Consumer Math Question

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Barefootgirl
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Consumer Math Question

Post by Barefootgirl »

My daughter jumped on an online offer from a local spa. The offer was buy one gift certificate, get an additional certificate for 50% off.

So, she sent them $300. We expected that to mean she would get one certificate for $300 and a "free" certificate for $150. Except - when she sent them money, she did not tell them how to split the value between the two, so now we are confused.

The spa claims that it means the $300 gift certificate actually costs $225 (buy one, get one 50 off is a 25% discount), so the second certificate is for $75 - but that only gets us back to the original $300 she gave them.

I know this is should't be complicated, but we are feeling stumped, probably the answer is obvious, but we are missing it?

Any consumer math gurus can simplify this for us?
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Cigarman
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Re: Consumer Math Question

Post by Cigarman »

Well, $225 + $75 = $300.

Buy one at $225 = $225.

Get a second at 50 % off = $225/2 = $112.50

$225 + $112.50 = $337.50 is what I would think it should have cost.

Was she expecting one for $200 and another for $100 (50% off) to equal her $300? That's how I learned math back in the 60's.
chipperd
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Re: Consumer Math Question

Post by chipperd »

If full price is $300, then I would think the total would be $450. Buy one at full price ($300) get second one at half price ($150). $300+$150=$450.
Am I off here?
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Kywildcat
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Re: Consumer Math Question

Post by Kywildcat »

I would think that she she could have gotten 2 $200 gift cards for $300.

1. First $200 gift card costs $200 (full price)
2. Second $200 gift card is 50% off so a cost of $100

Total cost: $300
Total Value: $400
squirm
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Re: Consumer Math Question

Post by squirm »

I would expect the second gift cert would be $150, so $450 on total.
She needs to just call the spa and get it straightened out instead of asking the internet.
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Oicuryy
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Re: Consumer Math Question

Post by Oicuryy »

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protagonist
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Re: Consumer Math Question

Post by protagonist »

Hi, bfg.
The bottom line is that the wording is ambiguous (as indicated by the variety of interpretations by forum members above), and even if it was not, any misunderstanding should be cleared up by a quick phone call to the spa, which (hopefully) cares enough about their business to either honor what your daughter's expectation was when she sent in the money, or refund her money in full and cancel the order.
If either of those options fail, then hopefully she paid by credit card, because I would think the CC company would refund her money.

(You might even refer the spa rep. or CC company to this thread to prove how ambiguous to others the offer was).
gch
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Re: Consumer Math Question

Post by gch »

Kywildcat wrote: Sun Mar 07, 2021 10:28 am I would think that she she could have gotten 2 $200 gift cards for $300.

1. First $200 gift card costs $200 (full price)
2. Second $200 gift card is 50% off so a cost of $100

Total cost: $300
Total Value: $400
This is the only math that makes sense if you have a buy one get one half off deal and you pay a total of $300.

If we truly want to go algebraic on it:
X + Y = 300
Y = 0.5X

X + 0.5X = 300
1.5X = 300
X = 200
Y = 100

With the actual face value of y being 200 before the half off.

If you had wanted a “free” $150 in a half off offer then the original face value would need to be $300 so you would’ve had to pay $300 (full price) + $150 (half price) = $450 payment by you to get the $150 (half off) for free.

I would simply call the spa and say you want 2, $200 gift certificates. The first one you pay full value, the second you get half off so in total you pay $300.
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Oicuryy
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Re: Consumer Math Question

Post by Oicuryy »

They could have sent you a $299 card and a $2 card. You would have paid full price for the $299 card and got the $2 card for half price.

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Jeepergeo
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Re: Consumer Math Question

Post by Jeepergeo »

Barefootgirl wrote: Sun Mar 07, 2021 10:04 am My daughter jumped on an online offer from a local spa. The offer was buy one gift certificate, get an additional certificate for 50% off.

So, she sent them $300. We expected that to mean she would get one certificate for $300 and a "free" certificate for $150. Except - when she sent them money, she did not tell them how to split the value between the two, so now we are confused.

The spa claims that it means the $300 gift certificate actually costs $225 (buy one, get one 50 off is a 25% discount), so the second certificate is for $75 - but that only gets us back to the original $300 she gave them.

I know this is should't be complicated, but we are feeling stumped, probably the answer is obvious, but we are missing it?

Any consumer math gurus can simplify this for us?
Here is my take on what she should get for the $300 she sent.

The first $200 of the $300 sent gets her a $200 certificate. That is the "buy one" part of the offer.

The next $100 of the $300 sent gets her another $200 certificate. That is the "get an additional certificate for 50% off" part of the offer.

In summary, $300 paid gets her $400 in services spread across 2 equal value certificates, effectively a 25% off deal on $400 in services.

