Any car enthusiasts? (or soon to be)

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rob
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Re: Any car enthusiasts? (or soon to be)

Post by rob »

VGisforme wrote: Fri Aug 28, 2020 11:43 am
Kenkat wrote: Fri Aug 28, 2020 10:44 am
VGisforme wrote: Fri Aug 28, 2020 8:39 am You might think the Charger to be gauche...
That’s where the appeal lies in my opinion. :wink:
Hah well certainly there are folks that look down their nose at a Dodge Charger and wouldn't be caught dead in one etc. so I'm not unaware of its lack of snob appeal. It is a heck of a lot of car for the money, rather than getting an ES350 or a Camry/Avalon TRD and wishing you had a GSF you can actually get a RWD V8 sedan. When it comes to daily drivers many folks are going to keep it 8-10 years and 150k miles anyway so the value at the end is low across the board.

I don't fit in most of the appreciating weekend toy cars like air-cooled 911s etc. If you are smart you can certainly buy cars that are nearly fully depreciated and have some upside but I'm talking about family daily driven cars because I don't have the extra time, space nor money to have a toy car.
I prefer the challenger for the retro look from 70's cars that I grew up with but charger is basically identical apart from the extra doors.... I've had some as rentals for work and I'd agree that they are a great driver......
| Rob | Its a dangerous business going out your front door. - J.R.R.Tolkien
smitcat
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Re: Any car enthusiasts? (or soon to be)

Post by smitcat »

azanon wrote: Mon Aug 31, 2020 3:12 pm
smitcat wrote: Mon Aug 31, 2020 2:33 pm
alfaspider wrote: Mon Aug 31, 2020 1:58 pm
gregwils wrote: Mon Aug 31, 2020 12:28 pm I purchased a 1986 Porsche 911 Carrera in 2007 for $21,000, which was market price at the time. I was 49.5 and was feeling like if I didn't pull the trigger it would never happen. It' was a fast performance car in 1986 (Turbo was much faster). It's not a fast performance car in 2020, but it's still faster than most cars on the roads. However, I am still happy with it - it's a ton of fun to drive on a very early summer morning and very easy to work on, which I routinely do. I subscribe to the old adage that "it's more fun to drive a slow car fast, than it is to drive a fast car slow." Plus, the market value is now mid-40's and moving north slightly faster than inflation.

New performance cars are so unbelievably capable they vastly exceed the driver's abilities 99.999% of the time, and even if they don't, the only legal and sane way to experience their capabilities is on a track. Sub-10 second times for 0-60, high triple-digit speeds, 1+ G cornering and braking forces are track numbers. Anyone crazy enough to attempt to achieve these results on the street is stunningly selfish, that they would place others at risk for their fun, and they deserve to be put in jail, which is typically what happens. Even my 30+ year old Carrera's capabilites are way beyond what can safely be exploited on the street, but it's raw, visceral driving experience is from the past. New Porsche's are way faster, but completely refined.

I think most buyers buy for image rather than a stated purpose, since most performance cars never get any closer to reaching their performance envelope that most SUV's get tested in off-road duty. I am not saying that people are not entitled to creating a self-image, but not sure that is the same as being a car enthusiast.
Generally agree with you, but sub 10 second 0-60 times? That's not exactly a high bar. Just about any car made in the last 20 years, and most even mildly performance oriented cars from the last 30 are quicker. You don't need to be driving recklessly to be able to use quicker acceleration than that when merging into high speed traffic.

I also think that everyone who owns a performance car should take it to the track or autocross at least once in their ownership. Buying a fast car but only putting around in it is like dating a supermodel but taking a vow of celibacy. Driving a slow car fast is more fun than a fast car slow, but driving a fast car fast is the best :mrgreen:
"but sub 10 second 0-60 times? That's not exactly a high bar."
Exactly - all of our past pickup trucks were under 10, a couple were sub 8 seconds and they were certianly not performance cars.
The rest of us assumed gregwils meant 1/4 mile times. Gregwils, am I right?

