Bike Cameras

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edgeagg
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Bike Cameras

Post by edgeagg »

Hello all
Looking for recommendations for bike cameras - ideally helmet mounted. Gopro is rather too bulky and large for me. The need here is just to document insane driving behavior that may put me at risk - such as drivers running stop signs or doing stuff that can endanger me.
ea
jebmke
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Re: Bike Cameras

Post by jebmke »

edgeagg wrote: Tue Jun 22, 2021 1:43 pm Hello all
Looking for recommendations for bike cameras - ideally helmet mounted. Gopro is rather too bulky and large for me. The need here is just to document insane driving behavior that may put me at risk - such as drivers running stop signs or doing stuff that can endanger me.
ea
I thought of doing this a few years ago. Then I realized that it won't result in anything material. I've stopped riding on the road, period.
Don't trust me, look it up. https://www.irs.gov/forms-instructions-and-publications
miamivice
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Re: Bike Cameras

Post by miamivice »

edgeagg wrote: Tue Jun 22, 2021 1:43 pm Hello all
Looking for recommendations for bike cameras - ideally helmet mounted. Gopro is rather too bulky and large for me. The need here is just to document insane driving behavior that may put me at risk - such as drivers running stop signs or doing stuff that can endanger me.
ea
What do you plan to do with your video?
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galawdawg
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Re: Bike Cameras

Post by galawdawg »

edgeagg wrote: Tue Jun 22, 2021 1:43 pm Hello all
Looking for recommendations for bike cameras - ideally helmet mounted. Gopro is rather too bulky and large for me. The need here is just to document insane driving behavior that may put me at risk - such as drivers running stop signs or doing stuff that can endanger me.
ea
Unless you are struck by a motorist, what do you plan to do with such documentation? It seems it would be more prudent to have a bike mounted camera, particularly one pointed to the rear, in the event you are involved in a collision with a motorist. You could have one rear mounted and one front mounted if you are that concerned. These articles may be helpful: https://www.cyclingweekly.com/group-tes ... ras-327336 and https://cycloscope.net/best-cycling-camera-bike-helmet

Of course, realize that having a camera cuts both ways. Unfortunately, more than a handful of cyclists in north Georgia disregard the rules of the road, for instance, they fail to keep to the right side of the roadway, ride more than two abreast, disregard traffic control devices and so on. Hopefully you are a safe and courteous cyclist who obeys the applicable traffic laws when traveling upon a public roadway. But if not, realize that the camera will document your riding behavior as well as that of others using the roadway.

"Let's be careful out there!" - Sgt. Phil Esterhaus
bob60014
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Re: Bike Cameras

Post by bob60014 »

I often ride on the city streets and personally I don't see the need for it as I've found my front & rear flashing led lights work well enough.

I would think that mounting on the handlebar or stem would provide better, stable video rather than the constant jerkiness if mounted on the helmet, should the recording ever be needed.
Onlineid3089
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Re: Bike Cameras

Post by Onlineid3089 »

I agree with the people asking why. Are you going to use it to change your riding habits? Or do you have other plans for it? Maybe some Law Abiding Citizen type revenge :shock:
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gwe67
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Re: Bike Cameras

Post by gwe67 »

Many people have cameras on their cars, which doesn't seem to be a point of contention. Cyclists are more vulnerable, so what's the problem with them having cameras as well?
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nalor511
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Re: Bike Cameras

Post by nalor511 »

gwe67 wrote: Tue Jun 22, 2021 2:38 pm Many people have cameras on their cars, which doesn't seem to be a point of contention. Cyclists are more vulnerable, so what's the problem with them having cameras as well?
Agreed. Seems nobody likes change.
jebmke
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Re: Bike Cameras

Post by jebmke »

gwe67 wrote: Tue Jun 22, 2021 2:38 pm Many people have cameras on their cars, which doesn't seem to be a point of contention. Cyclists are more vulnerable, so what's the problem with them having cameras as well?
My objection would also apply to cars. Just speaking for me personally, not sure where I would go with the video - maybe my insurance company, I guess.
Don't trust me, look it up. https://www.irs.gov/forms-instructions-and-publications
hershey102d
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Re: Bike Cameras

Post by hershey102d »

edgeagg wrote: Tue Jun 22, 2021 1:43 pm . . . to document insane driving behavior that may put me at risk - such as drivers running stop signs or doing stuff that can endanger me.
Don’t recall the last time I saw a bicyclist stop for a stop sign.
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Raybo
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Re: Bike Cameras

Post by Raybo »

hershey102d wrote: Tue Jun 22, 2021 2:56 pm
edgeagg wrote: Tue Jun 22, 2021 1:43 pm . . . to document insane driving behavior that may put me at risk - such as drivers running stop signs or doing stuff that can endanger me.
Don’t recall the last time I saw a bicyclist stop for a stop sign.
When did you last see a car stop at one?
No matter how long the hill, if you keep pedaling you'll eventually get up to the top.
jebmke
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Re: Bike Cameras

