I Want to Buy a Horrible, Expensive Car

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watchnerd
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I Want to Buy a Horrible, Expensive Car

Post by watchnerd »

I'm getting the hankering to upgrade / replace my perfectly serviceable, workhorse 2013 Nissan Murano SL AWD. It has ~40,000 miles on it and I'm sure could easily last another 5 years.

I love the interior in the Murano, the seats are some of the best I've ever sat in. The butt warmers are awesome. The engine / horsepower is 'meh'. Not bad or a liability, but not thrilling. Handling is also 'meh'. Not bad or truck-like, but far behind the Audi SQ5 and Porsche models I've been in. The electronics are a bit dated (no Apple Carplay like my wife's new 2018 Subaru), but adequate. The sound system is pretty good. The reliability has been good, with a finicky tire pressure gauge being my only gripe. My dog loves the visibility and human guests find it comfortable.

But I'm a bit bored with it and have no emotional connection to it. It's been a serviceable, yeoman machine. No objective complaints, but I get no driving thrill from it.

I've been in Volvo, Acura, and Lexii luxo SUVs and found them to be fine, but essentially of the same character as the Murano (nice, reliable, boring). I've also been in the Porsche and Audi SUVs and loved the driving experience, but have a real mental image problem with mapping those brands to outdoorsy activities. I'm not into the American offerings for a variety of reasons.

So what am I attracted to?

The Land Rover Discovery Sport.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gCfSZTmhzcI

Horrible god-awful reliability ratings. A nice set of super-duty offroad features that I'll likely never use. Great interior. Far-less-than-German handling and performance. Good looks. A brand image that ranges from David Attenborough in Africa, to pimped out douche mobiles for soccer players who aren't quite rich enough to buy a G-wagen, to the Queen. Pipes, hoses, and electronics that all die prematurely. Far less indestructible than a Toyota Land Cruiser or Hilux, but also less terroristy.

Blackhole depreciation that makes Fiat look good.

No objectively sane person would ever buy one, or really any of the sister models, unless they just enjoy flushing money and time down the drain, or have a fleet of spares (e.g. The Queen).

Probably the most anti-Boglehead car one could buy, as not only is it expensive and impractical (so are Aston Martins, Porsches, and Ferraris), but there is no collector's market for vintage ones until you get to the truly old models from 30-40 years ago that hobbyists with full garages modify into Mad Max offroaders.

And, yet, I want one. Probably gently used to reduce the cost insanity, a bit. But when I think of the logical alternatives (Lexus, Infiniti, Acura) they bore me, might as well stick with what I have. And the Audi and Porsches seem far too sophisticated for me to take on to the muddy stinky beach clamming, or on a hunting trip and field-dress wild boar hanging upside-down from the lift gate.

(Lastly, since this is the Boglehead forum, I'm 47, married, no kids, no debts, own my own home with $700k in equity, half a mill in cash, 3/4th of a mill in tax sheltered retirement accounts, 200 grand in offshore bank accounts, six figures in stock grants, maxed out 401k and ESPP, savings rate of 27%-35% depending on how you calculate it, and I would pay in cash).

So do I need an intervention?

Or should I get one?
Last edited by watchnerd on Fri Dec 29, 2017 10:43 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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ClevrChico
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Re: I Want to Buy a Horrible, Expensive Car

Post by ClevrChico »

I'd sleep on it. For days and days. :-)
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Re: I Want to Buy a Horrible, Expensive Car

Post by timmy »

viewtopic.php?f=11&t=235991&newpost=3690311

Get a puppy instead. You'll be so much happier.
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Re: I Want to Buy a Horrible, Expensive Car

Post by PFInterest »

Ugh no.
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Re: I Want to Buy a Horrible, Expensive Car

Post by timmy »

OK. A fish.
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Re: I Want to Buy a Horrible, Expensive Car

Post by timmy »

Honestly, given your situation, if a nice car was my thing and if I thought long and hard about it, I'd buy it. You are in great $$$ shape.
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Re: I Want to Buy a Horrible, Expensive Car

Post by Doom&Gloom »

If you're going to buy an expensive car, at least get a decent one. Good grief!

