues to upgrade OS from Sierra to Big Sur? Noob Help Needed?

Post by Dottie57 »

I’ve done a lot of updating over the years. The only thing I had trouble with was. i had to have a wire keyboard to do an upgrade on my iMac. After the KB was found and plugged in all went well. I don’t think there is much tonworry about.
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Re: MacBook Pro any issues to upgrade OS from Sierra to Big Sur? Noob Help Needed?

Post by billthecat »

You can scan your computer for 32-bit software either by using this free tool or by following these instructions using the built-in tool.
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Re: MacBook Pro any issues to upgrade OS from Sierra to Big Sur? Noob Help Needed?

Post by retiredjg »

I'd suggest that you upgrade to Catalina at least. Big Sur can come later if you want. Mojave is on its way out.

I upgraded from Mojave to Big Sur recently and it was a disaster although I'm not sure that was not due to some other problem.

After a few hours on the phone with Apple Support, my computer and I went to the local computer shop....where it was wiped and started over from my backup disk.

The computer guy said a couple of things that might apply to you. He said I was not alone in having a problem installing Big Sur. He said that updating to Catalina and then to Big Sur was the "right" way to do this rather than going directly from Mojave to Big Sur.
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Re: MacBook Pro any issues to upgrade OS from Sierra to Big Sur? Noob Help Needed?

Post by nisiprius »

I didn't try to do an N to N+2 jump. I have a "Late 2014 Mac Mini," so, officially compatible with Big Sur but not the latest and greatest hardware.

I had no issues upgrading to Big Sur except for...

...a steaming pile of annoying cosmetic issues, not resolved. In the process of trying to converge MacOS and iOS someone did an clumsy and insensitive job of choosing screen layouts, font sizes, and relative scaling of visual elements. On my 2560x1440 screen, Catalina had the typical Apple tasteful visual design, everything seemed "just right." With Big Sur everything is too big or too small, too widely spaced or not spaced widely enough, and mostly no good way to adjust.

One of the commonest suggestion in the Mac forums for resolving some of the worst issues (the main menu bar is tiny, and a promising-looking setting in System Preferences seemingly does not work) is to set the screen for a lower, scaled resolution! Not sure how this plays into a laptop-sized screen. Just be braced for it. You will likely be spending a little quality time tinkering appearance and layout settings.

After many decades, my personal policy is to mindlessly bite the bullet and perform OS upgrades approximately six months after release, whether the release seems worthwhile or not.

1) If you reject upgrades because you don't want any of the new features, after about three years you will start to experience "version skew" misery of the sort you are experiencing--you can't do this because you have to update that, but you can't update that because you must first upgrade the OS. The "version skew" misery may begins to include unavailability of security patches.

2) It is not a good idea to jump a major version number in an update (N to N+2 without installing N+1). My explanation is that I believe they put a lot of effort into testing and debugging N to N+1 and N+1 to N+2 transitions, but the little if any debugging of N to N+2 transitions.

3) Six months not only allows time for them to work out the teething pains, it also gives time for all the online forums to get up-to-date on what software has issues with the new OS; for developers to release necessary updates for the new OS (of course they should have been ready at launch, and one way to tell the developers with more than lip-service commitment to MacOS is to see if they were ready for the new OS before launch.)
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Re: MacBook Pro any issues to upgrade OS from Sierra to Big Sur? Noob Help Needed?

Post by Nummerkins »

Why not wait 6 days for Monterey? It's a polished version of Big Sur.
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Re: MacBook Pro any issues to upgrade OS from Sierra to Big Sur? Noob Help Needed?

Post by Sandtrap »

nisiprius wrote: Tue Oct 19, 2021 6:12 pm I didn't try to do an N to N+2 jump. I have a "Late 2014 Mac Mini," so, officially compatible with Big Sur but not the latest and greatest hardware.

I had no issues upgrading to Big Sur except for...

...a steaming pile of annoying cosmetic issues, not resolved. In the process of trying to converge MacOS and iOS someone did an clumsy and insensitive job of choosing screen layouts, font sizes, and relative scaling of visual elements. On my 2560x1440 screen, Catalina had the typical Apple tasteful visual design, everything seemed "just right." With Big Sur everything is too big or too small, too widely spaced or not spaced widely enough, and mostly no good way to adjust.

One of the commonest suggestion in the Mac forums for resolving some of the worst issues (the main menu bar is tiny, and a promising-looking setting in System Preferences seemingly does not work) is to set the screen for a lower, scaled resolution! Not sure how this plays into a laptop-sized screen. Just be braced for it. You will likely be spending a little quality time tinkering appearance and layout settings.

After many decades, my personal policy is to mindlessly bite the bullet and perform OS upgrades approximately six months after release, whether the release seems worthwhile or not.

1) If you reject upgrades because you don't want any of the new features, after about three years you will start to experience "version skew" misery of the sort you are experiencing--you can't do this because you have to update that, but you can't update that because you must first upgrade the OS. The "version skew" misery may begins to include unavailability of security patches.

2) It is not a good idea to jump a major version number in an update (N to N+2 without installing N+1). My explanation is that I believe they put a lot of effort into testing and debugging N to N+1 and N+1 to N+2 transitions, but the little if any debugging of N to N+2 transitions.

3) Six months not only allows time for them to work out the teething pains, it also gives time for all the online forums to get up-to-date on what software has issues with the new OS; for developers to release necessary updates for the new OS (of course they should have been ready at launch, and one way to tell the developers with more than lip-service commitment to MacOS is to see if they were ready for the new OS before launch.)
Good points.

The consensus seems to be Catalina at a minimum so I guess I’ll do a backup then do the upgrade to that. As you say smaller jump vs big jump.

What do you think?
Thanks.
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Re: MacBook Pro any issues to upgrade OS from Sierra to Big Sur? Noob Help Needed?