Yes, just about every production car in 2020 can get under 10 seconds 0-60. There are a few exceptions, but not many. Probably less than 10 examples?
"The rest of us assumed gregwils meant 1/4 mile times. Gregwils, am I right?"
Perhaps not all I guess.
What might this mean then?
"high triple-digit speeds"
Would that mean 800-900+?
bhsince87
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Re: Any car enthusiasts? (or soon to be)

Post by bhsince87 »

I'm just the opposite. I used to be a car enthusiast, but as time wore on, I weaned myself away from the habit. Financial security became more important to me.

I do still go to car shows and races on occasion though. I appreciate the things, but I have no more desire to own another one.
"If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, go home from us in peace." Samuel Adams
visualguy
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Re: Any car enthusiasts? (or soon to be)

Post by visualguy »

bhsince87 wrote: Mon Aug 31, 2020 3:43 pm I'm just the opposite. I used to be a car enthusiast, but as time wore on, I weaned myself away from the habit. Financial security became more important to me.

I do still go to car shows and races on occasion though. I appreciate the things, but I have no more desire to own another one.
Finally someone other than me in the ex car-enthusiast boat!

For me it wasn't just the financial aspect, which does indeed add up to real damage over time. I just largely lost interest after owning a few different kinds of performance cars, and finding out that the headaches exceeded the pleasure for me. There's just not much you can do safely/legally with a sports car on public roads that you can't do with a regular car, and I found that going to the track gets old after a while - the "been there, done that" effect. Maybe worth it if it's part of your social scene - you go with friends, etc.
Steady59
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Re: Any car enthusiasts? (or soon to be)

Post by Steady59 »

I picked up a 1975 BMW 2002 in good shape 3 years ago for $12K. Since then, I've got it looking and running great with little effort. Its certainly not the fastest car on the road, but it keeps up just fine at regular and highway speeds. Grammy Bluhaire can run me in her Honda Odyssey and not even know it, but its easily one of the most fun cars I've ever driven. It makes people smile when they see it. Getting gas can be an hour chore if you run into the wrong person. :shock: Everyone has a 02 story it seems.

And there is something about driving slow cars fast.

Highly recommended.
Darth Poppy
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Re: Any car enthusiasts? (or soon to be)

Post by Darth Poppy »

Monster99 wrote: Tue Aug 25, 2020 7:51 am This post triggered a few old neurons! Came of age in the early 70's and had a 1971 Mustang gt500 shelby, what a beautiful looking car. Fast as long as you were going in a straight line..... ran it into the ground as a teen.... 😣

You sure it was a 1971? Big mustang guy here, and noShelby’s were produced in the US for the 1971 model year.
alwi228
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Re: Any car enthusiasts? (or soon to be)

Post by alwi228 »

Another lifelong car enthusiast here. Have had a few base GT mustangs and finally bought (graduated high school in 2005 for time reference) a 2003 Mustang Cobra last month. I was stuck between a few cars but there are a few you can pull the trigger on now and your investment will be MOSTLY safe. The cobra is at the bottom of its depreciation curve (03/04 are the only ones I'd feel comfortable plopping 25k for), my friend has pockets deep enough to play the same game with a 2007 911 Turbo. I guess my point is, you don't totally have to commit to a "dream" car right now, if you just absolutely love cars, keep your eyes out for one of the well known cars that is somehow significant to automotive history. A brand new C8 turns my head, a fellow Terminator Cobra in the parking lot and im going to do everything I can to talk to that guy/girl. Dont discount the way a car with a personal attachment can bring happiness!
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Monster99
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Re: Any car enthusiasts? (or soon to be)

Post by Monster99 »

Darth Poppy wrote: Mon Aug 31, 2020 10:13 pm
Monster99 wrote: Tue Aug 25, 2020 7:51 am This post triggered a few old neurons! Came of age in the early 70's and had a 1971 Mustang gt500 shelby, what a beautiful looking car. Fast as long as you were going in a straight line..... ran it into the ground as a teen.... 😣

You sure it was a 1971? Big mustang guy here, and noShelby’s were produced in the US for the 1971 model year.
Probably a Cobra - didn't pay a whole lot for it as it had been in a wreck and had a few issues with the rear suspension. Still a good ride back then....
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Re: Any car enthusiasts? (or soon to be)

Post by smitcat »

bhsince87 wrote: Mon Aug 31, 2020 3:43 pm I'm just the opposite. I used to be a car enthusiast, but as time wore on, I weaned myself away from the habit. Financial security became more important to me.