Post by jebmke »

Multiple times today. Every day I drive. My concern is lane discipline vs. stop signs. I can anticipate stop sign violations but with cell phones, lane discipline is a thing of the past. I'm off the street with my bike.
Don't trust me, look it up. https://www.irs.gov/forms-instructions-and-publications
StrawMan
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Re: Bike Cameras

Post by StrawMan »

jebmke wrote: Tue Jun 22, 2021 1:51 pm
edgeagg wrote: Tue Jun 22, 2021 1:43 pm Hello all
Looking for recommendations for bike cameras - ideally helmet mounted. Gopro is rather too bulky and large for me. The need here is just to document insane driving behavior that may put me at risk - such as drivers running stop signs or doing stuff that can endanger me.
ea
I thought of doing this a few years ago. Then I realized that it won't result in anything material. I've stopped riding on the road, period.
There was a company working on an early warning device for cyclists a few years ago. Used a rear facing camera, have no idea of the current progress. I’ve given up riding on roads as well - too dangerous/too many issues.
furwut
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Re: Bike Cameras

Post by furwut »

Recommend asking your question on Twitter using the hashtag #bikedc. Several cyclists in DC run camera setups.

As for the practicality of it one example - Maryland, Virginia and DC (until recently) use a contributory negligence standard to resolve claims of liability. That means, so long as you are believed to be as little as 1% at fault in a crash, you can not collect from the other party.

I know of several instances where a cyclist was able to recover damages solely because they had video proof despite conflicting statements from the motorist and even some witnesses.

A few years ago (before DC law was changed) a car passed me in the same lane and then immediately applied their brakes hard. I went into the back of the car and was quite shaken up. The ambulance ride to the ER cost $5000. I did not have a camera and the police officer declined to assign blame (despite witness statements saying what happened). The motorist's insurance immediately, without my ever contacting them, rejected any liability. Had I had a camera I might have been able to press for reimbursement of my losses.
Onlineid3089
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Re: Bike Cameras

Post by Onlineid3089 »

StrawMan wrote: Tue Jun 22, 2021 3:27 pm
jebmke wrote: Tue Jun 22, 2021 1:51 pm
edgeagg wrote: Tue Jun 22, 2021 1:43 pm Hello all
Looking for recommendations for bike cameras - ideally helmet mounted. Gopro is rather too bulky and large for me. The need here is just to document insane driving behavior that may put me at risk - such as drivers running stop signs or doing stuff that can endanger me.
ea
I thought of doing this a few years ago. Then I realized that it won't result in anything material. I've stopped riding on the road, period.
There was a company working on an early warning device for cyclists a few years ago. Used a rear facing camera, have no idea of the current progress. I’ve given up riding on roads as well - too dangerous/too many issues.
I believe Garmin has a rear facing radar that will alert you to cars coming up behind you with distance back on your bike computer, but I don't think there is a camera involved in that product. I've never really looked into it because we have good enough trails in my area that I rarely ride on roads.
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Re: Bike Cameras

Post by jebmke »

Onlineid3089 wrote: Tue Jun 22, 2021 4:23 pm I believe Garmin has a rear facing radar that will alert you to cars coming up behind you with distance back on your bike computer, but I don't think there is a camera involved in that product. I've never really looked into it because we have good enough trails in my area that I rarely ride on roads.
An issue here is what to do if they drift into the “breakdown lane”? Most country roads have very deep drainage ditches since we are essentially at or near sea level (think Low Countries, Europe) so there isn’t anywhere to bail out to. There are a few areas with very little traffic down in a NWR near here that isn’t too bad; very little traffic but the ditch/swamp problem is there.
Don't trust me, look it up. https://www.irs.gov/forms-instructions-and-publications
EddyB
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Re: Bike Cameras

Post by EddyB »

hershey102d wrote: Tue Jun 22, 2021 2:56 pm
edgeagg wrote: Tue Jun 22, 2021 1:43 pm . . . to document insane driving behavior that may put me at risk - such as drivers running stop signs or doing stuff that can endanger me.
Don’t recall the last time I saw a bicyclist stop for a stop sign.
People yell at me about that, even though I only roll through when legally allowed.

Get off my lawn?
hunoraut
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Re: Bike Cameras

Post by hunoraut »

edgeagg wrote: Tue Jun 22, 2021 1:43 pm Hello all
Looking for recommendations for bike cameras - ideally helmet mounted. Gopro is rather too bulky and large for me. The need here is just to document insane driving behavior that may put me at risk - such as drivers running stop signs or doing stuff that can endanger me.
ea

gopro is the most common, for a good reason. its popularity is also an advantage because of compatibility of mounts and such. you also dont want to skimp because if you want to catch things like license plate of a speeding car in the shade... thats when you need the picture quality.

there are lots of commoditized/generic action cam for cheaper price, but theyre the same size as gopro anyway. "yi" brand is probably the best bet.
protagonist
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Re: Bike Cameras

Post by protagonist »

I never heard of this.
Would the camera be continuously on and filming whenever you are riding ?

