Bathroom remodel with no GC?

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Topic Author
Sagefemme
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Bathroom remodel with no GC?

Post by Sagefemme »

I am embarking on a bathroom remodel. My house was built in 1939. The bathroom has had a small "face lift" at some point since then, but it's still old and dated in appearance. There is only one electrical outlet, for example (and it's not a GFCI). I want to remodel this bathroom but not to be a very shiny, new-looking bathroom that doesn't match the rest of the house. I love my kitchen which is also "period" in that it has the original fir floor, painted wood cabinets, formica countertops, etc. I want the bathroom to look pretty much original, but better! For example 1930s bathrooms were full of pink and mint green tile; I want tile (surrounding the tub and possibly the lower half of the walls, and on the floor) but not pink and green! I have a 1940s sink and cast iron bath tub that I got at a salvage yard (the "new" tub is exactly the same dimensions as the current tub) that I would like to use. I will get a new toilet, as the new fixtures are white and the current toilet is peach colored.

My actual question is what you all think about not having a contractor manage the job. All fixtures will stay in their current locations. I need new electric, probably some new piping, installation of sink, tub, and toilet, new vanity probably with a formica top, and tile work. I was hoping to "manage" the job myself. I have two plumbers coming next week to bid. I will need an electrician and a tile setter. I have detailed ideas about materials for tile and countertops. I feel prepared to do the demo and hang new wallboard and paint. I'm generally pretty handy. However I've never done a bathroom remodel. I am not opposed to paying a general contractor but in my town they are all incredibly busy and not available for months and months. I like DIY projects but maybe there are things I don't know about bathrooms that will mess me up! I do need to find a way to draw up plans, and find out about permits. Seeking your considered advice!
rebellovw
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Re: Bathroom remodel with no GC?

Post by rebellovw »

Sagefemme wrote: Thu Apr 08, 2021 3:36 pm I am embarking on a bathroom remodel. My house was built in 1939. The bathroom has had a small "face lift" at some point since then, but it's still old and dated in appearance. There is only one electrical outlet, for example (and it's not a GFCI). I want to remodel this bathroom but not to be a very shiny, new-looking bathroom that doesn't match the rest of the house. I love my kitchen which is also "period" in that it has the original fir floor, painted wood cabinets, formica countertops, etc. I want the bathroom to look pretty much original, but better! For example 1930s bathrooms were full of pink and mint green tile; I want tile (surrounding the tub and possibly the lower half of the walls, and on the floor) but not pink and green! I have a 1940s sink and cast iron bath tub that I got at a salvage yard (the "new" tub is exactly the same dimensions as the current tub) that I would like to use. I will get a new toilet, as the new fixtures are white and the current toilet is peach colored.

My actual question is what you all think about not having a contractor manage the job. All fixtures will stay in their current locations. I need new electric, probably some new piping, installation of sink, tub, and toilet, new vanity probably with a formica top, and tile work. I was hoping to "manage" the job myself. I have two plumbers coming next week to bid. I will need an electrician and a tile setter. I have detailed ideas about materials for tile and countertops. I feel prepared to do the demo and hang new wallboard and paint. I'm generally pretty handy. However I've never done a bathroom remodel. I am not opposed to paying a general contractor but in my town they are all incredibly busy and not available for months and months. I like DIY projects but maybe there are things I don't know about bathrooms that will mess me up! I do need to find a way to draw up plans, and find out about permits. Seeking your considered advice!
New tub - is questionable - I'd probably lean towards a GC.

My last house was 1932 art decco - and I remodeled the bathroom - the previous owners painted all tile pink and installed this ugly French vanity.

They also installed linoleum.

I removed the toilet, stripped the paint off all tile - removed the linoleum - and found beautiful tile underneath (which I restored.)

I installed a nice pedestal sink, new faucet that matches the art deco on one the tub - rewired the lights from a center light to two side lights.

I did all this myself - came out great - nothing too risky - and no major changes.

I did it myself because:
- I can do electrical work, plumbing, sheetrock (and make it work with plaster and lathe) paint etc. I'm doing my current bathroom and subing out just the tile work.
Topic Author
Sagefemme
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Re: Bathroom remodel with no GC?

Post by Sagefemme »

New tub - is questionable - I'd probably lean towards a GC.
Curious why the tub specifically makes you lean that way? Both the old and the new tubs are heavy, heavy, cast iron things, which makes them a big challenge to move around. But I'm figuring if the old tub has been in place since the house was built, and the "new" tub has the same dimensions, it should slide right in!! It's a slide into an alcove type, with a skirt.

I like taking baths and am opposed to newfangled tubs that seem to be made out of plastic. Also for some reason it's difficult to find a tub that is both deep enough for a satisfying bath, and that has an angled back rest. The tub original to the house is deep and wide but for some reason the back is at right angles, so you can't recline comfortably.