Post by retiredjg »

That's what I would do.
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Re: MacBook Pro any issues to upgrade OS from Sierra to Big Sur? Noob Help Needed?

Post by student »

I have an older macbook pro using Big Sur. It is fine.
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Re: MacBook Pro any issues to upgrade OS from Sierra to Big Sur? Noob Help Needed?

Post by chuckb84 »

Sandtrap wrote: Tue Oct 19, 2021 11:16 am I have:
MacBook Pro (2017) 13" with OS High Sierra V 10.13.1
Should I upgrade to:
Mac OS Big Sur ???

I have enough storage space.
I just did a full backup to external SSD.

Important:
****The only reason for this upgrade right now is I keep getting messages on the screen that my browser is out of date on certain webpages.
**(Is there a way to fix this other than an upgrade of the OS?)

My laptop is very stable right now.
If I'm better off not upgrading, then that's great too. Why?
Would I have any instability issues or other possible issues with this upgrade?

thanks everyone for your help and any suggestions.
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Before you start: What browser? What web pages? Update the browser and leave everything else alone? Change browsers? This is the simplest path if you're happy with everything else.

I'd suggest that you get an external SSD drive (get at least 512G, 1T would be even better) and then use Carbon Copy Cloner to clone your existing setup. That way, if you don't like where you end up with the upgrade, you can get back to exactly where you were. I used Big Sur on a 2015 MBP, and it's okay, but I like the look of HIgh Sierra better, and I still think Mojave was the best macOS. Runs 32 bit, visually appealing (to me), and the end of multiple iterations of the same underlying OS, before they began tightening security and throwing things out.

I use Big Sur, but only because it's required for M1 Macs.
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Re: MacBook Pro any issues to upgrade OS from Sierra to Big Sur? Noob Help Needed?

Post by Sandtrap »

chuckb84 wrote: Tue Oct 19, 2021 11:31 pm
Sandtrap wrote: Tue Oct 19, 2021 11:16 am I have:
MacBook Pro (2017) 13" with OS High Sierra V 10.13.1
Should I upgrade to:
Mac OS Big Sur ???

I have enough storage space.
I just did a full backup to external SSD.

Important:
****The only reason for this upgrade right now is I keep getting messages on the screen that my browser is out of date on certain webpages.
**(Is there a way to fix this other than an upgrade of the OS?)

My laptop is very stable right now.
If I'm better off not upgrading, then that's great too. Why?
Would I have any instability issues or other possible issues with this upgrade?

thanks everyone for your help and any suggestions.
Low Tech Senior Noob
j :D
Before you start: What browser? What web pages? Update the browser and leave everything else alone? Change browsers? This is the simplest path if you're happy with everything else.

I'd suggest that you get an external SSD drive (get at least 512G, 1T would be even better) and then use Carbon Copy Cloner to clone your existing setup. That way, if you don't like where you end up with the upgrade, you can get back to exactly where you were. I used Big Sur on a 2015 MBP, and it's okay, but I like the look of HIgh Sierra better, and I still think Mojave was the best macOS. Runs 32 bit, visually appealing (to me), and the end of multiple iterations of the same underlying OS, before they began tightening security and throwing things out.

I use Big Sur, but only because it's required for M1 Macs.
Why use Carbon Copy Cloner to clone existing setup *instead of. . . Time Machine Backup?

Huge Thanks!
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Re: MacBook Pro any issues to upgrade OS from Sierra to Big Sur? Noob Help Needed?

Post by nisiprius »

Because you can boot directly from a Carbon Copy Cloner copy.

It's a little miserable running off an external rotating drive when you're used to SSD, but at least you're up and running... and it takes less time to use Carbon Copy Cloner to clone it back to the internal SSD than it does to make a full-system recovery from a Time Machine backup

My personal procedure is: make a Carbon Copy Cloner copy to an external rotating drive, then (eject and disconnect all external drives) and update the internal SSD drive.

It takes (me) hours to perform a full restoration from a Time Machine backup. I also, frankly, have doubts about the reliability of Time Machine in my setup. There's no real way to tell without actually performing a full restore.
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Re: MacBook Pro any issues to upgrade OS from Sierra to Big Sur? Noob Help Needed?

Post by Sandtrap »

nisiprius wrote: Wed Oct 20, 2021 7:42 am Because you can boot directly from a Carbon Copy Cloner copy.

It's a little miserable running off an external rotating drive when you're used to SSD, but at least you're up and running... and it takes less time to use Carbon Copy Cloner to clone it back to the internal SSD than it does to make a full-system recovery from a Time Machine backup

My personal procedure is: make a Carbon Copy Cloner copy to an external rotating drive, then (eject and disconnect all external drives) and update the internal SSD drive.

It takes (me) hours to perform a full restoration from a Time Machine backup. I also, frankly, have doubts about the reliability of Time Machine in my setup. There's no real way to tell without actually performing a full restore.
Huge Thanks!

Final question: hopefully.
Can I use Carbon Copy Cloner to an external SSD drive as long as it is large enough capacity that matches the MacBook Pro SSD Drive?

You mention external platter type drive which I have but I also have a large external SSD drive I can use.

thanks again.
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Re: MacBook Pro any issues to upgrade OS from Sierra to Big Sur? Noob Help Needed?

Post by illumination »

I just went through this, was a real mess. I lost all my Microsoft products because of the 32 to 64 bit jump, so I have to use Libre instead.

I'm a longtime, loyal Apple fan, but annoyed that they dropped the ball like this on an easily resolved issue that wouldn't even be a rounding error to patch. It took a longtime for me to even figure out what was going on. All over a SSL certificate not being updated. One of the big reasons I like Apple products is they usually can go along time "as is" for what I need done.
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