Time to ditch Tivo?

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Topic Author
bluebolt
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Joined: Sat Jan 14, 2017 8:01 am

Time to ditch Tivo?

Post by bluebolt »

I've been a Tivo user since relatively early days and have saved lots of money by not having to rent cable boxes. I've generally bought year or two old models with lifetime service and overall have gotten a lot of value out of them. Also have Tivo minis which allow a whole home experience without monthly fees.

However, because Tivo DVRs are on a non-Android OS, the streaming/app options are pretty limited. The Tivo Stream 4K is Android based, so it supports lots of apps, but there is no plan to integrate existing DVRs/program guides with the Tivo Stream.

If I cut the cord, which I am likely to do, live TV viewing/recording would require me getting a new main Tivo box (either discontinued Bolt OTA/Cable, the Bolt OTA, or the Edge OTA) which seems like a dead-end investment due to the non-commitment to new app support and the lack of integration with the Tivo Stream or any other streaming device.

The FCC has ended the requirement for cable companies to support CableCards, so at some point my current equipment will become obsolete.

Which is all a long way of saying that it seems like time to ditch Tivo. Any reason not to?
Da5id
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Re: Time to ditch Tivo?

Post by Da5id »

bluebolt wrote: Wed Mar 10, 2021 3:53 pm Which is all a long way of saying that it seems like time to ditch Tivo. Any reason not to?
Guess that depends on what your needs are going forward.

I have a TiVo, but haven't had cable in a long time. I use the TiVo to record OTA shows I care about. Which are VERY few now, some football during the season but I don't care about that as much as I once did. I prefer to watch football on TiVo starting maybe 90 minutes into the game. I mostly watch streaming services these days, and use my Smart TVs for that rather than the TiVo.
Topic Author
bluebolt
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Re: Time to ditch Tivo?

Post by bluebolt »

Da5id wrote: Wed Mar 10, 2021 3:56 pm
bluebolt wrote: Wed Mar 10, 2021 3:53 pm Which is all a long way of saying that it seems like time to ditch Tivo. Any reason not to?
Guess that depends on what your needs are going forward.

I have a TiVo, but haven't had cable in a long time. I use the TiVo to record OTA shows I care about. Which are VERY few now, some football during the season but I don't care about that as much as I once did. I prefer to watch football on TiVo starting maybe 90 minutes into the game. I mostly watch streaming services these days, and use my Smart TVs for that rather than the TiVo.
Since I would need to get a new Tivo to record OTA, it seems to make more sense to get an OTA DVR that integrates with Roku, Amazon, etc, rather than a Tivo.
sc9182
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Re: Time to ditch Tivo?

Post by sc9182 »

bluebolt wrote: Wed Mar 10, 2021 4:06 pm
Da5id wrote: Wed Mar 10, 2021 3:56 pm
bluebolt wrote: Wed Mar 10, 2021 3:53 pm Which is all a long way of saying that it seems like time to ditch Tivo. Any reason not to?
Guess that depends on what your needs are going forward.

I have a TiVo, but haven't had cable in a long time. I use the TiVo to record OTA shows I care about. Which are VERY few now, some football during the season but I don't care about that as much as I once did. I prefer to watch football on TiVo starting maybe 90 minutes into the game. I mostly watch streaming services these days, and use my Smart TVs for that rather than the TiVo.
Since I would need to get a new Tivo to record OTA, it seems to make more sense to get an OTA DVR that integrates with Roku, Amazon, etc, rather than a Tivo.
Our lifetime TiVo hard disk conked - doesn’t even boot now.

On recent sale picked up Tablo:

Tablo - DUAL LITE OTA DVR with WiFi - Black
Model: TDNS2B-01-CN. $99 (or can get $79 refurbished unit from Tablo)
Along With:
WD - Easystore 2TB External USB 3.0 Portable Hard Drive - Black
Model: WDBAJN0020BBK-WESN $62

Yes - Tablo got app for Roku, and Amazon Fire. I think we get 1-day TV guide & plenty recording capacity of 2TB drive we bought.

Make sure change your settings to 1080p 60fps - especially if you are on wired Ethernet and 4K TV !!

One thing many card cutters can benefit from this App model is: you connect Antenna at best possible location in your home/attic ., hook up to Tablo right there (without long cable - which could weaken signal) - you get full clarity signal, and many more channels on multiple devices/ROKU/Fire/TVs. With regular TiVo - you are forced to hook it next to TV, and watch it only on one TV.
Last edited by sc9182 on Wed Mar 10, 2021 5:43 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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5th_Dimension
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Re: Time to ditch Tivo?

Post by 5th_Dimension »

Long time TiVo user who dumped them several years ago and went to Channels. It takes a bit of technical expertise to set it up but it is a very good system.

https://getchannels.com
Pick up a penny and soon you'll have many.
bloom2708
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Re: Time to ditch Tivo?

Post by bloom2708 »

We have a Fire TV Recast DVR to record OTA.

Integrated with all our Fire TV cubes and sticks.

Quite a few good options these days.
chemocean
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Re: Time to ditch Tivo?

Post by chemocean »

If you have an unencrypted broadcast signal, get a IVIEW 3500STBII. Its a analogous digital converter that happens to be able to record the digital signal to usb medium storage (64 g flashdrive to a 1 tetrbyte harddrive). It is a digital VCR for upfront cost of $40 plus the storage device.
Anzio2824
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Re: Time to ditch Tivo?

