Marantec: Are Rolling Code Garage Door Openers Really Necessary?
Marantec: Are Rolling Code Garage Door Openers Really Necessary?
[2021 thread bumped in 2023 --admin LadyGeek]
I've anchored on a Marantec Synergy 370B DC belt drive because it is supposedly the quietest garage door opener available today. But it doesn't have a rolling code feature which has been standard on Genie and LiftMaster/Chamberlain openers for decades.
7% of burglaries occur through the garage, often unlocked by hooking the opener release with a coat hanger, but also when the door has been left open. Entry via hacking the opener with a modified child's toy, although scary, seems not at all common, but now it is even technically possible to use several different devices together to beat the most modern rolling code - if the thief can act quickly enough after snaring an unused code.
https://smarthomestarter.com/can-garage ... -included/
But electrical engineers tend not to be burglars. Real burglars might find it less mentally taxing to just break a window.
Genie and LiftMaster/Chamberlain tout their own rolling code technologies, while Marantec USA describes something called "extremely secure multi-bit code technology", but says literally nothing about it on its website. But Marantec Germany positively trumpets its own proprietary rolling code technology called "bi-link". So if rolling code is not a thing, why is it so promoted in Europe and not at all present in products sold here? I tried to talk to somebody at MUSA, but so far, crickets.
https://www.marantec.com/en/accessories ... ystem.html
My question: For those of you with Marantec garage door openers, is hacking something you worry about? Or is there some secret security feature of Marantec USA openers that foils hacks.
I would appreciate any comments.
I've anchored on a Marantec Synergy 370B DC belt drive because it is supposedly the quietest garage door opener available today. But it doesn't have a rolling code feature which has been standard on Genie and LiftMaster/Chamberlain openers for decades.
7% of burglaries occur through the garage, often unlocked by hooking the opener release with a coat hanger, but also when the door has been left open. Entry via hacking the opener with a modified child's toy, although scary, seems not at all common, but now it is even technically possible to use several different devices together to beat the most modern rolling code - if the thief can act quickly enough after snaring an unused code.
https://smarthomestarter.com/can-garage ... -included/
But electrical engineers tend not to be burglars. Real burglars might find it less mentally taxing to just break a window.
Genie and LiftMaster/Chamberlain tout their own rolling code technologies, while Marantec USA describes something called "extremely secure multi-bit code technology", but says literally nothing about it on its website. But Marantec Germany positively trumpets its own proprietary rolling code technology called "bi-link". So if rolling code is not a thing, why is it so promoted in Europe and not at all present in products sold here? I tried to talk to somebody at MUSA, but so far, crickets.
https://www.marantec.com/en/accessories ... ystem.html
My question: For those of you with Marantec garage door openers, is hacking something you worry about? Or is there some secret security feature of Marantec USA openers that foils hacks.
I would appreciate any comments.
"Plans are useless; planning is indispensable.” (Dwight Eisenhower) |
"Man plans, God laughs" (Yiddish proverb)
Re: Marantec: Are Rolling Code Garage Door Openers Really Necessary?
I wouldn’t buy an opener without rolling codes. While some might just break a window, there are burglars who only use opener mimicking. I use a chamberlain belt drive that is quiet enough.
Re: Marantec: Are Rolling Code Garage Door Openers Really Necessary?
My garage door makes the noise it makes even when the robotic door opener is not used. That is, almost ALL of the noise happens even when manually opening and closing the garage door. It never occurred to me to get a quieter robotic opener as I wouldn't even notice whether it was making any noise or not.
Re: Marantec: Are Rolling Code Garage Door Openers Really Necessary?
This seems like a acceptable burglary entry opportunity provided you feel safe in your neighborhood in general. I have a rebranded Marantec system, with rolling codes, and it's been fine. I was more worried about it working correctly then being abused by burglars. You could lock the door between the garage and the house which eliminates the Marantec as the source of your concern.
Re: Marantec: Are Rolling Code Garage Door Openers Really Necessary?
My read of their technology pagehttps://www.marantec.com/en/our-promise/technology.html indicates they have rolling code feature:
"Marantec radio system bi·linked
bi·linked is our radio standard that is used in all our radio hand transmitters and radio accessories. bi·linked was developed by our experienced engineers and is produced in our own factories. bi·linked technology works with 128-bit encryption, which is the same key as is used in online banking. At the same time, it also uses a rolling code, which means that it transmits a different code to the opener every time the opening button is pressed, which makes it near impossible for the code to be copied or decoded."