:oops:
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Re: I Want to Buy a Horrible, Expensive Car

Post by Benton Bair »

Doesn't matter what I think. How does your wife feel about the purchase :?: Her opinion matters :thumbsup
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Re: I Want to Buy a Horrible, Expensive Car

Post by technovelist »

If I were going to buy a car remotely like that, I would go with the Toyota Land Cruiser, just because it is a Toyota.

What makes it "terroristy"? Or was that supposed to be "touristy"?
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Re: I Want to Buy a Horrible, Expensive Car

Post by bottlecap »

Seems like you can afford it. Does the great interior, good looks, and "douche factor" outweigh the impracticality for you?

I slightly disagree with the douche factor and agree with the good looks and great interior. But I'd still never buy one because it's plain dumb. I'm a practical "car guy," not an impractical "car guy." If you gave it to me free, I would pay for the maintenance, though!

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Re: I Want to Buy a Horrible, Expensive Car

Post by watchnerd »

technovelist wrote: Fri Dec 29, 2017 10:43 pm If I were going to buy a car remotely like that, I would go with the Toyota Land Cruiser, just because it is a Toyota.

What makes it "terroristy"? Or was that supposed to be "touristy"?
Nope, terroristy is the word I meant:

http://abcnews.go.com/International/us- ... d=34266539
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Re: I Want to Buy a Horrible, Expensive Car

Post by ny_knicks »

watchnerd wrote: Fri Dec 29, 2017 10:24 pm (Lastly, since this is the Boglehead forum, I'm 47, married, no kids, no debts, own my own home with $700k in equity, half a mill in cash, 3/4th of a mill in tax sheltered retirement accounts, 200 grand in offshore bank accounts, six figures in stock grants, maxed out 401k and ESPP, savings rate of 27%-35% depending on how you calculate it, and I would pay in cash).

So do I need an intervention?

Or should I get one?
DINK w/ over 2 million in net worth at 47 including a house paid off and you're asking us if you can buy a used car for probably $30k at most. :confused

I guess the right answer would be to buy a used base model Camry w/ relatively low mileage and run it into the ground. Then take the $15k in cash you saved and invest it. The virtual numbers you see on Mint.com will be that much higher.

I don't think this decision will have any affect on your trajectory. Whether you buy the Discovery Sport or the Porsche Cayenne new you'll be just fine. Personally, one of the last SUVs I would pick in the 30-50k price range would be the Discover Sport...
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Re: I Want to Buy a Horrible, Expensive Car

Post by technovelist »

watchnerd wrote: Fri Dec 29, 2017 10:45 pm
technovelist wrote: Fri Dec 29, 2017 10:43 pm If I were going to buy a car remotely like that, I would go with the Toyota Land Cruiser, just because it is a Toyota.

What makes it "terroristy"? Or was that supposed to be "touristy"?
Nope, terroristy is the word I meant:

http://abcnews.go.com/International/us- ... d=34266539
Thanks for the clarification. But I don't see how that means you shouldn't buy one, unless of course you are going to be driving it in a country where most of them are driven by terrorists (which would be inadvisable for other reasons). Or are you just avoiding Toyota products because a lot of terrorists drive their cars? :confused
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Re: I Want to Buy a Horrible, Expensive Car

Post by tigermilk »

I thought you said expensive? Discovery Sport looksmawfully run of the mill price wise for SUVs. I came into this thread expecting a Bentley Bentayga.
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Re: I Want to Buy a Horrible, Expensive Car

Post by technovelist »

tigermilk wrote: Fri Dec 29, 2017 10:51 pm I thought you said expensive? Discovery Sport looksmawfully run of the mill price wise for SUVs. I came into this thread expecting a Bentley Bentayga.
I think he is including the maintenance cost in the "expensive" part. :sharebeer
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Re: I Want to Buy a Horrible, Expensive Car

Post by mega317 »

You didn't even attempt to make the case for the car! "Great interior", "good looks", and "less terroristy" are the only positives I could find. And you said you love the interior of the Murano. What exactly is the draw?