Post by Anzio2824 »

We are in month 24 of 24 Dish Preferred Customer pricing with Hopper3 DVR. Paying about $55 for 120 channels and Hopper3 DVR; no other boxes or local channels. Dish provided a OTA tuner that integrated locals into the Dish guide and we used DishAnywhere app on Roku and FireTV sticks on TVs to access all content (streamed from from the Hopper3 DVR).

We are going with Sling Blue Plan ($35/mo for almost identical programming and ability for 3 streams). Orange Plan has 1 stream for same $35 and has ESPN. You can switch back and forth for $35, or you can get both for $50. Each come with cloud DVR of $50 hours or can upgrade to 200 hours for $5.

For locals, you can get Sling's AirTV2 ($99; need to add a hard drive to DVR storage) or AirTV Anywhere ($199; includes 1 TB storage). When connected to router, the locals are streamed to the Sling App on you roku/fireTV/similar devices and are integrated into the Sling guide along with any subscribed channels. If you don't want a subscription, the locals can stilled be streamed to the free Sling app.

If you are a new customer and prepay 3 months, you can get the AirTV Anywhere and HD antenna for $99 or AirTV 2, HD antenna and an AirTV Mini (similar to roku or fireTV). No obligations other than the 3 month pre-pay.
Topic Author
bluebolt
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Re: Time to ditch Tivo?

Post by bluebolt »

Anzio2824 wrote: Wed Mar 10, 2021 7:09 pm We are in month 24 of 24 Dish Preferred Customer pricing with Hopper3 DVR. Paying about $55 for 120 channels and Hopper3 DVR; no other boxes or local channels. Dish provided a OTA tuner that integrated locals into the Dish guide and we used DishAnywhere app on Roku and FireTV sticks on TVs to access all content (streamed from from the Hopper3 DVR).

We are going with Sling Blue Plan ($35/mo for almost identical programming and ability for 3 streams). Orange Plan has 1 stream for same $35 and has ESPN. You can switch back and forth for $35, or you can get both for $50. Each come with cloud DVR of $50 hours or can upgrade to 200 hours for $5.

For locals, you can get Sling's AirTV2 ($99; need to add a hard drive to DVR storage) or AirTV Anywhere ($199; includes 1 TB storage). When connected to router, the locals are streamed to the Sling App on you roku/fireTV/similar devices and are integrated into the Sling guide along with any subscribed channels. If you don't want a subscription, the locals can stilled be streamed to the free Sling app.

If you are a new customer and prepay 3 months, you can get the AirTV Anywhere and HD antenna for $99 or AirTV 2, HD antenna and an AirTV Mini (similar to roku or fireTV). No obligations other than the 3 month pre-pay.
Hadn't seen this option. Thanks for pointing it out. Looks like the AirTV2 (2 Tuners) or the AirTV Anywhere (4 Tuners) can only show one local live stream at a time. Amazon Recast 1TB (4 tuners) can show 2 streams simultaneously.
atomicrc11
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Re: Time to ditch Tivo?

Post by atomicrc11 »

If you just want to watch local TV via streaming, you can use Locast (https://www.locast.org). It's a non-profit so you can donate if you wish. The drawback is that it does not cover the whole US yet.
Topic Author
bluebolt
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Re: Time to ditch Tivo?

Post by bluebolt »

atomicrc11 wrote: Wed Mar 10, 2021 7:57 pm If you just want to watch local TV via streaming, you can use Locast (https://www.locast.org). It's a non-profit so you can donate if you wish. The drawback is that it does not cover the whole US yet.
Thanks. It's available where I am and I already "subscribe." I do want the option of recording, so I want an OTA DVR option as well.
drummerboy
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Re: Time to ditch Tivo?

Post by drummerboy »

5th_Dimension wrote: Wed Mar 10, 2021 5:38 pm Long time TiVo user who dumped them several years ago and went to Channels. It takes a bit of technical expertise to set it up but it is a very good system.

https://getchannels.com
+1 Channels is great. AppleTV and iPad apps work great. An inexpensive OTA DVR
kabob
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Re: Time to ditch Tivo?

Post by kabob »

Maybe... but whats the replacement!
Don't have Tivo, but simular cablecard & OTA SiliconDust Prime(3Tuner) and HDHomeRun DVR on local LAN.
Works on most platforms(Win,AAPL,Droid), sees Vid network tuner signals(actually scans & finds em well) - but not Net streams that i know of and I don't think anything is in the works either.
Oh, and we gotta have a good Guide too(for scheduling recording (SiliconDust currently has a Nice Guide)
Current TV's with Wirelessand FiteSticks see the SDtuner and play em, but horrible interfave, it's literally change the network directory to change channels and NO Guide. The HDHomeRunDVR client will run on multi platforms.
But the Tuner itself ???? - How's it gonna scan to build a Guide - Scan multi Sites/Urls with psw's AND keep an integrated Guide/Schedule updated, oops , aint there yet.
Actually we were there, with Win7 MediaCenter & clients, tuners - Totally integrated Computer/TV/DVR flawless user interface --- But--- The StealerDealersRobberBarronProviders kabashed any std protocalls and we're back to Nothin STD... Plus my Communication utility bill is now more than Twice+++ all other Utilities PutTogether!!!
I aint dumpin my nice SiliconDust stuff till I find a Better solution

So What's tomorrow's Communications gonna be - Limited, measured, discretionary ,subscription, cloud Services (for the UberRich)? (OutaTown, miss a payment, move, have any simple prob, lose a psw, get hacked, cracked, whacked ked and Lose a Life & History Forever - Hey it's Good ole US Capitalism and a dependant(notsocurrent) population.
Tomorrow's Gonna be some a the Best Free entertainment available!