Hopefully she has learned 1) read and or seek out the details of offers before sending money and 2) spa owners don't go into the spa business because they are good at math.
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gobel
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Re: Consumer Math Question

Post by gobel »

Barefootgirl wrote: Sun Mar 07, 2021 10:04 am The spa claims that it means the $300 gift certificate actually costs $225 (buy one, get one 50 off is a 25% discount), so the second certificate is for $75 - but that only gets us back to the original $300 she gave them.
Does this mean she got $375 in certificates for $300? This is valid, although technically if she received 2 separate certificates, it should be $225 + $150 (the 2nd being discounted by half). Asking for a $200/$200 split would have been the optimum deal though.
dbr
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Re: Consumer Math Question

Post by dbr »

gobel wrote: Sun Mar 07, 2021 12:47 pm
Barefootgirl wrote: Sun Mar 07, 2021 10:04 am The spa claims that it means the $300 gift certificate actually costs $225 (buy one, get one 50 off is a 25% discount), so the second certificate is for $75 - but that only gets us back to the original $300 she gave them.
Does this mean she got $375 in certificates for $300? This is valid, although technically if she received 2 separate certificates, it should be $225 + $150 (the 2nd being discounted by half). Asking for a $200/$200 split would have been the optimum deal though.
The deal was stated to be 25% off, which it would be if she got two $200 certificates for $300. But she got $375 in certificates for $300, which is 20% off. When the daughter sent the $300 what did she specify she was buying? I would have ordered two $200 certificates, but the daughter evidently did not specify what she was ordering, which would be a mistake. If she ordered a $225 certificate as the "buy one" then the math for $225+$75 is the only way they could sell a $225 certificate and a half price certificate and still meet the criterion of "buy one, 50% off a second one" for a total cost of $300.

I think she got cheated even though $225 for $225 plus $150 for $75 meets the one plus one half off offer. But again, what did she ask for?
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Stinky
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Re: Consumer Math Question

Post by Stinky »

gch wrote: Sun Mar 07, 2021 10:53 am
Kywildcat wrote: Sun Mar 07, 2021 10:28 am I would think that she she could have gotten 2 $200 gift cards for $300.

1. First $200 gift card costs $200 (full price)
2. Second $200 gift card is 50% off so a cost of $100

Total cost: $300
Total Value: $400
This is the only math that makes sense if you have a buy one get one half off deal and you pay a total of $300.

If we truly want to go algebraic on it:
X + Y = 300
Y = 0.5X

X + 0.5X = 300
1.5X = 300
X = 200
Y = 100

With the actual face value of y being 200 before the half off.

If you had wanted a “free” $150 in a half off offer then the original face value would need to be $300 so you would’ve had to pay $300 (full price) + $150 (half price) = $450 payment by you to get the $150 (half off) for free.

I would simply call the spa and say you want 2, $200 gift certificates. The first one you pay full value, the second you get half off so in total you pay $300.
I like this logic and answer.
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Adfmacro
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Re: Consumer Math Question

Post by Adfmacro »

Barefootgirl wrote: Sun Mar 07, 2021 10:04 am My daughter jumped on an online offer from a local spa. The offer was buy one gift certificate, get an additional certificate for 50% off.

So, she sent them $300. We expected that to mean she would get one certificate for $300 and a "free" certificate for $150. Except - when she sent them money, she did not tell them how to split the value between the two, so now we are confused.

The spa claims that it means the $300 gift certificate actually costs $225 (buy one, get one 50 off is a 25% discount), so the second certificate is for $75 - but that only gets us back to the original $300 she gave them.

I know this is should't be complicated, but we are feeling stumped, probably the answer is obvious, but we are missing it?

Any consumer math gurus can simplify this for us?
There is nothing in the post that gift certificates are all a fixed price. If one certificate was purchased for $300, it would seem that you would have to purchase a second one to get the second one for half price. The second one would cost $150, but only if another $300 certificate was purchased. If the intent was to purchase one for $200 and the second for $100, you can not accomplish that by purchasing one for $300. I think the second one should have been another $200 certificate. So the nominal price would be $400 with the final price at $300. If they took 25% off for each vs 50% off for the lessor amount, then you would be better off if they converted the $300 to one for $200 and the other for $100.

I enjoyed the word problems in high school math, but I was in the minority. The ad may have all the details required to solve the problem, but if a human has to manually figure out the discount the they have to do a math problem after they convert the word problem into a math problem.

Since I don’t have the original word problem, I can’t say my assumptions above are correct.
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Oicuryy
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Re: Consumer Math Question

Post by Oicuryy »

Barefootgirl wrote: Sun Mar 07, 2021 10:04 am So, she sent them $300. We expected that to mean she would get one certificate for $300 and a "free" certificate for $150. Except - when she sent them money, she did not tell them how to split the value between the two, so now we are confused.