What's the difference after you sell the Murano, 25k? Many of us "true" Bogleheads are paying that in mortgage interest every year. And you don't have a family to support so I say spend away.

(I hope by cash you mean taxable investments, not just savings/checking/CDs/money markets and such.)
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Re: I Want to Buy a Horrible, Expensive Car

Post by watchnerd »

technovelist wrote: Fri Dec 29, 2017 10:50 pm
watchnerd wrote: Fri Dec 29, 2017 10:45 pm
technovelist wrote: Fri Dec 29, 2017 10:43 pm If I were going to buy a car remotely like that, I would go with the Toyota Land Cruiser, just because it is a Toyota.

What makes it "terroristy"? Or was that supposed to be "touristy"?
Nope, terroristy is the word I meant:

http://abcnews.go.com/International/us- ... d=34266539
Thanks for the clarification. But I don't see how that means you shouldn't buy one, unless of course you are going to be driving it in a country where most of them are driven by terrorists (which would be inadvisable for other reasons). Or are you just avoiding Toyota products because a lot of terrorists drive their cars? :confused
The connection was mostly a humorous aside.

Being more serious, I find the Highlander to be just too big for my needs. And the Lexii to be boring and basically in the same vein as the Murano I have now.
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Re: I Want to Buy a Horrible, Expensive Car

Post by watchnerd »

technovelist wrote: Fri Dec 29, 2017 10:56 pm
tigermilk wrote: Fri Dec 29, 2017 10:51 pm I thought you said expensive? Discovery Sport looksmawfully run of the mill price wise for SUVs. I came into this thread expecting a Bentley Bentayga.
I think he is including the maintenance cost in the "expensive" part. :sharebeer
Indeed.

And the time lost.
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Re: I Want to Buy a Horrible, Expensive Car

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tigermilk wrote: Fri Dec 29, 2017 10:51 pm I thought you said expensive? Discovery Sport looksmawfully run of the mill price wise for SUVs. I came into this thread expecting a Bentley Bentayga.
It's the maintenance factor and the absolute flush-it-down the toilet depreciation.

The G-wagen is probably as high as I would go for sticker price, but they're more of a statement car than I'd want.
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Re: I Want to Buy a Horrible, Expensive Car

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mega317 wrote: Fri Dec 29, 2017 10:56 pm
(I hope by cash you mean taxable investments, not just savings/checking/CDs/money markets and such.)
Well, yeah, mostly. We do keep 1 year of living expenses in CDs and such, but the rest are taxable investments.
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Re: I Want to Buy a Horrible, Expensive Car

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mega317 wrote: Fri Dec 29, 2017 10:56 pm You didn't even attempt to make the case for the car! "Great interior", "good looks", and "less terroristy" are the only positives I could find. And you said you love the interior of the Murano. What exactly is the draw?

What's the difference after you sell the Murano, 25k? Many of us "true" Bogleheads are paying that in mortgage interest every year. And you don't have a family to support so I say spend away.
It looks like I could get a low mileage, late-model used one for $35k-50k, so, yeah, the delta from a Murano trade-in ($20kish) is in the range you're talking about.

The upsides are a far better AWD system, a more sophisticated suspension system, adjustable damping, and a more powerful engine.
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Re: I Want to Buy a Horrible, Expensive Car

Post by Katietsu »

A few years ago, I felt the same way. Even after a few years of looking around, never did find anything that was comparable to me. But I talked myself out of it because my last SUV was a hassle as far as maintenance and repairs. I was not ready for that again. If I had been prepared to do more of the work myself and had a dealer or other mechanic closer than 2 hours away to do the warranty work & more sophisticated jobs, I would have gone through with it.
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Re: I Want to Buy a Horrible, Expensive Car

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Benton Bair wrote: Fri Dec 29, 2017 10:42 pm Doesn't matter what I think. How does your wife feel about the purchase :?: Her opinion matters :thumbsup
My wife is a total cheapskate, in general, and definitely not a car person. Her spending vices are in the clothing realm.

