I'm no expert in French defense but it doesn't seem to prevent 2. d4. I would think losing the center is bad for black, not unrecoverably bad but slightly bad.willthrill81 wrote: ↑Sun Nov 28, 2021 9:55 am Different strokes. I prefer the more open positions that e4 tends to lead to, and yes, one must be prepared for the Sicilian. Actually, I believe the French Defense to be at least as good for equalizing the position for black.
Let's play chess
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Re: Let's play chess
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Re: Let's play chess
I'm rooting for Nepo, but as far as this press conference, Carlsen's response won hands down https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bL5jq87uHmI
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Re: Let's play chess
There are refutations to 2. d4 though. The French defense is actually one of the more popular responses to 1. e4. I would personally rather face the Sicilian than the French, especially since death isn't on the line.Marseille07 wrote: ↑Sun Nov 28, 2021 10:34 amI'm no expert in French defense but it doesn't seem to prevent 2. d4. I would think losing the center is bad for black, not unrecoverably bad but slightly bad.willthrill81 wrote: ↑Sun Nov 28, 2021 9:55 am Different strokes. I prefer the more open positions that e4 tends to lead to, and yes, one must be prepared for the Sicilian. Actually, I believe the French Defense to be at least as good for equalizing the position for black.
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Re: Let's play chess
Match 3 was like watching a computer match. I think, the clocks have way too much time to make these matches remotely exciting.
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Re: Let's play chess
I'm not watching live but checking Levy's recap later. He is pretty good himself and can explain the intent behind the moves I don't comprehend.
Re: Let's play chess
I prefer Agadmator. Levy, I feel, is stuck in a rut trying to make GM, but he is making bank between YouTube and Twitch. And his analysis lately hasn't been as good as Agadmator's. But I can see why kids like Levy.Marseille07 wrote: ↑Sun Nov 28, 2021 7:12 pmI'm not watching live but checking Levy's recap later. He is pretty good himself and can explain the intent behind the moves I don't comprehend.
Here's the third game:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GdzqhmeSDvY
I'll catch these after the match. Looks like a rest day tomorrow.
I really wished they had less time because these long games often end up in a draw.
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Re: Let's play chess
Agadmator seems like a good commentator as well. The greatest queen sac video was quite interesting, Stockfish said 0.0 after the sac...it wasn't the best move, but didn't worsen the position for white.rockstar wrote: ↑Sun Nov 28, 2021 8:25 pm I prefer Agadmator. Levy, I feel, is stuck in a rut trying to make GM, but he is making bank between YouTube and Twitch. And his analysis lately hasn't been as good as Agadmator's. But I can see why kids like Levy.
Here's the third game:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GdzqhmeSDvY
I'll catch these after the match. Looks like a rest day tomorrow.
I really wished they had less time because these long games often end up in a draw.
Last edited by Marseille07 on Mon Nov 29, 2021 1:17 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Let's play chess
Do folks allow take-backs? I used to allow them but no longer do. I don't ask for take-backs when I screw up.
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Re: Let's play chess
So I started playing 10 minute games on Lichess rather than the three minutes games I normally do.
My rating after 24 games is 2035. Yay, finally got over 2000, just had to lengthen the time controls.
My rating after 24 games is 2035. Yay, finally got over 2000, just had to lengthen the time controls.
Re: Let's play chess
On obvious mouse slips when the time control is 5 minutes or greater.Marseille07 wrote: ↑Mon Nov 29, 2021 10:59 am Do folks allow take-backs? I used to allow them but no longer do. I don't ask for take-backs when I screw up.
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Re: Let's play chess
I think that's very reasonable. I think mouse slips are fine to take back (like, an obvious capture and a piece stops short by a square) .halfnine wrote: ↑Mon Nov 29, 2021 12:37 pmOn obvious mouse slips when the time control is 5 minutes or greater.Marseille07 wrote: ↑Mon Nov 29, 2021 10:59 am Do folks allow take-backs? I used to allow them but no longer do. I don't ask for take-backs when I screw up.