Because if not I cannot imagine you actually capturing bad behavior by a motorist. If a motorist cuts you off and you are not injured, you will either further risk your life trying to photograph his license plate before he zooms away while you are still riding, or you will stop, and by the time you take the photo the driver will almost certainly be gone. And even if it was on continuously and you were lucky enough to capture the deed, what do you think the chances are that the police would do anything about it?

If you actually got injured during an encounter the chances of capturing a hit-and-run would be even less. You would need to rely on either the honesty of the driver who would stop or on the presence of witnesses.

If it was filming continuously, would you have it facing forward? Back? Sideways? Which side? Or would you need four cameras?

I would think that having a camera on your bike would only clutter up your handlebars and make it more desirable to thieves (or another hassle of having to remove it and carry it with you whenever you locked your bike up). Other than that it would be, at best, almost worthless, and at worst, perhaps further put you in danger because of your own reaction in times of anger. Unless I am missing something.

In what proportion of bad cyclist/driver encounters where the rider had a camera has it actually helped? Are there reliable statistics out there that might prove my intuition wrong?

As an avid cyclist myself, I think that all of us who ride have to accept that riding is risky and be willing to accept the risk. The only way to mitigate that risk is to ride safely and wear a helmet. Sort of like investing in index funds instead of playing the lottery. Beyond that, we are at the mercy of the jerks out there.
Last edited by protagonist on Tue Jun 22, 2021 5:46 pm, edited 5 times in total.
bzcat
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Re: Bike Cameras

Post by bzcat »

I use a drift ghost X and an adapter for my helmet. It works well enough once set up, and I think that part was the most fiddly. It records immediately after power on, and beeps so that I know its started recording. It has a phone app to download clips over adhoc wifi, which I never do unless there was some sort of incident.
RichL
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Re: Bike Cameras

Post by RichL »

In my experience, GoPro makes the best action camera and Cycliq makes the best “dash cam” style camera. K-Edge makes a combo mount for a garmin and camera to finish off a for a clean combo.

Cameras are an expense and definitely distract from the simplicity of riding.

I think it’s also extremely important to be properly insured. You absolutely need to verify coverage by your vehicle insurance PIP policy or have suitable medical coverage while riding. It’s also important to understand how and if your bike is covered through a home owners or renter policy. A Cervelo or Pinarello riding carbon hoops can easily become a $10k loss for a no-fault incident.
roamingzebra
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Re: Bike Cameras

Post by roamingzebra »

protagonist wrote: Tue Jun 22, 2021 5:32 pm The only way to mitigate that risk is to ride safely and wear a helmet.
I would add: wear a neon green jacket. They seem to show up well in all weather and light conditions.

Better than neon orange in my experience.
stoptothink
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Re: Bike Cameras

Post by stoptothink »

protagonist wrote: Tue Jun 22, 2021 5:32 pm I never heard of this.
Would the camera be continuously on and filming whenever you are riding ?

Because if not I cannot imagine you actually capturing bad behavior by a motorist. If a motorist cuts you off and you are not injured, you will either further risk your life trying to photograph his license plate before he zooms away while you are still riding, or you will stop, and by the time you take the photo the driver will almost certainly be gone. And even if it was on continuously and you were lucky enough to capture the deed, what do you think the chances are that the police would do anything about it?

If you actually got injured during an encounter the chances of capturing a hit-and-run would be even less. You would need to rely on either the honesty of the driver who would stop or on the presence of witnesses.

If it was filming continuously, would you have it facing forward? Back? Sideways? Which side? Or would you need four cameras?

I would think that having a camera on your bike would only clutter up your handlebars and make it more desirable to thieves (or another hassle of having to remove it and carry it with you whenever you locked your bike up). Other than that it would be, at best, almost worthless, and at worst, perhaps further put you in danger because of your own reaction in times of anger. Unless I am missing something.

In what proportion of bad cyclist/driver encounters where the rider had a camera has it actually helped? Are there reliable statistics out there that might prove my intuition wrong?

