Calling all Plumbers (or anyone who has bought a toilet).

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LittleMaggieMae
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Re: Calling all Plumbers (or anyone who has bought a toilet).

Post by LittleMaggieMae »

I replaced a 25 year old toilet - because 5 years ago I had to replace the "innards" because the plug thing wasn't sealing like it should and the water was running endlessly I couldn't find replacement parts that would fit my toilet at the hardware store. I had to kludge a fix with a new "innards" replacement and what I already have. Then this year the "float" failed and another trip to the hardware store resulted in "not the right parts". My brother said he'd replace the toilet if I picked out a new one.

I picked out a new one - it's ADA height. We installed in ourselves. it works great. We did open the box and check to see that the toilet wasn't damaged at the Home Depot before buying. The "soft close" toilet seat that came with it was shrink wrapped in the box.

I'll be honest - I'm short. The ADA height is uncomfortable. But i got use to it - it's just like all the other chairs I have to sit in. I totally get why everyone sings the praises of the 'chair height' toilet they are taller than me and have longer legs.

If the ADA height toilet is uncomfortable I would demand the plumber install the height you asked for. Both types of toilets are readily available for purchase and generally at the same price (or close to it) for the same model/style.

Also, I really like the 'soft close' toilet seat - I keep the seat down - I have a cat who likes to drown his toys in the toilet or his water bowls. stuffed cat toy Mousies do flush well nor do plastic milk rings or milk caps or anything else the stupid cat feels the need to drown. Just saying. So the toilet seat needs to be down. The soft close just needs you to start it going down - and it will softly finish the job. Best thing ever in toilet innovations. :)
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kevinf
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Re: Calling all Plumbers (or anyone who has bought a toilet).

Post by kevinf »

A modern water conserving low-flush toilet may cause problems with older cast-iron plumbing. The rough inside of old cast iron drains may catch and accumulate waste products as the slug of water is not enough to keep it floating above the pipe itself. Modern PVC pipes do not have this problem as they remain smooth through their service life.
Audioarc
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Re: Calling all Plumbers (or anyone who has bought a toilet).

Post by Audioarc »

I recently replaced a standard height toilet with a comfort height toilet. Home Depot had it packaged with a seat for less than the same Kohler model without the seat. The reviews online said the seat was not the best. I received it from the delivery truck and immediately opened it to be sure it was not damaged. I prefer the comfort height. I agree the seat is not as good as other seats.
tibbitts
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Re: Calling all Plumbers (or anyone who has bought a toilet).

Post by tibbitts »

When I installed a toilet I found the first one I'd bought was uneven on the bottom so it wouldn't sit flat on the tile. So when I went back to the store I opened another one and checked for that - which required removing the toilet from the packaging. It was much closer to flat. Unfortunately my new floor was also only close to flat but that's another story.

I would not buy a lower-than-ADA toilet but maybe very short people would prefer that.

My toilet was inexpensive and came with an obviously inexpensive seat.
dknightd
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Re: Calling all Plumbers (or anyone who has bought a toilet).

Post by dknightd »

If you are not comfortable with the seat height, then get one you are comfortable with. If the plumber got the wrong seat height then replacement is on them.

edit: it is possible that all new installs be ADA complaint. I do not know the laws where you live . . .
Retired 2019. So far, so good. I want to wake up every morning. But I want to die in my sleep. Just another conundrum. I think the solution might be afternoon naps ;)
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kevinf
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Re: Calling all Plumbers (or anyone who has bought a toilet).

Post by kevinf »

I seriously doubt that ANY private residential install requires ADA toilets. Rentals/apartments perhaps? But not a private home.
lazydavid
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Re: Calling all Plumbers (or anyone who has bought a toilet).

Post by lazydavid »

megabad wrote: Tue Feb 23, 2021 7:27 pm
Boglegirl81 wrote: Tue Feb 23, 2021 6:48 pm I’d have to think people who want a low toilet are in a very, very slim minority.
Really? I would think the opposite. A short toilet will work for just about anyone. A high seat can be easily added in your home if applicable . There isn’t a good inoffensive solution for a toilet that is too high. Anecdotally (very vocal anecdotally), based on my SO, it seems ADA toilets are uncomfortable for anyone maybe 5ft 3 and shorter. I would say this is maybe 50 percent of the US population. I am a pretty large guy and even I am slightly uncomfortable on the commercial 19” models.
I would disagree that a high seat is "inoffensive" compared to a little stool such as the squatty potty linked above, but that's neither here nor there. :) And I believe we're actually talking about 17" here, rather than 19".