The closest helping hand is at the end of your own arm.
Re: Marantec: Are Rolling Code Garage Door Openers Really Necessary?
This is the German website.123 wrote: ↑Sun Apr 11, 2021 3:51 pmMy read of their technology pagehttps://www.marantec.com/en/our-promise/technology.html indicates they have rolling code feature:
"Marantec radio system bi·linked
bi·linked is our radio standard that is used in all our radio hand transmitters and radio accessories. bi·linked was developed by our experienced engineers and is produced in our own factories. bi·linked technology works with 128-bit encryption, which is the same key as is used in online banking. At the same time, it also uses a rolling code, which means that it transmits a different code to the opener every time the opening button is pressed, which makes it near impossible for the code to be copied or decoded."
The USA website is here. Nada.
https://www.marantecamerica.com/
"Plans are useless; planning is indispensable.” (Dwight Eisenhower) |
"Man plans, God laughs" (Yiddish proverb)
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Re: Marantec: Are Rolling Code Garage Door Openers Really Necessary?
I would just buy whatever garage door I wanted, rolling code or not. I have never heard of anyone personally who has had their garage door broken in by code mimicry although I'm sure it is possible.
Also like someone else mentioned above, I have a Chamberlain and it isn't the motor that I hear when it gets opened but the clatter of the wheels in the track. Unless I am in the kitchen right next to the garage, I don't hear a thing.
Also like someone else mentioned above, I have a Chamberlain and it isn't the motor that I hear when it gets opened but the clatter of the wheels in the track. Unless I am in the kitchen right next to the garage, I don't hear a thing.
Re: Marantec: Are Rolling Code Garage Door Openers Really Necessary?
Some people don't lock their front door, is it necessary that they should lock it? I don't know, but it seems like a very simple measure to keep from being an easy target of opportunity.
"To achieve satisfactory investment results is easier than most people realize; to achieve superior results is harder than it looks." - Benjamin Graham
Re: Marantec: Are Rolling Code Garage Door Openers Really Necessary?
This is the truth. The majority of the noise is caused by the metal roller wheels of the door, banging against the steel rails they move through to open and close the door. It’s that metal banging on metal sound that most people are hearing.livesoft wrote: ↑Sun Apr 11, 2021 3:43 pm My garage door makes the noise it makes even when the robotic door opener is not used. That is, almost ALL of the noise happens even when manually opening and closing the garage door. It never occurred to me to get a quieter robotic opener as I wouldn't even notice whether it was making any noise or not.
If you are super interested in quieter operation, get your tracks aligned, and replace the door rollers with vinyl coated ones. https://www.amazon.com/HardwareXsupply- ... RydWU&th=1
And if you’re not sure where the noise comes from, just disconnect the opener, and fun it a couple of times.
I’m actually surprised anybody makes an opener that doesn’t use rolling codes anymore.
Re: Marantec: Are Rolling Code Garage Door Openers Really Necessary?
Every time I have bought an obscure brand of anything I have eventually come to regret it (parts availability, service availability, general weirdness).
My experience has been that Liftmaster works very well, Genie not quite as good, but they work, and all others are unknowns.
My Liftmaster is 15 years old and is very quiet. I wouldn't even think about a different brand.
My experience has been that Liftmaster works very well, Genie not quite as good, but they work, and all others are unknowns.
My Liftmaster is 15 years old and is very quiet. I wouldn't even think about a different brand.
Answering a question is easy -- asking the right question is the hard part.
Re: Marantec: Are Rolling Code Garage Door Openers Really Necessary?
OP here.
I agree that a garage door opener is merely one aspect of having a quiet overall door operation. Other factors include the robustness of the door and whether it's insulated, the proper adjustment of the track and whether it's curve radius is greater than the minimum of 12 inches, the number of ball bearings in each wheel and the composition of their rolling surfaces, and the strength and ease of flexing of the door's hinges.
My dealer sells Genie and Liftmaster, but insists that I will be happiest with the Marantec. He claims to have never heard of a burglar remotely hacking a modern garage door opener and speculated that like horsepower, rolling code is now just a marketing thing. He was more than happy to sell me a Liftmaster 8550, but said I'd be better off with the Marantec 370 as he says it is noticeably quieter. BTW, the opener is just 6% of the total cost of the project, so a bit cheaper or a bit more expensive makes no difference to either party.