I'd probably position this as something to buy with part of my annual bonus, which gives me more room to be self-indulgent because it's "extra" money.
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Re: I Want to Buy a Horrible, Expensive Car

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Katietsu wrote: Fri Dec 29, 2017 11:11 pm A few years ago, I felt the same way. Even after a few years of looking around, never did find anything that was comparable to me. But I talked myself out of it because my last SUV was a hassle as far as maintenance and repairs. I was not ready for that again. If I had been prepared to do more of the work myself and had a dealer or other mechanic closer than 2 hours away to do the warranty work & more sophisticated jobs, I would have gone through with it.
What was your last SUV?
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Re: I Want to Buy a Horrible, Expensive Car

Post by TimeRunner »

Consider a lease.
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Re: I Want to Buy a Horrible, Expensive Car

Post by adamthesmythe »

1. I suppose you should post your portfolio so we can see whether you have Won The Game, And Large.

2. Ironic that a car called the Land Rover, with a heritage of being used, well, on the LAND, off the ROAD, is well known for poor reliability. Because when you are in the back country, you really DO need a reliable vehicle.

3. Or maybe you just plan on driving it around town. Then reliability doesn't matter. Much.

4. Hard for me to guess whether buying a used car with questionable reliability is a better bet than buying a new car with questionable reliability.
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Re: I Want to Buy a Horrible, Expensive Car

Post by Dottie57 »

Bored?

Try bungee jumping instead. Or zip lining across the Mississippi river. But a Lamd Rover?

Talk to your wife and see if she will pick you up every time the hing fails.

You have the $, but don't understand the desire.
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Re: I Want to Buy a Horrible, Expensive Car

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Dottie57 wrote: Fri Dec 29, 2017 11:46 pm Bored?

Try bungee jumping instead. Or zip lining across the Mississippi river. But a Lamd Rover?
I've done skydiving, am a regular scuba diver, and have been ultralight flying / hang-gliding over Vatnajokull glacier in Iceland.

But I can't really do those on a daily basis.
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Re: I Want to Buy a Horrible, Expensive Car

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TimeRunner wrote: Fri Dec 29, 2017 11:21 pm Consider a lease.
Ugh...I'm debt free. I really don't want to have financial shackles again, even if it does make fiscal sense in the context of a car warranty.
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Re: I Want to Buy a Horrible, Expensive Car

Post by BogleBoogie »

This certainly does not come down to a financial question as you are doing very well. It seems more like an itch that you are trying to figure out how to scratch. My advice is to go test drive one several times. Read all the reviews to really understand what you are getting into. Finally, I would say WAIT. Seriously, give this 3-6 months before even considering a purchase or lease. From a very objective point of view, I honestly am not convinced in reading what you've wrote that 6 months after the purchase you won't regret it, or at best, be "meh" about the decision (indifferent). Regardless of what you choose, you've made life decisions thus far that have certainly you put in the driver's seat (no pun intended) financially so given that freedom, even if you do make a mistake here it won't be a game changer. Best of luck!
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Re: I Want to Buy a Horrible, Expensive Car

Post by NYCguy »

Go for it if you want it. You can afford it. I am 4 years into a Cayenne and LOVE the truck.
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Re: I Want to Buy a Horrible, Expensive Car

Post by MN-Investor »

You remind me of my cousin-in-law who bought a Humvee. I think he was having a mid-life crisis. :D

Go for it. However, reassess the purchase one year from now. Does it stand up to your expectations? Do you have fun driving it? Are you still glad you bought it? After one year, you may not feel so enthusiastic. You can always sell the car and chalk it up to a learning experience. Or... you may still be having fun and truly love it. Just don't make it a forever purchase if you find yourself unhappy.
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Re: I Want to Buy a Horrible, Expensive Car

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watchnerd wrote: Fri Dec 29, 2017 11:52 pm
Dottie57 wrote: Fri Dec 29, 2017 11:46 pm Bored?

