Crypto investors: opinions on hard wallets?

Questions on how we spend our money and our time - consumer goods and services, home and vehicle, leisure and recreational activities
Locked
Topic Author
Williams57
Posts: 230
Joined: Tue Jan 21, 2020 10:16 pm

Crypto investors: opinions on hard wallets?

Post by Williams57 »

Locked: See this post by the site owner: New Forum Policy Prohibiting Discussions of Cryptocurrency, Market Manipulation Schemes, etc as Investing Strategies

Please do not respond with generic skepticism toward crypto, thank you. Part of me is a skeptic too, but let's stick to the question above.

As I am becoming more comfortable with crypto investing, I am learning more about hard/cold wallets.

Do you have/use one?

My concern is I am not necessarily better at hard wallets. I have lost and damaged a lot items in my life, I am just not that attached to physical assets. Statistically speaking, which one is actually safer, hard wallets or just one of the app wallets?

If you have one, which one would you reommend?
rage_phish
Posts: 772
Joined: Thu Jan 31, 2019 3:27 pm

Re: Crypto investors: opinions on hard wallets?

Post by rage_phish »

I dont use one. More afraid of losing everything that way

and my holdings are small enough, i dont mind keeping them elsewhere and earning interest
HyperCat
Posts: 91
Joined: Fri Jan 29, 2021 9:44 am

Re: Crypto investors: opinions on hard wallets?

Post by HyperCat »

I have one and stopped using it because of how the whole system works. Every time you transfer crypto to/from the wallet, it's an official transaction that costs some ridiculous transaction fee (at least for ETH "gas" fees in the recent past) and wastes an unimaginable amount of electricity (for BTC). For what little I have at stake, I'm willing to take the risk and not use it.
Freefun
Posts: 1237
Joined: Sun Jan 14, 2018 2:55 pm

Re: Crypto investors: opinions on hard wallets?

Post by Freefun »

I have the Ledger Nano as well as the Trezor. Both are good. If you're going to buy one make sure to use their website and not any third party including Amazon. You don't want anyone messing with it.

If you're liable to lose things then HW wallets may not be a good choice. However it's the 24 word passphrase you cannot lose. If you lose the HW wallet and still have the passphrase then you can easily replace the wallet.

If you have small sums of crypto and/or you think you may lose things then perhaps it's best to keep it on an exchange. I wouldn't keep large amounts on an exchange.
Remember when you wanted what you currently have?
investuntilimrich
Posts: 236
Joined: Thu Jan 21, 2021 1:33 pm

Re: Crypto investors: opinions on hard wallets?

Post by investuntilimrich »

I agree with Freefun, hardware wallet is good. I use Ledger and have my seed phrase etched into metal to protect against the risk of ink running. I would then store that in a fireproof safe. I do have some on exchanges and I have some coins in a wallet on a laptop I only use just for cryptos but the backup also then needs to be stored in an offsite location to protect against fire. Just remember anyone who ever gets your seed phrase owns your crypto. The hardware wallet is good though because even if you lose it your seed phrase will save the day so it's really all about protecting your device, your pin code, and above all else your seed phrase... have at least two secure locations for that and you should be good. I would want 80 percent in cold storage basically the stuff you're HODLING and keep the smaller stuff in your exchanges as trading accounts to buy and sell with.
Last edited by investuntilimrich on Thu Apr 22, 2021 5:57 pm, edited 1 time in total.
User avatar
anon_investor
Posts: 15122
Joined: Mon Jun 03, 2019 1:43 pm

Re: Crypto investors: opinions on hard wallets?

Post by anon_investor »

investuntilimrich wrote: Thu Apr 22, 2021 5:53 pm I agree with Freefun, hardware wallet is good. I use Ledger and have my seed phrase etched into metal to protect against the risk of ink running. I would then store that in a fireproof safe. I do have some on exchanges and I have some coins in a wallet on a laptop I only use just for cryptos but the backup also then needs to be stored in an offsite location to protect against fire. Just remember anyone who ever gets your seed phrase owns your crypto. The hardware wallet is good though because even if you lose it your seed phrase will save the day so it's really all about protecting your device, your pin code, and above all else your seed phrase.
How do you etch the metal? By hand?
investuntilimrich
Posts: 236
Joined: Thu Jan 21, 2021 1:33 pm

Re: Crypto investors: opinions on hard wallets?

Post by investuntilimrich »

My relative used to run a metal shop but you can also buy a kit on amazon.. here's a video of using a kit https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pGsWBOxNAGs
txhill
Posts: 628
Joined: Tue Mar 16, 2021 12:27 pm

Re: Crypto investors: opinions on hard wallets?