Re: Let's play chess
I think if Levy had a preference he'd probably leave the WC game reviews to Agadmator (and others) and focus on other content. But, at the end of the day, he now has a huge following and can't ignore it.rockstar wrote: ↑Sun Nov 28, 2021 8:25 pmI prefer Agadmator. Levy, I feel, is stuck in a rut trying to make GM, but he is making bank between YouTube and Twitch. And his analysis lately hasn't been as good as Agadmator's. But I can see why kids like Levy.Marseille07 wrote: ↑Sun Nov 28, 2021 7:12 pmI'm not watching live but checking Levy's recap later. He is pretty good himself and can explain the intent behind the moves I don't comprehend.
Here's the third game:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GdzqhmeSDvY
I'll catch these after the match. Looks like a rest day tomorrow.
I really wished they had less time because these long games often end up in a draw.
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Re: Let's play chess
I don't want to take anything away from Agadmator, but his peak rating appears to be around 2000 and that was a decade ago. Does he really see the intricacies of 2800-rated GMs playing World Championship quality chess? I know I don't, unless someone much stronger explains to me.
Or maybe people these days load up Stockfish then annotate based on what the engine says?
Re: Let's play chess
I watch both people, but only for a few minutes and not too often. I prefer anyone who is less animated and trying to put on a face during their video.
Anyone interested in Chinese chess, let me know!
Anyone interested in Chinese chess, let me know!
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Re: Let's play chess
I don't either. It's part of the game, not unlike those playing with physical boards who knock over their own king, and the opponent quickly accepts the 'resignation'.Marseille07 wrote: ↑Mon Nov 29, 2021 10:59 am Do folks allow take-backs? I used to allow them but no longer do. I don't ask for take-backs when I screw up.
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Re: Let's play chess
For some reason I see the Englund Gambit a lot on lichess:
I was white and I fell for it but managed to come back.1. d4 e5 2. dxe5 Bc5 3. Nf3 d6 4. exd6 Ne7 5. dxe7 Bxf2+ 6. Kxf2 Qxd1 7. Bg5
Qxc2 8. Nbd2 Nc6 9. e3 Be6 10. Bb5 Bg4 11. Rac1 Qxb2 12. Rxc6 Qxb5 13. Rxc7
Bxf3 14. Nc4 f6 15. Nd6# 1-0
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Re: Let's play chess
Usually with an opening like this you can credit/blame Youtube. Aman Hambleton, Eric Rosen, and Levy Rozman all have videos out on an opening trap in this line (and Aman used his against another master over the board).Marseille07 wrote: ↑Mon Nov 29, 2021 7:23 pm For some reason I see the Englund Gambit a lot on lichess:I was white and I fell for it but managed to come back.1. d4 e5 2. dxe5 Bc5 3. Nf3 d6 4. exd6 Ne7 5. dxe7 Bxf2+ 6. Kxf2 Qxd1 7. Bg5
Qxc2 8. Nbd2 Nc6 9. e3 Be6 10. Bb5 Bg4 11. Rac1 Qxb2 12. Rxc6 Qxb5 13. Rxc7
Bxf3 14. Nc4 f6 15. Nd6# 1-0
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Re: Let's play chess
I see. Some players resign as soon as their opening trap is defended...tbh I'm not sure why they come online at all.canadianbacon wrote: ↑Tue Nov 30, 2021 7:33 amUsually with an opening like this you can credit/blame Youtube. Aman Hambleton, Eric Rosen, and Levy Rozman all have videos out on an opening trap in this line (and Aman used his against another master over the board).Marseille07 wrote: ↑Mon Nov 29, 2021 7:23 pm For some reason I see the Englund Gambit a lot on lichess:I was white and I fell for it but managed to come back.1. d4 e5 2. dxe5 Bc5 3. Nf3 d6 4. exd6 Ne7 5. dxe7 Bxf2+ 6. Kxf2 Qxd1 7. Bg5
Qxc2 8. Nbd2 Nc6 9. e3 Be6 10. Bb5 Bg4 11. Rac1 Qxb2 12. Rxc6 Qxb5 13. Rxc7
Bxf3 14. Nc4 f6 15. Nd6# 1-0
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Re: Let's play chess
I just played through your game and that's the EXACT Rosen trap (although he learned it from someone else). He always premoves Ne7 so it looks like an accident.Marseille07 wrote: ↑Tue Nov 30, 2021 10:37 am I see. Some players resign as soon as their opening trap is defended...tbh I'm not sure why they come online at all.