Try bungee jumping instead. Or zip lining across the Mississippi river. But a Lamd Rover?
I've done skydiving, am a regular scuba diver, and have been ultralight flying / hang-gliding over Vatnajokull glacier in Iceland.

But I can't really do those on a daily basis.
You do have the money. My objection was. Is strictly personal. I don't nderstand buying an unreliablevehicle because you are "bored". It makes my head hurt, so am exiting this topic.
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Re: I Want to Buy a Horrible, Expensive Car

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NYCguy wrote: Sat Dec 30, 2017 12:00 am Go for it if you want it. You can afford it. I am 4 years into a Cayenne and LOVE the truck.
The Cayenne is really nice. I've been in a few and found them to be amazing driving machines given the size.

But I'd feel bad getting fish guts and the like on it.
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Re: I Want to Buy a Horrible, Expensive Car

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Re: I Want to Buy a Horrible, Expensive Car

Post by victorb »

You are looking for something, but only God knows what.
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Re: I Want to Buy a Horrible, Expensive Car

Post by corn18 »

Discovery doesn't meet your criteria for expensive and stupid. The Land Rover Range Rover Sport SVR is what you really want.
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Re: I Want to Buy a Horrible, Expensive Car

Post by technovelist »

watchnerd wrote: Fri Dec 29, 2017 11:52 pm
Dottie57 wrote: Fri Dec 29, 2017 11:46 pm Bored?

Try bungee jumping instead. Or zip lining across the Mississippi river. But a Lamd Rover?
I've done skydiving, am a regular scuba diver, and have been ultralight flying / hang-gliding over Vatnajokull glacier in Iceland.

But I can't really do those on a daily basis.
Are you limited to an SUV for some reason?

I have an Acura TL-S and it is a blast to drive.

Of course I don't take it off road, but I don't need to do that to have fun driving it.

Why not get a fun car and keep your SUV?
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Re: I Want to Buy a Horrible, Expensive Car

Post by watchnerd »

corn18 wrote: Sat Dec 30, 2017 12:40 am Discovery doesn't meet your criteria for expensive and stupid. The Land Rover Range Rover Sport SVR is what you really want.
Wow, are you so right.

575 HP Supercharged V8.

4.3 0-60.

MPG = TBD (?? really ??)

$113k

For that price, one could buy an actual near super car sports car.
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Re: I Want to Buy a Horrible, Expensive Car

Post by watchnerd »

technovelist wrote: Sat Dec 30, 2017 12:50 am
watchnerd wrote: Fri Dec 29, 2017 11:52 pm
Dottie57 wrote: Fri Dec 29, 2017 11:46 pm Bored?

Try bungee jumping instead. Or zip lining across the Mississippi river. But a Lamd Rover?
I've done skydiving, am a regular scuba diver, and have been ultralight flying / hang-gliding over Vatnajokull glacier in Iceland.

But I can't really do those on a daily basis.
Are you limited to an SUV for some reason?

I have an Acura TL-S and it is a blast to drive.

Of course I don't take it off road, but I don't need to do that to have fun driving it.

Why not get a fun car and keep your SUV?
I've thought about that, like 2 seater roadster. Heck, Mazda Miata's are a blast to drive.

But I can't fit my big dog in one and he's a necessary companion on weekend jaunts.
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Re: I Want to Buy a Horrible, Expensive Car

Post by technovelist »

watchnerd wrote: Sat Dec 30, 2017 1:06 am
corn18 wrote: Sat Dec 30, 2017 12:40 am Discovery doesn't meet your criteria for expensive and stupid. The Land Rover Range Rover Sport SVR is what you really want.
Wow, are you so right.