The spa claims that it means the $300 gift certificate actually costs $225 (buy one, get one 50 off is a 25% discount), so the second certificate is for $75 - but that only gets us back to the original $300 she gave them.
So you expected to get $1.50 in face value for every $1.00 spent.
I would have expected to get $1.33 in face value for every $1.00 spent.
What you actually got was $1.25 in face value for every $1.00 spent.

Word problems are hard.

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Big Dog
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Re: Consumer Math Question

Post by Big Dog »

if this was an algebra (SAT) problem, the solution would be:

x + 0.5x = $300

1.5x = $300

x = $200, which means

0.5x = $100

Thus, the spa should have given your D two certs: one for $200 and one for $100.
student
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Re: Consumer Math Question

Post by student »

Kywildcat wrote: Sun Mar 07, 2021 10:28 am I would think that she she could have gotten 2 $200 gift cards for $300.

1. First $200 gift card costs $200 (full price)
2. Second $200 gift card is 50% off so a cost of $100

Total cost: $300
Total Value: $400
This will be my interpretation.
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Re: Consumer Math Question

Post by Peaceful »

Barefootgirl wrote: Sun Mar 07, 2021 10:04 am My daughter jumped on an online offer from a local spa. The offer was buy one gift certificate, get an additional certificate for 50% off.

So, she sent them $300. We expected that to mean she would get one certificate for $300 and a "free" certificate for $150. Except - when she sent them money, she did not tell them how to split the value between the two, so now we are confused.

The spa claims that it means the $300 gift certificate actually costs $225 (buy one, get one 50 off is a 25% discount), so the second certificate is for $75 - but that only gets us back to the original $300 she gave them.

I know this is should't be complicated, but we are feeling stumped, probably the answer is obvious, but we are missing it?

Any consumer math gurus can simplify this for us?
Based on the wording that you supplied--which may not be the precise wording of the offer--I would have expected to get 1) A $200.00 gift certificate for $200.00 + 2) A $200.00 gift certificate for $100.00. (Total paid: $300.00) I.e. to pay $75.00 for every $100.00 worth of gift certificates.

So, $300 paid for $400 worth of gift certs.

If you paid $300 but only got $300 worth of certificates, you got no discount at all. But are you saying that they gave you a $300.00 certificate and a $75.00 certificate, or a $225 certificate and a $75 certificate? Your OP is unclear.

Edited: We aren't being given enough information in the OP. We're assuming that the first cert and the 1/2 off have to be the same value. I.e. 2 gift certificates for face price of $200 under the terms of the deal would cost $300.00. So far so good, the spa made a math mistake.

However--we're not told why OP's daughter sent in $300.00. Did anything in the spa ad talk about $200 gift certs?

Trying to see it from the spa's perspective, they get a check for $300.00. Maybe there was a conversation on the phone with the daughter that was misunderstood. OP does NOT specifically ever say her daughter asked for two, $200 certs, with the second getting 1/2 off.

So, the spa gets the $300.00 and let's say they issue a $300.00 coupon, because--get this--how do they know the daughter even wanted two coupons? Again not sufficient information provided about the actual communications between daughter and spa.

So let's assume that's what happened. Daughter sends in a single check, is issued a $300.00 coupon, no discount, no second coupon.

Daughter gets coupon, (I am assuming this is all over the phone/by mail/by email/text), wonders, "Where is my second coupon at 1/2 price?"

Daughter calls spa, complains. Manager says "Oh sorry about the mix up. How do we straighten this out?" O.K. the intention of the 2 for 1 offer was to charge 75%, i.e., 2 for 1 with the second of equal value 1/2 price in effect is a 25% discount.

So the manager is quickly doing the math and figures it out this way: "O.K. the idea was to give you a 25% discount. 25% discount of $300 = $75.00. Therefore we are sending you a second coupon free of value $75.00."

This is probably what actually happened, or some version of it.

So, the discrepancy is because the way the ad is worded, the 25% discount is on the full face value ($400.00) of the two coupons. However, because of the way I believe the transaction played out in real time, the manager only gave the 25% discount on the amount that OP's daughter actually paid, i.e. the already-discounted amount. So in effect the daughter's discount was discounted by 25% But I do not think the spa did anything wrong here.
We aren't given enough information stating that the daughter asked for two coupons of equal value $200/each but with the 1/2 off discount on the second one. Maybe part of the conversation between daughter and spa also went like this: "O.k. we can give you half off the second coupon, but you didn't buy a second coupon. You bought one for $300. If you want a second coupon also for $300, we will let you have it for an addition $150.00." Maybe that was offered to the daughter but she declined it. Again insufficient data provided by OP.