Post by txhill »

It sounds to me like you would be better off trusting others with custody--you should only self-custody if you are very confident in your methods and you have permanent places to store your seed phrase / wallet. Coinbase, Gemini, and Kraken are probably about as safe as most peoples' setups, and I'd recommend spreading out your collection on different exchanges and also some on some mobile wallets--reliable ones with open source code like BlueWallet. I do that for the most part, and I also have some in BlockFi (which uses Gemini for custody). If you don't use hardware wallets, make sure your email is highly secure and you don't use SMS authentication for your email, as SIM spoofing is a risk factor.

If you do want a hardware wallet, any of these are fine: https://bitcoin.org/en/wallets/hardware ... are&step=5
dru808
Posts: 1662
Joined: Sat Oct 15, 2011 2:42 pm
Location: mid pac

Re: Crypto investors: opinions on hard wallets?

Post by dru808 »

No, I store on an exchanges hot wallet as well as an interest bearing sites.
Last edited by dru808 on Fri Apr 23, 2021 12:30 am, edited 2 times in total.
1 fund
dru808
Posts: 1662
Joined: Sat Oct 15, 2011 2:42 pm
Location: mid pac

Re: Crypto investors: opinions on hard wallets?

Post by dru808 »

txhill wrote: Thu Apr 22, 2021 7:01 pm I also have some in BlockFi (which uses Gemini for custody).
So, you deposit crypto into blockfi and it’s safely stored in Geminis custody?
1 fund
txhill
Posts: 628
Joined: Tue Mar 16, 2021 12:27 pm

Re: Crypto investors: opinions on hard wallets?

Post by txhill »

dru808 wrote: Fri Apr 23, 2021 12:28 am
txhill wrote: Thu Apr 22, 2021 7:01 pm I also have some in BlockFi (which uses Gemini for custody).
So, you deposit crypto into blockfi and it’s safely stored in Geminis custody?
I put some in there to earn interest--it's a pretty nice setup. But it's a little bit riskier than self custody so I wouldn't put everything in there for sure.
Topic Author
Williams57
Posts: 230
Joined: Tue Jan 21, 2020 10:16 pm

Re: Crypto investors: opinions on hard wallets?

Post by Williams57 »

txhill wrote: Fri Apr 23, 2021 5:07 am
dru808 wrote: Fri Apr 23, 2021 12:28 am
txhill wrote: Thu Apr 22, 2021 7:01 pm I also have some in BlockFi (which uses Gemini for custody).
So, you deposit crypto into blockfi and it’s safely stored in Geminis custody?
I put some in there to earn interest--it's a pretty nice setup. But it's a little bit riskier than self custody so I wouldn't put everything in there for sure.

That's what I'm doing now too, some in Blockfi, some on Celsius. Figured making something already risky riskier is not as crazy.
Topic Author
Williams57
Posts: 230
Joined: Tue Jan 21, 2020 10:16 pm

Re: Crypto investors: opinions on hard wallets?

Post by Williams57 »

Thanks everyone. As I don't have that much in crypto, I guess I'll bypass the hard wallet for now. I just don't trust myself to be a good keeper of a physical wallet. If my crypto assets increase considerably in the future, this is probably something I'll have to come back to.
txhill
Posts: 628
Joined: Tue Mar 16, 2021 12:27 pm

Re: Crypto investors: opinions on hard wallets?

Post by txhill »

Williams57 wrote: Fri Apr 23, 2021 10:01 am
txhill wrote: Fri Apr 23, 2021 5:07 am
dru808 wrote: Fri Apr 23, 2021 12:28 am
txhill wrote: Thu Apr 22, 2021 7:01 pm I also have some in BlockFi (which uses Gemini for custody).
So, you deposit crypto into blockfi and it’s safely stored in Geminis custody?
I put some in there to earn interest--it's a pretty nice setup. But it's a little bit riskier than self custody so I wouldn't put everything in there for sure.

That's what I'm doing now too, some in Blockfi, some on Celsius. Figured making something already risky riskier is not as crazy.
Well... making something riskier can definitely be crazy :) But I think Blockfi's partnerships and track record make it a pretty good option for a moderate investment. I have not tried Celsius or Nexo yet but I might eventually.
qwerty123
Posts: 232
Joined: Thu Jun 26, 2014 7:44 pm

Re: Crypto investors: opinions on hard wallets?

Post by qwerty123 »

Williams57 wrote: Fri Apr 23, 2021 10:03 am Thanks everyone. As I don't have that much in crypto, I guess I'll bypass the hard wallet for now. I just don't trust myself to be a good keeper of a physical wallet. If my crypto assets increase considerably in the future, this is probably something I'll have to come back to.
That reasoning makes sense. If you do go down the path of getting a hardware wallet in the future, storing it safely really isn't all that difficult. Mainly, you need to be sure that the backup phrase you establish when setting up the wallet is stored on a piece of paper (not on a computer), and make sure you keep it somewhere safe. A safety deposit box, safe, etc are all good options.
Topic Author
Williams57
Posts: 230
Joined: Tue Jan 21, 2020 10:16 pm

Re: Crypto investors: opinions on hard wallets?