I spent considerable time looking a new new tubs and could not find what I want for under about $3000, which seemed crazy expensive.
rebellovw
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Re: Bathroom remodel with no GC?

Post by rebellovw »

My concern would be what it looks like when you rip the old tub out. Will there be any water damage - will the replacement tub have a slightly different shape - perhaps clawfoot - needing a new floor tiled in.

If your plumber is like - hey I can swap this out no biggy - then sounds like you are good to go.

If you have pro's doing all the work and you are not changing anything fundamentally - I think you are probably fine with managing them w/o a GC. That's kind of how I do it - a mixture of my self and Pros.

Best of luck!
mgensler
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Re: Bathroom remodel with no GC?

Post by mgensler »

We done projects both with and without a GC. Both have their issues. A GC should have connections to contractors and should be able to get them to show. A bathroom is a pretty small project. If you find a plumber and tile setter that you trust, that's half the battle.
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F150HD
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Re: Bathroom remodel with no GC?

Post by F150HD »

My house was built in 1939.
how much galvanized pipe is still in your house?
rebellovw
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Re: Bathroom remodel with no GC?

Post by rebellovw »

F150HD wrote: Thu Apr 08, 2021 8:18 pm
My house was built in 1939.
how much galvanized pipe is still in your house?
Yeah - that Galvanized pipe sucks but can be dealt with - I just used a screw driver to break up all the black nasty stuff at the point where the angle valve is attached - then flush it out - install new angle valve - good for many more years.
rascott
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Re: Bathroom remodel with no GC?

Post by rascott »

We are doing a similar project this year on a guest bath. 1930 house. We did a main floor bathroom that was more involved as it was converting a very tight and poorly designed 3/4 bath into a proper half bath/ powder room.

The demo on it was insane. Think think plaster walls that were almost like masonry walls. Lots of deeply embedded wall/floor tile. Took two guys two full days to fully demo a 4x9 area. Also a major dust mess. Something to keep in mind. We joked that we should have kept it for a bomb/ storm shelter.

But there was nothing exactly highly complex. The plumber did all the rough in work in a long day (though they made errors that had to be later fixed) . The electrical changes were pretty simple and quick.

Then it was simply insulation, drywall and tile work. I would have had no issue being the GC, but the crew that did it were a small contractor that typically worked as subs for bigger jobs. So just let them handle it start to finish.

Since you aren't making any real big changes one option is to hire a small (licensed) GC that does most of their own work. Think a 1-2 man shop. They may sub a few things, but mainly will be the owner/operator doing the actual work..... but hiring the individual trades yourself is a fine option.
jcpct
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Re: Bathroom remodel with no GC?

Post by jcpct »

I had my master bath remodeled last year. My carpenter acted as the GC. He did the simple electrical work himself and also had a plumber connection for that stuff. Worked out fine. I don't think you need a specific GC.
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lthenderson
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Re: Bathroom remodel with no GC?

Post by lthenderson »

Sagefemme wrote: Thu Apr 08, 2021 3:36 pm My actual question is what you all think about not having a contractor manage the job.
In my experience, not having a general contractor when it sounds like you are going to sub out much of the work if not all of it, means the project will probably take five times as long (if not longer) than it would under a general contractor. The reason is that finding, quoting, scheduling and getting those subs to the job site in back to back order is impossible and there will invariably be weeks that go by with nobody there and a non-working bathroom. General contractors will have access subs that do lots of work for them and will be able to get them in much faster. They probably have people or know people who are licensed to do plumbing and electrical work as well as do all the other work.

I have remodeled all my own bathrooms. But if I wasn't going to do all the work, I would most definitely get a GC so that it gets done in a timely manner.
Topic Author
Sagefemme
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Re: Bathroom remodel with no GC?

Post by Sagefemme »

F150HD wrote: Thu Apr 08, 2021 8:18 pm
My house was built in 1939.
how much galvanized pipe is still in your house?
I suspect there is lots of whatever pipe was used when the house was built. Sounds like you guys suspect galvanized, so that might be a complication.

I imagine demo will be a LOT of work. I tried to find some You Tube videos of an old, alcove style cast iron tub being removed intact (it's in great shape and vintage; I imagined donating it to the local salvage/recycle place). Only thing I could find was young, strong guys breaking cast iron tubs into pieces with huge sledge hammers! Not what I had in mind, but I suppose I could hire some young muscle.

It makes sense that managing the project myself will result in delays. Luckily it's only my husband and me in the house and we have another full bath that we will use while this project is ongoing. I think tile will be the piece that takes the longest. I am picky about things and want a really excellent tile setter to do the walls and floor. Replacement tub is the same size and style as the old one, alcove-style with a "skirt," so no new floor should need to be tiled in.

Thanks for all the advice, all!
rebellovw
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Re: Bathroom remodel with no GC?

Post by rebellovw »

I wouldn't consider the galvanized pipe too much of a complication as you can easily get iron pipe and the parts necessary at any hardware store.