Edited: OK I re-read the OP's post and her statement of the facts cannot be correct. OP is saying that she expected they would get one coupon for $300 and a "free" coupon for $150, i.e., that daughter would only have to pay $300 to get $450 worth of coupons. That is clearly NOT what the offer means. I think the spa is innocent at here, at worst, it was a communications misunderstanding in which you and your daughter were at lease equally responsible. I think the spa trying to make things right by sending out the free $75 coupon was completely appropriate, assuming your daughter was unwilling to chip in an additional $150 (per the actual discount offer) to get a second half price $300 coupon.
Last edited by Peaceful on Sun Mar 07, 2021 8:20 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Peaceful
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Re: Consumer Math Question

Post by Peaceful »

chipperd wrote: Sun Mar 07, 2021 10:22 am If full price is $300, then I would think the total would be $450. Buy one at full price ($300) get second one at half price ($150). $300+$150=$450.
Am I off here?
No, you're not off.
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Peaceful
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Re: Consumer Math Question

Post by Peaceful »

Cigarman wrote: Sun Mar 07, 2021 10:14 am Well, $225 + $75 = $300.

Buy one at $225 = $225.

Get a second at 50 % off = $225/2 = $112.50

$225 + $112.50 = $337.50 is what I would think it should have cost.

Was she expecting one for $200 and another for $100 (50% off) to equal her $300? That's how I learned math back in the 60's.
The first coupon was for $300.00, not $225.00. However, if you are correct, OP's daughter did not pay 50% for the second coupon, so was not entitled to it.
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Peaceful
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Re: Consumer Math Question

Post by Peaceful »

Kywildcat wrote: Sun Mar 07, 2021 10:28 am I would think that she she could have gotten 2 $200 gift cards for $300.

1. First $200 gift card costs $200 (full price)
2. Second $200 gift card is 50% off so a cost of $100

Total cost: $300
Total Value: $400
OP states their expectation was to send in $300.00 and in return receive 1) a $300 coupon and 2) $150 coupon for "free." That is obviously not what the discount offer means under any circumstances. OP states that they just sent in the check and did not indicate how if at all to split it up. there is nothing in the OP to indicate that OPs daughter even communicated to the spa that she was trying to avail herself of the discount offer when she sent in her payment. Op or her daughter then called to complain to the spa and asked for a free $150 gift card. Spa then told daughter "sorry that wasn't the deal we offered. We offered in effect a 25% discount for gift cards. If you want to send us an additional payment of $150 we will send out another $300 gift card offer to you per our advertised offer. Daughter said "No I am not sending you any more money." Spa said: "O.K. we will send you a free $75.00 gift card because that is 25% off the $300 you paid." OP's daughter did not comply with the terms of the offer which they misunderstood in any case. Spa handled the matter reasonably under the circumstances. OP does not make clear the actual denominations of the gift cards her daughter received. I believe her daughter in fact received 1) the original $300 gift card, undiscounted due to the misunderstanding, for which she paid $300; and 2) a $75.00 card at no additional charge. (The OP makes it seem as if her daughter may have only received a $225 gift card and $75 gift card but it's not clear that's what happened either.) The reference to $225 was not a reference to the face value of that gift card, it was a reference to the spa trying to explain their arithmetic. If the daughter received gift cards of $375 total value for which she paid $300, then she received a 20% discount. A 25% discount off of the $375 woud be $93.75, so one could say she "overpaid" $18.75. However, one could also say that she should have paid an additional $37.50 to get the second $75 coupon at half price, but got it for free. She wasn't actually entitled to any discount at all on the first $300 coupon, only to half price on the second coupon. And she paid nothing at all for the second coupon.

I think the spa handled it reasonably.
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Re: Consumer Math Question

Post by Peaceful »

Big Dog wrote: Sun Mar 07, 2021 7:06 pm if this was an algebra (SAT) problem, the solution would be:

x + 0.5x = $300

1.5x = $300

x = $200, which means

0.5x = $100

Thus, the spa should have given your D two certs: one for $200 and one for $100.
Incorrect. Assuming the spa had a way of knowing that when the daughter send in a $300.00 check, her intention was to receive 2 $200 coupons, of equal value, per the offer, (Buy one at full price, get the second at 1/2 price) daughter should have expected to receive two coupons each of $200 face value. This interpretation of the offer was confirmed when the spa told them that $300 worth of coupons should cost $225 per their offer.

Your interpretation has OPs daugther receiving 300 worth of coupons for 300, which is no discount at all, and cannot be correct.

However, OP and her daughter are also incorrect, since OP states that when daughter sent in $300, she expected to receive $450.00 worth of coupons in return. That is clearly not what the offer means either.