I do still go to car shows and races on occasion though. I appreciate the things, but I have no more desire to own another one.
That is right about the time we moved to boating.
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Re: Any car enthusiasts? (or soon to be)

Post by jabberwockOG »

OldBallCoach wrote: Tue Aug 25, 2020 12:23 pm I have a Nissan GTR which is a very fun car to drive...reliable, good street manners and it will eat just about anything else up for lunch. I acutally drive it back and worth to work once in a while...all wheel drive and great in the rain also...easy to get serviced as well. Not a bank breaker...
Godzilla....great choice!
tibbitts
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Re: Any car enthusiasts? (or soon to be)

Post by tibbitts »

bhsince87 wrote: Mon Aug 31, 2020 3:43 pm I'm just the opposite. I used to be a car enthusiast, but as time wore on, I weaned myself away from the habit. Financial security became more important to me.

I do still go to car shows and races on occasion though. I appreciate the things, but I have no more desire to own another one.
I think this applies to a lot of us, just maybe not that many people reading this thread. I was tempted to be a much nicer/newer slightly-used car this spring and found one of the very rare examples of that model that exist (probably only a few ever produced with the options I wanted) just 1 mile from me - kind of a miracle. But when I drove it... it just wasn't that exciting, and mostly what I thought about was the warranty on it running out in a few months.It just wasn't as satisfying an experience to drive as I'd remembered when buying new-to-me cars years ago, so I passed it up. Maybe part of the lack of enthusiasm was thinking that Covid (or ongoing derivations of something similar) might be around forever, so it just won't be as practical to drive as much, to as many places, going forward as it used to be.
investor997
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Re: Any car enthusiasts? (or soon to be)

Post by investor997 »

I'm still a car enthusiast... sort of. I used to own a 2010 Porsche 911 Carrera S (hence my name). But the car turned into a garage queen because I was always afraid to park it anywhere, I couldn't carry my bike easily, it was noisy on road trips and tough to hear callers on Bluetooth due to the noise, etc. I wound up driving my old 4Runner everywhere instead. That's no fun...

I sold the 911 and bought a Model 3. Yeah, I'm one of those guys.... Couldn't be happier. :sharebeer
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Re: Any car enthusiasts? (or soon to be)

Post by gregwils »

"The rest of us assumed gregwils meant 1/4 mile times. Gregwils, am I right?"

The original post status "sub-10 second times" for 0-60. Actually, I don't recall the thought at the time, but it probably should have read "sub-4 second times". Sub-10's for a 1/4 miles is still too fast for 99+% of street-legal vehicles.

The responses poking fun at the 0-60 misquote are fair, but legalistic. The essence of my post was valid, the only way to remotely come close to the upper performance envelope of modern performance cars is a track, and vast majority of those cars never see a track. Most of these cars are not purchased for performance, they are purchased for image. Driving a new 911, Corvette, Mustang or Chevy Suburban down the Interstate at 90 MPH takes no skill, you need to crest a blind negatively banked turn at 125, if you can, to fully understand what you bought.
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Re: Any car enthusiasts? (or soon to be)

Post by eye.surgeon »

lthenderson wrote: Tue Aug 25, 2020 4:59 pm
tibbitts wrote: Tue Aug 25, 2020 12:03 pm
RollDagoneTide wrote: Tue Aug 25, 2020 4:59 am Curious if there are any car enthusiasts on the boards or any bogleheads awaiting a certain net worth status?

I feel like I need to pay off my house and have 3 million before I purchase the Audi R8 V10.
You have to define car enthusiast. Most car enthusiasts don't own especially expensive cars or otherwise spend huge amounts on the hobby.
+1 I consider myself a car enthusiast but would never drop six figures on a car. I would rather rent one for awhile to get it out of my system and use my wealth in other ways that provide benefit to me and those around me.
Just want to make the point that consumer consumption does benefit those around you. Ask any business owner.
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krafty81
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Re: Any car enthusiasts? (or soon to be)

Post by krafty81 »

Not a supercar, but I am excited to get my Mustang Mach E delivered in a few weeks. Just drove one and they are pretty cool - great looking, 270 miles range and no gas! The acceleration is amazing in the Premium and the GT is coming out in the spring...
Tellurius
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Re: Any car enthusiasts? (or soon to be)