It never interfered with my many projects at that house - new sink, water heater, bath.

Sure it is nice to get rid of and replace - but that is a different expense and may not be justifiable. It wasn't for me.
michaeljc70
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Re: Bathroom remodel with no GC?

Post by michaeljc70 »

lthenderson wrote: Fri Apr 09, 2021 10:35 am
Sagefemme wrote: Thu Apr 08, 2021 3:36 pm My actual question is what you all think about not having a contractor manage the job.
In my experience, not having a general contractor when it sounds like you are going to sub out much of the work if not all of it, means the project will probably take five times as long (if not longer) than it would under a general contractor. The reason is that finding, quoting, scheduling and getting those subs to the job site in back to back order is impossible and there will invariably be weeks that go by with nobody there and a non-working bathroom. General contractors will have access subs that do lots of work for them and will be able to get them in much faster. They probably have people or know people who are licensed to do plumbing and electrical work as well as do all the other work.

I have remodeled all my own bathrooms. But if I wasn't going to do all the work, I would most definitely get a GC so that it gets done in a timely manner.
I was actually thinking the opposite. On a small job like this the contractor may send workers when they are free and prioritize them on bigger jobs. That is an issue where I live whether using a GC or not. They like working bigger jobs.
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Bogle7
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DIY

Post by Bogle7 »

1. You can do it. It just takes time and energy.

2. Add an electrical outlet behind the toilet for the [some day] washlet.

3. Replace all the plumbing with modern. Either PEX or copper. If copper, read this — https://www.bobvila.com/articles/copper-pipe-types/

4. Go down to the studs and sub-flooring. Replace the sub-floor if there is any concern. 3/4-inch marine-grade plywood is a good choice.

5. I say "no" to Formica countertop. Go with marble or better yet, quartz that looks like marble.

6. If feasible, install radiant in-floor heating.

7. Black and green tile looks great!

8. Plan (in writing) and then plan some more. Spec everything. Down to the drywall (oops, I meant Durock) screws.

9. Consider installing a fan. This is good — https://na.panasonic.com/us/home-and-bu ... ulti-speed

10. If the bathroom has a window, now is the time to rehab it.

11. Consider installing a towel warmer. We have this brand — https://runtalnorthamerica.com/residential-radiators/
Old fart who does three index stock funds, baby.
humblecoder
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Re: Bathroom remodel with no GC?

Post by humblecoder »

Many many years ago in our first house, we "remodeled" our kitchen without a GC. We generally kept the layout the same, but we swapped out the cabinets, new countertop and backsplash, new appliances, and updated electrical outlets.

We went to a Home Depot retailer with our measurements and they used some sort of computer program to order the materials and have them delivered to the house. We hired an experienced handyman to handle the installation of the cabinets, countertop, and backsplash. Separately hired an electrician to do the electrical updates and we had the appliance store do the appliance installation.
Topic Author
Sagefemme
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Re: DIY

Post by Sagefemme »

Bogle7 wrote: Fri Apr 09, 2021 4:12 pm 1. You can do it. It just takes time and energy.
I was hoping someone would say this!! I have both time and energy.
2. Add an electrical outlet behind the toilet for the [some day] washlet.
Yes!! I have a washlet in the other bathroom and love it, even though there is an electrical cord stretching across the room.
3. Replace all the plumbing with modern. Either PEX or copper. If copper, read this — https://www.bobvila.com/articles/copper-pipe-types/
I will read--thank you. I have 2 plumbers coming next week to give me an idea of cost.
4. Go down to the studs and sub-flooring. Replace the sub-floor if there is any concern. 3/4-inch marine-grade plywood is a good choice.
This is part of the plan.
5. I say "no" to Formica countertop. Go with marble or better yet, quartz that looks like marble.
Just curious why the neg on Formica. Remember it's a period remodel; no one had marble in a bathroom in a middle class home in the 1930s or 1940s.
6. If feasible, install radiant in-floor heating.
I have thought about this. The other bathroom in the house has radiant in-floor heat, although that room in on a concete slab, which I thought worked better for floor heat than an ordinary floor (with a room below it).
7. Black and green tile looks great!
Still working on the color scheme!
8. Plan (in writing) and then plan some more. Spec everything. Down to the drywall (oops, I meant Durock) screws.
Yes to this.
9. Consider installing a fan. This is good — https://na.panasonic.com/us/home-and-bu ... ulti-speed
Yes, I live in the Pacific Northwest. We have enough issues with moisture already.
10. If the bathroom has a window, now is the time to rehab it.
There is an (old) window. You're right, it would be smart to replace.
11. Consider installing a towel warmer. We have this brand — https://runtalnorthamerica.com/residential-radiators/
I have always wanted a towel warmer. In fact I have one sitting in the garage (some Italian brand) I bought at the same salvage place I got the sink and tub. Originally quite expensive. I was thinking this serves as both towel warmer and room heat, which would be easier than the heat in floor.
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