However, your height statistics are quite a bit off. 40% of females and just 2% of males are 5'3" or shorter. The net result is that 21% of the adult population is 5'3" or shorter.
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kevinf
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Re: Calling all Plumbers (or anyone who has bought a toilet).

Post by kevinf »

I'm a tall guy with long legs and I find higher toilets uncomfortable as well. The shorter ones also mimic the position you've evolved to use to defecate (a squatting position versus legs and back straight) better than a high toilet. There is some talk about how high toilets are potentially causing or exacerbating certain GI issues that you see much less of in places that use squatting toilets such as Japan... though it may also come down to general diet and health.
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Cruise
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Re: Calling all Plumbers (or anyone who has bought a toilet).

Post by Cruise »

OP here. Many thanks for all the insights and suggestions. I've learned a bunch about toilets over the past week.

Just to check my senses, I called a sister and asked her to measure the toilets that I use when I visit her home. They never seemed of abnormal height to me. She measured both, and they were about the same height as my newly installed toilet. Interesting: She did not know that she had "comfort height toilets;" I never thought hers was problematic.

At the urging of my wife, I am going to let this go. Well, sort of...I'm going to let the plumber wait a bit for payment.
Lexx
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Re: Calling all Plumbers (or anyone who has bought a toilet).

Post by Lexx »

Cruise wrote: Wed Feb 24, 2021 7:53 pm OP here. Many thanks for all the insights and suggestions. I've learned a bunch about toilets over the past week.

Just to check my senses, I called a sister and asked her to measure the toilets that I use when I visit her home. They never seemed of abnormal height to me. She measured both, and they were about the same height as my newly installed toilet. Interesting: She did not know that she had "comfort height toilets;" I never thought hers was problematic.

At the urging of my wife, I am going to let this go. Well, sort of...I'm going to let the plumber wait a bit for payment.
Dude, pay the plumber. He did the right thing. You're basically happy with the outcome. The box was opened to make sure there wasn't any problems with the item. End of story. Delaying payment just seems petty.
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Cruise
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Re: Calling all Plumbers (or anyone who has bought a toilet).

Post by Cruise »

Lexx wrote: Wed Feb 24, 2021 9:31 pm
Cruise wrote: Wed Feb 24, 2021 7:53 pm OP here. Many thanks for all the insights and suggestions. I've learned a bunch about toilets over the past week.

Just to check my senses, I called a sister and asked her to measure the toilets that I use when I visit her home. They never seemed of abnormal height to me. She measured both, and they were about the same height as my newly installed toilet. Interesting: She did not know that she had "comfort height toilets;" I never thought hers was problematic.

At the urging of my wife, I am going to let this go. Well, sort of...I'm going to let the plumber wait a bit for payment.
Dude, pay the plumber. He did the right thing. You're basically happy with the outcome. The box was opened to make sure there wasn't any problems with the item. End of story. Delaying payment just seems petty.
No one said that he wasn't getting paid. And, by the way, he did not do the right thing...which would have been to install the toilet that I ordered.
adestefan
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Re: Calling all Plumbers (or anyone who has bought a toilet).

Post by adestefan »

Then call and tell him to put in what you wanted. Don’t do the passive aggressive, petty thing like sitting on a payment for a couple weeks.
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F150HD
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Re: Calling all Plumbers (or anyone who has bought a toilet).

Post by F150HD »

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Californiastate
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Re: Calling all Plumbers (or anyone who has bought a toilet).

Post by Californiastate »

Cruise wrote: Wed Feb 24, 2021 9:39 pm
Lexx wrote: Wed Feb 24, 2021 9:31 pm
Cruise wrote: Wed Feb 24, 2021 7:53 pm OP here. Many thanks for all the insights and suggestions. I've learned a bunch about toilets over the past week.

Just to check my senses, I called a sister and asked her to measure the toilets that I use when I visit her home. They never seemed of abnormal height to me. She measured both, and they were about the same height as my newly installed toilet. Interesting: She did not know that she had "comfort height toilets;" I never thought hers was problematic.