As an avid cyclist myself, I think that all of us who ride have to accept that riding is risky and be willing to accept the risk. The only way to mitigate that risk is to ride safely and wear a helmet. Sort of like investing in index funds instead of playing the lottery. Beyond that, we are at the mercy of the jerks out there.
You aren't missing anything, it makes no sense. As a fellow cyclist myself (who has probably put more miles on a bike than in a car the last two decades), wearing all your gear and not riding like a moron who doesn't have to obey traffic laws puts you ahead of 90% of cyclists out there.
Hawk Hilling
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Re: Bike Cameras

Post by Hawk Hilling »

Onlineid3089 wrote: Tue Jun 22, 2021 4:23 pm
StrawMan wrote: Tue Jun 22, 2021 3:27 pm
jebmke wrote: Tue Jun 22, 2021 1:51 pm
edgeagg wrote: Tue Jun 22, 2021 1:43 pm Hello all
Looking for recommendations for bike cameras - ideally helmet mounted. Gopro is rather too bulky and large for me. The need here is just to document insane driving behavior that may put me at risk - such as drivers running stop signs or doing stuff that can endanger me.
ea
I thought of doing this a few years ago. Then I realized that it won't result in anything material. I've stopped riding on the road, period.
There was a company working on an early warning device for cyclists a few years ago. Used a rear facing camera, have no idea of the current progress. I’ve given up riding on roads as well - too dangerous/too many issues.
I believe Garmin has a rear facing radar that will alert you to cars coming up behind you with distance back on your bike computer, but I don't think there is a camera involved in that product. I've never really looked into it because we have good enough trails in my area that I rarely ride on roads.
+1

I can't recommend the Garmin Varia tail light enough if you're a road rider. Situational awareness is a big part of safety, especially in the Bay Area where whisper silent EVs are everywhere. I'm far more comfortable riding in the center of the road (outside of the door zone) knowing that I'll have advance warning of any need to move over.

The light also blinks in a different way as cars approach, with different patterns depending on speed. I've purchased a few for friends as gifts over the years.
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langelgjm
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Re: Bike Cameras

Post by langelgjm »

Soon after I started bike commuting in Manhattan, I rode with a helmet mounted GoPro for a while. It worked OK.

I mainly used it to submit complaints to the Taxi and Limousine Commission about cabs stopped in bike lines, or blocking crosswalks, etc. They had a system where you could upload images with your complaint. You could track the complaint, which usually resulted in a fine. One time, the defendant contested my complaint, and I was asked to phone in to an administrative hearing and testify, which I did (he lost).

Sadly, I never was able to get a response to my complaint about an Uber driver who got out of his car to verbally abuse me for not allowing him to unsafely pass me in a single lane narrowed by construction, so that he could sit behind the next car (it was Manhattan, after all).

I eventually stopped submitting the complaints - righteous indignation is exhausting after a while. I also no longer have to work in Manhattan. It's probably better for everyone's health :-)
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Jack FFR1846
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Re: Bike Cameras

Post by Jack FFR1846 »

I sold my road bike a few years ago and only ride trails. Before that, I was always on the road, even racing back when the USCF was the ABLA. Raced as a junior through college. With cell phones, I look back and realize that the trucker crossing the lane oncoming to try to run me off the road and the guys in the city opening their doors as they went by to try to knock me off the bike were amateur hour. 16 year old Cindy LOL'ing to her BFF in daddy's Tahoe are more likely to kill me. No thanks. Don't need a camera so they can figure out who ran me over.
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lightheir
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Re: Bike Cameras

Post by lightheir »

Ignore the haters.

The product exists, works well. Cycliq Fly 6. A bit pricey, but it works. Look at youtube for plenty of 'interesting' selected videos.
lightheir
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Re: Bike Cameras

Post by lightheir »

Hawk Hilling wrote: Tue Jun 22, 2021 7:21 pm
Onlineid3089 wrote: Tue Jun 22, 2021 4:23 pm
StrawMan wrote: Tue Jun 22, 2021 3:27 pm
jebmke wrote: Tue Jun 22, 2021 1:51 pm
edgeagg wrote: Tue Jun 22, 2021 1:43 pm Hello all
Looking for recommendations for bike cameras - ideally helmet mounted. Gopro is rather too bulky and large for me. The need here is just to document insane driving behavior that may put me at risk - such as drivers running stop signs or doing stuff that can endanger me.
ea
I thought of doing this a few years ago. Then I realized that it won't result in anything material. I've stopped riding on the road, period.
There was a company working on an early warning device for cyclists a few years ago. Used a rear facing camera, have no idea of the current progress. I’ve given up riding on roads as well - too dangerous/too many issues.
I believe Garmin has a rear facing radar that will alert you to cars coming up behind you with distance back on your bike computer, but I don't think there is a camera involved in that product. I've never really looked into it because we have good enough trails in my area that I rarely ride on roads.
+1

I can't recommend the Garmin Varia tail light enough if you're a road rider. Situational awareness is a big part of safety, especially in the Bay Area where whisper silent EVs are everywhere. I'm far more comfortable riding in the center of the road (outside of the door zone) knowing that I'll have advance warning of any need to move over.