Will checkout Channels Tomorrow - hope its good and multiplatform.
Anzio2824
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Re: Time to ditch Tivo?

Post by Anzio2824 »

Hadn't seen this option. Thanks for pointing it out. Looks like the AirTV2 (2 Tuners) or the AirTV Anywhere (4 Tuners) can only show one local live stream at a time. Amazon Recast 1TB (4 tuners) can show 2 streams simultaneously.
Thanks. I knew about 2 Tuners for AirTV2 and 4 Tuners for AirTV Anywhere; I did some more digging and it looks like you can simultaneously stream 2 or 4 streams, depending on device, when all receiving TV devices are connected to same router as the AirTV device. However, you are limited to one stream if streaming from the AirTV to a remote location over the internet (vacation home, while traveling, or if two geographically households were sharing an account and AirTV device).

Keep in mind that the one remote stream limitation only applies to the local channels (live or recorded) tuned by the AirTV device. If you have the Sling Blue subscription, $35, you can stream subscibed content simultaneously to three different geographically separated locations.
Monsterflockster
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Re: Time to ditch Tivo?

Post by Monsterflockster »

bluebolt wrote: Wed Mar 10, 2021 3:53 pm I've been a Tivo user since relatively early days and have saved lots of money by not having to rent cable boxes. I've generally bought year or two old models with lifetime service and overall have gotten a lot of value out of them. Also have Tivo minis which allow a whole home experience without monthly fees.

However, because Tivo DVRs are on a non-Android OS, the streaming/app options are pretty limited. The Tivo Stream 4K is Android based, so it supports lots of apps, but there is no plan to integrate existing DVRs/program guides with the Tivo Stream.

If I cut the cord, which I am likely to do, live TV viewing/recording would require me getting a new main Tivo box (either discontinued Bolt OTA/Cable, the Bolt OTA, or the Edge OTA) which seems like a dead-end investment due to the non-commitment to new app support and the lack of integration with the Tivo Stream or any other streaming device.

The FCC has ended the requirement for cable companies to support CableCards, so at some point my current equipment will become obsolete.

Which is all a long way of saying that it seems like time to ditch Tivo. Any reason not to?
Go Tablo with the onboard storage. Get the lifetime subscription. It’s all you need.
SaveMor
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Re: Time to ditch Tivo?

Post by SaveMor »

bloom2708 wrote: Wed Mar 10, 2021 6:06 pm We have a Fire TV Recast DVR to record OTA.

Integrated with all our Fire TV cubes and sticks.

Quite a few good options these days.
I also have been using FireTV Recast as a DVR for recording OTA content and sharing it across all of the FireTV sticks we have. Also supports streaming to the mobile app. All with no monthly fee.

I grew tired of the Tivo fees, even when used only for OTA. The Tivo user interface is the best, though.
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Supergrover
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Re: Time to ditch Tivo?

Post by Supergrover »

I didn’t know that about the cable cards. Yikes. Will have to read thru all of this to learn from what everyone’s posted.
Topic Author
bluebolt
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Re: Time to ditch Tivo?

Post by bluebolt »

Supergrover wrote: Thu Mar 11, 2021 12:11 pm I didn’t know that about the cable cards. Yikes. Will have to read thru all of this to learn from what everyone’s posted.
RCN has already dropped support. I expect other cable companies will follow suit, though they may allow legacy subscribers for a while.

Here's more info on Cablecard support no longer being required:
FCC ruling:
https://docs.fcc.gov/public/attachments ... -124A1.pdf

TechHive article about it:
https://www.techhive.com/article/357469 ... ntled.html
bigdoofus
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Re: Time to ditch Tivo?

Post by bigdoofus »

About to drop Tivo for my parents. Have an old Premiere / Mini and its been holding up well. The problem is more the cable company themselves and the rising cost of their packages. I was a bit ambivalent about streaming since the costs were pretty similar, but recent price increases have basically made it a no brainer.
mptfan
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Re: Time to ditch Tivo?

Post by mptfan »

bluebolt wrote: Wed Mar 10, 2021 3:53 pm Which is all a long way of saying that it seems like time to ditch Tivo. Any reason not to?
I think the best time to ditch Tivo was about 5 years ago. ;)
testing321
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Re: Time to ditch Tivo?

Post by testing321 »

A little over 4 years ago I ditched cable TV and bought a Tivo for OTA. I plan to stay with it until OTA switches completely over to ATSC 3. I supplement OTA with a streaming service which rotates among Netflix, Britbox, Acorn, Hulu, or Amazon Prime. So I still find Tivo to be very useful. The hard drives and fans are easy to replace on the newer Tivos.
Nicolas
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Re: Time to ditch Tivo?

Post by Nicolas »

sc9182 wrote: Wed Mar 10, 2021 4:26 pm Our lifetime TiVo hard disk conked - doesn’t even boot now.
You could’ve bought a replacement hard drive for your TiVo here and preserved your lifetime subscription, the subscription is tied to the motherboard, not the hard drive —> https://www.weaknees.com/

Your TiVo service is tied to your TiVo serial number, which is located in a chip on your motherboard. Changing TiVo drives does not in any way affect your TiVo service. So if you have lifetime service on your TiVo now, this upgrade (or repair, if that's the purpose of this drive kit) won't change anything - you'll still have lifetime after you install this kit.

(I have no affiliation). I bought a replacement TiVo remote from them once. We dropped the original one too many times.