Ops & her daughter's interpretation is that she can receive the "free" 50% of the second coupon WITHOUT PAYING for the other non-free half of it. Clearly if the offer intended this, it would say something like "Buy one at full price and get a second coupon worth 1/2 as much for FREE." That would be kind of unusual but I suppose it's possible. Since that results in a one third discount it would be far more likely to be worded as "Buy 2 and get the third one FREE." But not "Buy one and get the second one at half price."
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Re: Consumer Math Question

Post by mainiac »

Kywildcat wrote: Sun Mar 07, 2021 10:28 am I would think that she she could have gotten 2 $200 gift cards for $300.

1. First $200 gift card costs $200 (full price)
2. Second $200 gift card is 50% off so a cost of $100

Total cost: $300
Total Value: $400
This would also be my interpretation.
Peaceful
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Re: Consumer Math Question

Post by Peaceful »

Peaceful wrote: Sun Mar 07, 2021 8:06 pm
Kywildcat wrote: Sun Mar 07, 2021 10:28 am I would think that she she could have gotten 2 $200 gift cards for $300.

1. First $200 gift card costs $200 (full price)
2. Second $200 gift card is 50% off so a cost of $100

Total cost: $300
Total Value: $400
OP states their expectation was to send in $300.00 and in return receive 1) a $300 coupon and 2) $150 coupon for "free." That is obviously not what the discount offer means under any circumstances. OP states that they just sent in the check and did not indicate how if at all to split it up. there is nothing in the OP to indicate that OPs daughter even communicated to the spa that she was trying to avail herself of the discount offer when she sent in her payment. Op or her daughter then called to complain to the spa and asked for a free $150 gift card. Spa then told daughter "sorry that wasn't the deal we offered. We offered in effect a 25% discount for gift cards. If you want to send us an additional payment of $150 we will send out another $300 gift card offer to you per our advertised offer. Daughter said "No I am not sending you any more money." Spa said: "O.K. we will send you a free $75.00 gift card because that is 25% off the $300 you paid." OP's daughter did not comply with the terms of the offer which they misunderstood in any case. Spa handled the matter reasonably under the circumstances. OP does not make clear the actual denominations of the gift cards her daughter received. I believe her daughter in fact received 1) the original $300 gift card, undiscounted due to the misunderstanding, for which she paid $300; and 2) a $75.00 card at no additional charge. (The OP makes it seem as if her daughter may have only received a $225 gift card and $75 gift card but it's not clear that's what happened either.) The reference to $225 was not a reference to the face value of that gift card, it was a reference to the spa trying to explain their arithmetic. If the daughter received gift cards of $375 total value for which she paid $300, then she received a 20% discount. A 25% discount off of the $375 woud be $93.75, so one could say she "overpaid" $18.75. However, one could also say that she should have paid an additional $37.50 to get the second $75 coupon at half price, but got it for free. She wasn't actually entitled to any discount at all on the first $300 coupon, only to half price on the second coupon. And she paid nothing at all for the second coupon.

Another way to look at it: From the spa's viewpoint, due to a misunderstanding, and after she called them back to try to clear it up, they viewed the $300 original sent in as intended to be the amount of face value of both coupons OP's daughter actually wanted, entitling her to a 25% discount. Originally no one told the spa she wanted two coupons with the second getting the discount, so they sent her the single coupon, no discount. This would have been reasonable especially if the daughter was asking for a second coupon of $150.00 value which kind of doesn't make any sense. At a minimum, if she called them saying "Where is my second coupon for $150.00 per your offer?" the spa would be expecting her to send in an additional payment of $75.00 (i.e. that makes the second coupon half price.) Remember daughter had already received a single coupon for face amount of $300.00. She is technically not entitled to any discount at all on the first coupon, only the second (but as OP stated, her daughter didn't tell them if or how the $300 she sent in should be split up.)

If OP's daughter's view is that she is not going to send them any more money to take advantage of a discount which is only available on the second coupon, not the first, then that creates a problem which the spa wants to solve. It doesn't want unhappy customers, it is trying to get more business with these offers, not to antagonize people. So, the spa says, "I'm sorry, we can't give you the full two for one unless you send in another $150.00. If you do that we will send out a second $300 coupon honoring the offer." Op's daughter doesn't want to do that. But she still wants a $150 second coupon. So spa says to her: "I'm sorry, we can't give you a second coupon for free. We are happy to offer you a second coupon in the denomination of $150.00 but per our offer, you have to pay half price, i.e. $75.00." So daughter is still dissatisfied with this. So spa person on the phone then does some quick arithmetic: "OK since the intent of the offer was to give you a 25% discount, there was some kind of misunderstanding, but you don't want to send in any more money for an additional $300 coupon or a $150 coupon at half price to take advantage of the offer, what we can do is give you that 25% discount anyway, even though you didn't buy a second coupon." So that 25% discount is then the second $75.00 coupon which they send free. However, that $75.00 coupon is not intended to be the second coupon subject to the discount offer; it is simply the spa's way of rebating the discount amount. The $75.00 coupon itself is not actually part of the discount deal. If so, she would have had to pay an additional $37.50 for it.