At the urging of my wife, I am going to let this go. Well, sort of...I'm going to let the plumber wait a bit for payment.
Dude, pay the plumber. He did the right thing. You're basically happy with the outcome. The box was opened to make sure there wasn't any problems with the item. End of story. Delaying payment just seems petty.
No one said that he wasn't getting paid. And, by the way, he did not do the right thing...which would have been to install the toilet that I ordered.
You have accepted the job. Withholding/delaying payment now is beyond petty. I hope your water heater doesn't blow on a holiday. You've shown you can't install a water closet. Water heater installations can be more difficult.
stoptothink
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Re: Calling all Plumbers (or anyone who has bought a toilet).

Post by stoptothink »

Cruise wrote: Wed Feb 24, 2021 9:39 pm
Lexx wrote: Wed Feb 24, 2021 9:31 pm
Cruise wrote: Wed Feb 24, 2021 7:53 pm OP here. Many thanks for all the insights and suggestions. I've learned a bunch about toilets over the past week.

Just to check my senses, I called a sister and asked her to measure the toilets that I use when I visit her home. They never seemed of abnormal height to me. She measured both, and they were about the same height as my newly installed toilet. Interesting: She did not know that she had "comfort height toilets;" I never thought hers was problematic.

At the urging of my wife, I am going to let this go. Well, sort of...I'm going to let the plumber wait a bit for payment.
Dude, pay the plumber. He did the right thing. You're basically happy with the outcome. The box was opened to make sure there wasn't any problems with the item. End of story. Delaying payment just seems petty.
No one said that he wasn't getting paid. And, by the way, he did not do the right thing...which would have been to install the toilet that I ordered.
That would be my response: "install the toilet that I ordered and I'll gladly pay you". It really doesn't matter where the current toilet came from, it is not what you asked for.
Jim Beaux
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Re: Calling all Plumbers (or anyone who has bought a toilet).

Post by Jim Beaux »

This thread is beyond all reason. Think about it; 4 days of debate over 2 inches of sitting height? Naw man.
egrets
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Re: Calling all Plumbers (or anyone who has bought a toilet).

Post by egrets »

megabad wrote: Tue Feb 23, 2021 7:27 pm
Really? I would think the opposite. A short toilet will work for just about anyone. A high seat can be easily added in your home if applicable . There isn’t a good inoffensive solution for a toilet that is too high. Anecdotally (very vocal anecdotally), based on my SO, it seems ADA toilets are uncomfortable for anyone maybe 5ft 3 and shorter. I would say this is maybe 50 percent of the US population. I am a pretty large guy and even I am slightly uncomfortable on the commercial 19” models.
I'm a semi-tall elderly person with arthritis. A short toilet is a misery. I added a high seat but it is ugly. I'm not replacing the toilet with a higher one because of the problem with new toilets and old cast iron pipes someone mentioned, so I have this ugly but comfortable solution.
Californiastate
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Re: Calling all Plumbers (or anyone who has bought a toilet).

Post by Californiastate »

egrets wrote: Fri Feb 26, 2021 9:31 am
megabad wrote: Tue Feb 23, 2021 7:27 pm
Really? I would think the opposite. A short toilet will work for just about anyone. A high seat can be easily added in your home if applicable . There isn’t a good inoffensive solution for a toilet that is too high. Anecdotally (very vocal anecdotally), based on my SO, it seems ADA toilets are uncomfortable for anyone maybe 5ft 3 and shorter. I would say this is maybe 50 percent of the US population. I am a pretty large guy and even I am slightly uncomfortable on the commercial 19” models.
I'm a semi-tall elderly person with arthritis. A short toilet is a misery. I added a high seat but it is ugly. I'm not replacing the toilet with a higher one because of the problem with new toilets and old cast iron pipes someone mentioned, so I have this ugly but comfortable solution.
Your cast iron plumbing might not be as bad as the plastic industry wants you to think.
hicabob
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Re: Calling all Plumbers (or anyone who has bought a toilet).