My TiVo hard drive has been spinning almost continuously for just short of eleven years! When it fails I’ll replace it with one from this online store.

My TiVo’s case fan failed five years ago or so. I replaced it myself for $5, otherwise no problems. We bought a lifetime TiVo subscription in May 2010, a good financial decision on our part.
kabob
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Re: Time to ditch Tivo?

Post by kabob »

5th_Dimension wrote: Wed Mar 10, 2021 5:38 pm Long time TiVo user who dumped them several years ago and went to Channels. It takes a bit of technical expertise to set it up but it is a very good system.

https://getchannels.com
Oh Yea - Checked out Channels - Definitely Has Potential! And is Very HDHomeRun (SiliconDust) Friendly...
Plus It's a SoftwareSolution! Unlike TIVO that's a proprietaryHardware Solution.
HDHomeRun has a DVR also(a verygood one with a GoodInterated Guide/Schedule too).
Channels & HdhomeRun have a lot in common, Channels with the TV Everywhere option/add-on and HDHomeRun(DVR) are both a LocalNetwork&Wireless(Lan) based DVR server/software solution to clients Anywhere(including extended WAN accessibility via DynaDSN's or staticIP). Perhaps both are on course for the future UltimateSoultion

HDHomeRun(SiliconDust) has the OTA & Broadcast(Cable) all ready & worked out.
Channnels with TV AnyWhere(AddOn) [advertises} its got the internet premium streams all worked out with guide & schedule.
Yea - there's hope for the future(Tomorrow)...
But, Channels,immediately, starts out the $8 mthly BASE charge(just to run the software[perhaps on only one client).
HDHomeRun(software) is Free with the purchase any SiliconDust network Tuner/Connect device, and DVR option is only only $35/yr( for the integrated Guide/Scheduler service)
Not bad and making progress, Channels has the internet/digitalstream ready, HDHomeRun Dust has the OTA/Broadcast ready - and they both see each other... and Both have FireTV & multiplatforn clients (how dare they they call tv's a SmartTv when a $29 FireStick runs a tv better than the smart tv does![with a much better UI])
Hey, The Future's so Bright We gotta wear Shades ( if all's priced Right)

And this FCC/NetNutrality/Cablecard/RegulatedMonolopyDistribution stuff is just a current ratsnest Political/Admin thing, flops around like a fish out water. Who knows where that stuff goes Tomorrow?
A currently semihardware could/CanShould easily be a simplesoftwaresolution optically distributed...
America's Infrastructure should/NeedsToBe at least somewhere near to what is realistically quite possible!
Don't like the Weather, just be patient, its constantly Changin...
Last edited by kabob on Sat Mar 13, 2021 10:05 am, edited 1 time in total.
Topic Author
bluebolt
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Re: Time to ditch Tivo?

Post by bluebolt »

kabob wrote: Sat Mar 13, 2021 9:47 am
5th_Dimension wrote: Wed Mar 10, 2021 5:38 pm Long time TiVo user who dumped them several years ago and went to Channels. It takes a bit of technical expertise to set it up but it is a very good system.

https://getchannels.com
Oh Yea - Checked out Channels - Definitely Has Potential! And is Very HDHomeRun (SiliconDust) Friendly...
Plus It's a SoftwareSolution! Unlike TIVO that's a proprietaryHardware Solution.
HDHomeRun has a DVR also(a verygood one with a GoodInterated Guide/Schedule too).
Channels & HdhomeRun have a lot in common, Channels with the TV Everywhere option/add-on and HDHomeRun(DVR) are both a LocalNetwork&Wireless(Lan) based DVR server/software solution to clients Anywhere(including extended WAN accessibility via DynaDSN's or staticIP). Perhaps both are on course for the future UltimateSoultion
HDHomeRun has to be wired to router, correct? That makes it a no-go for me since that's not in a place where I could get antenna reception.
kabob
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Re: Time to ditch Tivo?

Post by kabob »

bluebolt wrote: Sat Mar 13, 2021 10:01 am HDHomeRun has to be wired to router, correct? That makes it a no-go for me since that's not in a place where I could get antenna reception.
Well, Yes and No!
HdHomeRun Client is software, so No, HDHomeRun Viewer client & its DVR runs fine Wireless or Wired.
The Silicondust HomeRun Hardware Device (Prime,Connect,Servio,Commerical) is a network connected box that the antenna/cable/StdBroadcast is also connected too. (as any/all tuner device must be) - So Yes - the Broadcast Receiver is is connected to the the LAN router/Switch - and - the Broadcast Signal (antenna/cable, other)

I have the antenna in the attic, its lead runs thru a hole in a closest ceiling down to the comm,cable/modem/router/tuner/wireless/NAS/Ups gear - Here's a Pic
Image
The HDHomeRun Prime tuner(3) is 2nd shelf from bottom on the left.
I just did this(the Rack) as an xmas pres to my self, was tired of the scattered ratsnest wires, so just like the BigBoys I made a CommCloset to keep it somewhat manageable. And even better, in my new retirement house, I have a Basement!- real Cat6(gig++) cableing to any room i want with and neat 7/16" paddle bit hole thru the floor (and I can plug up the hole neatly with a 7/16" hardwood dowel easily)
So, I am just multiGIG wired & wirelelssly Connected everywhere I want even outside!
Take a BigScreen, firestick outside on the deck, anywhere (no box/signal connection,just exectric - No Prob! & DVR!
(i am in the Software biz, and have been into the total integration of computer/TV integration for yrs. It is a shame that we have such a mess in that area that we do - It's All bout the MONEY - cause it is a very simple thing to do - Good ole Standards is all thats needed - till then am tryin to keep it as Robust, Neat & Efficient as possible)
Last edited by kabob on Sat Mar 13, 2021 12:19 pm, edited 1 time in total.
xb7
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Re: Time to ditch Tivo?