It is funny that people prep these traps and then are so bad otherwise that it then crumbles ten moves later. The number of people playing 2 Nf6 has also exploded because of Rosen's Stafford videos (I don't think they are Caruana fans ). Oh well...
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Re: Let's play chess
Yeah, I now know 1. d4 e5 means a trap incoming. I was able to come back this time but there are games I fell & couldn't recover.canadianbacon wrote: ↑Tue Nov 30, 2021 11:04 amI just played through your game and that's the EXACT Rosen trap (although he learned it from someone else). He always premoves Ne7 so it looks like an accident.Marseille07 wrote: ↑Tue Nov 30, 2021 10:37 am I see. Some players resign as soon as their opening trap is defended...tbh I'm not sure why they come online at all.
It is funny that people prep these traps and then are so bad otherwise that it then crumbles ten moves later. The number of people playing 2 Nf6 has also exploded because of Rosen's Stafford videos (I don't think they are Caruana fans ). Oh well...
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Re: Let's play chess
Game 4 was another draw but this time, Magnus forced a draw because he didn't want to complicate the end game in the a-file.
Levy says he'd be shocked if Nepo plays 1. e4 in Game 5, let's see what happens.
Levy says he'd be shocked if Nepo plays 1. e4 in Game 5, let's see what happens.
Re: Let's play chess
They play the Englund Gambit or even 1...c5 because quick wins are rewarded in Blitz Arena style tournaments. Although, OTOH, this seems to disappear once players are greater than 2200 on LIchess. There is a kid my children play against often online who will play either and scores very well in the tournaments. If you want to avoid theory and just play chess with an advantageous position the simplest solution we came across was:Marseille07 wrote: ↑Tue Nov 30, 2021 10:37 amI see. Some players resign as soon as their opening trap is defended...tbh I'm not sure why they come online at all.canadianbacon wrote: ↑Tue Nov 30, 2021 7:33 amUsually with an opening like this you can credit/blame Youtube. Aman Hambleton, Eric Rosen, and Levy Rozman all have videos out on an opening trap in this line (and Aman used his against another master over the board).Marseille07 wrote: ↑Mon Nov 29, 2021 7:23 pm For some reason I see the Englund Gambit a lot on lichess:I was white and I fell for it but managed to come back.1. d4 e5 2. dxe5 Bc5 3. Nf3 d6 4. exd6 Ne7 5. dxe7 Bxf2+ 6. Kxf2 Qxd1 7. Bg5
Qxc2 8. Nbd2 Nc6 9. e3 Be6 10. Bb5 Bg4 11. Rac1 Qxb2 12. Rxc6 Qxb5 13. Rxc7
Bxf3 14. Nc4 f6 15. Nd6# 1-0
Qe7 line: 1.d4 e5 2.dxe5 Nc6 3.Nf3 Qe7 4.Nc3 Nxe5 5.e4
Bc5 line: 1.d4 e5 2.dxe5 Bc5 3.Nf3 d6 4.Nc3
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Re: Let's play chess
Thank you, I loaded up both lines and they seem effective against the Englund Gambithalfnine wrote: ↑Wed Dec 01, 2021 3:40 am They play the Englund Gambit or even 1...c5 because quick wins are rewarded in Blitz Arena style tournaments. Although, OTOH, this seems to disappear once players are greater than 2200 on LIchess. There is a kid my children play against often online who will play either and scores very well in the tournaments. If you want to avoid theory and just play chess with an advantageous position the simplest solution we came across was:
Qe7 line: 1.d4 e5 2.dxe5 Nc6 3.Nf3 Qe7 4.Nc3 Nxe5 5.e4
Bc5 line: 1.d4 e5 2.dxe5 Bc5 3.Nf3 d6 4.Nc3
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Re: Let's play chess
Another game, another draw. Tomorrow is a rest day.