Post by Williams57 »

txhill wrote: Fri Apr 23, 2021 10:14 am
Williams57 wrote: Fri Apr 23, 2021 10:01 am
txhill wrote: Fri Apr 23, 2021 5:07 am
dru808 wrote: Fri Apr 23, 2021 12:28 am
txhill wrote: Thu Apr 22, 2021 7:01 pm I also have some in BlockFi (which uses Gemini for custody).
So, you deposit crypto into blockfi and it’s safely stored in Geminis custody?
I put some in there to earn interest--it's a pretty nice setup. But it's a little bit riskier than self custody so I wouldn't put everything in there for sure.

That's what I'm doing now too, some in Blockfi, some on Celsius. Figured making something already risky riskier is not as crazy.
Well... making something riskier can definitely be crazy :) But I think Blockfi's partnerships and track record make it a pretty good option for a moderate investment. I have not tried Celsius or Nexo yet but I might eventually.
There is a part of me that's a skeptic, and I'm like, it's all going to zero haha. So may as well earn interest on it. There is a part of me that's very bullish. I've had Celsius for a couple of months now, I just opened Blockfi. I have not had issues with Celsius, knock on wood.
Topic Author
Williams57
Posts: 230
Joined: Tue Jan 21, 2020 10:16 pm

Re: Crypto investors: opinions on hard wallets?

Post by Williams57 »

qwerty123 wrote: Fri Apr 23, 2021 10:25 am
Williams57 wrote: Fri Apr 23, 2021 10:03 am Thanks everyone. As I don't have that much in crypto, I guess I'll bypass the hard wallet for now. I just don't trust myself to be a good keeper of a physical wallet. If my crypto assets increase considerably in the future, this is probably something I'll have to come back to.
That reasoning makes sense. If you do go down the path of getting a hardware wallet in the future, storing it safely really isn't all that difficult. Mainly, you need to be sure that the backup phrase you establish when setting up the wallet is stored on a piece of paper (not on a computer), and make sure you keep it somewhere safe. A safety deposit box, safe, etc are all good options.
if I were to estimate the value of my physical assets overall, I'd say somewhere in 3 figures, including my smartphone. A hard wallet would definitely change that.
txhill
Posts: 628
Joined: Tue Mar 16, 2021 12:27 pm

Re: Crypto investors: opinions on hard wallets?

Post by txhill »

Williams57 wrote: Fri Apr 23, 2021 11:29 am
txhill wrote: Fri Apr 23, 2021 10:14 am
Williams57 wrote: Fri Apr 23, 2021 10:01 am
txhill wrote: Fri Apr 23, 2021 5:07 am
dru808 wrote: Fri Apr 23, 2021 12:28 am

So, you deposit crypto into blockfi and it’s safely stored in Geminis custody?
I put some in there to earn interest--it's a pretty nice setup. But it's a little bit riskier than self custody so I wouldn't put everything in there for sure.

That's what I'm doing now too, some in Blockfi, some on Celsius. Figured making something already risky riskier is not as crazy.
Well... making something riskier can definitely be crazy :) But I think Blockfi's partnerships and track record make it a pretty good option for a moderate investment. I have not tried Celsius or Nexo yet but I might eventually.
There is a part of me that's a skeptic, and I'm like, it's all going to zero haha. So may as well earn interest on it. There is a part of me that's very bullish. I've had Celsius for a couple of months now, I just opened Blockfi. I have not had issues with Celsius, knock on wood.
It could definitely go to zero. But I have a longterm positive view on it, so earning some interest on it both makes sense with that in mind and also helps me retain my longterm mindset during volatile trading days like today. Blockfi (and I guess Celsius etc) encourages hodling, so to speak :)
Topic Author
Williams57
Posts: 230
Joined: Tue Jan 21, 2020 10:16 pm

Re: Crypto investors: opinions on hard wallets?