Post by xb7 »

I've got a Tivo Roamio OTA. At one point I also had whatever the "watch on a second TV" thing is from Tivo to be able to use the one Tivo to watch both upstairs and downstairs. This was a great system, except that the second-TV connector unit kept crapping out. It got to the point where I had to reboot it daily or even more often to make sure I had a connection.

So I kept the Tivo on just one TV, but bought the Fire Recast setup along with a couple of cubes. Part of the driver here is that I've sort of standardized on Amazon stuff (Echo, Ring, etc). Also, I really wanted just ONE television remote for my wife to have to learn and use, on both TVs.

So anyway, I can compare Fire Recast to Tivo.

Fire has lots of ads and it gets tedious to sort through this stuff sometimes to find what I want. A significant interface update is promised soon, but based on what I've seen to date I'm not optimistic.
And IMO the DVR software just sucks in comparison with Tivo. IF Amazon were to push for a couple of years or more and go through multiple generations of Recast, I presume they would be capable of coming close to the simplicity, ease of use, reliability of Tivo. As it is I find their DVR to be way behind. And I have no sense that they're working on it at all. Who knows, maybe they'll come up with a new generation of this at some point, but they haven't rolled out software updates to do much in the way of improving a clumsy interface.

OTOH, DVR programming is free with Recast, no subscription. Fire cubes have a rich set of streaming options it connects to, and the voice control is good. At this point I plan to hang in there and hope that at some point Amazon decides to either commit to developing an improved DVR, or makes sufficiently clear that they've abandoned it. My wife and I watch recorded local news on Recast at our upstairs TV, but if I'm downstairs and want to look at DVR content, I always switch to Tivo to watch on that. Every time.
Topic Author
bluebolt
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Re: Time to ditch Tivo?

Post by bluebolt »

xb7 wrote: Sat Mar 13, 2021 11:51 am I've got a Tivo Roamio OTA. At one point I also had whatever the "watch on a second TV" thing is from Tivo to be able to use the one Tivo to watch both upstairs and downstairs. This was a great system, except that the second-TV connector unit kept crapping out. It got to the point where I had to reboot it daily or even more often to make sure I had a connection.

So I kept the Tivo on just one TV, but bought the Fire Recast setup along with a couple of cubes. Part of the driver here is that I've sort of standardized on Amazon stuff (Echo, Ring, etc). Also, I really wanted just ONE television remote for my wife to have to learn and use, on both TVs.

So anyway, I can compare Fire Recast to Tivo.

Fire has lots of ads and it gets tedious to sort through this stuff sometimes to find what I want. A significant interface update is promised soon, but based on what I've seen to date I'm not optimistic.
And IMO the DVR software just sucks in comparison with Tivo. IF Amazon were to push for a couple of years or more and go through multiple generations of Recast, I presume they would be capable of coming close to the simplicity, ease of use, reliability of Tivo. As it is I find their DVR to be way behind. And I have no sense that they're working on it at all. Who knows, maybe they'll come up with a new generation of this at some point, but they haven't rolled out software updates to do much in the way of improving a clumsy interface.

OTOH, DVR programming is free with Recast, no subscription. Fire cubes have a rich set of streaming options it connects to, and the voice control is good. At this point I plan to hang in there and hope that at some point Amazon decides to either commit to developing an improved DVR, or makes sufficiently clear that they've abandoned it. My wife and I watch recorded local news on Recast at our upstairs TV, but if I'm downstairs and want to look at DVR content, I always switch to Tivo to watch on that. Every time.
This is really helpful, thanks. I'm in a similar place, but can't see buying an OTA Tivo (to replace my Roamio Plus) just for the relatively small benefits.

The new Fire TV UI has already rolled out on a couple of devices and will come to most existing devices soon, though not sure if it addresses any of your issues. https://amazonfiretv.blog/introducing-t ... 1ebecbd813
Mudpuppy
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Re: Time to ditch Tivo?

Post by Mudpuppy »

Since I stared with a Tivo OTA model, my experience is likely very different than your experience. Like some others, I use it to record the OTA shows I'm still watching (with OnePass usually). It also integrates into Amazon Prime video, which is my primary video streaming service. So it works well enough for me.

My main challenges with the Tivo is finding decent quality parts to repair it. The hard disk is easy in my model, since it stores its firmware and subscription info on a flash module, I can swap out any hard drive and only lose my local data like the recorded shows. Finding a good quality fan is the bane of my existence with my Tivo. I literally have three fans sitting in a pile that I tried and they were noisy out of the box that I keep thinking I can use in another project where noise isn't as important, but I probably should just toss. And my WiFi card died a year or so back, so I had to string an Ethernet cable over to it. But I'm keeping it patched along for the moment.

As for other services, several years ago, I built a gaming Windows 8.1 slim PC that's basically a form factor like a gaming console. So I have that in the entertainment center hooked up to another HDMI input on the TV. I can use that for the things the Tivo can't access. So my setup works great for me, but it's not going to translate to the OP's situation.

When it comes to OTA, also be aware that any device purchased now will be obsolete in 5-10 years when ATSC 3.0 "NextGen TV" becomes the standard. Think of this like the equivalent to the analog to digital conversion that happened many years back. The standard is relatively new, with only a few markets actively using it at the moment, so most OTA DVRs are ATSC 1.0. The ones that support ATSC 3.0 are rather new and expensive, so probably not something a Boglehead would want.