In effect, arithmetically, what the spa actually did was treat the $300 payment as a $75 overpayment for two $150 coupons--the first should have been charged full price; the second should have been charged half price per the deal. That adds up to $225.00. The $75 coupon sent back to OPs daughter was in effect not part of the actual discount deal, it was a rebate to OPs daughter. Netting things out, daughter was charged $225 for the $300 worth of coupons she actually bought under the deal (remember she didn't buy the $75 dollar coupon).

I think the spa handled it reasonably.
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Peaceful
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Re: Consumer Math Question

Post by Peaceful »

mainiac wrote: Sun Mar 07, 2021 8:36 pm
Kywildcat wrote: Sun Mar 07, 2021 10:28 am I would think that she she could have gotten 2 $200 gift cards for $300.

1. First $200 gift card costs $200 (full price)
2. Second $200 gift card is 50% off so a cost of $100

Total cost: $300
Total Value: $400
This would also be my interpretation.
Ops daughter may have gotten an additional $100 card/coupon if when she had contacted the spa after the misunderstanding arose, she explained it the way you did and provided them with your arithmetic, because that's certainly the most straightforward interpretation of what their offer was. Although maybe not, since OP states daughter did not advise him that she wanted two coupons or to use the offer when she sent in her check. Possibly had she asked they might have told her "Sorry we cannot send you out a free second coupon, but we will give you one for $100 at half price, so you need to send us another $50." But I don't think she even asked for the free $100 card, since OP doesn't mention that.

OP said her daughter expected NOT to get 2 $200 cards for a total of $300.00. OP specifically stated that her daughter expected to get 1) a $300 card and 2) a $150 card in exchange for the $300 payment.

I suspect the spa people were tearing their hair out, as there is no way they could reconcile what OP wanted with what the offer was for. If OP had sent in a check for 375 then possibly it might have made sense to ask for a 300 card and a 150 card, but even so, how was the spa supposed to know what denominations of gift cards OPs daughter wanted, without being told?

Imagine you work for the spa and you are on the phone with a new customer trying to straighten this out. Customer insists that you have to send her a free $150 gift card, not that you should send her a free $100 gift card. Customer does not want to pay for a second gift card and the offer only provides a discount for the second gift card, not the first.

So what do you do? You want to try to mollify the customer and be fair to the customer.

"O.K., Customer. I'm sorry that the advertisement for our offer was confusing. That wasn't the intent. The basic idea is to give the customer a 25% discount on the gift cards. So in the spirit of that, what I can do is send you a 75 card completely free of charge. That puts you in the same position as if you had originally paid a total of $225 for the $300 worth of gift cards that you received." Note, the second card can't be part of the offer since she paid nothing for it. It's just a rebate, not the "second card at half price."
"Be fearful when others are greedy, be even MORE fearful when others are fearful."
Peaceful
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Re: Consumer Math Question

Post by Peaceful »

protagonist wrote: Sun Mar 07, 2021 10:45 am Hi, bfg.
The bottom line is that the wording is ambiguous (as indicated by the variety of interpretations by forum members above), and even if it was not, any misunderstanding should be cleared up by a quick phone call to the spa, which (hopefully) cares enough about their business to either honor what your daughter's expectation was when she sent in the money, or refund her money in full and cancel the order.
If either of those options fail, then hopefully she paid by credit card, because I would think the CC company would refund her money.

(You might even refer the spa rep. or CC company to this thread to prove how ambiguous to others the offer was).
It wouldn't make sense for OPs daughter to cancel the transaction because she actually got $375 of gift cards but only paid $300 for them. Why would she give back $75?
"Be fearful when others are greedy, be even MORE fearful when others are fearful."
an_asker
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Re: Consumer Math Question

Post by an_asker »

Barefootgirl wrote: Sun Mar 07, 2021 10:04 am My daughter jumped on an online offer from a local spa. The offer was buy one gift certificate, get an additional certificate for 50% off.

So, she sent them $300. We expected that to mean she would get one certificate for $300 and a "free" certificate for $150. Except - when she sent them money, she did not tell them how to split the value between the two, so now we are confused.

The spa claims that it means the $300 gift certificate actually costs $225 (buy one, get one 50 off is a 25% discount), so the second certificate is for $75 - but that only gets us back to the original $300 she gave them.

I know this is should't be complicated, but we are feeling stumped, probably the answer is obvious, but we are missing it?