575 HP Supercharged V8.

4.3 0-60.

MPG = TBD (?? really ??)

$113k

For that price, one could buy an actual near super car sports car.
Here's a review of my car: https://www.caranddriver.com/features/t ... e-s-page-5

It's not a super car sports car, but it is pretty fast for a reliable car. :mrgreen:

And I suspect your dog could fit in it too. It's a four ("five") seater.
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Re: I Want to Buy a Horrible, Expensive Car

Post by whodidntante »

That's not even a proper midlife crisis. Buy a 'vette.
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Re: I Want to Buy a Horrible, Expensive Car

Post by Ditchwitch »

Go for it but only b/c you can afford to do so....AND b/c you probably will have second thoughts if you settled for something other than that. It sure looks like a nice vehicle. I have found it's easier to let go of dreams once you have had them for a little bit and experienced some of the real life pains.....
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Re: I Want to Buy a Horrible, Expensive Car

Post by H-Town »

:mrgreen: Make sure you have proper tax filing for that 200k stashed in offshore accounts :moneybag

As for the Discovery, have you taken it out for a test drive? I have much better experience driving a Porsche Cayenne. Even a Mercedes AMG GLE 63 S is a much better deal. I know every one has a taste, but a Discovery...?
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Re: I Want to Buy a Horrible, Expensive Car

Post by HomerJ »

Get a boat and/or a couple of jetskis instead. How about flying lessons and a plane?

Or get the car if you think it will make you happy. But how long until you're "bored" with this new car?
plasma800
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Re: I Want to Buy a Horrible, Expensive Car

Post by plasma800 »

Look dude, let me say something.

This year, my amazing father in law died suddenly of pancreatic cancer at age 61.

poof

gone

Buy the car if you want the car. Life is worth living if it's worth living to you. The super frugal's will nay-say, even poke fun at you. Be reasonable with yourself, AND your own feelings, find the balance, and live your life.
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randomizer
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Re: I Want to Buy a Horrible, Expensive Car

Post by randomizer »

I would not.
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FireSekr
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Re: I Want to Buy a Horrible, Expensive Car

Post by FireSekr »

You said you enjoyed driving the Porsche and the Audi. Personally I think the Audi is a bland over engineered appliance but the Porsche is spectacular. Why not get one of these sice they clearly made an impression on you and get a rubber trunk liner so your fish guts or whatever don’t get in the carpet.

Not even Land Rover die hards have any respect for the discovery, let alone a discovery sport. If you’re going for Land Rover go all the way and at least get a Range Rover.

Financially you can afford it so do what makes you happy.
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watchnerd
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Re: I Want to Buy a Horrible, Expensive Car

Post by watchnerd »

bottlecap wrote: Fri Dec 29, 2017 10:43 pm Seems like you can afford it. Does the great interior, good looks, and "douche factor" outweigh the impracticality for you?

I slightly disagree with the douche factor and agree with the good looks and great interior. But I'd still never buy one because it's plain dumb. I'm a practical "car guy," not an impractical "car guy." If you gave it to me free, I would pay for the maintenance, though!

JT
While not an option on the Discovery Sport, the Range Rover Velar offers personalized door tread plates:

Image

I don't know how you could get much douchier.
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watchnerd
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Re: I Want to Buy a Horrible, Expensive Car

Post by watchnerd »

ssquared87 wrote: Sat Dec 30, 2017 3:00 am You said you enjoyed driving the Porsche and the Audi. Personally I think the Audi is a bland over engineered appliance but the Porsche is spectacular. Why not get one of these sice they clearly made an impression on you and get a rubber trunk liner so your fish guts or whatever don’t get in the carpet.
I'd agree if it was the Q7, but this was the SQ5, 354 hp, 0-60 5.1 sec, same as Porsche Macan S, so more sizzle than the base model.

Or split the difference and get the new Allroad.
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