Wikipedia on ATSC 3.0: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ATSC_3.0

If you think of your chosen solution as something you'll need to replace in 5-10 years anyways to support the new standard, it might affect what you choose now. That's part of the reason I'm still patching along my Tivo OTA with repairs.... I'm waiting for the ATSC 3.0 market to get more robust and have more competitive pricing.
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magellan
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Re: Time to ditch Tivo?

Post by magellan »

bluebolt wrote: Wed Mar 10, 2021 8:05 pm
atomicrc11 wrote: Wed Mar 10, 2021 7:57 pm If you just want to watch local TV via streaming, you can use Locast (https://www.locast.org). It's a non-profit so you can donate if you wish. The drawback is that it does not cover the whole US yet.
Thanks. It's available where I am and I already "subscribe." I do want the option of recording, so I want an OTA DVR option as well.
Depending on how much DVR space you need, stremium.com might be worth checking out. They're a cloud DVR that links up with locast (and seems to have some channels of its own). The cost for 25 hours is $5/mo or $50/yr.

I planned to bag cable and Tivo and did a test with locast + stremium on a roku. Stremium doesn't officially support Roku yet (in perpetual beta apparently), but aside from small hiccups and some klunkiness, it was workable during my trial.

I ended up sticking with Tivo and cable because comcast offered me a retention deal w/Internet plus basic cable for $15/month more than Internet only including all fees.
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illumination
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Re: Time to ditch Tivo?

Post by illumination »

I still use a TiVo for OTA. It has a lifetime subscription and I've even soldered new capacitors in it and replaced the hard drive to just keep it going. It's like mid 2000's model. It gets the job done, but being an older model, it's slow. But most of our TV viewing is streaming through a Roku Ultra.

That being said, if you're paying for cable, I would probably drop TiVo. The cable companies really make life difficult for TiVo users. I just don't think the savings are much and the newer cable company DVRs are way better than they were.

TiVo really dropped the ball, that's a company that should have been a major tech player. Lots and lots of mistakes, but they were really ahead of he curve when it came out. Someone like Apple should have bought them.
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magellan
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Re: Time to ditch Tivo?

Post by magellan »

illumination wrote: Sat Mar 13, 2021 6:25 pmBut most of our TV viewing is streaming through a Roku Ultra.
...
TiVo really dropped the ball, that's a company that should have been a major tech player. Lots and lots of mistakes, but they were really ahead of he curve when it came out.
We're long time Tivo users and we also use our roku more than Tivo now.

One thing that bugs me though is that the Tivo is 10x better with forwarding and replay. I understand that Tivo is local and Roku is cloud, but I would have guessed by now that apps would figure out a way to buffer enough to make skipping around faster, especially for short +- 60 second skipping. Some roku apps are better than others, but none of them are anywhere near as good on this as the Tivo.

Our roku ultra has a gig ethernet connection and our Internet is very fast. When I watch shows on my laptop on youtube, the forward and rewind speed is fantastic, even at 1.5 playback speed.

Anyhow, am I missing some trick to this or is this just the cost of not having the show on a local hdd or streaming with a high end laptop cpu?
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bluebolt
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Re: Time to ditch Tivo?

Post by bluebolt »

magellan wrote: Sat Mar 13, 2021 6:08 pm
bluebolt wrote: Wed Mar 10, 2021 8:05 pm
atomicrc11 wrote: Wed Mar 10, 2021 7:57 pm If you just want to watch local TV via streaming, you can use Locast (https://www.locast.org). It's a non-profit so you can donate if you wish. The drawback is that it does not cover the whole US yet.
Thanks. It's available where I am and I already "subscribe." I do want the option of recording, so I want an OTA DVR option as well.
Depending on how much DVR space you need, stremium.com might be worth checking out. They're a cloud DVR that links up with locast (and seems to have some channels of its own). The cost for 25 hours is $5/mo or $50/yr.

I planned to bag cable and Tivo and did a test with locast + stremium on a roku. Stremium doesn't officially support Roku yet (in perpetual beta apparently), but aside from small hiccups and some klunkiness, it was workable during my trial.

I ended up sticking with Tivo and cable because comcast offered me a retention deal w/Internet plus basic cable for $15/month more than Internet only including all fees.
Hadn't heard of Stremium, but just checked it out. Cool. Might be a good interim solution for me until I buy an OTA DVR.
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Re: Time to ditch Tivo?

Post by yosh99 »

We continue to use Tivo because of its "One Pass" and "Wish List" search capabilities. Is there another DVR system with similar features?
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Re: Time to ditch Tivo?

Post by watchnerd »

Sweet Christmas, yes, get rid of your Tivo.

And cable TV while you're at it.
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Re: Time to ditch Tivo?

Post by rascott »

I could count on 2 hands the amount of recordings I've done in the last 2 years, typically only the occasional live sports event. Seems literally everything else is available on demand.
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Re: Time to ditch Tivo?

Post by ncbill »

OP could pick up a base Roamio or Roamio OTA w/ lifetime off eBay for ~$200 & then add a separate Roku/FireTv device for streaming, as do I.

And as another poster noted, there's still nothing out there that beats Tivo as a DVR.
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Re: Time to ditch Tivo?

Post by Bigsmith »

I still watch a lot of broadcast TV and use two Roamio OTA's that I bought at big discounts with Lifetime program guide subscriptions included.