Post by hicabob »

Californiastate wrote: Fri Feb 26, 2021 10:03 am
Your cast iron plumbing might not be as bad as the plastic industry wants you to think.
I looked inside my 50 yo cast iron sewer pipe with a plumbing scope and it looked amazingly good - nice and smooth. Still I don't think anyone would use cast Iron in new construction unless they had to by code. 30 something years ago San Mateo county code used to require cast iron for sewage!
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kevinf
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Re: Calling all Plumbers (or anyone who has bought a toilet).

Post by kevinf »

hicabob wrote: Fri Feb 26, 2021 10:34 am
Californiastate wrote: Fri Feb 26, 2021 10:03 am
Your cast iron plumbing might not be as bad as the plastic industry wants you to think.
I looked inside my 50 yo cast iron sewer pipe with a plumbing scope and it looked amazingly good - nice and smooth. Still I don't think anyone would use cast Iron in new construction unless they had to by code. 30 something years ago San Mateo county code used to require cast iron for sewage!
Another problem with cast iron installs is that they likely also use older plumbing codes such as U style house traps which tend to clog easily. I had just one such trap removed in my house after dealing with that particular problem (they make special plungers for it!) I also had a plumber come in to clear a very difficult clog in the below-slab main line. An additional bit of fun was the hour he spent trying to get the cast iron cleanout cover to come unscrewed from the main so he could snake the line. I have an outside cast iron gutter pipe that was buried next to the foundation well below grade... it deteriorated and began leaking roof runoff directly into the foundation causing foundation damage and water intrusion.

But I'm sure big plastic is the reason why we don't see cast iron pipes much anymore.
LittleMaggieMae
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Re: Calling all Plumbers (or anyone who has bought a toilet).

Post by LittleMaggieMae »

Cruise wrote: Wed Feb 24, 2021 7:53 pm OP here. Many thanks for all the insights and suggestions. I've learned a bunch about toilets over the past week.

Just to check my senses, I called a sister and asked her to measure the toilets that I use when I visit her home. They never seemed of abnormal height to me. She measured both, and they were about the same height as my newly installed toilet. Interesting: She did not know that she had "comfort height toilets;" I never thought hers was problematic.

At the urging of my wife, I am going to let this go. Well, sort of...I'm going to let the plumber wait a bit for payment.
you could always just surf over to the Home depot or Lowes or Menards website and look at toilets on line... you can check the measurements and determine if your new toilet is "chair hieght" or ADA height or whatever...

When I purchased a toilet for mid century house - I measured the existing toilet and "foot print" and distance from the wall and height of the tank and how far out the bowl went. Modern stuff doesn't fit well in my old house. Thankfully my bathroom is big enough that I didn't have to worry that installing a too big toilet would result in the door not being able to close. :) Anyway - when I went to the store to actually see and purchase a toilet - I had a list of 4 that would fit and I thougth would "look nice" which was a good thing - because there were atleast 50 toilets displayed on the Wall O' Toilets at the HomeDepot. My pre shopping eliminated alot of indecision and being overwhelmed. There's a bunch of different toilet manufacturers - but the toilets are all pretty much the same across brands. I'm guessing the plumber sold you a "plain" everyday toilet - versus one of the higher priced "toilet designed around a theme". Just go look. You''ll see what I'm talking about.
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StevieG72
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Re: Calling all Plumbers (or anyone who has bought a toilet).

Post by StevieG72 »

I never thought much about toilet height until I installed a chair height toilet which is 16 1/2 “ to the rim, add a seat and I imagine it is 17” plus. Much more comfortable, I don’t understand the folks that prefer a low seat. If given the option would you sit in a kiddie chair or an adult chair? As far as the proper position to clear bowels, meh I am not sold on that, nor do I have any issues using a chair height toilet.
Fools think their own way is right, but the wise listen to others.
Enjoy11
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Re: Calling all Plumbers (or anyone who has bought a toilet).

Post by Enjoy11 »

Oh man was I a jerk in this thread. I apologize for that. Times are hard for me because of Covid worries and my eyes are getting infected again from wearing a mask and huffing and puffing around a construction site. And fatigue from overtime. But that’s no excuse. Sorry OP. I’ll try and do better.

It’s funny how something a little different can feel so different to a user. I use wrenches a lot. In the last 2 years, I’ve upgraded my wrench set 3 times. Each time, I initially really dislike the feel of the open spanners when I use them. They just don’t feel right! It’s taken 2-3 weeks for my hand or brain to get used to them, and then they are fine and I don’t even notice. Maybe it’ll work that way for you with the new toilet.