Post by Tellurius »

Classic car enthousiast here. Dream car is 1940s-50s Talbot-Lago
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MMiroir
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Re: Any car enthusiasts? (or soon to be)

Post by MMiroir »

gregwils wrote: Mon Aug 31, 2020 12:28 pmNew performance cars are so unbelievably capable they vastly exceed the driver's abilities 99.999% of the time, and even if they don't, the only legal and sane way to experience their capabilities is on a track. Sub-10 second times for 0-60, high triple-digit speeds, 1+ G cornering and braking forces are track numbers. Anyone crazy enough to attempt to achieve these results on the street is stunningly selfish, that they would place others at risk for their fun, and they deserve to be put in jail, which is typically what happens. Even my 30+ year old Carrera's capabilites are way beyond what can safely be exploited on the street, but it's raw, visceral driving experience is from the past. New Porsche's are way faster, but completely refined.
That was my experience. I was a track rat for about seven years with a Lotus Exige. It is a great car, but you can't scratch the surface of that vehicles capabilities on the street, and the modern high horsepower cars are much worse. After deciding to stop tracking, I sold the Lotus and got a vintage Alfa GTV. That car unbelievably slow compared to any modern car, but it is a blast to drive in ways that modern cars can't match.

I want to get an Alfa Giulia QV or Porsche Cayman GTS since this generation will be the last of the purely gasoline engined cars before they are phased out in place of EV's, but am worried that that they will be too much car for the street and will end up just being expensive garage queens.
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Re: Any car enthusiasts? (or soon to be)

Post by veggivet »

I'm considering leasing a Porsche Taycan, and found this thread. Anybody on here have one? This car would be added to the current stable of two MINIs (one of which I use for track days, the other is a daily driver), and one Classic Mini. The Taycan would not be used for any long road trips, so the relative lack of charging stations available vs. Tesla is a non-issue for me. It'll charge up in the garage, and I will use it for enjoying the twisties on the back roads which is what I use the Classic for now. Those jaunts are typically around 50-75 miles long.

I realize that this forum has a definite lean toward frugality, practicality and reliability when it comes to cars, but for the sake of this question, let's assume none of those mean much, at least to me. My attitude is, it's all about the fun factor. Ideally, the tracks that I go to will eventually add a charging station that would be able to be used by something other than a Tesla. If that happens, this car will be an absolute scream on track, I'm sure! 0-60 numbers are under 3 seconds; anyone have any data points for 0-100? 0-150? :D
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Re: Any car enthusiasts? (or soon to be)

Post by PHD-2 »

>>so the relative lack of charging stations available

The Taycan is CCS I believe, yes? I've been driving electric for 10 years now and you'd be surprised how many plugs are available. Not going to be tripping over CCS just yet but have you checked plugshare? There might be more than you think?

My track car is a supercharged gas burner and my daily is my plug in - a Volt for 8 years and a Cadillac CT6 for the last 2.
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Re: Any car enthusiasts? (or soon to be)

Post by veggivet »

I'll keep a closer eye out for those chargers going forward. :idea:

What is your 'supercharged gas burner' track toy, and which tracks do you go to most often?
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Re: Any car enthusiasts? (or soon to be)

Post by Sandtrap »

Question:
On an unlimited budget:

What would be a quick "car enthusiast car" that has AWD, good ground clearance, traction in snow, high horsepower, easily cruises at 80 mph and is quiet, roomy, and comfy, great visibility front and back and sides, and can easily park in a handicap parking stall and/or fit a folding wheelchair or other stuff if that's ever needed in the far future, and is dependable and reliable as a Toyota, and looks cool?

And, is easy to get in and out of and roomy in the driver's seat?