Re: Let's play chess
Why bother? Can they just agree to draw, rather than waste hours of their lives playing?
This is a good overview:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9bwP861g1Cc
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Re: Let's play chess
Yeah, I think everyone's talking about 20. Red1 that should have been 20. c4: https://lichess.org/broadcast/world-che ... 5/H8H4enOLrockstar wrote: ↑Wed Dec 01, 2021 6:42 pmWhy bother? Can they just agree to draw, rather than waste hours of their lives playing?
This is a good overview:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9bwP861g1Cc
The truth is though, beating Carlsen is never easy. It's kind of amusing the pundits loading up engines and saying this and that, but they can't even draw Carlsen if they're sitting at the table.
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Re: Let's play chess
It theoretically may turn out that 1. ... e5 and 1. ... c5 are the only replies to 1. e4 that equalize, but this is certainly not anything that has been established at this time. The French defense cedes space in the center, but black stakes a claim in the center with 2. ... d5. The defense has been, and continues to be played by top grandmasters.Marseille07 wrote: ↑Sun Nov 28, 2021 10:34 amI'm no expert in French defense but it doesn't seem to prevent 2. d4. I would think losing the center is bad for black, not unrecoverably bad but slightly bad.willthrill81 wrote: ↑Sun Nov 28, 2021 9:55 am Different strokes. I prefer the more open positions that e4 tends to lead to, and yes, one must be prepared for the Sicilian. Actually, I believe the French Defense to be at least as good for equalizing the position for black.
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Re: Let's play chess
Yeah, it's quite interesting how the French defense tries retaking the center. I'm kind of surprised that Carlsen's using Ruy Lopez, which (I believe) often leads to more open & tactical games.Northern Flicker wrote: ↑Wed Dec 01, 2021 6:53 pm It theoretically may turn out that 1. ... e5 and 1. ... c5 are the only replies to 1. e4 that equalize, but this is certainly not anything that has been established at this time. The French defense cedes space in the center, but black stakes a claim in the center with 2. ... d5. The defense has been, and continues to be played by top grandmasters.
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Re: Let's play chess
Lots of so called hypermodern defenses let white build a commanding center only to undermine it later, or achieve a closed center with play on opposite wings. The King's Indian Defense is much more extreme in that regard than the French Defense. The King's Indian perhaps may not equalize for black, but you probably would not suspect that when playing over games where Kasparov or Fischer played it.
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Re: Let's play chess
That's true, I guess the idea then was to indirectly influence the center with a knight without moving the pawns.
If Nepo doesn't win the championship, I guess Firouzja would be the next challenger. He just hit 2800.
If Nepo doesn't win the championship, I guess Firouzja would be the next challenger. He just hit 2800.
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Re: Let's play chess
I think Nepo's in trouble, he needs to win with white but has been unable to break down Carlsen's Ruy Lopez.
Apparently Game 5 was winnable if he played correctly but there was an inaccurate move.
Apparently Game 5 was winnable if he played correctly but there was an inaccurate move.
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Re: Let's play chess
I'm not sure that Nepo's game was ever truly winnable. Many thought he had an edge after 19.Be3, but Carlsen quickly traded his ineffective pieces for Nepo's good ones, and the position was equal after that.Marseille07 wrote: ↑Thu Dec 02, 2021 3:26 pm I think Nepo's in trouble, he needs to win with white but has been unable to break down Carlsen's Ruy Lopez.
Apparently Game 5 was winnable if he played correctly but there was an inaccurate move.
This match isn't looking good for Nepo.
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Re: Let's play chess
It's never easy to beat Carlsen, but that's the only path for Nepo. If the series goes to the tiebreakers, Nepo stands no chance.willthrill81 wrote: ↑Thu Dec 02, 2021 4:17 pmI'm not sure that Nepo's game was ever truly winnable. Many thought he had an edge after 19.Be3, but Carlsen quickly traded his ineffective pieces for Nepo's good ones, and the position was equal after that.Marseille07 wrote: ↑Thu Dec 02, 2021 3:26 pm I think Nepo's in trouble, he needs to win with white but has been unable to break down Carlsen's Ruy Lopez.