Regardless, you should communicate with the plumber that you aren’t happy with not getting the height that you wanted. He needs to know and maybe learn from this. Maybe he didn’t understand or something else happened. Good luck with the toilet and I love the diverse and interesting topics on this site!
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Cruise
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Re: Calling all Plumbers (or anyone who has bought a toilet).

Post by Cruise »

Enjoy11 wrote: Sat Feb 27, 2021 3:09 am Oh man was I a jerk in this thread. I apologize for that. Times are hard for me because of Covid worries and my eyes are getting infected again from wearing a mask and huffing and puffing around a construction site. And fatigue from overtime. But that’s no excuse. Sorry OP. I’ll try and do better.

It’s funny how something a little different can feel so different to a user. I use wrenches a lot. In the last 2 years, I’ve upgraded my wrench set 3 times. Each time, I initially really dislike the feel of the open spanners when I use them. They just don’t feel right! It’s taken 2-3 weeks for my hand or brain to get used to them, and then they are fine and I don’t even notice. Maybe it’ll work that way for you with the new toilet.

Regardless, you should communicate with the plumber that you aren’t happy with not getting the height that you wanted. He needs to know and maybe learn from this. Maybe he didn’t understand or something else happened. Good luck with the toilet and I love the diverse and interesting topics on this site!
Hey, Enjoy11. I totally understand COVID worries and fatigue from too much work. I appreciate your message, and we all try to be at our best and also hoped not to be judged by our worst moments. Be safe out there.
egrets
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Re: Calling all Plumbers (or anyone who has bought a toilet).

Post by egrets »

Enjoy11 wrote: Sat Feb 27, 2021 3:09 am Oh man was I a jerk in this thread. I apologize for that. Times are hard for me because of Covid worries and my eyes are getting infected again from wearing a mask and huffing and puffing around a construction site. And fatigue from overtime. But that’s no excuse. Sorry OP. I’ll try and do better.
Pre-vaccination, my doctor got safety glasses that fit completely so no air seems like it would get in. Maybe those would help? (She still wears them.)

I'm sorry you are distressed, this past year sucks. Hopefully vaccinations will step up soon, they are in our area with mass vaccination sites and better supply.
egrets
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Re: Calling all Plumbers (or anyone who has bought a toilet).

Post by egrets »

Californiastate wrote: Fri Feb 26, 2021 10:03 am
egrets wrote: Fri Feb 26, 2021 9:31 am
megabad wrote: Tue Feb 23, 2021 7:27 pm
Really? I would think the opposite. A short toilet will work for just about anyone. A high seat can be easily added in your home if applicable . There isn’t a good inoffensive solution for a toilet that is too high. Anecdotally (very vocal anecdotally), based on my SO, it seems ADA toilets are uncomfortable for anyone maybe 5ft 3 and shorter. I would say this is maybe 50 percent of the US population. I am a pretty large guy and even I am slightly uncomfortable on the commercial 19” models.
I'm a semi-tall elderly person with arthritis. A short toilet is a misery. I added a high seat but it is ugly. I'm not replacing the toilet with a higher one because of the problem with new toilets and old cast iron pipes someone mentioned, so I have this ugly but comfortable solution.
Your cast iron plumbing might not be as bad as the plastic industry wants you to think.
Better safe than sorry. If the old toilet is taken out and the new one causes problems, a lot of messy, expensive, time consuming work would need to be done under the house.
grok87
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Re: Calling all Plumbers (or anyone who has bought a toilet).

Post by grok87 »

Lexx wrote: Tue Feb 23, 2021 10:47 pm When we did our gut remodel, I made sure all the toilets were Toto ADA height. ADA height is so much more comfortable when if you sit for an appreciable amount of time. The short squatty ones make your legs go numb. Oh and BTW, the 30 year old toilets are prized these days because other than the Totos and a very few other units, most of the newer ones are low flow and clog up all the time. Even with the Toto, I have a plumbing snake for the occasional clog. I bet that leak was caused by a dried out O-ring.
we are very happy with our new Toto ADA height toilet.
RIP Mr. Bogle.
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