Post by Williams57 »

Williams57 wrote: Fri Apr 23, 2021 11:33 am
qwerty123 wrote: Fri Apr 23, 2021 10:25 am
Williams57 wrote: Fri Apr 23, 2021 10:03 am Thanks everyone. As I don't have that much in crypto, I guess I'll bypass the hard wallet for now. I just don't trust myself to be a good keeper of a physical wallet. If my crypto assets increase considerably in the future, this is probably something I'll have to come back to.
That reasoning makes sense. If you do go down the path of getting a hardware wallet in the future, storing it safely really isn't all that difficult. Mainly, you need to be sure that the backup phrase you establish when setting up the wallet is stored on a piece of paper (not on a computer), and make sure you keep it somewhere safe. A safety deposit box, safe, etc are all good options.
if I were to estimate the value of my physical assets overall, I'd say somewhere in 3 figures, including my smartphone. A hard wallet would definitely change that.
Dammit, I'm wrong. I do have a condo, but for some reason do not think of it as a physical asset. Maybe because most of it is owned by a bank and I don't feel as much of a liability for the safety of it. Real estate is weird.
Topic Author
Williams57
Posts: 230
Joined: Tue Jan 21, 2020 10:16 pm

Re: Crypto investors: opinions on hard wallets?

Post by Williams57 »

txhill wrote: Fri Apr 23, 2021 11:34 am
Williams57 wrote: Fri Apr 23, 2021 11:29 am
txhill wrote: Fri Apr 23, 2021 10:14 am
Williams57 wrote: Fri Apr 23, 2021 10:01 am
txhill wrote: Fri Apr 23, 2021 5:07 am

I put some in there to earn interest--it's a pretty nice setup. But it's a little bit riskier than self custody so I wouldn't put everything in there for sure.

That's what I'm doing now too, some in Blockfi, some on Celsius. Figured making something already risky riskier is not as crazy.
Well... making something riskier can definitely be crazy :) But I think Blockfi's partnerships and track record make it a pretty good option for a moderate investment. I have not tried Celsius or Nexo yet but I might eventually.
There is a part of me that's a skeptic, and I'm like, it's all going to zero haha. So may as well earn interest on it. There is a part of me that's very bullish. I've had Celsius for a couple of months now, I just opened Blockfi. I have not had issues with Celsius, knock on wood.
It could definitely go to zero. But I have a longterm positive view on it, so earning some interest on it both makes sense with that in mind and also helps me retain my longterm mindset during volatile trading days like today. Blockfi (and I guess Celsius etc) encourages hodling, so to speak :)

All pro HODL, except maybe there'll be a tax loss harvesting opportunity soon if it keep dropping. We will see.
User avatar
khangaroo
Posts: 255
Joined: Mon Dec 18, 2017 12:11 am

Re: Crypto investors: opinions on hard wallets?

Post by khangaroo »

I looked into using a digital wallet but it seems like it's only useful if you wanted to use your crypto tokens for an actual purchase/transaction. In my case, I'm interested in long-term investing and staking so I decided to keep it simple and keep all of my holdings in the Coinbase app. I also only invest in 3 crypto's so that makes things easier too I guess.

A downfall of the Coinbase app is that I wish I could stake ADA but I would need to get a dedicated wallet to do that so for now I'm stuck with only buying ADA tokens and watching it sink (currently lol).
investuntilimrich
Posts: 236
Joined: Thu Jan 21, 2021 1:33 pm

Re: Crypto investors: opinions on hard wallets?

Post by investuntilimrich »

Risk with coinbase if if your account gets hacked, then you will be out your coins unless it was coinbases fault.2FA will certainly help reduce the risk.
ThankYouJack
Posts: 5704
Joined: Wed Oct 08, 2014 7:27 pm

Re: Crypto investors: opinions on hard wallets?

Post by ThankYouJack »

investuntilimrich wrote: Mon Apr 26, 2021 4:39 pm Risk with coinbase if if your account gets hacked, then you will be out your coins unless it was coinbases fault.2FA will certainly help reduce the risk.
This is one of my biggest hesitations with cryptocurrency. I wouldn't feel comfortable holding a large sum of it because seems like there are too many ways to lose it all whether it gets stolen or lost.
txhill
Posts: 628
Joined: Tue Mar 16, 2021 12:27 pm

Re: Crypto investors: opinions on hard wallets?

Post by txhill »

ThankYouJack wrote: Tue Apr 27, 2021 11:21 am
investuntilimrich wrote: Mon Apr 26, 2021 4:39 pm Risk with coinbase if if your account gets hacked, then you will be out your coins unless it was coinbases fault.2FA will certainly help reduce the risk.
This is one of my biggest hesitations with cryptocurrency. I wouldn't feel comfortable holding a large sum of it because seems like there are too many ways to lose it all whether it gets stolen or lost.
Definitely the biggest problem with crypto at the time (and a barrier to truly wide adoption). For now I think the best approach is to distribute your crypto assets among different platforms (e.g., coinbase / gemini, blockfi, as well as wallets), and to ensure that there's no single attack vector for all of the platforms (e.g., if your email or your phone is hacked, they can't get access to everything). 2FA definitely helps, as do other options like whitelisting addresses on BlockFi. Hard to ever get comfortable with it though.
Locked