Any consumer math gurus can simplify this for us?
I am confused as to what you are saying. If you did not say anything on how much the first gift certificate was for - or if the advertisement does not say anything either - it could be any of the following:

- one certificate for $1 and a $598 certificate for $299 (I doubt very much if this is possible. When payless store or similar run a special like "buy one get one half off" it usually implies that the second is as expensive as, or less expensive than, the first)

- one certificate for $200 and a $200 certificate for $100

- one certificate for $225 and a $150 certificate for $75

- one certificate for $250 and a $100 certificate for $50

... and so on :-)
Peaceful
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Re: Consumer Math Question

Post by Peaceful »

dbr wrote: Sun Mar 07, 2021 1:13 pm
gobel wrote: Sun Mar 07, 2021 12:47 pm
Barefootgirl wrote: Sun Mar 07, 2021 10:04 am The spa claims that it means the $300 gift certificate actually costs $225 (buy one, get one 50 off is a 25% discount), so the second certificate is for $75 - but that only gets us back to the original $300 she gave them.
Does this mean she got $375 in certificates for $300? This is valid, although technically if she received 2 separate certificates, it should be $225 + $150 (the 2nd being discounted by half). Asking for a $200/$200 split would have been the optimum deal though.
The deal was stated to be 25% off, which it would be if she got two $200 certificates for $300. But she got $375 in certificates for $300, which is 20% off. When the daughter sent the $300 what did she specify she was buying? I would have ordered two $200 certificates, but the daughter evidently did not specify what she was ordering, which would be a mistake. If she ordered a $225 certificate as the "buy one" then the math for $225+$75 is the only way they could sell a $225 certificate and a half price certificate and still meet the criterion of "buy one, 50% off a second one" for a total cost of $300.

I think she got cheated even though $225 for $225 plus $150 for $75 meets the one plus one half off offer. But again, what did she ask for?
OPs daughter didn't get cheated. There was a misunderstanding. The deal literally wasn't 25% off. It was "Buy one gift card, get the second for half price." If both cards are equal denominations it is 25% but doesn't have to be. Although I think most people would assume the cards are supposed to be equal value. Also we aren't told if there's a max value for this deal.

OP sent in a single payment for $300 but didn't tell the spa that she wanted two cards of $200 each, paying 200 for the first, 100 for the second, per the offer. And in fact, OP's daughter didn't understand the deal to mean that. OP's daughter thought if she sent in $300 she should get one $300 card and a second $150 card. That would explain why she didn't give instructions. If that is what the deal was, no instructions are really necessary--you send in any amount, you get a card for that amount, and a second card for half that amount. Unfortunately, OP's daughter's understanding of the offer seems clearly incorrect. Again this is a misunderstanding and no one is at fault.

Presumably when the daughter got the 300 but not the second 150 she contacted the spa. The spa tried to explain what the deal meant but was still not understood, as proven by the OP, which contains the same misunderstanding of the discount offer.

The spa tried to explain that the idea was to give a 25% discount, total, on the cards bought under the offer. Unfortunately, daughter only bought one card, not two. The discount only applies to the second card.

Daughter doesn't want to pay any more money towards a second card, i.e., she doesn't want to send in another $75 to get a second card for $150 and she doesn't want to send in $150 to get a second card worth $300. She believes she is entitled to a second card for $150 at no additional charge.

This interpretation, even if you think it is reasonable, creates a dilemma for the spa since it isn't what their offer is for.

How can they attempt to satisfy daugther within the terms of the offer?

Well, she did pay $300 and the intention was to give a 25% discount. So, sending her a rebate gift card of $75, at no charge, is equivalent to her having purchased $300 worth of gift cards for $225. (The rebate card is not part of the discount offer, as it was not purchased as part of that offer. It is simply a rebate.) From this viewpoint, which is completely reasonable, she only actually is out of pocket $225 and received $300 worth of gift cards from the discount offer (remember the 75 is a rebate and is not part of the offer) so she received the full discount.

We can safely assume this is pretty close to what happened because of the way the OP relates the interaction with the spa about it.
"Be fearful when others are greedy, be even MORE fearful when others are fearful."
an_asker
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Re: Consumer Math Question

Post by an_asker »

Big Dog wrote: Sun Mar 07, 2021 7:06 pm if this was an algebra (SAT) problem, the solution would be:

x + 0.5x = $300

1.5x = $300

x = $200, which means

0.5x = $100

Thus, the spa should have given your D two certs: one for $200 and one for $100.
But the SAT question would also specifically state that both certificates are of equal value. OP has not made any such statement here.
Peaceful
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Re: Consumer Math Question

Post by Peaceful »

an_asker wrote: Sun Mar 07, 2021 9:42 pm
Barefootgirl wrote: Sun Mar 07, 2021 10:04 am My daughter jumped on an online offer from a local spa. The offer was buy one gift certificate, get an additional certificate for 50% off.