Apparently Game 5 was winnable if he played correctly but there was an inaccurate move.
This match isn't looking good for Nepo.
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Re: Let's play chess
And, of course, Nepo knows that. Few could tolerate that kind of pressure and not flinch. And if he does, Carlsen, who should be very confident at this point, is likely to punish him.Marseille07 wrote: ↑Thu Dec 02, 2021 4:26 pmIt's never easy to beat Carlsen, but that's the only path for Nepo. If the series goes to the tiebreakers, Nepo stands no chance.willthrill81 wrote: ↑Thu Dec 02, 2021 4:17 pmI'm not sure that Nepo's game was ever truly winnable. Many thought he had an edge after 19.Be3, but Carlsen quickly traded his ineffective pieces for Nepo's good ones, and the position was equal after that.Marseille07 wrote: ↑Thu Dec 02, 2021 3:26 pm I think Nepo's in trouble, he needs to win with white but has been unable to break down Carlsen's Ruy Lopez.
Apparently Game 5 was winnable if he played correctly but there was an inaccurate move.
This match isn't looking good for Nepo.
The Sensible Steward
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Re: Let's play chess
Nepo absolutely knows that. It'll be interesting if he'll try riskier lines to go for a win in Game 11 or 13.willthrill81 wrote: ↑Thu Dec 02, 2021 4:29 pm And, of course, Nepo knows that. Few could tolerate that kind of pressure and not flinch. And if he does, Carlsen, who should be very confident at this point, is likely to punish him.
Re: Let's play chess
I get the impression that Magnus would rather draw than attempt to win after we saw him draw by repetition twice already. That does make sense and something I have started to incorporate into my chess. If I know my position cannot result in a win, find a way to draw.Marseille07 wrote: ↑Wed Dec 01, 2021 6:50 pmYeah, I think everyone's talking about 20. Red1 that should have been 20. c4: https://lichess.org/broadcast/world-che ... 5/H8H4enOLrockstar wrote: ↑Wed Dec 01, 2021 6:42 pmWhy bother? Can they just agree to draw, rather than waste hours of their lives playing?
This is a good overview:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9bwP861g1Cc
The truth is though, beating Carlsen is never easy. It's kind of amusing the pundits loading up engines and saying this and that, but they can't even draw Carlsen if they're sitting at the table.
I don't think Nepo is aggressive enough to win. He seems more than willing to take a draw even if he has a chance to win.
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Re: Let's play chess
Yeah, Magnus doesn't need to win because he's invincible in tiebreakers. He won this way in 2018 vs Caruana.rockstar wrote: ↑Thu Dec 02, 2021 6:15 pm I get the impression that Magnus would rather draw than attempt to win after we saw him draw by repetition twice already. That does make sense and something I have started to incorporate into my chess. If I know my position cannot result in a win, find a way to draw.
I don't think Nepo is aggressive enough to win. He seems more than willing to take a draw even if he has a chance to win.
I think Nepo is still being careful because he doesn't want to trail the series early. But I'm sure he's fully aware he has to go for broke if the series is still tied.
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Re: Let's play chess
I have recently done tactics training focusing on this. At my level it usually makes sense to not give up on the win, but it’s not a bad idea to keep an eye out for perpetual check opportunities if the material balance gets bad.rockstar wrote: ↑Thu Dec 02, 2021 6:15 pm I get the impression that Magnus would rather draw than attempt to win after we saw him draw by repetition twice already. That does make sense and something I have started to incorporate into my chess. If I know my position cannot result in a win, find a way to draw.
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Re: Let's play chess
What a game, I couldn't stop watching: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A82NI_42kgY
Excellent delivery by agadmator.
Excellent delivery by agadmator.
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Re: Let's play chess
Game 6 turning interesting, Carlsen went +1.00 then Nepo now -1.12.
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Re: Let's play chess
That was an exciting time scramble!
Bulls make money, bears make money, pigs get slaughtered.
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Re: Let's play chess
I don't know why Nepo didn't capture the b-pawn with a bishop. That appeared like the advantage he had at one point.