Example of a non starter:
Cars like a Porch 911 do not have enough visibility and are too hard to get in and out of.

j :D
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lazydavid
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Re: Any car enthusiasts? (or soon to be)

Post by lazydavid »

Sandtrap wrote: Wed Mar 24, 2021 8:46 am Question:
On an unlimited budget:

What would be a quick "car enthusiast car" that has AWD, good ground clearance, traction in snow, high horsepower, easily cruises at 80 mph and is quiet, roomy, and comfy, great visibility front and back and sides, and can easily park in a handicap parking stall and/or fit a folding wheelchair or other stuff if that's ever needed in the far future, and is dependable and reliable as a Toyota, and looks cool?
You'll never get everything on that list in a single vehicle, and since many of your requirements indirectly specify that the vehicle must be an SUV, most enthusiasts would agree that there's nothing that will come even close to meeting those requirements and still be a "car enthusiast's car"

Probably the best compromise I can come up with is a Porsche Macan GTS or Turbo. You miss out a bit on room there. Then there's the Jeep Grand Cherokee Trackhawk and/or Durango Hellcat, though obviously those are not even in the same galaxy as Toyota from a reliability perspective.

But come to think of it, you're on an unlimited budget, so until reliability gets so bad that it significantly impedes your life, it really shouldn't matter that much. :) So your ideal vehicle is the Lamborghini Urus. It's an Audi Q7/Q8 under the skin, so reliability is actually pretty decent, though repairs and maintenance are obviously expensive. It meets all your other requirements except visibility--which is merely good, not great--and legitimately drives like a Lambo.
apex84
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Re: Any car enthusiasts? (or soon to be)

Post by apex84 »

I don't think an exact match for your criteria exists.

For ease of ingress/egress, you probably want something higher up. That could be one of the sporty SUVs. A Porsche Cayenne, Audi SQ7, or BMW X5 M50i might work. If the power and looks are more important, maybe an Audi RSQ8 (closely related to the Lamborghini Urus). The usual suspects in this space of high horsepower versions of daily driver cars are BMW M, Mercedes AMG, and Audi S/RS. One has to decide on the right balance of handling and ride quality.

If a lower car is OK, the ultimate cars in this space are the Audi RS6 and Mercedes E63S wagon. The Porsche Panamera Sport Turismo has less cargo capacity and much higher cost.

For high power and a greater emphasis on comfort and luxury, the Bentley Bentayga, BMW Alpina XB7, Rolls Royce Cullinan, and Mercedes Maybach GLS are worth a look.

I'll add one more thing. Most cars these days have a lot of power, so you don't even need the sporty version. Something like an Audi A6 Allroad or Mercedes E450 All-terrain might fit the bill. All of the German brands have SUVs with plenty of power. The upcoming Acura MDX Type-S is worth a look too. Unlimited budget means different things to different people, so I've included a wide range of options.
Sandtrap wrote: Wed Mar 24, 2021 8:46 am Question:
On an unlimited budget:

What would be a quick "car enthusiast car" that has AWD, good ground clearance, traction in snow, high horsepower, easily cruises at 80 mph and is quiet, roomy, and comfy, great visibility front and back and sides, and can easily park in a handicap parking stall and/or fit a folding wheelchair or other stuff if that's ever needed in the far future, and is dependable and reliable as a Toyota, and looks cool?

And, is easy to get in and out of and roomy in the driver's seat?

Example of a non starter:
Cars like a Porch 911 do not have enough visibility and are too hard to get in and out of.

j :D
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Re: Any car enthusiasts? (or soon to be)

Post by Sandtrap »

apex84 wrote: Wed Mar 24, 2021 9:50 am I don't think an exact match for your criteria exists.

For ease of ingress/egress, you probably want something higher up. That could be one of the sporty SUVs. A Porsche Cayenne, Audi SQ7, or BMW X5 M50i might work. If the power and looks are more important, maybe an Audi RSQ8 (closely related to the Lamborghini Urus). The usual suspects in this space of high horsepower versions of daily driver cars are BMW M, Mercedes AMG, and Audi S/RS. One has to decide on the right balance of handling and ride quality.

If a lower car is OK, the ultimate cars in this space are the Audi RS6 and Mercedes E63S wagon. The Porsche Panamera Sport Turismo has less cargo capacity and much higher cost.

For high power and a greater emphasis on comfort and luxury, the Bentley Bentayga, BMW Alpina XB7, Rolls Royce Cullinan, and Mercedes Maybach GLS are worth a look.