I pulled the trigger, but I'd still like to hear from Marantec owners......
I agree that a garage door opener is merely one aspect of having a quiet overall door operation. Other factors include the robustness of the door and whether it's insulated, the proper adjustment of the track and whether it's curve radius is greater than the minimum of 12 inches, the number of ball bearings in each wheel and the composition of their rolling surfaces, and the strength and ease of flexing of the door's hinges.
My dealer sells Genie and Liftmaster, but insists that I will be happiest with the Marantec. He claims to have never heard of a burglar remotely hacking a modern garage door opener and speculated that like horsepower, rolling code is now just a marketing thing. He was more than happy to sell me a Liftmaster 8550, but said I'd be better off with the Marantec 370 as he says it is noticeably quieter. BTW, the opener is just 6% of the total cost of the project, so a bit cheaper or a bit more expensive makes no difference to either party.
I pulled the trigger, but I'd still like to hear from Marantec owners......
"Plans are useless; planning is indispensable.” (Dwight Eisenhower) |
"Man plans, God laughs" (Yiddish proverb)
Re: Marantec: Are Rolling Code Garage Door Openers Really Necessary?
I couldn't find anything other than the text already quoted from the Marantec website.
I've reached out to Marantec and asked if their bi-linked devices are protected against attacks as described here: https://www.wired.com/2015/08/hackers-t ... s-garages/ . I'll let you know if I hear from Marantec.
I've reached out to Marantec and asked if their bi-linked devices are protected against attacks as described here: https://www.wired.com/2015/08/hackers-t ... s-garages/ . I'll let you know if I hear from Marantec.
Re: Marantec: Are Rolling Code Garage Door Openers Really Necessary?
Quick update.
The reply from Marantec did not contain more technical information then what is available on their website.
I tried to receive the code transmitted by my garage's remote while being out of range, and then playing it back at the garage with a Flipper Zero. No success.
While this does not prove that the system is or isn't susceptible to a rolljam attack it does at least give me some confidence that this attack is not in the range of script kiddies at this moment.
The reply from Marantec did not contain more technical information then what is available on their website.
I tried to receive the code transmitted by my garage's remote while being out of range, and then playing it back at the garage with a Flipper Zero. No success.
While this does not prove that the system is or isn't susceptible to a rolljam attack it does at least give me some confidence that this attack is not in the range of script kiddies at this moment.
Re: Marantec: Are Rolling Code Garage Door Openers Really Necessary?
Thanks for following up. It's good to hear that there's no readily available hack on the internets yet.
The Marantec has been so quiet that I only know someone has come home when the door to the garage into the house opens. The opening of the garage door is also undetectable from the bedroom over the garage.
The Marantec rep has been out twice to address issues that the installer was supposedly responsible for. It turns out that the installation was botched, but with the rep and me getting on ladders we managed to get the system working properly. But DW & I still wait for the garage to completely close (and stay closed) before motoring away or closing the door going into the house.
Nevertheless, I am very happy with the investment now. What I learned though, is garage door replacement can indeed be overthought. There's a lot to be said about having the lowest feature, but highest quality motor and "technicians" that have extensive experience with all the exact components selected. Perfect installation is essential. I hate having to redo work that I already paid for.
Knowing what I know now though, I would have been more receptive to American marketed, but China manufactured, garage door openers.
The Marantec has been so quiet that I only know someone has come home when the door to the garage into the house opens. The opening of the garage door is also undetectable from the bedroom over the garage.
The Marantec rep has been out twice to address issues that the installer was supposedly responsible for. It turns out that the installation was botched, but with the rep and me getting on ladders we managed to get the system working properly. But DW & I still wait for the garage to completely close (and stay closed) before motoring away or closing the door going into the house.
Nevertheless, I am very happy with the investment now. What I learned though, is garage door replacement can indeed be overthought. There's a lot to be said about having the lowest feature, but highest quality motor and "technicians" that have extensive experience with all the exact components selected. Perfect installation is essential. I hate having to redo work that I already paid for.
Knowing what I know now though, I would have been more receptive to American marketed, but China manufactured, garage door openers.
"Plans are useless; planning is indispensable.” (Dwight Eisenhower) |
"Man plans, God laughs" (Yiddish proverb)