The light also blinks in a different way as cars approach, with different patterns depending on speed. I've purchased a few for friends as gifts over the years.
I too use a Garmin Varia and enjoy it.

I will add though, I think people give it way too much credit for what it does. It alerts to you a rear-coming car, but most of the time there isn't much you can do about it. If the car is veering INTO you and going to hit you, the Varia will accomplish almost nothing unless you happen to have the widest shoulder known to mankind to go far right.

Have said it before but I'm pretty sure that a super-strong tail-light like a Dinotte ($$$ but eye-searingly blight) will be a lot safer functionally than a Varia. But there's no denying that it's a lot more 'fun' and even 'reassuring' to ride with a Varia.

The Varia does excel when you're on a fast (25+mph) riding road and want to 'take the lane' and the wind noise makes it too hard to hear the rear cars, and the speed/twisty roads make it too dangerous to look back. That's the best-use case of the Varia.
hunoraut
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Re: Bike Cameras

Post by hunoraut »

protagonist wrote: Tue Jun 22, 2021 5:32 pm I never heard of this.
Would the camera be continuously on and filming whenever you are riding ?
...
I would think that having a camera on your bike would only clutter up your handlebars and make it more desirable to thieves (or another hassle of having to remove it and carry it with you whenever you locked your bike up). Other than that it would be, at best, almost worthless, and at worst, perhaps further put you in danger because of your own reaction in times of anger. Unless I am missing something.
All the action cams are meant to run continuously. They're also ultra-wide in field of view, most people only require 1 in the front, instead of a suite of cameras pointed at all direction. Bike mounts solves problem of aesthetics and clutter and etc.

All of these things have long been 'solved' in the industry.

Whether one really needs them is a personal and local issue. We have a bike-friendly culture here so it's not necessary. If one is in the UK, and most parts of US, etc, where the car-bike relationship is often very antagonistic...its not a bad idea. Consequences of bad behavior caught on camera range from social shaming to, in many cases, post hoc citation of motorists.
jebmke
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Re: Bike Cameras

Post by jebmke »

lightheir wrote: Tue Jun 22, 2021 10:08 pm Ignore the haters.

The product exists, works well. Cycliq Fly 6. A bit pricey, but it works. Look at youtube for plenty of 'interesting' selected videos.
I’m not a hater. I simply don’t know where I’d go with the video. If I took it to the sheriff he would laugh at me. Insurance company? Trauma surgeon? I guess they could show it at my cremation.
Don't trust me, look it up. https://www.irs.gov/forms-instructions-and-publications
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edgeagg
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Re: Bike Cameras

Post by edgeagg »

miamivice wrote: Tue Jun 22, 2021 2:04 pm
What do you plan to do with your video?
Nothing, unless something happens.
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edgeagg
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Re: Bike Cameras

Post by edgeagg »

Onlineid3089 wrote: Tue Jun 22, 2021 2:35 pm I agree with the people asking why. Are you going to use it to change your riding habits? Or do you have other plans for it? Maybe some Law Abiding Citizen type revenge :shock:
I'm not planning on revenge. Just documentation. I've been riding for over 30 years and with no accidents yet - but close calls. The classic right hook is the one that I have experienced. Yes, I run both front and rear flashers. I'd prefer bike mounted since it is WSIWYG.
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edgeagg
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Re: Bike Cameras

Post by edgeagg »

jebmke wrote: Wed Jun 23, 2021 6:28 am
lightheir wrote: Tue Jun 22, 2021 10:08 pm Ignore the haters.

The product exists, works well. Cycliq Fly 6. A bit pricey, but it works. Look at youtube for plenty of 'interesting' selected videos.
I’m not a hater. I simply don’t know where I’d go with the video. If I took it to the sheriff he would laugh at me. Insurance company? Trauma surgeon? I guess they could show it at my cremation.
I live in Washington, mostly trail riding with some very quiet road sections. All roads have wide shoulders. I disagree with your statement on dashcam video being inadmissible in court. There are plenty of cases that show otherwise.
jebmke
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Re: Bike Cameras

Post by jebmke »

edgeagg wrote: Wed Jun 23, 2021 7:17 am I live in Washington, mostly trail riding with some very quiet road sections. All roads have wide shoulders. I disagree with your statement on dashcam video being inadmissible in court. There are plenty of cases that show otherwise.
Where did I say it was inadmissible in court? I looked through my posts and couldn't find it. I'll wait.
Don't trust me, look it up. https://www.irs.gov/forms-instructions-and-publications
spitty
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Re: Bike Cameras

Post by spitty »