So, she sent them $300. We expected that to mean she would get one certificate for $300 and a "free" certificate for $150. Except - when she sent them money, she did not tell them how to split the value between the two, so now we are confused.

The spa claims that it means the $300 gift certificate actually costs $225 (buy one, get one 50 off is a 25% discount), so the second certificate is for $75 - but that only gets us back to the original $300 she gave them.

I know this is should't be complicated, but we are feeling stumped, probably the answer is obvious, but we are missing it?

Any consumer math gurus can simplify this for us?
I am confused as to what you are saying. If you did not say anything on how much the first gift certificate was for - or if the advertisement does not say anything either - it could be any of the following:

- one certificate for $1 and a $598 certificate for $299 (I doubt very much if this is possible. When payless store or similar run a special like "buy one get one half off" it usually implies that the second is as expensive as, or less expensive than, the first)

- one certificate for $200 and a $200 certificate for $100

- one certificate for $225 and a $150 certificate for $75

- one certificate for $250 and a $100 certificate for $50

... and so on :-)
Daughter understands the deal to be as follows: Whatever amount of money you send them, you will get: 1) The first card for the amount of money you sent them, in this case, $300.; 2) the second "discount" card which is 50% of the face amount of the first card, but is entirely FREE.

Now, I don't think this is what the offer means, but I can understand why daughter didn't think she needed to provide any instructions with her payment. If she was correct, it would be automatic--you send in X, you get two cards: first one is for X, second gift card is for 1/2 X.

So daughter is thinking there is no way spa could misunderstand what she wants: gift card for 300 and second card for 150.



So daughter is mystified when she only gets the 300 and there is no second card for 150.

She contacts spa. Spa explains: "No you misunderstood. It's buy one for full price, and then buy the second one for half price. Do you want to buy a second $300 card for $150? We will honor that." "No, I want a second card for $150 for free." "I'm sorry, we can't do that." "Well I was supposed to get a second card for 150." "Well, we can send you a 150 card for half price." "No, I don't want to pay half price, I want the second card of 150 without paying anything more for it." "I'm sorry, we can't do that. Look--this was a huge misunderstanding. Here's what we can do. Since the idea was to give customers a 25% discount, and you paid 300, we can rebate you $75 so your total out of pocket is $225. We can't refund your credit card but we can send you another $75 gift card."
"Be fearful when others are greedy, be even MORE fearful when others are fearful."
Adfmacro
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Re: Consumer Math Question

Post by Adfmacro »

If it were to buy one pair of shoes and get the second for 1/2 off, I don’t think the OPs daughter would have expected one pair plus a right shoe for the price of one, but when the product is cash equivalent, things don’t seem that clear.
dbr
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Re: Consumer Math Question

Post by dbr »

This is kind of an interesting math problem but also an issue of customer relations.

The math problem is defined by the two conditions of buy one - get one free and the total cost being $300. There is a family of solutions that ranges from buying one $300 certificate for $300 and one 0$ certificate for 0$ and getting $300 of goods for $300 and 0% discount -- or the other extreme of buying a 0$ certificate for 0$ and a $600 certificate for $300 and getting $600 worth of goods for $300 and a 50% discount.'

If one imposes the reasonable and obvious further condition that both certificates have the same value then the deal is to buy one $200 certificate for $200 and one $200 certificate for $100 and get $400 worth of goods for $300 and that is a 25% discount.

The contention that the purchase be for one $225 certificate for $225 and a $150 certificate for $75 "because there is a 25% discount" is a mental malfunction in the part of he spa that falls in the category of "not even wrong" meaning plain nonsense rather than an error. In any case in that deal one gets $375 worth of goods for $300, which is actually a discount of 20%. In that sense the deal proposed by the spa is cheating the customer because they claim to offer a 25% discount and only give a 20% discount.

As to whether the two certificates have to be of equal value, that might be a negotiation between the customer and the spa. It is unlikely the spa is going to discount the larger of the two, however. Very often these 50% off the second one also contain the condition "of equal or less value."
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Oicuryy
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Re: Consumer Math Question

Post by Oicuryy »

Let X and Y represent the face value of the two gift certificates. 300 is the total amount paid. Which of the following math expressions best interprets the phrase "buy one gift certificate, get an additional certificate for 50% off"?

A. X+Y/2 = 300 (discount ranging from 0% to 50%)
B. X+Y/2 = 300 and X=Y (discount of 25%)
C. X=300, Y=X/4 (discount of 20%)
D. X=300, Y=X/2 (discount of 33.3%)



The correct answer is C according to the spa. I picked A. I can't fault the OP for picking D. She is closer to the right formula than I am.

Ron
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