The Roamio onboard streaming apps are slow and outdated compared with Roku, FireTV etc. I wouldn't use any traditional Tivo for accessing streaming services. (I don't know anything about the new-ish Tivo streaming device.)

The big issue I have with Tivo nowadays is they changed the source of their program guide information a few years ago. They used to use GraceNote data and it was always up to date and accurate. Now they use Rovi guide data which is much poorer quality. If you do a lot of scheduled recording you have to intervene fairly regularly to change what the machine is going to do or initiate manual recordings, or else accept that you aren't going to catch all the shows you wanted, because the guide data is often incomplete or just plain wrong.

I've gotten my money's worth out of my Roamios and will keep using them until ATSC 3.0 renders them obsolete or they have an unrepairable failure. But I won't invest any more money in Tivo hardware, and wouldn't advise doing so unless you can get a screaming deal on a used OTA unit with Lifetime service.
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Re: Time to ditch Tivo?

Post by bluebolt »

ncbill wrote: Sun Mar 14, 2021 3:11 pm OP could pick up a base Roamio or Roamio OTA w/ lifetime off eBay for ~$200 & then add a separate Roku/FireTv device for streaming, as do I.

And as another poster noted, there's still nothing out there that beats Tivo as a DVR.
Good point. I had been looking at the Bolt OTA figuring since it was a generation old there would be decent deals. But the going rate is about $100 more than the Roamio.
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Re: Time to ditch Tivo?

Post by danaht »

If you like Android TV, or Roku TV - I highly recommend Tablo as the TV recording mechanism: https://www.tablotv.com/products/tablo-quad-ota-dvr/. Tablo hooks up to a OTA antenna (indoor, or outdoor) and records channels to a standard 3.5" laptop HD. You can buy a lifetime channel guide subscription for it for really cheap. I like the Roku Tablo app the best. But the Android Tablo app is also good. The only downfall for Tablo is that new HD 4K OTA sources will be replacing the old 1080P sources in the next 5 years. So, I suspect that you will only get about 5 years of use out of it - then you will need to upgrade to a Tablo 4K recording device when those become available. (You may also need to re-buy the lifetime channel subscription - since those are linked by the device)
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Re: Time to ditch Tivo?

Post by Monsterflockster »

danaht wrote: Sun Mar 14, 2021 6:32 pm If you like Android TV, or Roku TV - I highly recommend Tablo as the TV recording mechanism: https://www.tablotv.com/products/tablo-quad-ota-dvr/. Tablo hooks up to a OTA antenna (indoor, or outdoor) and records channels to a standard 3.5" laptop HD. You can buy a lifetime channel guide subscription for it for really cheap. I like the Roku Tablo app the best. But the Android Tablo app is also good. The only downfall for Tablo is that new HD 4K OTA sources will be replacing the old 1080P sources in the next 5 years. So, I suspect that you will only get about 5 years of use out of it - then you will need to upgrade to a Tablo 4K recording device when those become available. (You may also need to re-buy the lifetime channel subscription - since those are linked by the device)
The lifetime subscription for Tablo is to the user, not the device. (I have upgraded and transfers my subscription).
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Re: Time to ditch Tivo?

Post by illumination »

Mudpuppy wrote: Sat Mar 13, 2021 4:34 pm Finding a good quality fan is the bane of my existence with my Tivo. I literally have three fans sitting in a pile that I tried and they were noisy out of the box that I keep thinking I can use in another project where noise isn't as important, but I probably should just toss.
Not sure if this helps, but those computer fans can be lube. You basically pull the sticker/label back and drop some light oil in there. Makes a big difference.

https://www.techrepublic.com/article/qu ... op-of-oil/
Nicolas
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Re: Time to ditch Tivo?

Post by Nicolas »

Mudpuppy wrote: Sat Mar 13, 2021 4:34 pm Finding a good quality fan is the bane of my existence with my Tivo. I literally have three fans sitting in a pile that I tried and they were noisy out of the box that I keep thinking I can use in another project where noise isn't as important, but I probably should just toss.
After four years the case fan failed on my TiVo Premiere, it became unbearably noisy. I replaced it for $5 (and $5 shipping) from Amazon. It was the “IPCQUEEN 12 V DC 50x50x25 mm Ball Bearing Fan with 3-pin connector fan-ipc-505025”.

It’s been seven years now since I replaced it and it’s still working fine, no noise. I just checked and it’s no longer available from Amazon. But you may find a good replacement here, but for more money than I paid —> https://www.weaknees.com/tivo-fans.php
Last edited by Nicolas on Mon Mar 15, 2021 1:23 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Time to ditch Tivo?

Post by Mudpuppy »

illumination wrote: Sun Mar 14, 2021 11:02 pm
Mudpuppy wrote: Sat Mar 13, 2021 4:34 pm Finding a good quality fan is the bane of my existence with my Tivo. I literally have three fans sitting in a pile that I tried and they were noisy out of the box that I keep thinking I can use in another project where noise isn't as important, but I probably should just toss.
Not sure if this helps, but those computer fans can be lube. You basically pull the sticker/label back and drop some light oil in there. Makes a big difference.

https://www.techrepublic.com/article/qu ... op-of-oil/
I was able to revitalize and quiet down the original Tivo fan multiple times with this method, before it finally stopped working last year at around 4-5 years old. So it does work for quite a while, but the fan does still eventually give up the proverbial ghost.

However, once it stops working, one is stuck with a pretty mediocre fan market. The first one I tried had a whine right out of the box that developed into a rattle in less than a week. The second <$10 one was nearly as bad. I finally forked out $30 for the WeaKness fan, and that one worked. I should be able to use the oil method to keep it functioning for quite a while.