I'm also an avid road cyclist and have thought about this many times. Few years ago I used the K-edge handlebar mount for a GoPro and it worked well but the battery lasted maybe 2 hours and I didn't feel like carrying an extra. Anyway, most bad things will happen from the rear so that's where you'd want the video; I have heard about the Cycliq Fly 6 and the videos look very good. Two friends have the Varia and love it but a helmet mirror works better for me. I can watch an approaching car to be sure it's moving slightly left to pass me and can also make sure they aren't gonna try to pass on a blind uphill..if so I give a hand signal or move to the center of the lane. I use a Cygolite Hotshot rechargeable tail blinker and a NiteRider headlight blinker. We'll get more respect from drivers by being extra polite--wave them when it's safe to pass on curves, hills, etc, and a thumbs-up when they wait for appropriate times to pass.
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edgeagg
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Re: Bike Cameras

Post by edgeagg »

EddyB wrote: Tue Jun 22, 2021 5:08 pm
hershey102d wrote: Tue Jun 22, 2021 2:56 pm
Don’t recall the last time I saw a bicyclist stop for a stop sign.
People yell at me about that, even though I only roll through when legally allowed.

Get off my lawn?
In Washington State, bikes are legally allowed to slowly roll through stop signs after checking. It is called a safety stop. Frankly, I was hoping for a less politically fraught discussion, but I guess that it is unavoidable these days - sigh.
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edgeagg
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Re: Bike Cameras

Post by edgeagg »

spitty wrote: Wed Jun 23, 2021 7:32 am I'm also an avid road cyclist and have thought about this many times. Few years ago I used the K-edge handlebar mount for a GoPro and it worked well but the battery lasted maybe 2 hours and I didn't feel like carrying an extra. Anyway, most bad things will happen from the rear so that's where you'd want the video; I have heard about the Cycliq Fly 6 and the videos look very good. Two friends have the Varia and love it but a helmet mirror works better for me. I can watch an approaching car to be sure it's moving slightly left to pass me and can also make sure they aren't gonna try to pass on a blind uphill..if so I give a hand signal or move to the center of the lane. I use a Cygolite Hotshot rechargeable tail blinker and a NiteRider headlight blinker. We'll get more respect from drivers by being extra polite--wave them when it's safe to pass on curves, hills, etc, and a thumbs-up when they wait for appropriate times to pass.
I mostly agree. I use flashers 100% of the time (front and rear) and a helmet mirror. My daily ride is between 1.5 - 2 hours and so need the battery to last at least that long. I'll check out the gopro too. In my experience, given where I ride, the left cross and right hook are the more common accident modes. Rear collisions are rare since roads have wide shoulders except in some neighborhoods.

Other failure modes for me have been people with dogs on extensible leashes on the trails - complete with headphones that block out all sounds like a bell etc. This caused me to move to an air horn - used about once per month on the average.
sschoe2
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Re: Bike Cameras

Post by sschoe2 »

hershey102d wrote: Tue Jun 22, 2021 2:56 pm
edgeagg wrote: Tue Jun 22, 2021 1:43 pm . . . to document insane driving behavior that may put me at risk - such as drivers running stop signs or doing stuff that can endanger me.
Don’t recall the last time I saw a bicyclist stop for a stop sign.
I don't recall the last time I saw a car obey the speed limit (unless traffic forced them), and fewer than 50% use turn-signals.
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galawdawg
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Re: Bike Cameras

Post by galawdawg »

edgeagg wrote: Wed Jun 23, 2021 7:53 am
EddyB wrote: Tue Jun 22, 2021 5:08 pm
hershey102d wrote: Tue Jun 22, 2021 2:56 pm
Don’t recall the last time I saw a bicyclist stop for a stop sign.
People yell at me about that, even though I only roll through when legally allowed.

Get off my lawn?
In Washington State, bikes are legally allowed to slowly roll through stop signs after checking. It is called a safety stop. Frankly, I was hoping for a less politically fraught discussion, but I guess that it is unavoidable these days - sigh.
I'm not sure why you consider comments such as the one's you quoted to be "politically fraught." You may have been able to avoid those comments by refraining from explaining in your initial post that you wanted the camera to "just to document insane driving behavior that may put me at risk - such as drivers running stop signs or doing stuff that can endanger me."

Intersection behaviors seem to be a prime source of conflict between motorists and cyclists in our area. You periodically see cyclists riding near the right edge of the roadway pass a line of stopped vehicles at an intersection and maneuver ahead of that line of vehicles, only to have that same line of vehicles back up behind the cyclist once the light changes. Depending on road and traffic conditions, motorists may have to maintain a very reduced speed for a considerable distance due to an inability to safely pass the cyclist. Frustration and discourteous or aggressive driving can result. Some such cyclists (which fortunately appear to be the minority) seem to relish causing such slowdowns as though it is their way of making the point that they get to use the road too. As others noted, common courtesy by both motorists and cyclists goes a long way towards letting everyone safely travel upon our public roadways.