I'll add one more thing. Most cars these days have a lot of power, so you don't even need the sporty version. Something like an Audi A6 Allroad or Mercedes E450 All-terrain might fit the bill. All of the German brands have SUVs with plenty of power. The upcoming Acura MDX Type-S is worth a look too. Unlimited budget means different things to different people, so I've included a wide range of options.
Sandtrap wrote: Wed Mar 24, 2021 8:46 am Question:
On an unlimited budget:

What would be a quick "car enthusiast car" that has AWD, good ground clearance, traction in snow, high horsepower, easily cruises at 80 mph and is quiet, roomy, and comfy, great visibility front and back and sides, and can easily park in a handicap parking stall and/or fit a folding wheelchair or other stuff if that's ever needed in the far future, and is dependable and reliable as a Toyota, and looks cool?

And, is easy to get in and out of and roomy in the driver's seat?

Example of a non starter:
Cars like a Porch 911 do not have enough visibility and are too hard to get in and out of.

j :D
Awesome input!!!
I’ll test drive the Accura MDX Type S when I can.

Thanks!!
j🌺
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mtwhmemn
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Re: Any car enthusiasts? (or soon to be)

Post by mtwhmemn »

The 2022 Acura MDX will have double-wishbone front suspension. It should handle very, very well.
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Re: Any car enthusiasts? (or soon to be)

Post by Sandtrap »

mtwhmemn wrote: Wed Mar 24, 2021 3:39 pm The 2022 Acura MDX will have double-wishbone front suspension. It should handle very, very well.
Will it go through 8 inches of snow on an uneven gravel road and hill?

j :D
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mtwhmemn
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Re: Any car enthusiasts? (or soon to be)

Post by mtwhmemn »

Sandtrap wrote: Wed Mar 24, 2021 4:50 pm
mtwhmemn wrote: Wed Mar 24, 2021 3:39 pm The 2022 Acura MDX will have double-wishbone front suspension. It should handle very, very well.
Will it go through 8 inches of snow on an uneven gravel road and hill?

j :D
I don't see why not.
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Re: Any car enthusiasts? (or soon to be)

Post by apex84 »

Whatever vehicle you choose, I would make sure you have tires rated for severe snow service. This could be an all-season tire if it's for occasional use. If you need to drive extensively on gravel roads with deep snow, I'd get dedicated winter tires. A performance vehicle isn't the best choice for such conditions, but the Acura MDX with appropriate tires should be fine. It has a sophisticated AWD system, but ultimately the tires and ground clearance matter (7.3" for MDX).

https://www.tirerack.com/tires/tiretech ... techid=125
Sandtrap wrote: Wed Mar 24, 2021 4:50 pm Will it go through 8 inches of snow on an uneven gravel road and hill?

j :D
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Re: Any car enthusiasts? (or soon to be)

Post by alfaspider »

Sandtrap wrote: Wed Mar 24, 2021 8:46 am Question:
On an unlimited budget:

What would be a quick "car enthusiast car" that has AWD, good ground clearance, traction in snow, high horsepower, easily cruises at 80 mph and is quiet, roomy, and comfy, great visibility front and back and sides, and can easily park in a handicap parking stall and/or fit a folding wheelchair or other stuff if that's ever needed in the far future, and is dependable and reliable as a Toyota, and looks cool?

And, is easy to get in and out of and roomy in the driver's seat?

Example of a non starter:
Cars like a Porch 911 do not have enough visibility and are too hard to get in and out of.

j :D
AMG G-wagen would be closest thing to that. Also maybe a Durango Hellcat or Jeep Trackhawk.
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Re: Any car enthusiasts? (or soon to be)

Post by Jack FFR1846 »

Maybe the new Wrangler hemi.
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Re: Any car enthusiasts? (or soon to be)

Post by Fat Tails »

Cubicle wrote: Wed Aug 26, 2020 5:54 am Also a car enthusiast. I own a few "regular" cars, & like to take care of them myself. Educational, money savings, & enjoyable. No specific not worth needed to get started.

I'm working on 2 cars with check engine lights on. And they're winning so far.
+1, I like cars. Have not had anything expensive. Had a 2004 BMW 3-series that I purchased at 75000 mikes for $11k that I enjoyed driving. I respect all, from the daily drivers, to the hyper-milers, to the people keeping their 1972 VW Diesel Rabbits with 500,000 miles on the road.

Check engine lights... I remember praying to get to the emissions testing place with a ‘96 F150 before an intermittent misfire tripped the CEL.

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