Like some others in the thread, I'm trying to keep my Tivo limping along until ATSC 3.0 becomes more popular.
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Re: Time to ditch Tivo?

Post by bluebolt »

bluebolt wrote: Sat Mar 13, 2021 9:03 pm
magellan wrote: Sat Mar 13, 2021 6:08 pm Depending on how much DVR space you need, stremium.com might be worth checking out. They're a cloud DVR that links up with locast (and seems to have some channels of its own). The cost for 25 hours is $5/mo or $50/yr.

I planned to bag cable and Tivo and did a test with locast + stremium on a roku. Stremium doesn't officially support Roku yet (in perpetual beta apparently), but aside from small hiccups and some klunkiness, it was workable during my trial.

I ended up sticking with Tivo and cable because comcast offered me a retention deal w/Internet plus basic cable for $15/month more than Internet only including all fees.
Hadn't heard of Stremium, but just checked it out. Cool. Might be a good interim solution for me until I buy an OTA DVR.
Looks like Stremium plans now start at $10 mo./$100 yr.
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magellan
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Re: Time to ditch Tivo?

Post by magellan »

bluebolt wrote: Mon Mar 15, 2021 8:25 amLooks like Stremium plans now start at $10 mo./$100 yr.
Hmmm. When I scroll down on their homepage about 3/4 of the way down, they show the 25 hour plan at $5/mo and $50/yr.

Do you see something different on that page? If you do, maybe try it in a private browser window and see if that changes it. (They do also have a 50 hour plan for $10/mo $100/yr).
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bluebolt
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Re: Time to ditch Tivo?

Post by bluebolt »

magellan wrote: Mon Mar 15, 2021 8:33 am
bluebolt wrote: Mon Mar 15, 2021 8:25 amLooks like Stremium plans now start at $10 mo./$100 yr.
Hmmm. When I scroll down on their homepage about 3/4 of the way down, they show the 25 hour plan at $5/mo and $50/yr.

Do you see something different on that page? If you do, maybe try it in a private browser window and see if that changes it. (They do also have a 50 hour plan for $10/mo $100/yr).
You're right. I see that on their home page as well. I read somewhere else that $10 was the minimum (not sure if it was reddit or one of the app store reviews), but that appears to be incorrect.
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Re: Time to ditch Tivo?

Post by ncbill »

illumination wrote: Sun Mar 14, 2021 11:02 pm
Mudpuppy wrote: Sat Mar 13, 2021 4:34 pm Finding a good quality fan is the bane of my existence with my Tivo. I literally have three fans sitting in a pile that I tried and they were noisy out of the box that I keep thinking I can use in another project where noise isn't as important, but I probably should just toss.
Not sure if this helps, but those computer fans can be lube. You basically pull the sticker/label back and drop some light oil in there. Makes a big difference.

https://www.techrepublic.com/article/qu ... op-of-oil/
hmmm...I use FluidFilm on large motors, e.g. bathroom vent fans to quiet them back down...I'd probably try it on a small fan motor before oil.
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illumination
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Re: Time to ditch Tivo?

Post by illumination »

ncbill wrote: Mon Mar 15, 2021 9:31 pm
illumination wrote: Sun Mar 14, 2021 11:02 pm
Mudpuppy wrote: Sat Mar 13, 2021 4:34 pm Finding a good quality fan is the bane of my existence with my Tivo. I literally have three fans sitting in a pile that I tried and they were noisy out of the box that I keep thinking I can use in another project where noise isn't as important, but I probably should just toss.
Not sure if this helps, but those computer fans can be lube. You basically pull the sticker/label back and drop some light oil in there. Makes a big difference.

https://www.techrepublic.com/article/qu ... op-of-oil/
hmmm...I use FluidFilm on large motors, e.g. bathroom vent fans to quiet them back down...I'd probably try it on a small fan motor before oil.
They make oil products specifically for electric motors, you can find them at almost any hardware store. 3 in 1 makes one as well as "Zoom"

I would use that before something like FluidFilm that's really more for rust prevention and closer to a wax from sheep lanolin.
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Re: Time to ditch Tivo?

Post by criticalmass »

illumination wrote: Sun Mar 14, 2021 11:02 pm
Mudpuppy wrote: Sat Mar 13, 2021 4:34 pm Finding a good quality fan is the bane of my existence with my Tivo. I literally have three fans sitting in a pile that I tried and they were noisy out of the box that I keep thinking I can use in another project where noise isn't as important, but I probably should just toss.
Not sure if this helps, but those computer fans can be lube. You basically pull the sticker/label back and drop some light oil in there. Makes a big difference.

https://www.techrepublic.com/article/qu ... op-of-oil/
Many Tivo fans don't have any place for lube behind the sticker. You need to delicately put a wee bit of lube directly on the fan shaft. I use a bicycle lubricant or Boeshield that I have on hand, which usually lasts a few years. Sewing machine oil would also be a good choice.
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bluebolt
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Re: Time to ditch Tivo?

Post by bluebolt »

Ironically enough considering the title of this thread, I ended up getting a really good deal on a used Tivo Bolt OTA/Cable with lifetime/all-in service, so I went with that. I'll use that for OTA channels and recording. Upside - my Tivo minis will work with it and I can transfer over some shows I'd like to keep. Downside is that I have to switch to streaming stick to watch everything else, but with our Harmony remote that's not a big deal.

If it doesn't work out, I can sell it for more than I bought it.
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