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Re: Let's play chess
Magnus should bag this one easily now. This may be one of the longest world championship match games ever in terms of number of moves.Marseille07 wrote: ↑Fri Dec 03, 2021 11:00 amI don't know why Nepo didn't capture the b-pawn with a bishop. That appeared like the advantage he had at one point.
Last edited by willthrill81 on Fri Dec 03, 2021 2:13 pm, edited 1 time in total.
The Sensible Steward
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Re: Let's play chess
Wow, Nepo screwed up something somewhere. This will be 1-0.willthrill81 wrote: ↑Fri Dec 03, 2021 2:11 pmMagnus should bag this one easily now.Marseille07 wrote: ↑Fri Dec 03, 2021 11:00 amI don't know why Nepo didn't capture the b-pawn with a bishop. That appeared like the advantage he had at one point.
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Re: Let's play chess
Even the engines are having a hard time precisely evaluating the position, but Magnus should win easily, just a question of how many moves.Marseille07 wrote: ↑Fri Dec 03, 2021 2:12 pmWow, Nepo screwed up something somewhere. This will be 1-0.willthrill81 wrote: ↑Fri Dec 03, 2021 2:11 pmMagnus should bag this one easily now.Marseille07 wrote: ↑Fri Dec 03, 2021 11:00 amI don't know why Nepo didn't capture the b-pawn with a bishop. That appeared like the advantage he had at one point.
The Sensible Steward
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Re: Let's play chess
It's over! Carlsen wins game #6. This was the longest WC match game ever at 136 moves. Very exciting!
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Re: Let's play chess
Tbh Nepo had a shot when Carlsen was in time trouble. This is a devastating loss.willthrill81 wrote: ↑Fri Dec 03, 2021 2:18 pm It's over! Carlsen wins game #6. This was the longest WC match game ever at 136 moves. Very exciting!
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Re: Let's play chess
Carlsen actually blundered on 33. Rcd1. He should have played 33. Rcc2 with a winning advantage. He also blundered with 40. Nxe4.Marseille07 wrote: ↑Fri Dec 03, 2021 2:20 pmTbh Nepo had a shot when Carlsen was in time trouble. This is a devastating loss.willthrill81 wrote: ↑Fri Dec 03, 2021 2:18 pm It's over! Carlsen wins game #6. This was the longest WC match game ever at 136 moves. Very exciting!
The Sensible Steward
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Re: Let's play chess
While the game was an instant classic, I'm just disappointed by Nepo. Ivanchuk has beaten Carlsen: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xtcjx0EDz3Mwillthrill81 wrote: ↑Fri Dec 03, 2021 2:24 pmCarlsen actually blundered on 33. Rcd1. He should have played 33. Rcc2 with a winning advantage. He also blundered with 40. Nxe4.Marseille07 wrote: ↑Fri Dec 03, 2021 2:20 pmTbh Nepo had a shot when Carlsen was in time trouble. This is a devastating loss.willthrill81 wrote: ↑Fri Dec 03, 2021 2:18 pm It's over! Carlsen wins game #6. This was the longest WC match game ever at 136 moves. Very exciting!
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Re: Let's play chess
I haven't followed any of Nepo's prior games, so I didn't have high expectations for him. Carlsen is certainly one of the very best players of all time, very tough to beat in a long match.Marseille07 wrote: ↑Fri Dec 03, 2021 4:39 pmWhile the game was an instant classic, I'm just disappointed by Nepo. Ivanchuk has beaten Carlsen: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xtcjx0EDz3Mwillthrill81 wrote: ↑Fri Dec 03, 2021 2:24 pmCarlsen actually blundered on 33. Rcd1. He should have played 33. Rcc2 with a winning advantage. He also blundered with 40. Nxe4.Marseille07 wrote: ↑Fri Dec 03, 2021 2:20 pmTbh Nepo had a shot when Carlsen was in time trouble. This is a devastating loss.willthrill81 wrote: ↑Fri Dec 03, 2021 2:18 pm It's over! Carlsen wins game #6. This was the longest WC match game ever at 136 moves. Very exciting!
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