Fortunately, many cities and suburbs have adopted dedicated bike lanes which greatly reduces or eliminates issues such as this.
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edgeagg
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Re: Bike Cameras

Post by edgeagg »

galawdawg wrote: Wed Jun 23, 2021 8:29 am
I'm not sure why you consider comments such as the one's you quoted to be "politically fraught." You may have been able to avoid those comments by refraining from explaining in your initial post that you wanted the camera to "just to document insane driving behavior that may put me at risk - such as drivers running stop signs or doing stuff that can endanger me."

Intersection behaviors seem to be a prime source of conflict between motorists and cyclists in our area. You periodically see cyclists riding near the right edge of the roadway pass a line of stopped vehicles at an intersection and maneuver ahead of that line of vehicles, only to have that same line of vehicles back up behind the cyclist once the light changes. Depending on road and traffic conditions, motorists may have to maintain a very reduced speed for a considerable distance due to an inability to safely pass the cyclist. Frustration and discourteous or aggressive driving can result. Some such cyclists (which fortunately appear to be the minority) seem to relish causing such slowdowns as though it is their way of making the point that they get to use the road too. As others noted, common courtesy by both motorists and cyclists goes a long way towards letting everyone safely travel upon our public roadways.

Fortunately, many cities and suburbs have adopted dedicated bike lanes which greatly reduces or eliminates issues such as this.
I was trying to explain that I needed the camera for evidence, that is all. I believe that we all have to obey the rules of the road, and in addition for cyclists, "Ride like they are trying to kill you" - you may be legally right but still dead. Having someone with a multi-ton vehicle be frustrated at you doesn't do anyone any good.

That said, the focus of the question is basically around equipment - a camera that can record at 1080p for 2 hours and has a waterproof casing for wet Washington State weather.
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Re: Bike Cameras

Post by SmallSaver »

As others have mentioned, various companies make bike-specific combination lights/cameras. I think Cycliq is the best known. I'd go with those over a helmet mounted gopro - you look around quite a bit while biking in the city and may miss what you need to capture (for instance, the rear view, or if something does happen you'll be looking for an escape route rather than at the car in your way).
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edgeagg
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Re: Bike Cameras

Post by edgeagg »

SmallSaver wrote: Wed Jun 23, 2021 10:04 am As others have mentioned, various companies make bike-specific combination lights/cameras. I think Cycliq is the best known. I'd go with those over a helmet mounted gopro - you look around quite a bit while biking in the city and may miss what you need to capture (for instance, the rear view, or if something does happen you'll be looking for an escape route rather than at the car in your way).
Good point. I might need to build an additional mount for all the crap that will otherwise land on my handlebars (light, horn, camera,..)
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Re: Bike Cameras

Post by furwut »

edgeagg wrote: Wed Jun 23, 2021 12:59 pm
SmallSaver wrote: Wed Jun 23, 2021 10:04 am As others have mentioned, various companies make bike-specific combination lights/cameras. I think Cycliq is the best known. I'd go with those over a helmet mounted gopro - you look around quite a bit while biking in the city and may miss what you need to capture (for instance, the rear view, or if something does happen you'll be looking for an escape route rather than at the car in your way).
Good point. I might need to build an additional mount for all the crap that will otherwise land on my handlebars (light, horn, camera,..)
They make things called accessory bars that attach to the stem upon which you can hang all your stuff.
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edgeagg
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Re: Bike Cameras

Post by edgeagg »

Thanks. Wasn't aware of this.
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Re: Bike Cameras

Post by Cycle »

edgeagg wrote: Thu Jun 24, 2021 11:12 am Thanks. Wasn't aware of this.
https://www.bikelaneuprising.com/camera-reviews

Good resource above. Another option would be to find some people who are posting video and dm them on Twitter with thoughts on the camera you want to get.

It's important to know if you want video just in bright light or in low light / night. If it's all bright light, a cheap camera with good image stabilization may work. I do think video could be useful to get some level of justice when you die or are severely injured from a distracted driver.

I think rear facing is more important than front facing, but both are necessary.

I sold my car 5 years ago and do a fair bit of biking around town.
I have wanted to just get a safety camera that captures both front and rear with good image stabilization for evidence when I am killed. I just haven't found the right product.

As often as I use my bike I use shared bikes/scooters, so I've been considering getting two body cameras, one to clip on my collar (back) and one front facing. But I think the image quality would be bad. But it would be enough to show I was in the bike lane when I was right hooked by a box truck or standing still when a drivist running a red light has a collision causing a vehicle to crush me.

I'd be curious what thoughts are on getting two of these mini body cameras, they could also be helmet / hat mounted, I usually wear a wide brimmed straw hat

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B08JH6JTMR/re ... 8KAX7GNCVT

Image
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halfnine
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Re: Bike Cameras

Post by halfnine »

stoptothink wrote: Tue Jun 22, 2021 7:17 pm
protagonist wrote: Tue Jun 22, 2021 5:32 pm I never heard of this.
Would the camera be continuously on and filming whenever you are riding ?

Because if not I cannot imagine you actually capturing bad behavior by a motorist. If a motorist cuts you off and you are not injured, you will either further risk your life trying to photograph his license plate before he zooms away while you are still riding, or you will stop, and by the time you take the photo the driver will almost certainly be gone. And even if it was on continuously and you were lucky enough to capture the deed, what do you think the chances are that the police would do anything about it?

If you actually got injured during an encounter the chances of capturing a hit-and-run would be even less. You would need to rely on either the honesty of the driver who would stop or on the presence of witnesses.

If it was filming continuously, would you have it facing forward? Back? Sideways? Which side? Or would you need four cameras?

I would think that having a camera on your bike would only clutter up your handlebars and make it more desirable to thieves (or another hassle of having to remove it and carry it with you whenever you locked your bike up). Other than that it would be, at best, almost worthless, and at worst, perhaps further put you in danger because of your own reaction in times of anger. Unless I am missing something.

In what proportion of bad cyclist/driver encounters where the rider had a camera has it actually helped? Are there reliable statistics out there that might prove my intuition wrong?

As an avid cyclist myself, I think that all of us who ride have to accept that riding is risky and be willing to accept the risk. The only way to mitigate that risk is to ride safely and wear a helmet. Sort of like investing in index funds instead of playing the lottery. Beyond that, we are at the mercy of the jerks out there.
You aren't missing anything, it makes no sense. As a fellow cyclist myself (who has probably put more miles on a bike than in a car the last two decades), wearing all your gear and not riding like a moron who doesn't have to obey traffic laws puts you ahead of 90% of cyclists out there.
I largely agree with both of you and would be willing to guess that probably 95% of the time a camera would be either unnecessary or not of any relevant interest to any authority that would matter. However, I live in one of the world's major cities and pedestrians, cyclists, and vehicles are all equally dangerous. As there have been cases where cyclists have killed pedestrians who stepped out onto the roadway, having a camera can be a prudent decision provided you are actually not the one at fault.
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edgeagg
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Re: Bike Cameras

Post by edgeagg »

Cycle wrote: Thu Jun 24, 2021 3:12 pm
edgeagg wrote: Thu Jun 24, 2021 11:12 am Thanks. Wasn't aware of this.
https://www.bikelaneuprising.com/camera-reviews

Good resource above. Another option would be to find some people who are posting video and dm them on Twitter with thoughts on the camera you want to get.

It's important to know if you want video just in bright light or in low light / night. If it's all bright light, a cheap camera with good image stabilization may work. I do think video could be useful to get some level of justice when you die or are severely injured from a distracted driver.

I think rear facing is more important than front facing, but both are necessary.

I sold my car 5 years ago and do a fair bit of biking around town.
I have wanted to just get a safety camera that captures both front and rear with good image stabilization for evidence when I am killed. I just haven't found the right product.

As often as I use my bike I use shared bikes/scooters, so I've been considering getting two body cameras, one to clip on my collar (back) and one front facing. But I think the image quality would be bad. But it would be enough to show I was in the bike lane when I was right hooked by a box truck or standing still when a drivist running a red light has a collision causing a vehicle to crush me.

I'd be curious what thoughts are on getting two of these mini body cameras, they could also be helmet / hat mounted, I usually wear a wide brimmed straw hat

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B08JH6JTMR/re ... 8KAX7GNCVT

Image
In my case all my riding is daytime and at off-peak hours. Most of the issues I've had are of drivers running stop signs or right hooks. As I said, I do use a helmet mirror too and run bright flashers 100% of the time. I will take a look see at the links. Thanks!!
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Re: Bike Cameras

Post by WhyNotUs »

I think you can get it down to a GoPro or Ghost Drift if you want to save a bunch of time. The price and features will help you decide efficiently. I do not have one but borrowed a GoPro in the past to see what it was like.
Recently did a 450 mile ride on a parkway and there were a few times when I would have like a rear mounted one just to see if people were smiling when the drive close to me.
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Re: Bike Cameras

Post by Cycle »

Something like GoPro max would be nice bc it has image stabilization and 360 video

One could clamp it on the left end of the handlebar, and therefore quick put it on whatever bike you're using.

Or get one if the heros with good image stabilization, like 7-9
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bikesandbeers
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Re: Bike Cameras

Post by bikesandbeers »

I have a Cycliq camera. The police will generally laugh if you try to report a car passing close to you, but it is good to document aggressive/dangerous drivers in case the hit an actual cyclist in the the future.

The Mandeville Canyon road rage doc got prison partly because folks had documented aggressive behavior in the past
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